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Neslo
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Posted - 2006.03.28 03:24:00 -
[1]
When an office goes into impound it stores everything like esecrow.... however when you go to claim it... or if you re-rent an office and you have more than 1000 individual stacks.... you lose anything from 1001 and on.
Case in point.... a corporation unrented their office and they had 2000 locked down seperate blue prints seperated out over the 7 hangars.... the office was unrented, the items nautrually went into impound. The office was re-rented and since hangar 1 can only hold 1000 unique items..... viola... blueprints 1001-2000 were destroyed....
Bad BAD bug I think.
Nes
From Ashes to Ashes... From Dust to Dust....
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Raluque
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Posted - 2006.03.30 16:06:00 -
[2]
Simple Answer: Pay your bills, not that hard.
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K thx send me isk.
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Omatje
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Posted - 2006.03.30 18:03:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Raluque
Simple Answer: Pay your bills, not that hard.
Crappiest answer .. ever!
Allthough i can imagine why CCP pulls the 1000 items stunt on us, they should at least have encoded the items to be split in separate packages.
sig? |
Hectic
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Posted - 2006.03.30 22:22:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Raluque
Simple Answer: Pay your bills, not that hard.
This is also a poor answer, due to this bug being counter productive in terms of all the "new" elements CCP have added to the game. For example with the implimentation of Outposts, there is now an unlimited amount of situations where people cannot control the loss of their offices via the "Pay Bill" feature. If you loose your station and your offices are revoked, and you are denied docking rights, there is no way you can keep your items in their hangar. This changing of station ownership happens regularly, if thousands of item stacks are lost each time, then this bug directally works aginst outposts and other conquerable structures.
Wanted Contracts
Originally by: ParMizaN
i am a pink power ranger.
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Raluque
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Posted - 2006.03.30 22:30:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Hectic
Originally by: Raluque
Simple Answer: Pay your bills, not that hard.
This is also a poor answer, due to this bug being counter productive in terms of all the "new" elements CCP have added to the game. For example with the implimentation of Outposts, there is now an unlimited amount of situations where people cannot control the loss of their offices via the "Pay Bill" feature. If you loose your station and your offices are revoked, and you are denied docking rights, there is no way you can keep your items in their hangar. This changing of station ownership happens regularly, if thousands of item stacks are lost each time, then this bug directally works aginst outposts and other conquerable structures.
In this case it is counter-productive yes.. :)
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Do you think i care? Well i don't
K thx send me isk.
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Miss Overlord
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Posted - 2006.03.31 11:05:00 -
[6]
this represents a petitionable issue and subsequent refunds
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SibSpi
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Posted - 2006.03.31 12:41:00 -
[7]
Edited by: SibSpi on 31/03/2006 12:41:34
CCP have in fact already addressed this issue with a foreword/warning to those who would have had stacks more than 1000 items.
something to the effect of "Please ensure that you make use of station containers to sort your items, as you can effectively have 1000 containers, with 1000 stacks inside them, which comes to a maximum of 1,000,000 seperate stacks."
Shouldn't be too hard to seperate things into cans.
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Neslo
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Posted - 2006.03.31 16:32:00 -
[8]
Originally by: SibSpi
Edited by: SibSpi on 31/03/2006 12:41:34
CCP have in fact already addressed this issue with a foreword/warning to those who would have had stacks more than 1000 items.
something to the effect of "Please ensure that you make use of station containers to sort your items, as you can effectively have 1000 containers, with 1000 stacks inside them, which comes to a maximum of 1,000,000 seperate stacks."
Shouldn't be too hard to seperate things into cans.
I think we have a failure to communicate... mainly you didn't read my post.
I said when you get stuff impounded (and lets say you have one container in each hangar with 1000 items in it) it still doesn't change ANYTHING... cuz as soon as it's impounded.... your stuff get's thrown out of the container.
When you RE-rent your office and get your stuff outta impound it throws it all into hangar 1. There is no choice in where to take impound from. It goes to hangar one (only).
So in your example if you have 1000 containers and they all get impounded... you are going to lose 998,999 of them.
Tell me how to avoid that and you will have addressed the OP.
Nes
From Ashes to Ashes... From Dust to Dust....
