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Coconut Joe
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Posted - 2006.03.21 20:10:00 -
[1]
So I was thinking about a few of the 'problems' in the Eve market at this moment. One of the problems is that cirtain items are price gouged because that item's got a lower effective level to price correlation than any of its peers. Obviously, to anyone to moans, and moans... AND MOANS... about the prices of cirtain things, then the answer is not to buy them, and I dont. 
But I was wondering how much harder it would be for someone to keep to price of an item up, if they were doing it in a region twice the size of what we normaly get right now. Would it be twice as hard? How would it affect cross regional tradeing? Could prices go up as well as down? Also, does anyone know if price gougeing is less of an issue in some of the larger regions such as Domain, compared to smaller ones like Essence?
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Wanoah
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Posted - 2006.03.21 20:44:00 -
[2]
 Quote:
Obviously, to anyone to moans, and moans... AND MOANS... about the prices of cirtain things, then the answer is not to buy them, and I dont.
Me too. I don't buy Cap Recharger IIs or HACs on principle. Vote with your feet!
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Kylania
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Posted - 2006.03.21 20:44:00 -
[3]
I am intrigued by your ideas and wish to sign up for your newsletter. 
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Lil Miner |
Jonis Sinmaker
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Posted - 2006.03.21 21:11:00 -
[4]
I will be able to fly HAC soon on both of my accoutns. I have held off training them until recently due to the retarded prices that have been on market for them and the insane wait for decent priced ones. I am hoping in the kali patch this gets fixed so I am now training them in preperation for this patch. Until the prices come down I refuse to buy them and so do many of my corpmates.
Semper Fi
Jonis Sinmaker
Bring back Mines
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Professor McFly
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Posted - 2006.03.21 21:17:00 -
[5]
Increasing region size won't have that much impact for items where it's mostly consumers doing the "resell at higher price".
__________________
Inappropriate link description. --Jorauk
mods - pwning sigs since 1943 |
BlackDragonShadow
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Posted - 2006.03.21 21:35:00 -
[6]
I think one thing that people have to remember about HAC and level 2 gear is that it takes a level one item PLUS whatever it takes to make the level two item. So that means you either have to MAKE the first item or BUY it. In either case it causes the cost of the item to go up by at least that much. Now add to that the fact that there are not that many level 2 Blue Print Originals out there. And prices really start to go up due to scarcity. THEN you have to realize that there are a lot of people who have been playing for at least a year and can afford to spend several million on Tech two ships and gear. Because there are people out there with a lot of money there will always be merchants and traders and miniers looking to relieve them of that problem. Which leaves people like me to the good old grind of mining.
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2006.03.21 21:36:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Wanoah
Quote:
Obviously, to anyone to moans, and moans... AND MOANS... about the prices of cirtain things, then the answer is not to buy them, and I dont.
Me too. I don't buy Cap Recharger IIs or HACs on principle. Vote with your feet!
Snort.
Cap Charger II's are stupidly expensive, Eut's are a lot cheaper and very very nearly as good. (Although looting them from the enemy is good too!)
HAC's function cannot be easily duplicated by other ships in many cases.
Very different situations.
Digital Communist> The Jin-Mei are probably more profficient in training for Tofu and Noodles than Spaceship Command |
Coconut Joe
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Posted - 2006.03.21 22:01:00 -
[8]
aw Geez, I should have known this would have decended into people moaning about prices. I mean this in the nicest way, if you only want to talk about Cap recharger 2s, or HACs, then please do so in one of the many dozens of threads on that issue. Thank you.
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Coconut Joe
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Posted - 2006.03.21 22:02:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Professor McFly
Increasing region size won't have that much impact for items where it's mostly consumers doing the "resell at higher price".
Come on dude, in economics, you need to give reasons for your answer
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Alexis DeTocqueville
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Posted - 2006.03.21 22:04:00 -
[10]
You posted this in the wrong forum. If you want an educated discourse on economics, you need to post it in Market Discussions, where the boneheads don't tread.
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Hillesumos
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Posted - 2006.03.21 23:33:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Hillesumos on 21/03/2006 23:34:19
Dear Coco,
This subject is interesting and pricing in eve pretty much reflect a similar system in real life.
Let start with the basic: supply and demand. It is the most limiting factor especially for named and tech 2 stuff since availlability of theses items are clearly limited. So if u happen with the usual cap 2 and HAC to have a very high demand compared to a low supply then obviously price will rises no matter the size of the region universe whatever. It is especially true of modules like cap 2 that are required and compatible with all the ships unlike shield and armor tanking which basically halve and regionalise the demand for theses items.
The size of the region only play a role in unlimited supplied item like the tech 1 stuff. Basically, you will notice the natural formation of hubs where most demand and supply will agregate. A bigger region will only cause two effects: increase the chance of more than one hub in the region and increase the overall number of potential players in the region and thus the demand for goods.
