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Bael Malefic Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 9	Posted - 2014.01.24 15:06:00 - [1] - Quote Scenario: You want to gank a hard target in hisec. Your gang is bringing some tackle, some DPS and some logi. No wardec, going for a surprise attack. I know the tackle will earn a flag (for using the modules on the target) and the DPS will (for attacking) but what about the logi? Will the booster get flagged? I was thinking cheap disposable tackle and DPS (just frigs and destroyers) but the logi seems to be the key to making it work effectively. Or am I missing something?
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 2588	Posted - 2014.01.24 15:22:00 - [2] - Quote Boosting with ganglinks: No flagging. Remote assistance (reps, reccm, rsebo) someone with a flag, will pick up that flag on the next cycle after the flag is gained. If you have your safety set to something above that level, it will automatically turn off the module. Why Logi with a gank? Steve Ronuken for CSM 9! http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Bael Malefic Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 9	Posted - 2014.01.24 15:40:00 - [3] - Quote Steve Ronuken wrote: Boosting with ganglinks: No flagging. Remote assistance (reps, reccm, rsebo) someone with a flag, will pick up that flag on the next cycle after the flag is gained. If you have your safety set to something above that level, it will automatically turn off the module. Why Logi with a gank? First, thanks for the response. I am trying to work out a gang setup that will maximize my chances of successfully ganking a big-ish, shiny ship without risking too much ISK. Something like a mission fit BS or BC. I was thinking some form of boost (I am not very familiar with this aspect!) would be the way to do it, hence I was thinking a logi. What you're saying is that a logi offering reps etc. would get flagged along with the "active" shooters. So would a better answer be a command ship with warfare links? Would using links require the whole gang to be in fleet together?
Gizznitt Malikite Agony Unleashed Agony Empire 3451	Posted - 2014.01.24 15:50:00 - [4] - Quote Bael Malefic wrote: Scenario: You want to gank a hard target in hisec. Your gang is bringing some tackle, some DPS and some logi. No wardec, going for a surprise attack. I know the tackle will earn a flag (for using the modules on the target) and the DPS will (for attacking) but what about the logi? Will the booster get flagged? I was thinking cheap disposable tackle and DPS (just frigs and destroyers) but the logi seems to be the key to making it work effectively. Or am I missing something? 1.) In highsec, No Wardec, going for a "surprise attack". I hope, for your sake, that the pilot is either a corp mate, an outlaw, currently has a Suspect flag (activating a killright on the target makes them a suspect), or currently has a Criminal Flag (in which case concord will blap them within 20 seconds anyway). If they are NOT one of these, then attacking them is illegal, and you will receive a criminal flag for engaging them. When you are criminally flagged, concord will spawn within 20s or less (depending on system security and stuff). When concord arrives on the scene, they will destroy everyone that is criminally flagged. You won't be able to tank them, even with logi (which will also be destroyed if it reps a criminal). 2.) Logistics inherit the flags of the ship they are repping. If the repped ship has a weapons flag (which prevents docking, ejecting, or jumping through a gate), it will gain a weapons flag. If the repped ship has a Suspect flag, which makes you a legal target for EVERYONE to shoot, the logi will gain a Suspect flag. If the repped ship has a Criminal Flag, which makes you a legal target for Everyone to shoot AND, if you enter or are in highsec, results in concord spawning and destroying your ship within 20 seconds, the logi ship will also gain a criminal flag and die in a fire. If you rep a ship that is fighting someone else, and that someone else does NOT have the right to shoot the logistics ship, the logistics ship will gain a suspect flag and become a legal target for everyone (unless it is corp mates shooting each other). 3.) There is only one way to have a semi-invincible logistics ship: Attacking a corp mate. If your attack frigates and dessies are in corp with your target, you can bring an out-of-corp logistics ship to rep your frigs and dessies, and nobody gains permission to attack the logistics ship. Under this case, people can attempt to suicide gank the logi ship, but that generally doesn't end well for them as concord will destroy them within 20 seconds.
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 2588	Posted - 2014.01.24 15:52:00 - [5] - Quote Reps for your ganking ships wouldn't help much. The damage will be coming from Concord, and it's enough to kill anything. Reps won't slow it down. Remote Sebo's have their place for the setup, so you lock faster. Everything else is not particularly useful. Probably better to have a ship with a scram (depending on where you are, and their align times) Warfare links are a better idea, yes. On a command ship, a BC, or possibly an Orca. However, these still won't boost your damage output. Another shooter is probably better. Steve Ronuken for CSM 9! http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 15595	Posted - 2014.01.24 16:41:00 - [6] - Quote Bring friends with Catalysts if you want maximum bang for minimum bucks if you're going for a surprise attack in highsec. Concord will instapwnwtf anything you use in the gank, including logi because it'll inherit any flags. Minerbumping gives some good info on manipulating Concord to give you a few extra seconds for the kill, scroll down to Ganking 101 for it. I'd also recommend looking at the fits they use, which can be found on eve-kill. Tippia has done some research with reference to Concord response times and time they take to kill you which you may find useful.
