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Stealing from maco-miners - Good or bad?

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Rikkard Strofeldt	Posted - 2006.02.02 12:02:00 - [1] Now I know macro-miners are an part of EVE, and an exploit. I also know that ore-theft, while not glamourous, is a valid but not rather rewarding profession. Now, what I want to know is, what happens when you steal from a macro-miner by moving their ore into your can, blow them to pieces for thieving your stuff, then hauling the lot back to your base? Will we get a warning from the GMs and lose the loot, or is it okay for us to do this at every oppurtunity? I'm sure I know what your average Joe will say: "Cut sick mate " A devil I may be, but I am trying to help you. You just don't realise it yet.
Xoria Krint	Posted - 2006.02.02 12:03:00 - [2] Petition them instead. And yes you can steal the ore. ---- Space Invader \| Unknown \| Xoria Krint
Suhadi	Posted - 2006.02.02 12:08:00 - [3] Most macro miners are hillarious when they notice you stealing their ore. I've had barges attack my Caracal when I shuffled their ore into my can. I've seen a suicide Kestrel intended for my hauler attacking a Raven because the Raven did the shuffling. If you're bored, harassing macroers is great fun. -------------------------------------------------- - Suhadi
Rikkard Strofeldt	Posted - 2006.02.02 12:27:00 - [4] Originally by: Suhadi Most macro miners are hillarious when they notice you stealing their ore. I've had barges attack my Caracal when I shuffled their ore into my can. I've seen a suicide Kestrel intended for my hauler attacking a Raven because the Raven did the shuffling. If you're bored, harassing macroers is great fun. Yeah, I was so scared of these guys. 2x Imicus with a target lock on me. Of course I will be sueing them for the mental anguish I suffered when I urinated myself laughing at the fact they only had mining lasers, and ended up swallowing some of the fouled pod goop A devil I may be, but I am trying to help you. You just don't realise it yet.
Cvuos	Posted - 2006.02.02 13:57:00 - [5] In my experience, stealing ore is a lot more demotivating to them than getting haulers blown up. After all, a full jetcan pays for two or three haulers. I used to visit two gangs, one with 2 barges+hauler and one with 4 solo Apocs + hauler. After they were wisened by some ship losses, they stopped flagging. Then I simply stopped trying to flag them and stole as best I can with bookmarks etc. Didn't take long for them to become more vigilant and stop mining once they saw me, now I can't even see them in the region anymore.
Rikkard Strofeldt	Posted - 2006.02.02 14:20:00 - [6] I'll keep that in mind. In this case however, I think your maths might be off. Hauler was an Itty 2, and they were mining scordite. After downtime I harrased their op again. The only scary part was when a Caldari Destroyer came in and targeted me. I asked in local what the deal was, and if it was his op. Got no reply, and he didn't try his luck. Might have to keep my eye on him Still, I got 20k scordite with no effort YARR! A devil I may be, but I am trying to help you. You just don't realise it yet.
Scarlet Pimpernel	Posted - 2006.02.02 16:42:00 - [7] I must be missing something here but if they are at the keyboard (to take the loot back or whatever) then surely they arent macro miners?
Malka Badi'a	Posted - 2006.02.02 17:02:00 - [8] Good or bad? Who cares, it's fun. --------------
Go Team	Posted - 2006.02.02 18:53:00 - [9] Originally by: Scarlet Pimpernel I must be missing something here but if they are at the keyboard (to take the loot back or whatever) then surely they arent macro miners? Could still be macro user running more then one account on a pc and only accasionally checking on stuff....... you are confusing with AFK macro miner.... the macro refers to the prog used..... i think..... HAC Glutton.