Obviously, the bigger the region and thus the size of the market the harder it is of price fix specific item since there is going to be more and more competitors. In a smaller market with limited demand and a controled cartel for supply then it might be possible to control the market. But franckly it is unlikely given the potential for competition in the game.
Price gouging can potentially occur in any region as long as the competitive pressure on the specific item is low.
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Sadly I just make ISK, I don't print it. :(
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Al Thorr
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Posted - 2006.03.22 00:15:00 -
[12]
Personally,If we initially concentrate on t1.
Will a bigger market decrease overall prices. Simply No.
Why - Eve regions are primarily just a group of localised markets. Yes there are the Hubs for the volume sellers, but outside of them there are thriving local economies. And Most of those producers / resellers dont give a monkeys about who has the lowest price (as long as it doesnt infringe on their sales).
For example you lose you BS do you then go and hunt for the cheapest available . Or do you look at the market and find the closest acceptable price. Players soon realise that running off doing 30 jump round trips to save a few percent on items. and losing playing time just isnt worth the extra isk they have saved.
Now as for Tech 2 -
With High demand ships, making markets bigger will actually do nothing. there simply isnt the supply capability out there to nullify the demand. - And when the prices do finally stabilise, again its then down to distance / time to travel.
As for modules - again its the same old scenario of distance / time.
What will definately happen If the market sizes were increased imho Is that the reselling / market manipulations will become even more predominant .
Any how just a few opinions
regards
Al Thorr
"You cant polish a turd" - The new rendered font is living proof.
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Vaux
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Posted - 2006.03.22 15:44:00 -
[13]
In my opinion it's about geography and location. I guess that is the essence of your question, really. I don't think that the size of a region is what matters, but more importantly, the geography of the region. I am only talking about tech1 items which can be found everywhere. Tech 2 items are much more rare, and therefore are affected by supply/demand more than geography (but not always).
Essentially, like a previous poster said, if a consumer must travel a far distance to get an item at a lower price, he may or may not do it. This will depend on how far he has to do, how safe the route is, and how big the price difference is. If we made Essence a bigger region, then I belive all prices would stay the same in that region, mainly because Essence is fairly homogenous with concerns to safety. Other regions have pockets of low security, or may be strung out over vast distances with many chokepoints, and thus prices on one end are very different than at the other. If we enlarged any of the regions in Eve, pilots would have to think even more about their safety and convenience when viewing the market.
As far as "keeping the price up" goes, I still think that supply and demand have more of an affect than geography. After that, someone can easily "price gouge" if the geography of an area warrants it.
"I can see the price for this ship is half of what it is here on the other side of the region. I could go get it, but that $%&#@ gate camp is always there! I guess I'll just pay the higher price here. Oh well."
"The prices over there are just a little cheaper, but it's not worth 15 minutes to save 5,000 isk. I'll just buy it here."
Thus, my argument is that the size of the region is not really important compared to supply/demand and geography. And that's what makes the game fun, afterall.
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RF | DTS |
Matthew
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Posted - 2006.03.22 23:07:00 -
[14]
If anything, I would say that allowing filtering of the market into smaller areas would assist more in elimitating areas of high prices. The market conditions across a region are never the same everywhere - what is a poor price in a hub may be a good price on the fringe, simply because it saves the customer a long trip to the hub and back to fetch it.
The only time regional boundaries really help in maintaining high prices are where something is chronically undersupplied in that region anyway, and customers are ignorant of a true sensible price - otherwise there will always be someone willing to compete you down to a good price. With traders moving around, such a price-fix should be eliminated by traders flooding supply in at that higher price.
Location is important in the price of things, and allowing people to see the prices further away will not necessarily change the price locally.
For example, consider Isogen in Metropolis and Lonetrek regions. Prices in Lonetrek are significantly higher than in Metropolis. Allowing the residents of Lonetrek to see the prices in Metropolis wouldn't lower the price of isogen in lonetrek. The isogen in metropolis may be cheaper, but getting it from where it is to where you want it, is not a trivial task. The traders willing to do this on a signifiacnt scale already know about such cross-region price differences - being able to see wider regional markets would be convenient for them, but wouldn't make the costs of moving the stuff any less.
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There is no magic Wand of Fixing, and it is not powered by forum whines. |
Shiner BockBeer
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Posted - 2006.03.22 23:34:00 -
[15]
I honestly think it wouldn't make an enormous difference to anyone but cross-region traders. I've found that people are resistant to traveling too far to get something they want. "Too far" of course being entirely subjective.
I personally have made quite a lot of money buying things in high-volume systems, marking them up a bit, and selling them in neighboring systems with lower player loads.
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