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Yve Mountbatten Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 0	Posted - 2014.01.22 00:30:00 - [1] - Quote So in 6 days of my trial account, I have managed to complete all career agent tutorials (still don't know what to be), completed various level 1 missions and I'm halfway through Blood Stained Stars. I've destroyed a Merlin and an Ibis while being too ambitious in a security mission. Last night was the most depressing of all my moments on Eve. While heading back to Arnon with all my possessions, I stopped to do a side mission. It was late and I was tired. I awoke to find my Cormorant and all my items (career agent modules, salvaged items and my few items which I stared to trade with) destroyed. They had been replaced with my capsule. I am quite disappointed and very disheartened. So much time and effort in salvaging - all for nothing. So should I stay or should I go? Having lost everything, it's easy to leave. However, I'd prefer to stay only I don't know how to move forward. With only a modest amount of ISK (relative to a 6 day old), if I can, should I buy a Cormorant or is there another ship that would be better? I liked the Cormorant, but there might be something more suitable. Do I rebuild it using the modules as provided in career agent tutorials or are there other builds (assuming I can afford them) which would be better? I'm assuming BSS shouldn't really be done using Ibis, Merlin or Heron, so without a Cormorant or equivalent, I guess I'm back to mining or trading. Do I have any other options? Any and all help is greatly appreciated.
Ovv Topik Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic 597	Posted - 2014.01.22 00:42:00 - [2] - Quote That is the nature of sandbox gameplay my friend. No pause button. No game saves. Genuine consequences. A month from now you'll laugh at a few mil loss. Pick yourself up and try something new. "Jita 4 4 Spaceport. You will not find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious!"
Omega Sunset Black.Omega 170	Posted - 2014.01.22 00:55:00 - [3] - Quote You can use a cormorant for most of it, but the last boss may be hard to damage. You may be best doing the last mission with either someone to help, or bring a cruiser with medium size weapons. If you don't have the DPS, you wont finish the last mission, he regenerates fast. An attack cruiser imo is ideal with the low skill points. Biomass and rage quit over loosing newbie loot? By the end of your first year, you could be making 100m isk an hour, even more. Quit over maybe 7m worth of newbie stuff? ... GÇö+¬GÇö
Yve Mountbatten Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 0	Posted - 2014.01.22 01:17:00 - [4] - Quote Thanks for the positive feedback. Perhaps I came across a little more defeated than I intended. Appreciate the nature of the game and clearly there are some obvious mistakes made which won't be repeated. I'm definitely up for going again. Just not really sure how. For the moment, I'll dust off the Merlin and fit it out as best I can to complete as much of BSS as possible. I'm sure there are some good threads on Merlin mission builds. A little trading and salvaging on the side to save up for the cruiser to do the final stage. However, I'd be grateful for guidance on the following: - If I can, should I buy a Cormorant or is there another ship that would be better? - Do I rebuild it using the modules as provided in career agent tutorials or are there other builds (assuming I can afford them) which would be better? - Do I have any other options (suffering from a case of Rumsfeld disease: "I don't know what I don't know") Thanks again
Miriya Zakalwe Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic 36	Posted - 2014.01.22 01:18:00 - [5] - Quote Ships and gear are tools, not friends. You need to lose the attachment to them. You will suffer far, far greater losses in the future and laugh it off. Last night some Amarr guy lost a 500M SoE frigate and a 3B ISK pod in Siseide. While amusing (and trust me, we were laughing in Militia chat), that should put your dessie and pod in perspective :) You'll go on to far greater things. Roll with it.
Praxis Ginimic Vessels of the Line Bask of Fail 751	Posted - 2014.01.22 01:21:00 - [6] - Quote There are 3 stations that provide tutorial missions for each race. You can complete them at another station to replace everything you've lost. There are no time limits on the mission arc either so you can feel free to take a break and fix your situation.
