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The great injustice that is Command Ships :I

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Kunming	Posted - 2006.06.16 07:57:00 - [151] Originally by: FFGR Care to propose something ? ... Sure, sensor dampners instead of ECM is a step in the right direction. Gallente are not EW oriented though so the whole idea of giving them EW boosts is just wrong. Amarr got their armor stuff Minmatar got their speed stuff Caldari got their shield stuff Gallente got caldari EW stuff ?! Gallente navy doctrine is to overload the opposing ships tank with high dmg, or field drones which are immune to jamming once engaging. All gang assist mods are pretty much for defensive purposes. Gallente doesnt have much for defence (not in the sence of a durable tank), they use dual reps supported by nos and injectors, since nos are offensive equipment and already 'given' to Amarr this leaves us with either armor rep amount a'la Brutix (armored warfare has repair speed) and/or some bonus related to the cap injectors.
Shadowsword	Posted - 2006.06.16 08:14:00 - [152] Quote: with either armor rep amount a'la Brutix (armored warfare has repair speed) and/or some bonus related to the cap injectors. Would be quite useless in fleet battles. ------------------------------------------ Don't make War, War is messy. Make love instead, so your kids will do the War part for you.
SengH	Posted - 2006.06.16 08:41:00 - [153] we already resolved this a long time ago in the main gang mod thread recon operation - give us back the dammn sig res or if not change it so it increases the range of ALL EWAR modules not just ECM. Bump it up to a +3% gang mod. sensor integrity - give it a new bonus +3% chance of all EWAR automatically failing (target painting/tracking disruption/ecm/sensor damping. electronic superiority - make the strength bonus affect ALL EWAR mods not just ECM. make all of them +3% mods and the set is fixed.
Kunming	Posted - 2006.06.16 08:47:00 - [154] Originally by: Shadowsword Quote: with either armor rep amount a'la Brutix (armored warfare has repair speed) and/or some bonus related to the cap injectors. Would be quite useless in fleet battles. Maybe but the armored warfare one that gives armor rep speed is also useless for fleets then. Not a valid concern really, imo. All I want is gallente bonus' instead of caldari ones.
Kunming	Posted - 2006.06.16 08:55:00 - [155] Originally by: SengH we already resolved this a long time ago in the main gang mod thread recon operation - give us back the dammn sig res or if not change it so it increases the range of ALL EWAR modules not just ECM. Bump it up to a +3% gang mod. sensor integrity - give it a new bonus +3% chance of all EWAR automatically failing (target painting/tracking disruption/ecm/sensor damping. electronic superiority - make the strength bonus affect ALL EWAR mods not just ECM. make all of them +3% mods and the set is fixed. Possibly missed it, but my main point is EW is not for gallente. Gallente has the lowest number of mid slots after Amarr. I'm more in favor of bonus' that would directly help gallente defence, like the other gang assist mods do.
madaluap	Posted - 2006.06.16 09:23:00 - [156] Edited by: madaluap on 16/06/2006 09:23:05 Originally by: Vampire Blade CCP DOESN'T CARE ABOUT GHEYLENTE PEOPLE! o yes they do, check patchnotes charisma and intelligence will be the new attributes for gunnery. Fire that gun with some style... /emote wakes up a gallente can only dream _________________________________________________
SengH	Posted - 2006.06.16 10:25:00 - [157] Originally by: Kunming Originally by: SengH we already resolved this a long time ago in the main gang mod thread recon operation - give us back the dammn sig res or if not change it so it increases the range of ALL EWAR modules not just ECM. Bump it up to a +3% gang mod. sensor integrity - give it a new bonus +3% chance of all EWAR automatically failing (target painting/tracking disruption/ecm/sensor damping. electronic superiority - make the strength bonus affect ALL EWAR mods not just ECM. make all of them +3% mods and the set is fixed. Possibly missed it, but my main point is EW is not for gallente. Gallente has the lowest number of mid slots after Amarr. I'm more in favor of bonus' that would directly help gallente defence, like the other gang assist mods do. I know .. I was about to suggest drone gang mods modifying speed, strength of utility drones and possibly resists of drones , then remembered how ****** up drones are already and I wouldnt want CCP making it even worse
TuRtLe HeAd	Posted - 2006.06.16 10:42:00 - [158] Quote: Sleipnir (stupid name btw) its cool ! They are all Norse mythology related, you have Odin, Sliepnir his horse (i think) and Munnin and Huginn his ravens/crows/bird things. (Then you get into the whole ragnarok area as well) -Regardless of the skill requirments You cannot simply remove a Way the training requirements for something, The people that HAVE trained will be pee'd at the skill sink they have just wasted on. -Tech II BPO seeding is FUBAR atm We all know it. -Love command Ships. Maybe releasing a Heavy Heavy Assualt ship will ease the pressure off the Heavy assualt ship market. Allowing for a drop in price. We all Know how cheaply BoB can get thier HACs for, but most of us live in the real world. Where a Cerberus Costs 200 mill and a Deimos 165. Personally I'd like to think That the introduction of a New Ship like these ones May actually aid The Market. But for that to happen, CCP Needs to seed more BPO's into the market. -EoS Not flown it yet, Got the astarte, Guess I'll buy the EoS and se how bad it is.
