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Burtakus
Genstar Inc
0
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Posted - 2013.12.10 18:03:00 -
[1] - Quote
Since the other thread devolved into a pissing contest back and forth I am going to attempt to start a thread to cover potential changes to FW mechanics.
Some background on myself:
Started EVE in 2008, after a couple of months as a newbie doing everything from mining, ratting, missions etc to make minimal isk and such I got tired of it and took a 4-year break from Eve.
A little over a year ago I read somewhere about FW and decided to give Eve a try again and resubbed specifically to join FW and do PvP.
Farming LP has and will always be a part of FW. I did it when I started and still do it now to fund my PvP activities vi isk and faction ships. I even made an alt on a second account just to Farm LP while I PvP on my main as they built up SP for combat. Now days I will use both toons concurrently to either purely farm LP, purely PvP, or split duties. In fact without adequate farming activities I would have gone broke from PvP within the first week or two when I just started FW so I fully appreciate the need to have income through acquiring FW LP.
The issue I see it is not one of farming but enabling the farmers to dictate WZ control. By enabling farmers to dictate WZ control the folks who want to PvP are spending nearly all of their EVE time chasing away farmers or deplexing a system from the damage the PvE characters have done.
Points that I feel most people can agree on
- I agree that system and WZ control (or lack thereof) should have rewards much like the current tier mechanism does today.
- I agree that if people want to have the benefit of a higher tier their militia should have to hold system
- I agree that you should have to do something to gain and maintain control of a system
- I agree that their needs to be a mechanism in place to enable LP farming in whatever ships/fittings you so choose to use
One proposal for discussion I would like to bring forward is and idea similar to exploration sites. Use that concept to have something analogous to rated and unrated combat sites. Call them rated and unrated FW complex's.
- The unrated FW complexes would be that bastion of farmers where LP payout is lower by X% to account for the potential for significantly lower risk to being killed and the impact to WZ control is significantly lower as well.
- The rated FW sites would essentially be the exact same as the ones we have today with the restrictions of not allowing warp cores stabs, not allowing any cloaks that are not Cov Ops.
This basically says that you can farm to your hearts content in the cloaked and stabbed farming ships and you are essentially safe from PvP but to compensate for that safety you will get a lower LP payout and have a lower impact on WZ control.
This also means that if you want to take a system you will at some point need to step up and run the rated FW plex's and it enables those who want PvP to not have to spend all of their time defending from the farmers when defending by running a couple rated plex's will counteract a large number of the unrated plex's the farmers have run.
Please only constructive discourse.
Burt |
Starbuck05
The Mjolnir Bloc
B O R G
73
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Posted - 2013.12.10 19:23:00 -
[2] - Quote
+1
I am with cal mil . The faction that has had recently high tier rate lp rewards and yes,i am still complaining even now about these cloacked stabbed farmers.
Like the op mentioned above, i myself fund my pvp through lp from plexes or running missions,i prefer to plex because then i can pvp aswell and if no fight presence itself then np atleast i make lp...saying this,i do not have a problem with people doing the same thing, the problem is the people that ONLY farm like wild creatures non stop,the people that come in my plex attempting to steal my hard worked lp and running away at the first sign of trouble , the people that do not give a damn about the militia and the struggle for warzone control and home stability.
There is a great need of change to be done in order tp reduce this issue to a more compeling lvl,because i know it will never be solved completely...
-á- I am the commanding officer , u should adress me as sir !
-á- But if i call u sir , what would i call your wife then ?? |
Foodpimp
Heaven's Harvesters
LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM
129
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Posted - 2013.12.10 19:41:00 -
[3] - Quote
devolution in 3....2...1.... |
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
White Mountain Coalition
672
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Posted - 2013.12.10 23:14:00 -
[4] - Quote
It's actually against forum rules to start another thread when one already exists on the forums. You should add to the existing thread and try and salvage the discussion. Plus a second thread is even more likely to descend into a pissing contest when people find it.
Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction... |
Xuixien
Attitude Adjustment Incorporated
619
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Posted - 2013.12.10 23:19:00 -
[5] - Quote
People QQcatting about FW miss a few vital things
- FW is an ISK sink - ISK is removed from the game when LP is cashed in
- FW encourages ship losses, which creates ship demand, which reduce ship prices to encourage pew pew - FW keeps the market healthy.