Salsa	Posted - 2006.02.02 19:08:00 - [10] Mostly they are isk farmers, not macro'ers. Still I don't like them running 8 apoc's and stripmining sectors I call home. So I abuse them any chance I get! Its actually quite funny and even enjoyable to disrupt their operations. A few weeks ago I had them in the system I mine in. I loaded up the dom for bear and started swapping cans on him then blowing my can up (full of his ore). After awhile he'd move or log off. This went on for a week until one day I was harassing one of his apoc's and a named NPC rat spawned....I quickly launched my drones and locked the NPC target. As it just so happens the rat was on the other side of the apoc from me and was attacking the farmers apoc. As I pounded the NPC rat I noticed a ferox warp to the belt (the farmers guard). At a glance it must have looked like my drones were attacking his apoc so he launched hvy missles at my dom (which was fitted with 6 miner 2's at the time) from 30k out. I figure why not? and hit approach and sent my drones after him. As soon as I hit 20k I scrambled him (foolish mortal let me get in range) and by this time his shield was gone and my drones were eating away at his armor. He sent some hobgoblins drones after me but they were no threat so I kept approaching him to engage my 2nd scrambler. Well he didnt last much longer, my hammerheads ate him whole. Once he pop'd he sat there in his pod just glaring at me (probably wishing I'd pod him in empire and get concordgankored). After a few min he warped to station and logged off all his alts...now he wont mine when I'm in the system...hmm strange eh? I must admit it had my heart racing...great fun. Nothing like the smell of a stripminer's burning hull in the morning! There are lots of little tricks you can try to kill these guys, just keep at it. and Yarr!
minnmirman	Posted - 2006.02.02 19:26:00 - [11] Im disapointed that i havent had a chance to do any of these fun shenanigans yet, since i havent seen any macro'ers yet. Someone should start a thread with up to date information of the locations of macro'ers
Cvuos	Posted - 2006.02.02 19:40:00 - [12] Originally by: Scarlet Pimpernel I must be missing something here but if they are at the keyboard (to take the loot back or whatever) then surely they arent macro miners? I keep trying to defuse the importance of the terms. I prefer "farmers" but often catch myself using "macro". There is ALWAYS someone at the keyboard in a macro/farming op However, this person is usually in the hauler most of the time and two or more miner accounts run mouse macros to drag ore from hold into the can. If you watch them, they take a long time to set up once they arrive in a belt and in most cases it seems like only one person is controlling all of them. When I was stealing from the Apocs, if one of them responded by popping his can, I knew I could warp to the next and move most of his ore to my can because it would be a few minutes before the operator would do anything with it. I have never seen any activity that indicates a fully automated mining op.
Go Team	Posted - 2006.02.02 20:47:00 - [13] I agree, there is normally one at the keyboard and a couple of macro run accounts. I got talking to one of em the other night, it was a very.very.painful. converstation as my german is no good and neither was his english but we managed. Him and his three friends run the game 23/7 by taking it in shifts to run as many accounts as their pcs can manage all contolled by one guy at a time, with macros to run all but one, which would act as defender/ guy who spoke in system. He would make a check on all his clients once every few minutes. they paid themselves in RL buy auctioning and figured at the pay like piecework. when the trials ran out, they moved the money to the perm account, made new ones and started all over again. i did petition. oh and i killed his hauler. that's what started the convo as he pretended that all his "friends" were online but never spoke to other players, other than between themselves and started a why pick on the new players speech that made my nails curl with anger. (They had been watched for quite a while by the normal system miners who had watched the cycles and timed them. they petitioned too.) Absolute Bo***ks. He fessed up a few mins later. HAC Glutton.
Duodecimal	Posted - 2006.02.02 21:17:00 - [14] I was in Funtanainen, jet can mining for the 2nd or 3rd day to build up cash for my 2nd-tier Learning skills and a Caracal. In comes a self-professed macro-miner hunter and he steals my can's contents. My client promptly crashes, and the damn timer runs out before I can refit my bantam with offensive weaponry and find him (not that I was going to be able to do much good). I like the concept of hunting down macro miners. After reading this, I'm not sure how you can tell who is one and who isn't. Particularly after being stolen from by some retard who also can't tell the difference.
Ryctor	Posted - 2006.02.02 21:43:00 - [15] Good...bad, I'm the man with their ore. The Guiding Hand Social Club
Pride NL	Posted - 2006.02.03 04:55:00 - [16] Hurting macroers or isk farmers is the way to go!
Malthros Zenobia	Posted - 2006.02.03 05:21:00 - [17] Originally by: Scarlet Pimpernel I must be missing something here but if they are at the keyboard (to take the loot back or whatever) then surely they arent macro miners? You are missing something, or rather you have something, a common misconception that macrominer = AFK mining. Mst macro operations have a person checking in on them from time to time. Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu I'm probably one of the biggest Bush fanboys in Eve... This is like, Darth Vader, can't-reach-climax-without-killing-a-puppy evil.