Omega Sunset Black.Omega 170	Posted - 2014.01.22 01:29:00 - [7] - Quote Destroyer vs cruiser. Depends on your long-term goals, if you have any yet anyway. If you are going to focus on pvp, good to raise frig and destroyer skills early. If going towards the mission running pve stuff at least early on, it's never too early to start training your cruiser skills. edit: well never too early once the all the career agent missions are done. But once on the epic arc, sure. GÇö+¬GÇö

ISD LackOfFaith ISD Community Communications Liaisons 1075	Posted - 2014.01.22 01:31:00 - [8] - Quote Yve Mountbatten wrote: - If I can, should I buy a Cormorant or is there another ship that would be better? Better for what? There is seldom a single ship that is clearly "best" at anything in Eve. It all depends on how you're fit up, how you fly, your skills, what the specific situation is, etc. The Cormorant is designed for killing frigate-sized craft from (relatively) long range. It is also tankier than a frigate. For the BSS epic arc, it serves you quite well because of this. Are there better options? Perhaps. There are 7 other destroyers like the Cormorant, each with their own unique quirks. I'm not going to go on a long rant about all of them, but if you'd like more info, feel free to ask. A cruiser may also do very well with the arcs, but is more expensive, takes longer to train for, and is harder to fly. Keep in mind: bigger is not always better. A single Merlin could take down an unprepared battleship, and a small industrial ship or frigate may be better for hauling some things than a freighter is, to give a couple examples. Yve Mountbatten wrote: - Do I rebuild it using the modules as provided in career agent tutorials or are there other builds (assuming I can afford them) which would be better? I haven't run the tutorials very recently, so I could be wrong, but the career agent tutorials hardly give you what you need to fit something well. You'll have to go to the market. To aid in planning your fit without having to "buy and try" stuff from the market, you could look into a standalone "fitting tool": a 3rd party program that simulates fitting a ship using your skills, giving you stats about its mobility, tank, damage, and a lot more. Some examples are Pyfa, EFT, and EVEHQ. Of course, the question remains of what fit to use in the first place. There are websites for that, and maybe someone in this thread can help with it. I can't, since it's beyond my role in the CCL, but I can tell you this: the Cormorant rocks with 7 railguns. Yve Mountbatten wrote: - Do I have any other options (suffering from a case of Rumsfeld disease: "I don't know what I don't know") Sure. Eve is a sandbox, so you can always do anything you wish. Finding those things is often a challenge for newbies, but that's why we're here. Take a look at this chart: http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ The BSS epic arc is simply an introductory PvE chain of missions, but you are not obligated to do it, same as you are not obligated to do the tutorials, or to do missions at all. So, question right back at you: what are you looking to get out of Eve? It's a mini virtual universe full of spaceships and people fighting, building, trading, leading, conquering, exploring, and much more. It's your pick what direction to go in! ISD LackOfFaith Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department @ISD_LackOfFaith on Twitter

Sabriz Adoudel Mission BLITZ 1802	Posted - 2014.01.22 01:39:00 - [9] - Quote I don't recommend Destroyers for newer players (except to use early on in PVE content as they are better at PVE than frigates are). Destroyers are generally pretty narrow. They are extremely good at two things in EVE: 1) Attacking unsuspecting players illegally in highsec (they are cheap for the amount of damage you can do, and you will lose your ship doing this) 2) Killing frigates (NPC or player ones). They are really quite terrible at everything else, having neither the durability of cruisers nor the agility of frigates. I would suggest that you set yourself a goal of flying a cruiser soon. But not until you can afford to absorb the loss of a fully fitted cruiser (which, with a budget fit, is probably around 15 million ISK). To get back on your feet, you can get another Cormorant by running one of the other Amarr Advanced Military tutorial agents' chain. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. EVE's golden rule: Never trust anyone in-game unless you are sleeping with them in real life. Even then, they may only be screwing you to screw you.
Omega Sunset Black.Omega 171	Posted - 2014.01.22 01:48:00 - [10] - Quote ISD LackOfFaith wrote: The Cormorant is designed for killing frigate-sized craft from (relatively) long range. It is also tankier than a frigate. For the BSS epic arc, it serves you quite well because of this. Are there better options? Perhaps. There are 7 other destroyers like the Cormorant, each with their own unique quirks. I'm not going to go on a long rant about all of them, but if you'd like more info, feel free to ask. A cruiser may also do very well with the arcs, but is more expensive, takes longer to train for, and is harder to fly. Keep in mind: bigger is not always better. A single Merlin could take down an unprepared battleship, and a small industrial ship or frigate may be better for hauling some things than a freighter is, to give a couple examples. It's realy-reaaaly hard to defeat the last boss in BSS with a cormorant. His shield regens pretty quick. The first time I did the epic arc some years ago, I did it with an attack cruiser, and it was challenging enough and with low SP. The second time I did the epic arc was with an alt that had far more SP than my first run through, but only using the "re-balanced" Cormorant (missing mid-slot). I just barely managed to finish the last mission by rigging for rail sniping, just barely finishing it with quite a bit of SP and almost 30 minutes. PvE? Yeah... sometimes bigger is better, at least bigger DPS. GÇö+¬GÇö
Yve Mountbatten Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 0	Posted - 2014.01.22 01:53:00 - [11] - Quote All really very helpful comments and I'm grateful that you took the time to provide feedback. I wasn't aware of the 4 stations doing tutorials so helps enormously. Destroyer will be a stepping stone to a Cruiser, so it's good advice to start training for a Cruiser. The tutorials and arcs are useful gameplay to get my head into the sandbox. They also provide a broad scope of what is available (except pvp) so that might help decide what to do. What comes across clearly is don't fly anything you can't afford to lose. For a new player, this is hard to bend your head around. However, the forum and your feedback have certainly helped. Now all I have to do is wait 7 hours for work to finish so I can log back in and get going.