If you reduce LP income in FW you are going to
- Reduce an ISK sink, promoting inflation
- Slow the market down, promoting stagnation
AUT5M - Active WH Corporation seeking new recruits. Frequent fleets, perfect boosts, material buyback, and more. Battleship/Logi/T3 pilots needed. Inquire within. Full API required. |
Tsobai Hashimoto
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
146
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Posted - 2013.12.10 23:26:00 -
[6] - Quote
If you are farming and making changes to WZ control your doing it wrong....even more so if you duel box....
Get SBs. Run missions. Make isk..... And don't tell me your faction can't do it vrs them rats....I've done it was amarr. Minnie and caldari fw. Its easy as pie
I'd say amarr is most easy mostly because the hound is a beast.
Second....CCP loves few farmers...they are fixing the eve economy. You make isk while sinking isk!
Every lp you cash out removes 1000 isk from the game....it adds up quick....and you end up earning more isk back. So you don't stop.....this removes isk from the game.... So CCP is going to let you farm all you want.
Third... Most PvP pilots don't care about WZ control. Most farmers don't care about WZ control and even most RP FW pilots only care for a few select systems for docking rights
Who cares about WZ control? |
Xuixien
Attitude Adjustment Incorporated
621
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Posted - 2013.12.10 23:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
Tsobai Hashimoto wrote:If you are farming and making changes to WZ control your doing it wrong....even more so if you duel box....
Get SBs. Run missions. Make isk..... And don't tell me your faction can't do it vrs them rats....I've done it was amarr. Minnie and caldari fw. Its easy as pie
I'd say amarr is most easy mostly because the hound is a beast.
Second....CCP loves fw farmers...they are fixing the eve economy. You make isk while sinking isk!
Every lp you cash out removes 1000 isk from the game....it adds up quick....and you end up earning more isk back. So you don't stop.....this removes isk from the game.... So CCP is going to let you farm all you want.
Third... Most PvP pilots don't care about WZ control. Most farmers don't care about WZ control and even most RP FW pilots only care for a few select systems for docking rights
Who cares about WZ control?
All this.
What it all boils down is some vindictive kids are butthurt their 20 man gang couldn't get tackle and gank a lone Condor.
AUT5M - Active WH Corporation seeking new recruits. Frequent fleets, perfect boosts, material buyback, and more. Battleship/Logi/T3 pilots needed. Inquire within. Full API required. |
Burtakus
Genstar Inc
4
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Posted - 2013.12.11 00:39:00 -
[8] - Quote
Xuixien wrote:Tsobai Hashimoto wrote:If you are farming and making changes to WZ control your doing it wrong....even more so if you duel box....
Get SBs. Run missions. Make isk..... And don't tell me your faction can't do it vrs them rats....I've done it was amarr. Minnie and caldari fw. Its easy as pie
I'd say amarr is most easy mostly because the hound is a beast.
Second....CCP loves fw farmers...they are fixing the eve economy. You make isk while sinking isk!
Every lp you cash out removes 1000 isk from the game....it adds up quick....and you end up earning more isk back. So you don't stop.....this removes isk from the game.... So CCP is going to let you farm all you want.
Third... Most PvP pilots don't care about WZ control. Most farmers don't care about WZ control and even most RP FW pilots only care for a few select systems for docking rights
Who cares about WZ control? All this. What it all boils down is some vindictive kids are butthurt their 20 man gang couldn't get tackle and gank a lone Condor.
Your characterization is a bit disingenuous. |
Quaczarr
Stay Frosty.
0
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Posted - 2014.01.09 15:04:00 -
[9] - Quote
I've just finished reading the other forum post on this topic, in addition to this one. I'm a lowsec resident myself. I spend my time pirating in Faction Warfare space, as a neutral, and looking for fights. Like many others, over the past month or two, the surge in stabbed, cloaky LP farmers is noticeable, to say the least. I agree with the point that LP farming in a cloaky and/or stabbed ship is detrimental to the game-play mechanic of FW.
I agree with what many others have suggested: A timer change. I think this is a very simple solution and will have a positive effect. No one limits the LP farmer from entering the plex and farming. However, should he leave - or cloak - and not opt to defend the plex, the timer resets. When you minimize the risk in this game, the reward (or even the potential for a reward) should be minimized as well.