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Lolotte Garatonku
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Posted - 2006.04.01 01:13:00 -
[9]
It's not exactly a case of the cans being repackaged, in my experience they were not: the issue comes from the fact you are only allowed to have 1000 unique stacks per hangar, but each divisional hangar of a corp is treated as a separate container, which means you cna have a total of 7k unique stacks in 'first layer' of a corporation office hangars.
When this drops to impounded, and later returned when you recover the office, everything is dropped in the first divisional hangar, most likely overflowing the 1k limit for this single container, but there is no mechanism ensuring the excess stacks beyond the first 1k spillover into teh next divisions (stating teh obvious: this could be a fix).
The issue has been petitionned and bug reported already, still waiting on feedback at this point.
I suspect the same problem could happen to any entity with divisional hangars, or anywhere a repackaging of container could overflow the 1k cap on the hangar it happens in, but since my corp has been raped bare already and there is not SiSI anymore, I'll leave to others to enjoy the discovery by trial and error - I've done my share for this week. :(
Fly safe. |
BH Sharkbait
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Posted - 2006.04.01 19:47:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Raluque
Simple Answer: Pay your bills, not that hard.
this kind of responce doesn't really help anyone does it 
as regards the original post. i've tried to reproduce this on a test server and haven't been able to atm. it's possible it's already been fixed internally but i'm not sure about that atm.
can you file me a bugreport with a reproduction and as much info as you can spare and i will continue to check into it.
thx 
[Bug Report Here] - [How to write a good bugreport] |
Lolotte Garatonku
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Posted - 2006.04.01 20:21:00 -
[11]
My corp was the one Neslo referred to in his original post, and I already filed both bug report and petition documenting the issue.
I hold a copy of the bug report text, if you want, but I have no way (that I know of) to track it, so how/whether it was filed is guesswork from where I stand. 
As stated earlier, I don't feel too much like 'experimenting' further on TQ, since I have no clue how much could be lost and never recovered...
Feel free to contact me in-game (or over my acct contact email) to let me know how/if I can assist with this.
Safety Middleware Specialists |
BH Sharkbait
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Posted - 2006.04.01 20:29:00 -
[12]
no, don't experimenting on tq, leave that to me
can you file another bug report anyways please. it will be useful for me.
thx
[Bug Report Here] - [How to write a good bugreport] |
Lolotte Garatonku
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Posted - 2006.04.02 00:17:00 -
[13]
Done.
Safety Middleware Specialists |
Tachy
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Posted - 2006.04.02 10:05:00 -
[14]
Read: Our 'random' bug reports are totally useless because noone works on them.
--*=*=*--
Megadon
CCP wanted a well known artist and celebrity to test the new font so it's approval would be well known. They got Ray |
Angry Dan
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Posted - 2006.04.04 12:35:00 -
[15]
Originally by: SibSpi
Edited by: SibSpi on 31/03/2006 12:41:34
CCP have in fact already addressed this issue with a foreword/warning to those who would have had stacks more than 1000 items.
something to the effect of "Please ensure that you make use of station containers to sort your items, as you can effectively have 1000 containers, with 1000 stacks inside them, which comes to a maximum of 1,000,000 seperate stacks."
Shouldn't be too hard to seperate things into cans.
Magic me up some secure cans in my ourtpost and our PCS please.
Although in the OP's case, small cans would do the trick. BP's take up sweet FA in volume.
Intresting questions, are cans emptied when a lockdown occurs?
Oh yeah, 1000 item limit, POS hangers. I whined about it beforehand Nice to see no one is listening. Maybe I should spit out my dummy in some stylish and potentially bannable way.
++++++++++++++++++++
Founder member of the Huzzah Federation.
Remember, the grass is greener on our side of the fence
Widowmakers director
Fear my kneepads of allure!
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Tachy
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Posted - 2006.04.04 20:59:00 -
[16]
Yes, the cans are emptied and all items are dropped into a single hangar when you're going to unimpound them. Well, the items until the hangar holds 1000 items, the rest is just paid for and discarded.
--*=*=*--
Megadon
CCP wanted a well known artist and celebrity to test the new font so it's approval would be well known. They got Ray |
Lolotte Garatonku
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Posted - 2006.04.04 22:52:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Lolotte Garatonku on 04/04/2006 22:55:31
Er. One week has gone since I first petitioned this, and not a single answer ?