Arc'Los Xyn Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 9	Posted - 2014.01.22 02:21:00 - [12] - Quote Yve Mountbatten wrote: All really very helpful comments and I'm grateful that you took the time to provide feedback. I wasn't aware of the 4 stations doing tutorials so helps enormously. Destroyer will be a stepping stone to a Cruiser, so it's good advice to start training for a Cruiser. The tutorials and arcs are useful gameplay to get my head into the sandbox. They also provide a broad scope of what is available (except pvp) so that might help decide what to do. What comes across clearly is don't fly anything you can't afford to lose. For a new player, this is hard to bend your head around. However, the forum and your feedback have certainly helped. Now all I have to do is wait 7 hours for work to finish so I can log back in and get going. you could probably get another destroyer free if you find the next group of career agent tutorials as they will give you the same rewards.. i believe you get a destroyer from the advanced military career agent tutorial. try that if you can get a new destroyer that way. here's a link with the names and locations for all factions of new eden's tutorial career agents. i did this when i lost my destroyer .. hehe https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Tutorial_Agents http://ahanddrawnlife.tumblr.com my artwork !
Malcolm Shinhwa Bad Touches 1050	Posted - 2014.01.22 02:42:00 - [13] - Quote If truly down on your luck for isk and ships, contact The Angel Project via email or by joining the channel of the same name. Sindel may be able to help you get back on your feet. I know violence isn't the answer. I got it wrong on purpose.
Sabriz Adoudel Mission BLITZ 1803	Posted - 2014.01.22 03:11:00 - [14] - Quote One more thing to add. Don't haul all your stuff everywhere unless you have a very, very good reason for doing so. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. EVE's golden rule: Never trust anyone in-game unless you are sleeping with them in real life. Even then, they may only be screwing you to screw you.
Omega Sunset Black.Omega 172	Posted - 2014.01.22 03:19:00 - [15] - Quote Yve Mountbatten wrote: Destroyer will be a stepping stone to a Cruiser, so it's good advice to start training for a Cruiser. Hmmm... if you courier some stuff for me in Caldari empire to Jita (all high sec), I'll give you a Caracal after completed, or a blackbird whichever you want. Assuming you still have your hauler from the career agent missions. Maybe a little over an hour or so of hauling, and no collateral requirement. Been cleaning out my station assets, various stuff filling my assets list being a nuisance. I cant put the ship into the courier contracts as a reward, but once you are finished I'll contract it over to you. Up to you, let me know. No time rush, few days or whatever, when you have the time. GÇö+¬GÇö
Kayla Brandewyn School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 17	Posted - 2014.01.22 03:24:00 - [16] - Quote Omega Sunset wrote: It's realy-reaaaly hard to defeat the last boss in BSS with a cormorant. His shield regens pretty quick. I very much agree with this. I have not killed the last boss yet even with all my launchers firing away for 15 mins. To OP, if you need help (I personally need it too), drop me a mail and we can do this mission together if you don't mind. I'd very much love to finish up this mission. Haha.. Cheers!
Yve Mountbatten Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 0	Posted - 2014.01.22 03:59:00 - [17] - Quote Omega Sunset wrote: Hmmm... if you courier some stuff for me in Caldari empire to Jita (all high sec), I'll give you a Caracal after completed, or a blackbird whichever you want. Thanks loads Omega for your kind offer. I'll be in touch ingame when I've got my industrial together. Kayla Brandewyn wrote: To OP, if you need help (I personally need it too), drop me a mail and we can do this mission together if you don't mind. I'd very much love to finish up this mission. Kayla, this would be great. Once I've got an suitable ship functioning, I'll race through the remainder of BSS and contact you in game so we can work together on the last boss. I usually log in daily around 8pm Australia East Standard Time. Hopefully, that time in game works for you both.