+1 for Timer Change
Also, thank you to everyone that has spent a lot of time discussing this topic. With more awareness and voices, hopefully something will change. |
Eternus8lux8lucis
Journies End
216
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Posted - 2014.01.09 15:50:00 -
[10] - Quote
Why not just disallow a ship fitted with stabs or cloak to even be IN a plex to begin with?
The gate itself could be the doorman here as it already disallows certain ship types so it would be easy to code a module ontop of this.
Strength isnt measured in numbers but in force of will. For if one motived willful individual stands many will fall around him that are weak.
http://tinyurl.com/YarrFace |
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Charlie Firpol
Noob Mercs
Monkeys with Guns.
102
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Posted - 2014.01.09 16:05:00 -
[11] - Quote
Xuixien wrote:
All this.
What it all boils down is some vindictive kids are butthurt their 20 man gang couldn't get tackle and gank a lone Condor.
Have you ever thought why noone that has been in FW for a while gives a sh** about WZ control? It-¦s exactly because they can-¦t do much to change or hold it anyway. It swings back and forth and it will keep doing so, until some mechanics change. Everyone that lives in FW for some time learns that and either starts to ignore or abuse it. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
9020
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Posted - 2014.01.09 18:51:00 -
[12] - Quote
Stop ******** up my General Discussion with your Features and Ideas.
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
Lugalbandak
Anunnaku Warfare Corp.
402
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Posted - 2014.01.09 19:19:00 -
[13] - Quote
Xuixien wrote:People QQcatting about FW miss a few vital things
- FW is an ISK sink - ISK is removed from the game when LP is cashed in
- FW encourages ship losses, which creates ship demand, which reduce ship prices to encourage pew pew - FW keeps the market healthy.
If you reduce LP income in FW you are going to
- Reduce an ISK sink, promoting inflation
- Slow the market down, promoting stagnation
this
im also in fw with small corp , we teach our newbros to farm in tech1 pvp fitted ships , you get as much lp as with stabbs fitted and you can use d scan to tell if sombody comes into plex. you cant win as newbe? np you already aligt to a new safe to w8 it out or check other systems.
last week on of our nwebie got their very first kill inside a plex , so exited he was , that had not happen i i told to fit stabbs & cloack.
its not the fault of game mechanics , its the fault of bad ceos and so called veterans who tell newbros tey should run missies, mining and farming in stabbs & cloacks , this is freaking eve , newbies should be trained to murder pillage & ****...
for the so called veteran with farming alts , tey do it wrong , i make plenty of isk with this pvp main with farming in pvp ships even that i loose alot , check the kb.
That said , i dont think your idea is a bad one tho , but i think the main reason nothing will change is what said above me
sorry for the very bad english o/
The police horse is the only animal in the world that haz his male genitals on his back |
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
NEW ORDER DEATH DEALERS
CODE.
171
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Posted - 2014.01.09 21:24:00 -
[14] - Quote
Xuixien wrote:People QQcatting about FW miss a few vital things
- FW is an ISK sink - ISK is removed from the game when LP is cashed in
- FW encourages ship losses, which creates ship demand, which reduce ship prices to encourage pew pew - FW keeps the market healthy.
If you reduce LP income in FW you are going to
- Reduce an ISK sink, promoting inflation
- Slow the market down, promoting stagnation
This is true. Anything that is done to combat ninja plexing needs to be a mechanics change, not a rewards change.
New player resources:
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Main_Page - General information
http://www.evealtruist.com/p/know-your-enemy.html - Learn to PvP
http://belligerentundesirables.com/ - Safaris, Awoxes, Ganking and Griefing-á |
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
765
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Posted - 2014.01.10 00:31:00 -
[15] - Quote
As the OP admitted himself that this is essentially a restart of a previous discussion, it gets a lock.
Also, as it is presented a proposal for a change in game mechanics regarding Factional Warfare, it should belong in Features & Ideas. but as there are a plethora of threads on that subject already, it would also get locked there.
The rules:
16. Redundant and re-posted threads will be locked.
As a courtesy to other forum users, please search to see if there is a thread already open on the topic you wish to discuss. If so, please place your comments there instead. Multiple threads on the same subject clutter up the forums needlessly, causing good feedback and ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread.
ISD Ezwal
Commander
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department |
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