Scarlet Pimpernel	Posted - 2006.02.03 15:44:00 - [18] Originally by: Salsa Mostly they are isk farmers, not macro'ers. Still I don't like them running 8 apoc's and stripmining sectors I call home. So they could just as easily be strip mining for minerals needed to make a battleship or something? The point I'm trying to make is that I see alot of people calling other people isk farmers or macro miners, but when it comes down to it most of the antagonists just seem to label any non-solo mining op (exept in the example where the miner was convo'd and the truth revealed) a macro'er or a isk farmer (and dare I say use it as an 'excuse' to give them some stick - not that I'm defending what they are doing if in deed they are isk farmers or macro'ers) I'm not suggesting you should all have to prove it, I'm just illustrating that theose tags seems to get far to easily attached to anyone who happens to be mining....
unit2376	Posted - 2006.02.03 18:47:00 - [19] I am going to jump on this.... I used to play SWG which had a macro system and in the early stages a player could truely "macro mine". Most of you are WAY OUT OF line if you ask me...seeming to think you are able to tell what type of miner such and such is based off in-game cues, sightings or even replies. The reality is yes there are people abusing the game's mining system.... However, I feel there are more people BEING the real *****s like the griefer *** they would be seen for bu using the mining problem as an excuse has saved them from that lable. I too often have seen in my short time on the game some * in a HUGE armed to the max gunboat talking smack to a noob in his first hauler. Gunboat * demands on local that miner reply...yet this cheapass gunboater hardly pay for adirect connection. If miner doesn't reply gunboat * tells all on local to steal resources, attack and even pod kill miner. The more people who talk to the miner on local and get no reply; the more the *s talk themselves into the miner is a "macro miner". Problem comes as I stated before I hardly see anyone pay to talk to the miner and the *s are too quick to decide to do something. Screw reporting the person to the devs, admin or someone who you know could see more then a player..these players (like those listed above) take matters into their own hands. And often incorrectly. Last night as I am mining I get a phone irl and walk outside on the cordless to have a smoke and talk to an old friend. I turn the music off and the game sounds up so I can hear as I stand outside the sun room looking back at my computer. Like a lot of miners, I am checking prices on market and using my in-game browser to look at some of the resource prices on the (non-search-able) forums...so leaving my chat window open doesn have the best laying effect. If i do leave it open I am more likely to have my corp chat window open...because frankly the macro-hunters don't kill enough Vin and Chuck spammers so i grow bored of stories of what chuck could do. Anywho...I don't have my local window open so I don't see the *** who thinks because I haven't replied to him on local that I am a mining bot. He is talking himself and his little friend into this..mind you I am afk from less then ten mins and back for the remaining 20mins speech by this guy about how China is ruining america's economic status and a couple other wacked out theories on how isk farming is ruining the world. The reality is, this * of a guy doesn't know what true macro mining is...in fact I am not even sure half of you know what macro-ing is...which BTW was defined LONG before Eve was ever online. My point is it seems that this game is too quick to decide someone mining and not paying attention to you is a bot, someone who is part of colelctive ring to loot the sector or is someone from an asian speaking country hell-bent on cheating. The reality as I see it is most of the time (yes i know a couple of you have met people up to know good) but the majority of us aren't the so called incorrectly labled macro miners, aren't doing anything ICly worthy of your OOC deciding to blow us out of the sky and lastly aren't really worthy of the that flies out of your mouth until we interact with you. It seems most of you forgot something along the way....I don't have to interact with you at all. I don't need to have my chat window open to check the airwaves for crazy people with hardons for miners and lastly I don't have to prove a damn thing to another player...I pay the same as you do. Think i am cheating tell an admin Think about that the next time you roll up on some mining ship and decide to blow it out of the sky. Are you really doing it because you are the best person to decide if another player is cheating or not?...or you just some * who targeting people you think it is ok to be a * to? I vote most of you are the second..***s just using it as an excuse.