Izo Azlion	Posted - 2006.06.16 11:18:00 - [159] Originally by: Pottsey Edited by: Pottsey on 30/01/2006 21:49:09 Or with Healing drones it heals a fair amount. How much mana do those have? What class uses those? hehe... In all seriousness tho, OP is right... I have to /sign it. Izo Azlion. ---
Walok	Posted - 2006.06.16 11:33:00 - [160] cry .. No I don't have anything constructive to add. - Walok (I make signatures for 10mil ISK)
Dragy	Posted - 2006.06.16 11:42:00 - [161] Originally by: DigitalCommunist Sleipnir (stupid name btw) - 3% siege warfare its not, this command ship's name is for rememberance of the great minmatar commander.
Kunming	Posted - 2006.06.16 15:27:00 - [162] Bah who cares about the name of ships, this thread is about balance.. Whats even worse is Tuxford took the time to look at the gang assist mods and decided information warfare was not caldari enough for his taste... I miss TomB I really DO
Kunming	Posted - 2006.06.18 15:44:00 - [163] /Bump.. As a gallente specialized pilot, I demand this being fixed!
Kunming Amarr adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.25 12:30:00 - [164] This deserves another bump for attention especially with big changes coming around (Kali..) I'd like the gallente gang mods to have gallente bonus' instead of caldari ones...
Vicious Phoenix	Posted - 2006.08.25 14:52:00 - [165] I agree with the change in the bonus for the Gallente command fleet command, however, I don't think ANY other changes need to be made to command ships. They are not and never will be a 1-up form of HAC. Why you ask? At least until they fix BC mass, they are slow as crap and turn slower than a 1974 Buick. Better damage, yes, better tank, yes, better overall, no. Its all because of the speed/mass issue. Pretty much all of the command ships are tight mid-slot wise, so that you can't easily fit a web and aa AB. Better hope that enemy BS doesn't have an MWD fitted, or it'll end up staying out of your web range while it either runs or pounds away at you. Anything cruiser sized or below? Fugiddaboutit. (Assuming they try to run) CFW (Certified Forum Warrior) I kill people ingame too.