Keno Skir Vectis Covert Solutions 646	Posted - 2014.01.22 04:06:00 - [18] - Quote Hehe welcome to EvE :D Add me as a contact and if i'm online i'm usually happy to answer questions or come (dispatch someone else) to help you with your missions etc. Good attitude so far, learning to fly cheap and not care about ship losses go hand in hand and are some of the most important lessons. Bet you loved that tutorial mission where your ship gets blown up by the station :P Some people do that in their new expensive trophy ships ;) BUDDY TRIALS - 21days + ISK bonus + Starting Assistance : https://secure.eveonline.com/trial/?invc=77facad8-d941-45ad-95bc-c1ec90919b6b&action=buddy Feel free to contact me with questions :)
Yve Mountbatten Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 0	Posted - 2014.01.22 04:17:00 - [19] - Quote The most annoying part of losing the Cormorant is that I lost it because I fell asleep. When I woke up to find it was gone, I was frustrated with myself so much I couldn't get back to sleep. But I was too tired to log back in and get back on the horse. But it has provided me with my first reason to post on the forum. Part of understanding Eve is becoming familiar with the parlance of the game and other pilots....that's a steep learning curve in itself that has no tutorial.
Omega Sunset Black.Omega 172	Posted - 2014.01.22 04:32:00 - [20] - Quote Yve Mountbatten wrote: Thanks loads Omega for your kind offer. I'll be in touch ingame when I've got my industrial together. k a few courier contracts waiting for your attention. A week on the timers. When you finish, send me a game e-mail and let me know which cruiser you want as previously mentioned. GÇö+¬GÇö
Miriya Zakalwe Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic 36	Posted - 2014.01.22 04:38:00 - [21] - Quote Kayla Brandewyn wrote: I very much agree with this. I have not killed the last boss yet even with all my launchers firing away for 15 mins. You two teaming up to do this sounds like a really good plan. For reference, when I did this a couple months ago, I did it in a destroyer and found (experimentally, through failure :) that you need at least 150 DPS to get past his tank. That should be no problem for two of you but can be hard for a single low SP player to fit without rig skills and/or faction ammo. Faction ammo is a really good plan for you for this mission actually but might seem expensive to you. I have some caldari faction missiles and rockets lying around, shoot me a message in-game if you have too much trouble teamed up.
Kayla Brandewyn School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 17	Posted - 2014.01.22 04:51:00 - [22] - Quote Yve Mountbatten wrote: I usually log in daily around 8pm Australia East Standard Time. Hopefully, that time in game works for you both. That will be 5pm Australia East Standard Time for my time zone. It depends very much whether I have lessons at that time. I'll replay mails or convos when I'm online :) See you in space
Kayla Brandewyn School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 17	Posted - 2014.01.22 04:59:00 - [23] - Quote Miriya Zakalwe wrote: You two teaming up to do this sounds like a really good plan. For reference, when I did this a couple months ago, I did it in a destroyer and found (experimentally, through failure :) that you need at least 150 DPS to get past his tank. That should be no problem for two of you but can be hard for a single low SP player to fit without rig skills and/or faction ammo. Faction ammo is a really good plan for you for this mission actually but might seem expensive to you. I have some caldari faction missiles and rockets lying around, shoot me a message in-game if you have too much trouble teamed up. Thanks :) When they opportunity arises we'll see how it goes. In a sense my low SP in offensive skills makes this mission tough. I have been pushing my Frigate to level V the past week so I don't have the time to skill up my Missiles. My DPS can get past 50% of the tank in about 7-8 mins but the 10s reloading time for my Missiles wasted all the effort. By the time I reloaded, the tank is back up to almost full. I'll skill up DPS after Frigate V. And thank you very much for your offer. If we still can't complete it then we'll call for help. Haha
Cloaky McWarpStab Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 4	Posted - 2014.01.22 06:17:00 - [24] - Quote Yve Mountbatten wrote: The most annoying part of losing the Cormorant is that I lost it because I fell asleep. Welcome to EVE PVE. Falling asleep is an ever present danger.
Marcus Avon New Eden Fedo Lovers Society 31	Posted - 2014.01.22 06:51:00 - [25] - Quote Yve Mountbatten wrote: The most annoying part of losing the Cormorant is that I lost it because I fell asleep. Makes you wonder why your ship doesn't have an alarm claxon that sounds either when you are targeted or when you are shot at. It would seem to be the sort of no-brainer device that every ship would be fitted with as standard..... But nope, you have to keep your eyes peeled for that little flashing yellow box..... Just imagine how many lives would be saved if only these mega-high tech space ships came equipped with a bell :)
Miriya Zakalwe Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic 37	Posted - 2014.01.22 07:00:00 - [26] - Quote Marcus Avon wrote: Yve Mountbatten wrote: The most annoying part of losing the Cormorant is that I lost it because I fell asleep. Makes you wonder why your ship doesn't have an alarm claxon that sounds either when you are targeted or when you are shot at. It would seem to be the sort of no-brainer device that every ship would be fitted with as standard..... But nope, you have to keep your eyes peeled for that little flashing yellow box..... Just imagine how many lives would be saved if only these mega-high tech space ships came equipped with a bell :) Well, they do, but it's more of a "beep" than a klaxon :)
Marcus Avon New Eden Fedo Lovers Society 31	Posted - 2014.01.22 07:07:00 - [27] - Quote Miriya Zakalwe wrote: Well, they do, but it's more of a "beep" than a klaxon :) Yeah I'm thinking more of the kind of thing you'd see on Star Trek or Babylon 5, a really loud "AROOGHA....... AROOGAH!!!" claxon the lights dim to red and someone screams out "GENERAL QUARTERS!" in a panicky kind of voice. That's the kind of alarm I'd personally want if I were about to be shot at and die.... Not a noise that sounds like someone stepping on a mouse's tail - as heard from a great distance.....
