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Thorax vs. Caracal

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Kaffeine	Posted - 2006.04.03 18:50:00 - [1] Does the Thorax stand a chance? Caracal's can use missiles from extreme range, while Thorax is usually fitted for blasters (ie 10k or less). The only way I can see the Thorax standing a chance is if it somehow happens to warp on top of the Caracal. The reason I'm asking is because I'm Gallente, but I'm thinking of training up Caldari ships. Those missiles sure are appealing!
Juryrig	Posted - 2006.04.03 18:58:00 - [2] Well, I think most encounters happen near gates, so people are relatively close. Also, most people also put a MWD on the thorax, so it can easily get right up next to a caracal. I think it depends on how each ship is fitted though. I think both could win depending on fittings.
fmercury	Posted - 2006.04.03 18:58:00 - [3] Thorax will probably win from 30-40km on down, depending on skills. It is a moot point, since the caracal cannot scramble outside 20km, the thorax can just warp off if the caracal's too far away.
Ascendant Zephyr	Posted - 2006.04.03 19:17:00 - [4] Here is my .02 isk: Generally engagements are within 20km, in which case I believe the Thorax has the upper hand. Sure the Caracal ahs range, but like an above poster stated; the Thorax can just warp away if they aren't close enough. But if the Thorax has good skills with MWDs or good armor skills then the pilot can probably chance taking a few rounds of missiles from the Caracal. I would say that once a Thorax gets in close with blasters, its over real quick. The Caracal isn't exactly known for its ability to tank the dps the Thorax can put out.
Kaffeine	Posted - 2006.04.03 19:23:00 - [5] What if the Caracal is also using microwarpdrives to keep it's distance? I could definitely see the Thorax winning the battle if it can get within webbing range, it's just closing the distance in the first place might be difficult.
Dark Shikari	Posted - 2006.04.03 19:40:00 - [6] Edited by: Dark Shikari on 03/04/2006 19:40:02 I've fought a number of Caracal vs Rax battles at close range, including vs a platerax with Electron IIs and a gankrax. I've won every one easy, without EW . Caracal = win tbh. [23] Member: Official Forum Warrior What's with the blue robots? Click my sig.
fmercury	Posted - 2006.04.03 19:44:00 - [7] Originally by: Dark Shikari Edited by: Dark Shikari on 03/04/2006 19:40:02 I've fought a number of Caracal vs Rax battles at close range, including vs a platerax with Electron IIs and a gankrax. I've won every one easy, without EW . Caracal = win tbh. I've fought a number of Rifter vs. Caracal battles at close range, and won easy. Doesn't make a rifter better than a caracal :s
Karma Coma	Posted - 2006.04.03 19:54:00 - [8] Edited by: Karma Coma on 03/04/2006 19:54:58 Caracal with a MWD would not be able out run a Thorax for very long... Two reasons: 1. its heavier and slower; 2. and, the strain on its smaller cap. Furthermore, the caracal pilot flying around 0.0 packing missiles is not likely to choose a MWD over a extra tank module because who knows whats around the corner... Its bonus to kinetic damage wont isnt gonna help it too much against a Gallente ship either. All in all its up to skill but everything being equil I'd put my money on the thorax any day EDIT: forgot to add the thorax's bonus to mwd
Kaffeine	Posted - 2006.04.03 19:58:00 - [9] I've thought about the low cap of the Caracal as well but then the Carc could use a cap injector. Though that's unlikely right? I mean they need med slots for tanking.
Mila Prestoc	Posted - 2006.04.03 20:00:00 - [10] Ok, just for examples sake lets see what damage is if you have to travel 30km. (30000m). With MWD on the Thorax you should be doing more than 1000m/s so 30000/1000 = 30 seconds Say 8 seconds ROF on Caracal = 3 rounds 5 Missile slots = 15 missiles. 200 damage against 0 resistance = 3000 damage. So shields are gone, but with increased resistances the actual HP damage is probably 2000hp. So your shields are gone, and probably 30% of armour. If caracal has AB/web/scrambler it's tank is going to be weak, I think a plated 'rax should win, it gives you enough HP to play with and if you have NOS you can rep the damage and after the caracal has to shield boost for a bit the cap will empty. If the Caracal has a good tank and no web/ab it will do some serious damage but you can probably get out of range and run. The challenge is keeping nerve and judging if your tank will hold or if you need to run. If the 'rax pilot is clever he should not lose, but might not always win.
