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Faction dreadnoughts

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Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 348	Posted - 2014.02.07 12:37:00 - [1] - Quote Someone can say - we don't need more capitals. I cannot agree more, but dreads are not OP when compared with other capital ships. When they do damage they cannot repair remote help or hit smaller targets. This idea is not about making them more powerful but to create additional ISK sink - as this game needs them badly. We are not talking about faction carriers! My idea is to add both Navy and Pirate version of each dreadnought. 1. BPC, and only BPC will be available on faction LP store for 20k LP and 250 (navy) or 50k lp 500 (pirate) mil isk. 2. Each BPC will have T1 Hull and PL materials as requirements. 3. Navy faction will get flat bonus specific for race +15 % of armor or shield / Pirate faction will get 15% flat bonus to cap recharge. Those bonuses are only suggestions to start discussion. Main goal - no bonuses that will affect DPS Pirate dreads > Faction Dreads No changes in weapon systems. Acceptable ones : - bigger fuel bay - less stront per cycle - faster align time - more passive buffer etc. Insurance payout for dread will be equal to normal Goal is simple - that each faction dread dead will remove isk from EVE. Faction Dreadnoughts
Schmata Bastanold Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo 1375	Posted - 2014.02.07 12:43:00 - [2] - Quote Meh, better idea would be to introduce command ships in frig and dessie classes. Much more needed, much more useful, much more fun, much more accessible to new players, much more explodable. I am not my skills but... http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schmata_Bastanold
Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 348	Posted - 2014.02.07 12:53:00 - [3] - Quote We have pirate navy frigates, cruisers, battlecruisers , battleships. ( yes we are missing destroyers). We also have faction command ships. All Navy battle cruisers "Can fit Warfare Link modules ". All of them you build from base materials. What im suggesting base on modification of T1 hull. The only goal for this suggestion is to make additional isk sink. I think 80-90 % of new dreads that will have rigs fitted will be Navy or Pirate version , and at the same time the base version will still have the same DPS. Faction Dreadnoughts
Batelle Komm susser Tod 1603	Posted - 2014.02.07 13:13:00 - [4] - Quote BPC typically require a lot more LP than that and a lot less isk. Seriously those amounts of LP pretty much represent.. 4-5 missions at most. "CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!" Never forget.
Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 349	Posted - 2014.02.07 13:17:00 - [5] - Quote Batelle wrote: BPC typically require a lot more LP than that and a lot less isk. Seriously those amounts of LP pretty much represent.. 4-5 missions at most. My idea is not about creating LP sink but ISK sink. 25/50k LP is just to make LP still useful and be consistent. Faction Dreadnoughts
Schmata Bastanold Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo 1375	Posted - 2014.02.07 13:25:00 - [6] - Quote No matter your intention it is still about introducing more caps into a game that really doesn't need any more of them. And reason for it is that in YOUR OPINION there is too much ISK flowing around. I am not my skills but... http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schmata_Bastanold
Kenrailae Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships. 175	Posted - 2014.02.07 13:27:00 - [7] - Quote I agree that Command Destroyers would be a better choice for dev's at this point. But even more than that would be Capital rebalance. However, if you want to give me a Serpentis Moros with web bonuses... TY PLS. The Law is a point of View
Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 349	Posted - 2014.02.07 13:28:00 - [8] - Quote I don't want to introduce more caps in the game, and im talking about the only capital ship that is not abused. If you want to have DPS on dread you have to siege. Bonuses of those navy/pirate versions will not be affecting main aspect of dread - DPS. You will not see more caps - just faction ones. Kenrailae wrote: I agree that Command Destroyers would be a better choice for dev's at this point. But even more than that would be Capital rebalance. However, if you want to give me a Serpentis Moros with web bonuses... TY PLS. No im not talking about this kind of abuse. All Navy will get the same bonus - for example 10% more armor or shield. All Pirate will again get the same bonus - for example 15% cap recharge . They just will be a bit better than normal ones and Pirate faction will be again a bit better than Navy ones. Faction Dreadnoughts