Still Hart Aurora Empire Fuzzy Nut Attack Squirrels	Posted - 2006.08.25 22:52:00 - [166] Originally by: SengH we already resolved this a long time ago in the main gang mod thread recon operation - give us back the dammn sig res or if not change it so it increases the range of ALL EWAR modules not just ECM. Bump it up to a +3% gang mod. sensor integrity - give it a new bonus +3% chance of all EWAR automatically failing (target painting/tracking disruption/ecm/sensor damping. electronic superiority - make the strength bonus affect ALL EWAR mods not just ECM. make all of them +3% mods and the set is fixed. Sorry if I missed this, but these mods all state bonuses to Electronic Warfare mods. I assumed that includes things like Remote Sensor Damps (which Gallente gets bonuses to), TP, Web, etc. Are you telling me it's only ECM? That's weak as ****... _____________________
Doomed Predator Xoth Inc Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.26 16:00:00 - [167] I demand the nighthawk beeing fixed.Those 2 precision bonuses realy suck ffs.Change atleast 1 of them to a rof bonus.Every race has a command ship that can deal loads and loads of damage,while we get a frig killer.I mean if i want to kill frigs i would use precision missiles or a target painer with webber drones.I woul like to kill stuff thatsbigger than me not only smaller. Nuh unh. Too big. 400w x 120h are the limits. --Jorauk
Bhoki Tentor	Posted - 2006.08.26 16:13:00 - [168] Originally by: Doomed Predator I demand the nighthawk beeing fixed.Those 2 precision bonuses realy suck ffs.Change atleast 1 of them to a rof bonus.Every race has a command ship that can deal loads and loads of damage,while we get a frig killer.I mean if i want to kill frigs i would use precision missiles or a target painer with webber drones.I woul like to kill stuff thatsbigger than me not only smaller. Indeed. It really is too bad that the tier 2 battlecruisers weren't around when they made the command ships, being based on a missile bc would help the nighthawk a lot imo. (If they'd do this it would be nice to also have it for other command ships as well)
Kunming Amarr adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.26 16:18:00 - [169] Originally by: Bhoki Tentor Originally by: Doomed Predator I demand the nighthawk beeing fixed.Those 2 precision bonuses realy suck ffs.Change atleast 1 of them to a rof bonus.Every race has a command ship that can deal loads and loads of damage,while we get a frig killer.I mean if i want to kill frigs i would use precision missiles or a target painer with webber drones.I woul like to kill stuff thatsbigger than me not only smaller. Indeed. It really is too bad that the tier 2 battlecruisers weren't around when they made the command ships, being based on a missile bc would help the nighthawk a lot imo. (If they'd do this it would be nice to also have it for other command ships as well) Go whine about the nighthawk somewhere else.. And yes the bonus is only to ECM, unless the devs have the intention to change ECM to be gallete EW (which is crap IMO) the gang mods for gallente are boosting caldari. Seriously borked balance, fix it before factional warfare pls.
Bhoki Tentor	Posted - 2006.08.26 21:31:00 - [170] Originally by: Kunming Originally by: Bhoki Tentor Originally by: Doomed Predator I demand the nighthawk beeing fixed.Those 2 precision bonuses realy suck ffs.Change atleast 1 of them to a rof bonus.Every race has a command ship that can deal loads and loads of damage,while we get a frig killer.I mean if i want to kill frigs i would use precision missiles or a target painer with webber drones.I woul like to kill stuff thatsbigger than me not only smaller. Indeed. It really is too bad that the tier 2 battlecruisers weren't around when they made the command ships, being based on a missile bc would help the nighthawk a lot imo. (If they'd do this it would be nice to also have it for other command ships as well) Go whine about the nighthawk somewhere else.. And yes the bonus is only to ECM, unless the devs have the intention to change ECM to be gallete EW (which is crap IMO) the gang mods for gallente are boosting caldari. Seriously borked balance, fix it before factional warfare pls. In case you didn't notice(I'm sure you missed the thread is titled "the great injustice that is Command ships"), this thread is about Command ships, that includes the Nighthawk... Information warfare is a silly gang bonus to give to gallente, even if it wouldn't be just ecm(which makes it even worse). But I can't think of a replacement that would be better right now without being too good(we can't really add gang warfare type that would boost weapons, could we)
Kalki Nibiru Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2006.08.27 00:40:00 - [171] DigitalCommunist, I agree with everything you've posted. I really hope the devs take notice because with the Gallente race especially, we've been on the short end of pretty much everything for a long time, be it railguns, blasters, MWD penalties, no MWD in deadspace etc. The one thing I'm really saddened about is the change for Squadron Command V, the last thing we need now in this game is to allow people to be specialized in everything. Eve is making great strides in allowing people to branch out and be specialists in frigats, cruisers, transports, battleships, capital ships, etc and we should further promote that by making the paths harder and harder, but also much more rewarding if you commit. If we don't enforce Level V for skills, we'll just have people training to level 4 and becoming specialists in everything. Really, what's the difference of 5% to turret damage, missile damage, ship velocity, etc really going to do? Not much. Taken from the May 29th 2003 Devchat at EveGate . <Muaddid> Q: When will sentry gun and station and similar construction pods be introduced on the market? <Hellmar> we have various player owned entities already implemented. Sentry guns, power/shield generators, field repair mini-stations, mobile refineries. We are still working out the last tidbits of how they can be over taken, what is the penalty of having a sentry gun kill a n00b etc. and we have been a bit busy with plugging the holes that people have found.I would say that you'd start to see these items on the market in about 2-3 weeks, very expensive to begin with
xeom Veto.	Posted - 2006.08.27 01:25:00 - [172] I'm thinking lvl V will be left for something like the t2 battleships.And lvl IV with the commandships is a bit more entry mabye? But this "we've been on the short end of pretty much everything for a long time, be it railguns, blasters, MWD penalties, no MWD in deadspace etc." CCP where are our t2 shield power relays?