DeathWarrior	Posted - 2006.04.03 20:11:00 - [11] Caracal HIGH-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~~ > [ 96 \| 41] Heavy Missile Launcher II > [ 96 \| 41] Heavy Missile Launcher II > [ 96 \| 41] Heavy Missile Launcher II > [ 96 \| 41] Heavy Missile Launcher II > [ 96 \| 41] Heavy Missile Launcher II MED-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~ > [ 13 \| 58] Medium Shield Booster II > [ 0 \| 40] 'Copasetic' I Particle Field Acceleration > [ 0 \| 32] 'Anointed' I EM Ward Reinforcement > [ 0 \| 34] V-M15 Braced Multispectral Shield Matrix > [ 150 \| 25] Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I LOW-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~ > [ 1 \| 40] Ballistic Control System II > [ 0 \| 2] Local Power Plant Manager: Capacity Power Relay I Very Tight Fit, But I love it. I use it when with a partener in an inty. I am being sold! o.O
DeathWarrior	Posted - 2006.04.03 20:12:00 - [12] Thorax HIGH-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~~ > [ 212 \| 29] Heavy Neutron Blaster II [80xVoid M] > [ 212 \| 29] Heavy Neutron Blaster II [80xVoid M] > [ 212 \| 29] Heavy Neutron Blaster II [80xVoid M] > [ 10 \| 15] Light Neutron Blaster II [80xVoid S] > [ 10 \| 15] Light Neutron Blaster II [80xVoid S] MED-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~ > [ 165 \| 50] 10MN MicroWarpdrive II > [ 1 \| 24] Faint Epsilon Warp Prohibitor I > [ 1 \| 22] Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I LOW-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~ > [ 173 \| 28] Medium Armor Repairer II > [ 2 \| 30] Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II > [ 2 \| 30] Energized Reactive Membrane II > [ 1 \| 30] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II > [ 0 \| 2] Local Power Plant Manager: Capacity Power Relay I With t2 valkyres. This one is quite capable of soloing. I am being sold! o.O
Salmod	Posted - 2006.04.03 20:15:00 - [13] I use 150mm II railguns on my rax (with the 1600mm plate obviously), and I've never come across a Caracal to give me even the slightest bit of trouble... Like someone said above, if the caracal is too far away, I can just warp off (and back if the pilot is silly enough to wait). With the MWD bonus on the rax, it's easy to catch a Caracal anyway - and I can set t2 drones on it from 45km away to soften it for when I do get there... One medium NOS replenish's my cap and hurts Caracal's tank - and with Iridium ammo, I can start hitting you from about 25km (even further if I splashed out on t2 ammo)... With the huge buffer of the 1600mm plate (and EANM II's), I just can't see how a Caracal would even stand a chance... Rax ftw every time! Caracal's can deal good damage tho, so they are useful as part of a group (where they can be effective at longer ranges) - but crap solo IMHO. -[ salmod ]-
wierchas noobhunter	Posted - 2006.04.03 20:16:00 - [14] if caracal with ecm multis bye bye rax if not caracal will last 20 sec max :) btw my setup 5x ions II mwdII, web (90%), scrambler 3x mag tsbas II, 400mm tungsten plate, small repy II 5x valkerys II in drone bay
MuShRoOm ChAmPiOn	Posted - 2006.04.03 20:45:00 - [15] 50/50 tbh I can pop a thorax in my caracal, infact I've popped a ferox in it too. The only problem I have is when the pilot is well skilled to deal damage, using t2 guns and drones blaa blaa blaa, and I still have trouble with them thoraxs fitted with a 1600MM plate. Infact I still cant take down a 1600-plate thorax in my thorax loaded with an 800M plate, t2 heavy electrons and t2 hammerheads, over time the drones nibble at me. Certainly though, you dont need to fit jammers on the caracal, heres my setup: 5 X heavy launchers 1 X 10MN AB 1 X 20KM disupter 2 X invul field 1 X large shield extender II 1 X PDU 1 X BCU Nice passive tank on it.
Silicon Soul	Posted - 2006.04.03 20:50:00 - [16] Edited by: Silicon Soul on 03/04/2006 20:50:15 Even if the caracal jams the rax its at an expense of its tank and at this point the rax just has to hold out long enough for its drones to kill the caracal =\ Alt post sorry Silicon Soul = Karma Coma
Crym Synistar	Posted - 2006.04.11 08:47:00 - [17] I am farely new only 250k sp. I ended up tanking for a ferox and a vexar in a lvl 3 mission. I came out ok. I however got wasted later on in .3 space against a vexar. Any advice for neutralizing drones? I was in battle with two rats at the time he came in so didnt have a chance to git range and not to long after I was scrambled and drained of cap. My spec at the time was: 2 Arb Assault 3 TE-2100 Launchers Mix of Flameburst and Bloodclaw Standard. F-59 Shield Extender M C5-L Shield Booster Peroxide Cap Battery Em Passive Shield Amp WSC PDS Stab Again I have low skill 250k...am I better off to just stick to Empire until I hit 1mil or more? I ended up getting trashed by a ferox just before hand also while fighting rats. (I see a pattern here) I noticed that the collective thought here is that a caracal cant tank, but I had 1 less shield Ext then what i see reccomended in this forum and more then likely a mil or more less then most of the players listing these fittings yet I seem to tank fine.

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