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 1261	Posted - 2014.02.07 13:35:00 - [9] - Quote Thukker issue Naglfar (as per empire age novel).. IGNORE CYNO JAMMERS.. muhuahuahuahuahuahua!!! "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
Kenrailae Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships. 175	Posted - 2014.02.07 13:38:00 - [10] - Quote I actually have to disagree with both of you. Eve could use more capitals. Not stupidly broken Supers, or mega fleet Slow cats, but more capitals. There is a decent amount of support for something in the field of an escort/light carrier. The details for the idea vary from group to group, but something like this could definitely be used considerably. Less rep/tank than a carrier Less drone bay Less ship maint. bay Some iterations float the idea of it being able to fit a couple capital turrets, or a rack of large weapons Cheaper to build Easier to get into Some iterations sway back and forth on the fighters Some iterations disagree on whether this should be high sec or just low/null capable, but high sec capable minus capital mods + bonuses to large(significant bonuses) has been tossed around. Basic idea is like a battle orca + Domi I'd really like to see that. I'd also like to see a combat oriented cap, something built to stay on the field for a long time, if not do tons of DPS. And another ship along the lines of the dread, but able to more DPS out of siege, but much less while in it, with all the penalties of x-l weapons. Eve has plenty of room for capital expansion. Cap expansion may be the answer to the cap problem where nothing else really can be. But only 4 caps, at least 2 of which are stupidly broken, is not good for the game. The Law is a point of View

Kenhi sama Project Stealth Squad The Initiative. 5	Posted - 2014.02.07 13:41:00 - [11] - Quote Anthar Thebess wrote: Goal is simple - that each faction dread dead will remove isk from EVE. That is totally wrong, because the isk went into the pockets of the producer, and the miners and ist NOT gone! The opposite is right: When it dies it gives isk to the player via insurance. The only time isk would leave new eden in this scenerio is, when the bpc is bought in the lp store with isk.
Schmata Bastanold Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo 1376	Posted - 2014.02.07 13:45:00 - [12] - Quote If they will have same DPS but better tank or cap they will completely replace current dreads because nobody uses inferior ships unless it is for lolz or out of boredom or their own preference And caps are rather not a class of ships where you choose one over another just for lolz. And with amount of grind people are capable of doing there is no way new dreads would stay very unique and exceptional commodity. Unless their prices would be at ludicrous levels which would simply lead them to being mostly ignored. At least that is my opinion. I am not my skills but... http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schmata_Bastanold
Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 351	Posted - 2014.02.07 14:08:00 - [13] - Quote Kenhi sama wrote: Anthar Thebess wrote: Goal is simple - that each faction dread dead will remove isk from EVE. That is totally wrong, because the isk went into the pockets of the producer, and the miners and ist NOT gone! The opposite is right: When it dies it gives isk to the player via insurance. The only time isk would leave new eden in this scenerio is, when the bpc is bought in the lp store with isk. Read my suggestion. You buy BPC that cost 250 or 500 mil isk. Material requirements for each this BPC is T1 Hull and some PL materials. ISK spent in LP store will be removed from game. Someone still have to build T1 hull so no carebear miner will be harmed during the process. Insurance payout will be equal to T1 hull. Faction Dreadnoughts
unidenify Caldari Provisions Caldari State 36	Posted - 2014.02.07 14:25:00 - [14] - Quote sure, after they fix Phoenix issue otherwise Navy Phoenix is just piece of junk with camo paint.
Deadonstick Puppyseeker Scarlet...Widow 7	Posted - 2014.02.07 15:37:00 - [15] - Quote Dreads have always seemed more like a T2 ship to me than they ever seemed to be capitals. Their use is very very specific, just like a T2 ship. They're just way too specialized imo. So yeah, a pirate Dread might not be the worst idea. +1 Despite what you may have heard there's only one rule of EVE: Never stop learning and realise there's always a lot more to be learned. To this end, seek wisdom in everything.
Danika Princip Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team 2436	Posted - 2014.02.07 17:42:00 - [16] - Quote You do realise that's less LP than a one run BPC for a bloody FRIGATE, right?
Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 351	Posted - 2014.02.09 11:26:00 - [17] - Quote Yes. The main idea is to create ISK not LP sink. Dreads are only capital and super capital ships that dont rise any issues. I know that phoenix is almost worthless - but - this is the BEST capital ship for structure grinding. It can overdps any other ship. On good skills it will do more damage than mothership. Excelent skills, faction stuff , missile implants and you can get over 14k dps on it o.0 - but only for structure bashing. Faction Dreadnoughts
Danika Princip Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team 2443	Posted - 2014.02.09 13:16:00 - [18] - Quote Anthar Thebess wrote: Yes. The main idea is to create ISK not LP sink. Dreads are only capital and super capital ships that dont rise any issues. I know that phoenix is almost worthless - but - this is the BEST capital ship for structure grinding. It can overdps any other ship. On good skills it will do more damage than mothership. Excelent skills, faction stuff , missile implants and you can get over 14k dps on it o.0 - but only for structure bashing. But the people who are going to be buying these things will view 250, or even 500 million ISK as pocket change. It's not a particularly good ISK sink.. Hell, I just went and checked. A battleship BPC costs 200 million. Fifty million over that price is a joke.
Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 351	Posted - 2014.02.10 06:42:00 - [19] - Quote If you are talking about faction battleships check how much they are better than a t1 version. I dont want buff the dreads in the aspect of DPS , but give them some bonuses that will still make them preferable. Faction Dreadnoughts
Paikis Vapour Holdings 1077	Posted - 2014.02.10 07:06:00 - [20] - Quote Hahahaha. Just had an amusing thought. Angels ships are OP because they are fast and agile. Angel's Dreadnaught has agility and mass bonuses, and then it activates siege LOLOLOLOL.

Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 351	Posted - 2014.02.10 07:07:00 - [21] - Quote Like i stated before - pirate bonuses will be similar for all dreadnoughts and not connected to specific faction. Faction Dreadnoughts
Luscius Uta Unleashed' Fury Forsaken Federation 72	Posted - 2014.02.10 08:09:00 - [22] - Quote Paikis wrote: Hahahaha. Just had an amusing thought. Angels ships are OP because they are fast and agile. Angel's Dreadnaught has agility and mass bonuses, and then it activates siege LOLOLOLOL. Don't like the OP's idea, but Angel Dread with a falloff bonus to Capital Projectiles would be pretty sweet. But I guess it would be logical for CCP to introduce pirate destroyers and battlecruisers first.
Catherine Laartii Providence Guard Templis CALSF 64	Posted - 2014.02.10 08:28:00 - [23] - Quote an appropriate LP cost would be 2.5 million. Perhaps they could circumvent the issue of RR during siege by doing away with siege entirely, and apply damage bonuses directly to the ship itself? I think it would be appropriate, considering each one would be worth nearly as much as a titan...
Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 351	Posted - 2014.02.10 09:55:00 - [24] - Quote Funny where this idea is going. But we already have more than enough items to get from LP store. This is not to create new one , it is just to introduce ISK sink. To much isk is in the system, and i don't want to introduce something that will brake dreads. Faction Dreadnoughts
Janeway84 Aliastra Gallente Federation 77	Posted - 2014.02.10 11:28:00 - [25] - Quote Faction/Pirate Capitals would be a nice way to Spark some happyness and joy into the old bitter vets living it out in low and 0.0 space Other than that I dont have a clue how they would look like or work like.
Danika Princip Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team 2451	Posted - 2014.02.10 13:39:00 - [26] - Quote Anthar Thebess wrote: Funny where this idea is going. But we already have more than enough items to get from LP store. This is not to create new one , it is just to introduce ISK sink. To much isk is in the system, and i don't want to introduce something that will brake dreads. Then quadruple the price. If you can afford the several billion for a fitted dread, you can afford to drop some pocket change and an hour's LP on the faction upgrade.