Paranoid Loyd 342	Posted - 2014.01.24 20:11:00 - [7] - Quote Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Have someone not involved in the gank loot and salvage if you want to make a profit, they may or may not pick up a suspect flag for looting your target though (I'm unsure, never been the looter). You do pickup a suspect flag. The wreck belongs to the victim. He is the only one who won't get flagged the wreck is looted. "PvE in EVE is a trap to turn you into PvP content, don't confuse it for actual gameplay." Lipbite
Haedonism Bot Revolutionary Front 779	Posted - 2014.01.24 22:56:00 - [8] - Quote All you need is DPS. A suicide ganking fleet is not a well rounded PvP fleet. It has one purpose - to inflict lots of damage in a very short time before being annihilated by CONCORD. Logi and boosts are pointless - just get moar DPS. everevolutionaryfront.blogspot.com
Sabriz Adoudel Mission BLITZ 1832	Posted - 2014.01.25 00:36:00 - [9] - Quote Very valuable target: Use Taloses and or Tornadoes. Don't skimp on the number of pilots. Lower value target away from sentry guns (ie stations and gates) - use a Catalyst fleet or a Vexor fleet Lower value target under sentry fire : Use a Vexor fleet. Optionally bring a Thorax with a full rack of smartbombs to pop the pod. They are the cheapest ship that can instapop a pod without needing a target lock. Practice this timing. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. EVE's golden rule: Never trust anyone in-game unless you are sleeping with them in real life. Even then, they may only be screwing you to screw you.
J'Poll CDG Playgrounds 3587	Posted - 2014.01.26 19:05:00 - [10] - Quote Bael Malefic wrote: Scenario: You want to gank a hard target in hisec. Your gang is bringing some tackle, some DPS and some logi. No wardec, going for a surprise attack. I know the tackle will earn a flag (for using the modules on the target) and the DPS will (for attacking) but what about the logi? Will the booster get flagged? I was thinking cheap disposable tackle and DPS (just frigs and destroyers) but the logi seems to be the key to making it work effectively. Or am I missing something? (neutral) booster will stay out of any flags and will be perfectly "safe". Logi's when repping an someone with a flag will inherit the same flag / go suspect (can't recall which of them it actually is). I do know that repping someone with a flag at least make you FFA to everybody in EVE, so it is at least a suspect flag. And why rep a gank, it's useless as CONCORD DPS isn't repairable and once they arrive on site you are dead. Want to have some chat in game? Need help to get into the game as a new player? Just join my channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Bael Malefic Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 9	Posted - 2014.01.27 09:12:00 - [11] - Quote Great responses, all! Many thanks. I wasn't thinking attacking a corp mate...but that might of course come in handy some day. What if I deliberately got myself suspect flagged (I've read I can do this by can flipping?) then provoked the shiny ship into shooting at me? Would this allow me to gank them without CONCORD spawning on me? I understand totally that doing this is illegal, will make me a target, etc.
Gregor Parud 135	Posted - 2014.01.27 09:25:00 - [12] - Quote If someone attacks you you're always allowed to defend yourself and shoot back, so yes if you can coax the target into shooting you while you're suspect you can then attack him. And then you can also bring in logistics although they will go suspect over it, but if that happens in a mission area the chance of that being a problem is very low.
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 15617	Posted - 2014.01.27 10:21:00 - [13] - Quote Bael Malefic wrote: Great responses, all! Many thanks. I wasn't thinking attacking a corp mate...but that might of course come in handy some day. What if I deliberately got myself suspect flagged (I've read I can do this by can flipping?) then provoked the shiny ship into shooting at me? Would this allow me to gank them without CONCORD spawning on me? I understand totally that doing this is illegal, will make me a target, etc. Shoot at Mobile Tractor Units (MTU), any drones belonging to the owner that are out and set to aggressive will engage you automatically, and drop the owner of them into an unwanted limited engagement allowing you to shoot back without Concord interfering. NB this may or not be a bug, CCP may or may not fix it or change the rules regarding it.
Bael Malefic Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 9	Posted - 2014.01.27 10:59:00 - [14] - Quote Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Shoot at Mobile Tractor Units (MTU), any drones belonging to the owner that are out and set to aggressive will engage you automatically, and drop the owner of them into an unwanted limited engagement allowing you to shoot back without Concord interfering. NB this may or not be a bug, CCP may or may not fix it or change the rules regarding it. I hadn't thought of that. That might be a very useful "trigger." I am starting to think pulling this off will be a sort of hunting trip; choose the system(s) to hunt, position the ships (DPS and booster) then scan/probe down MTU's, warp to them and then try this if it's the right combo of conditions (shiny drone boat, etc.) Thanks for the feedback and advice!
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 15622	Posted - 2014.01.28 01:34:00 - [15] - Quote FYI as of Rubicon 1.1 drones will no longer engage people who shoot MTUs automatically. Rubicon 1.1 Patch Notes wrote: Drones that are set to aggressive will no longer perform automatic actions against a target if those actions would trigger a new Limited Engagement, unless explicitly instructed to engage that target.
Sabriz Adoudel Mission BLITZ 1853	Posted - 2014.01.28 04:12:00 - [16] - Quote Jonah Gravenstein wrote: FYI as of Rubicon 1.1 drones will no longer engage people who shoot MTUs automatically. Rubicon 1.1 Patch Notes wrote: Drones that are set to aggressive will no longer perform automatic actions against a target if those actions would trigger a new Limited Engagement, unless explicitly instructed to engage that target. Which means it is time to get a lot of suicide ganking ships into Apanake and Osmon, as the bears will feel safer flaunting their wealth than they did before. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. EVE's golden rule: Never trust anyone in-game unless you are sleeping with them in real life. Even then, they may only be screwing you to screw you.

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