Kitty O'Shay	Posted - 2006.02.03 19:17:00 - [20] Originally by: unit2376 ... So. Many. Words. It's all be said before. Bottom line, you mine into jett cans, you open yourself up for theft. It doesn't matter if you're macroing/farming/afking, your ore is in a space trash can. It's your own damn fault for putting it there. Miners whined and got ways to fight ore theft, use them. -- Swethren > tank god for drones :) Kitty O'Shay > I'd rather not tank god, his dps is
dobaran	Posted - 2006.02.03 21:34:00 - [21] Originally by: Kitty O'Shay Originally by: unit2376 ... So. Many. Words. It's all be said before. Bottom line, you mine into jett cans, you open yourself up for theft. It doesn't matter if you're macroing/farming/afking, your ore is in a space trash can. It's your own damn fault for putting it there. Miners whined and got ways to fight ore theft, use them. That would be a great stance if that was my point. My point is not everyone who mines (or uses floating trash cans) is a macro miner. I was saying, in a long winded manner, that I have had more contact with ***s who claim to be defending the game against macro miners then I have macro miners. I know the macro miners are out there...but not every miner who doesn't have his "ears on" local is a macro miner. Further more I was pointing out and mocking the concept that people for the most part don't know what a true macro miner is...because most of the people they suggest are really are just ignoring some self serving ***.
Go Team	Posted - 2006.02.05 14:24:00 - [22] Edited by: Go Team on 05/02/2006 14:30:01 Originally by: dobaran Further more I was pointing out and mocking the concept that people for the most part don't know what a true macro miner is...because most of the people they suggest are really are just ignoring some self serving *****. My friend mines every day... he runs two accounts. he sits at his keyboard and clicks every movement,every response. No-one could accuse him of macro mining or isk farming, he builds, he sells, he makes isk, he buys ships. well done him. I know the diff between a macro user and a real miner. and so do most of the peeps out there. But miners who activley choose to ignore local/mails/convo on purpose and so in fact hide themselves, or appear to be macro users or at least convince local and whine about it when something happens.... nope. don't get it. HAC Glutton.
DREAMWORKS	Posted - 2006.02.05 14:34:00 - [23] Originally by: Scarlet Pimpernel I must be missing something here but if they are at the keyboard (to take the loot back or whatever) then surely they arent macro miners? In china there are sweat shops (look it up on google, you will know im not lying), these sweat shops have chinese people working at low rates a month where most of us cant buy a bottle of beer from. They play sometimes 16-18 hours a day. What the deal is: These guys mine all the time, sometimes they have 6-9 accounts to monitor or more. What they do is keep players away from their op, and in some games like Lineage2 they have "bot" protectors. What are they? High level pvp characters that come pwn your arse when you harass their op. Its just a mather of time before they do it here. Their own motivation is: Money. They make on some online market places 25-20$ per 100mil. Cutting off their only way of income is making them do 1 thing: Move to another game where its easier. A strong community stands up and unites against these players. If you look at Lineage2 you know they are perfectly capable of ruining a game. __________________________ http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html
Keta Min	Posted - 2006.02.05 16:12:00 - [24] Originally by: DREAMWORKS Originally by: Scarlet Pimpernel I must be missing something here but if they are at the keyboard (to take the loot back or whatever) then surely they arent macro miners? In china there are sweat shops (look it up on google, you will know im not lying), these sweat shops have chinese people working at low rates a month where most of us cant buy a bottle of beer from. They play sometimes 16-18 hours a day. What the deal is: These guys mine all the time, sometimes they have 6-9 accounts to monitor or more. What they do is keep players away from their op, and in some games like Lineage2 they have "bot" protectors. What are they? High level pvp characters that come pwn your arse when you harass their op. Its just a mather of time before they do it here. Their own motivation is: Money. They make on some online market places 25-20$ per 100mil. Cutting off their only way of income is making them do 1 thing: Move to another game where its easier. A strong community stands up and unites against these players. If you look at Lineage2 you know they are perfectly capable of ruining a game. good thing about eve, there are no 'high lvl pvp characters'. if they try something like that any real pvp player or a small group will just wipe the floor with them. i've seen a few groups of macroers daring to come into lowsec with BS protection too. i turned them all into nice little loot cans.