Sofia Tsero EVE University Ivy League 6	Posted - 2014.01.22 13:26:00 - [28] - Quote If you all can't hook up to finish the last boss, there's almost always someone in Local willing to help. The guy who helped me (because all I had was a Condor) said he sits in system a few days of the month helping with that last boss. The great thing about EVE honestly, is that, no, don't trust anyone, but there's still a lot of support for newbies. Just give a shout in Local and someone should answer.
Kerrec Snowmane Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 11	Posted - 2014.01.22 16:23:00 - [29] - Quote There is some good advice already, but I feel like adding my 2c. If you read the forums extensively, the general consensus is you do level 1 security missions in a Destroyer, level 2's in a Cruiser, level 3's in a Battlecruiser and level 4's in a Battleship. This is not bad advice, however it is aimed at grinding ISK. The above is for people that are trying to maximize ISK and minimize RISK. So they fly into a mission, sit there without effort, blast the bad guys, fly back for the reward and repeat ad nauseum. I won't speak for others, but this kind of "GRINDING" is boring. I would quit PVE or EvE outright if all I did was follow the conventional wisdom in these forums. I also feel it's worth mentioning that you will gain faction standing to reach level 4 missions LONG before you are able to fly a battleship well (I'm talking about core skills). Before I started to read these forums, I was doing level 3 security missions with a Destroyer (Gallente Catalyst, with a salvager on one of the turrets), so 7 railguns total using only antimatter (I didn't bother looking into the other ammo types). I did about half a dozen level 3's without issue, until I ran into one mission that obliterated me before I knew I was in trouble. That is when I decided to upgrade to Cruisers (Thorax). When I made the switch, I was just barely able to survive the level 3 missions that would have blapped my Destroyer. Cruisers use MEDIUM guns, so when you move up to Cruiser, you have to retrain to improve your DPS. I also had to learn that those medium guns didn't track well at very close range, so I learnt a whole new strategy. Also, I had level 4 Destroyer and the drop to level 1 Cruiser meant my Cruiser DPS wasn't much better than my Destroyer. In hindsight, there was a lot I could have done to improve my Destroyer DPS as well as the range I engaged at. I could probably have finished that level 3 in my Destroyer simply by switching ammo types (more range) since it was the range of the Cruiser that allowed me to survive those missions. Today, with about 4M SP, level 3's are easy in my Cruiser. I have progressed to doing level 4's in my Thorax, although it is hard. But that is what I find FUN. Yeah it takes way more time than a battleship would take, but again... hard, challenging, fun! All I'm saying, is a lot of the advice given is provided by people with decent SP who have forgotten what it's like to be a new player. Someone saying they did the BSS mission "again" and did it solo with a cruiser and it was much easier has lost sight of the fact that a lot of the core skills, as well as cruiser skills have been trained up since "the first time". I'm sure you're not interested in waiting a week or two to train cruisers and medium weapons (whatever you use) to be able to go back and try for yourself. And for my last bit of advice, let me say that I killed Dagan solo using a Catalyst (Destroyer) equipped with 7 railguns + antimatter right out of the tutorial missions. I did it, and did not know I was "supposed to have to rely on a friend". I chose the Gallente version of the ending (if that makes a difference). Maybe the difference between you and I is my guns were hitting his weak resists? Oh, and I also got real close and orbited at 500m. Before doing that, I was getting hit and running out of capacitor before I could finish him off. At 500m, you're under his guns and he can't hit you, meaning you can turn everything but your guns off and grind him down. So, check your damage type vs. his resists, orbit him real close and kill him on your own. Or make a friend to help you out, that is more in the spirit of EvE after all.
Miriya Zakalwe Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic 37	Posted - 2014.01.22 16:29:00 - [30] - Quote great post!

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