Should I re-file it under exploit to get user support to simply consider looking into an issue that is destructive of in-game assets and offers a serious potential for grief ?
I run 4 accounts and have been supportive of CCP during highs and lows for a good while, but this one 'feature' and apparent lack of willingness to do anything about it starts to get me worried about CCP still having a clear vision of what constitutes acceptable level of screwup to retain the trust of their users.
I don't know what happens when recovering impounded assets via payment of the impound fee, cans-wise, but recovering assets by renting back an office didn't cause cans to be repackaged in my experience, so it reduces the potential for damage.
Obviously it doesn't solve the issue of 7k unique stacks getting flushed in a single divisional hangar and hitting the 1k cap...
Safety Middleware Specialists |
Lolotte Garatonku
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Posted - 2006.04.04 22:57:00 -
[18]
I don't know what happens when recovering impounded assets via payment of the impound fee, cans-wise, but recovering assets by renting back an office didn't cause cans to be repackaged in my experience, so it reduces the potential for damage.
Obviously it doesn't solve the issue of 7k unique stacks getting flushed in a single divisional hangar and hitting the 1k cap...
Safety Middleware Specialists |
Star Nove
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Posted - 2006.04.05 12:59:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Hectic
Originally by: Raluque
Simple Answer: Pay your bills, not that hard.
This is also a poor answer, due to this bug being counter productive in terms of all the "new" elements CCP have added to the game. For example with the implimentation of Outposts, there is now an unlimited amount of situations where people cannot control the loss of their offices via the "Pay Bill" feature. If you loose your station and your offices are revoked, and you are denied docking rights, there is no way you can keep your items in their hangar. This changing of station ownership happens regularly, if thousands of item stacks are lost each time, then this bug directally works aginst outposts and other conquerable structures.
Everyone that dock and have items or offices in outposts know the risk, knwo that it's conqurable and take that risk for the benefit of being there and using the resources that aren't avalable in good 'ol safe empire. You loose, sorry for you.
-nove
Stay the Course! |
Neslo
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Posted - 2006.04.05 16:43:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Star Nove
Everyone that dock and have items or offices in outposts know the risk, knwo that it's conqurable and take that risk for the benefit of being there and using the resources that aren't avalable in good 'ol safe empire. You loose, sorry for you.
Reading ftl...
This problem exists in empire... in outposts... anywhere an office no longer exists (by choice or random stupidity) and you have 1001 or more unique items in your corp hangar.
(Personal hangar too but at least you can control that to some degree).
The person you are replying to was replying to the quite idiotic post saying "pay your bills." This isn't always possible with conquerable stations.
So are you saying that knowing that the station is conquerable somehow relates to the number of items in our corporation hangars? Yes, I take the risk that station will be taken over and that the items might get impounded, but is it my fault when I go through all the effort to take it back that I loose item number 1001 - infinity because CCP has an issue when you take stuff outta impound it all goes in one hangar? (Btw that isn't a question to be answered, it's an exercise in thinking.)
Get real... Devs WANT people to leave empire... They named an entire expansion exodus.
I see this as simply an oversight. With impound the amount need only be bumped up to 1000 per hangar and when you take something out of impound they return to their normal hangar. (BTW yes it was bug reported before RMR....)
Nes
From Ashes to Ashes... From Dust to Dust....
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Lolotte Garatonku
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Posted - 2006.04.14 10:55:00 -
[21]
Yay !
Just shy of two weeks after my initial petition, and after poking for assistance over other channels, user support finally tried to help.
Despite what I believe to be earnest efforts to solve the issue, it appears means are lacking to backlog in database history, so unless I was able to give a list of lost items (which was impossible to do), CSRs can't help.
We will have to chalk unassessed losses to paying betaware, and will factor that in deciding whether it's worth the time and money investment to keep playing EVE when such 'features' are released on production servers without testing or consideration for the obvious consequences, nor means to correct their foreseable ill effects after the fact.
I respectfully suggest CCP realizes that destroying player-controlled assets over careless design can be a dealbreaker for some, and not a very good business practice in a niche game where customer trust is a premium.
Enjoy.
Safety Middleware Specialists |
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