Ronin Woman	Posted - 2006.02.05 20:28:00 - [25] Stealing from Macro miners is ALL GOOD! They're stealing from us. Don't produce in game goods, just sell for real cash & don't care that it ruins the games economy. Glad to see that CCP is banning anyone they can prove is buying ISK. Thats my 0.02 Isk, thanks for reading
Mara Noan	Posted - 2006.02.05 21:19:00 - [26] You know, it's funny, by some of your defenitions I am a macro miner, yet unles something comes up I am and will always be sitting in front of the computer looking at what is goiong on. Case in fact, mining barges, they strip mine at an unbelevable rate, and you have to put it somewhere, I prefer to put it in a jetcan, yes they are basicaly trash cans, but if they were not meant to be used that way I beleve CCP would have changed their size long ago. On the other hand, if I chose not to talk to anyone while I'm mining so be it for them, and I hope you like my greting when I do start to talk to you.
Rikkard Strofeldt	Posted - 2006.02.06 00:38:00 - [27] Well, in the case of the spanners I harrassed, it was definitly a macro op. After popping the can, the 3 mining frigates just sat there, scratching themselves. The day after, I popped the destroyer of the op owner. Seems he thinks 2 75mm rails wih iron rounds has a chance in hell against a burning frigate wih 3 ion blasters and anitmatter rounds. 1.5 - 2.5 dmg a hit to 35-65 dmg a hit? Still, I got quite a lot of ammunition, a few miner 1s, and a missle ops skill book. W00t, ph4t lewt As for the difference between stealing from macroers and honest miners... I'll take from both, but I'm less inhibited when it comes to taking from macroers. A devil I may be, but I am trying to help you. You just don't realise it yet.
Cvuos	Posted - 2006.02.06 01:59:00 - [28] Edited by: Cvuos on 06/02/2006 02:01:35 Originally by: Keta Min good thing about eve, there are no 'high lvl pvp characters'. if they try something like that any real pvp player or a small group will just wipe the floor with them. i've seen a few groups of macroers daring to come into lowsec with BS protection too. i turned them all into nice little loot cans. I had one such experience. I was on an op I had been seeing (and harassing) for days. I finally got their barge flagged and disposed of it. A few mins later I was on the second barge in a different belt. I noticed the can had a corp tag, I hit show info and it was another character, over a year old and with a name and corp that sounded like it was from a certain country with beautiful nature and fascinating history. I swapped cans to see what showed up and lo, two mins later a Megathron arrives and proceeds to engage. I concede the unbalanced fight (was in a Ferox fitted with amongst other things, a miner 1, passive targetter and a cargo scanner ), pat my warp stabs and leave the area. Still have the char in my address book and have been wondering if he does indeed protect/manage macro ops, but haven't seen any of them in region for quite a while. edit: Had to mention another: Guy docked his hauler and came back in Minnie destroyer. Started hitting me for 3-4 dmg and I found out heavy missiles do decent damage against destroyers.
haloblack	Posted - 2006.02.07 17:38:00 - [29] Edited by: haloblack on 07/02/2006 17:46:05 I was going to get all long winded... Local chat is a bunch of Chuck and Vin spammers.... I can understand if a player ignores a mail or a direct chat...but local? You wouldn't ask any other type of player to prove themselves on local....so I for one will say: Screw local, if you are going to take OOC police aspects of the game into your pay to play hands...I strongly suggest reporting the person. If you can't, won't or for whatever reason don't end up doing that way....if you are going to cross what I think is a line and shoot someone ICly for what you think is an OOC crime...don't be a *** about it. Give them a mail, a direct chat AND THE CHANCE to reply...just using local is a copout. I am a miner and I NEVER look at local..don't give me some ** about if I want ot defend myself against being called a macro miner I should watch it..because frankly local is ONE step below a Chuck Norris' TotalGym Informercial...all you combat peeps are staring at that why should I do the same in local? Be a male, female, alien or whatever your IC rp is and give us a mail.....
Kasshim	Posted - 2006.02.08 02:20:00 - [30] I say steal ore and blow up their ships and petition the macro miners. Then blow up and steal their ore again. Do it constantly so they leave your area of space. Death to Macro/ISK farmers!!

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