LWMaverick	Posted - 2006.08.27 01:48:00 - [173] Amen. <3
Andrew Redburn Caldari adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.09.06 13:26:00 - [174] Originally by: Kalki Nibiru If we don't enforce Level V for skills, we'll just have people training to level 4 and becoming specialists in everything. Really, what's the difference of 5% to turret damage, missile damage, ship velocity, etc really going to do? Not much. The difference is the sum of all your lv5s compared to someone with all of them only at 4. Together it is a big difference. One reason why a 35M skillpoint char will beat a 10M skillpoint char, even if the later one has all at lv4.
Cadman Weyland Millennium E.R.A	Posted - 2006.09.06 16:16:00 - [175] Flown with SengH a lot, he knows his command mod stuff. Made me feel a real noob in my twin mod Proph/Cyclone. Seng u back in game or u had enough mate ? Director of Bubbles and Noobs
uiuiui	Posted - 2006.09.06 17:26:00 - [176] i have a related questionb. dontz want to put a new thread just because of that. i have a gang going with an eos and a scorpion. scan resolution of the scorpion is 103 after entering the gang. before it was at 93. after activating the recon operation warfare link the scan resolution should be further increased acording to the description. however there was no schange. any idea whats up here?
Galen Silas Gallente Digital assassins	Posted - 2006.09.07 14:57:00 - [177] Would people stop complaining, the command ships are fine the way they are, you people want all these rediculously easy ways to get by stuff when you can do it yourselves, stop complaining and just play the game made for you and half of you people probably cant even fly command ships, i love my astarte its a nice boat nice damage coming from 7x heavy tech2 neutrons and dual reppers, tank and damage who could ask for more, the nighthawk is just as nasty, the eos is gross because of its drones and still getting the 25% to damage and it has a hella tank. If theres any ships that need to be nerfed are the amarr Command ships, but i dont care if there not, all the bonus's are fine the way they are, dont expect to get like a 10% per lvl to effectiveness to gang assist modules, there not made to make you super uber, they add a bonus and it helps and if you get your skills up the difference is very good, FLEET command ships, again... FLEET, made for a FLEET, and field are made for more smaller gangs, maybe one gang assist mod, and getting up close, jeez stop whining. and for the squad command skill being set back, thats actually a good thing, otherwise the number of people in command ships would be very small, most peoples charisma sucks, so traingin that to 5 for them is like the average BS to lvl 5, it sucks.
Elenath Gallente The Vindaloo Enema Disasters	Posted - 2006.09.07 20:37:00 - [178] Originally by: Galen Silas i love my astarte its a nice boat nice damage coming from 7x heavy tech2 neutrons and dual reppers, tank and damage who could ask for more, the nighthawk is just as nasty, Not only is your post almost completely illegible... but your above statement regarding the Nighthawk means you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about... because... The Nighthawk is a steaming pile of crap.
Hllaxiu Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2006.09.07 20:49:00 - [179] Originally by: uiuiui i have a related questionb. dontz want to put a new thread just because of that. i have a gang going with an eos and a scorpion. scan resolution of the scorpion is 103 after entering the gang. before it was at 93. after activating the recon operation warfare link the scan resolution should be further increased acording to the description. however there was no schange. any idea whats up here? You're a couple patches behind, my recon operation mod says that it increases EWAR optimal, and it does that pretty well! (a good rook pilot + information mods results in some downright crazy jammer stats ) --- Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Chimaera Pact	Posted - 2006.09.08 23:18:00 - [180] Thing is that this role is not needed, caldari have already quite a few ships which can do this just nicely.

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