Anthar Thebess REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN 353	Posted - 2014.02.10 13:53:00 - [27] - Quote Ask youself how many people will pay x2 or x3 more for dread that will not have any significant bonuses. Then ask yourself if you will pay additional 250 or 500 million for a bit better dread. Its like placing faction stuff on your dread, just those isk will be actually removed from the eve , and not passing to another player. First of all - when you buy a dread there is almost no isk removed from the system, it is just passing from hands to hands of players. Next thing is base payout or insurance isk that will be added to your wallet when the dread is destroyed - and we are talking about hunders of millon isk that are just created. (Un)insured (T1) dead dread = isk from base payout feeded to the system. Faction/Pirate hull destroyed = Half of base payout ( faction) almost non (pirate) going to the system. So like you see each faction dread killed will actually still put isk to the system, but in smaller numbers. Faction Dreadnoughts
Secret Squirrell Allied Press Intergalactic 75	Posted - 2014.02.10 16:08:00 - [28] - Quote The thing with dreads is that, outside a wormhole, once you hit seige, there is basically nothing you can do to change whether you live or die. Get primaried, refit max tank, pray. Your faction/pirate dread would need a major bonus to change that, a bigger bonus then I think CCP would be willing to give. You'll note that it is very rare to see a dread with expensive upgrades except (1) Faction Damage Mods (2) T2 Damage/Tracking/Range rigs (3) Meta Guns; all applied damage bonsues. You never see a dread with say a deadspace tank (outside wormholes at least). When you seige the dread, you roll the dice, treating it as an expendable that may or may not survive. If we therefor assume dreads are expendable, then the main question is whether the faction dread increases applied damage enough to justify its price tag. Potential bonuses proposed by OP: Cap Bonus - Useless for combat, only use is getting to jump cap quicker for extract Bigger fuel bay - Useless for combat, its rare to not have enough room as iss Less stront per cycle - Useless for combat - Stront it practically free, and any engagement that could use up as much stront as most people carry will tidi so bad it will take 10 hours to use it all. Faster align time - If its serious, you jump out rather than align More passive buffer - This one is potentially useful at a fleet level, but for the individual it just means you die slower. Really not sure how much anyone would pay for those bonuses. Not very much I think. Furthermore, some of those would require everyone in fleet to have the faction version or they are even less useful. Having more fuel then the rest of your fleet... not very helpful. We don't want to end up with a situation where the only people who fly them do it because they are rare, not better, like the revenant. (Which is many times more expensive, and regarded as inferior in combat) Want a potentially interesting bonus: -20% Siege duration -20% Stront use
Enya Sparhawk State Protectorate Caldari State 10	Posted - 2014.02.10 23:49:00 - [29] - Quote The only way you could possible make this feasible is if you were to enable dreads for orbital bombardments... F+¡orghr+í: Gr+í na f+¡rinne D+¬an g+íire...Tiocfaidh +ír l+í
KiithSoban Big Johnson's PLEASE NOT VIOLENCE OUR BOATS 31	Posted - 2014.02.11 00:23:00 - [30] - Quote I think you may be going the wrong direction with this. I would agree to a navy/pirate faction dread that was 2/3 as effective as "dreads today". I agree with the isk sink idea. Trading a high value item and buying blueprints with isk does create more faucets. With the introduction of "lesser" faction and faction navy dreads, it opens up the ability for these ships to have structure grind or "magically counts for [insert fraction] of its mass when traveling through a WH." bonuses. But I may be trying to kill too many birds with one stone here. I want to see logi appear on killmails! (by just repping)-á See CSM "reasonable things"

KiithSoban Big Johnson's PLEASE NOT VIOLENCE OUR BOATS 31	Posted - 2014.02.11 00:24:00 - [31] - Quote KiithSoban wrote: I think you may be going the wrong direction with this. I would agree to a navy/pirate faction "dread" that was 2/3 as effective as "dreads today". I agree with the isk sink idea. Trading a high value item and buying blueprints with isk does create more faucets. With the introduction of "lesser" faction and faction navy dreads, it opens up the ability for these ships to have structure grind or "magically counts for [insert fraction] of its mass when traveling through a WH." bonuses. But I may be trying to kill too many birds with one stone here. I want to see logi appear on killmails! (by just repping)-á See CSM "reasonable things"
Jureth22 Vanguard Frontiers Black Legion. 158	Posted - 2014.02.21 18:56:00 - [32] - Quote funny.now shut up coven
Baron Jasta Caldari Provisions Caldari State 0	Posted - 2014.02.22 11:50:00 - [33] - Quote Well if you want an isk sink how about black ops dreads, able to jump to covert cynos


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