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Neil armstrong
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Posted - 2006.05.01 16:11:00 -
[1]
im not quite sure what this entails atm i use 50% active hardners is it possible to exceed this with passive hardners and the armour compensation skills? what exactly do they do i know when i fit active hardners but dont turn them on i get a bonus
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Bunneh Gurl
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Posted - 2006.05.01 16:55:00 -
[2]
Passive hardeners increase your resistances in your armour without using any cap. You can get 30 and 40% with faction hardeners and they are not all that expensive. They are normally CPU heavy and power grid light. Armour compensation skill gives an extra 5% to your resistances using passive hardeners and 3% to actives when they are turned off, IIRC.
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Neil armstrong
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Posted - 2006.05.01 16:59:00 -
[3]
so if i fit a thermal passive with 30% and get the skill to lvl5 il get 55% from the passive hardner?
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Neothas
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Posted - 2006.05.01 17:36:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Neil armstrong
so if i fit a thermal passive with 30% and get the skill to lvl5 il get 55% from the passive hardner?
Actually it would be closer to 38% (30x1.05^5).
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Neil armstrong
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Posted - 2006.05.01 17:42:00 -
[5]
so even with maxed skills il still be way short of actives??
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Neothas
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Posted - 2006.05.01 17:55:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Neil armstrong
so even with maxed skills il still be way short of actives??
Pretty much... With no cap usage, I don't see CCP ever making passive hardeners as good as actives. Unless of course they found some other trade off to make them viable, but not overpowered.
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Neil armstrong
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Posted - 2006.05.01 18:03:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Tryptic Photon
Originally by: Bunneh Gurl
gives an extra 5% to your resistances using passive hardeners and 3% to actives when they are turned off, IIRC.
So with actives turned on, the 3% bonus is no longer present?
nope
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Tryptic Photon
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Posted - 2006.05.01 18:03:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Bunneh Gurl
gives an extra 5% to your resistances using passive hardeners and 3% to actives when they are turned off, IIRC.
So with actives turned on, the 3% bonus is no longer present?
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Hasan Rachid
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Posted - 2006.05.01 19:50:00 -
[9]
The bonus works very well on tech 2 ships though, I prefer passive plates in my Muninn.
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Neil armstrong
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Posted - 2006.05.01 21:09:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Hasan Rachid
The bonus works very well on tech 2 ships though, I prefer passive plates in my Muninn.
y better on t2?
and is it deffo 38% rather than 55%???
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Hiccup
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Posted - 2006.05.02 03:46:00 -
[11]
You're also saving Cap so you can run your shield booster longer. It's up to your setup really. I just learned some great ones that are passive tanks.
*BURP* |
Mirra Saoi
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Posted - 2006.05.02 04:11:00 -
[12]
I swear this thread wasn't here when I posted my other one, I'll just toss a quick clarification question in...
The skill reads that you get the % bonus to your armor resistance, not to the resistance granted by the module... So it would be 55% instead of 38%.... which is the case in actuality?
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Neil armstrong
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Posted - 2006.05.02 07:24:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Neil armstrong on 02/05/2006 07:33:20
now im confused iv just had a play with passive mods i got 2 x 32.5% hardners with the compensation skill to lvl3 i thought id get a 47.5% bonus per hadner but it doesnt work like that at all
the 1st hardner gave me 67% extra!! the 2nd gave 22% so 1 passive hardner gave better resist than 1 active but 2 actives gave better than 2 passives AND 1 passive 1 active
its bloody confusing this i have no idea what the formula is or how much the skill affects it
i think
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Stephen HB
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Posted - 2006.05.02 09:01:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Neil armstrong
Edited by: Neil armstrong on 02/05/2006 07:33:20
now im confused iv just had a play with passive mods i got 2 x 32.5% hardners with the compensation skill to lvl3 i thought id get a 47.5% bonus per hadner but it doesnt work like that at all
the 1st hardner gave me 67% extra!! the 2nd gave 22% so 1 passive hardner gave better resist than 1 active but 2 actives gave better than 2 passives AND 1 passive 1 active
its bloody confusing this i have no idea what the formula is or how much the skill affects it
i think
I strongly doubt that. What were the resistance values before and after adding the passive hardener?
-- Originally by: Drayce
Between the learning skills and the tutorial, Eve is like a firewall against the attention deficit kids.
EVE Tracking Guide |
Astrum Ludus
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Posted - 2006.05.02 09:06:00 -
[15]
This is from memory so I can't check, but if you fit a plate modified by the skills and then show info doesn't tell you the modified applied %?
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NoNamium
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Posted - 2006.05.02 11:31:00 -
[16]
Using Branch-n-Bound for optimizing setups, passive armor tanking often comes out on top.
It's just more efficient Armor Point/Cap -wise
- NoNamium
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Shinca
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Posted - 2006.05.02 13:21:00 -
[17]
the armor compensation skill is one of the most unclear ones when it comes to description, mainly because it works differently for active and passive hardeners
for passive hardeners you get a 5% increase to your base resistance... so you get 5% bonus to your base resistance per skill level, which means you multiply base resistance with 1+(skill_lvl*0.05)
example: 30% passive resistance plate, skill at lvl 5, you end up with 30%*1.25=37.5% resistance
for active hardeners you get flat 3% resistance per level, so with skill at 5 you get 15% resistance but only until you switch the active hardener on...
as for getting better resistance with passive hardeners... no, you can't since best active ones are 64% but you can get resistance pretty high (over 55% with best passive ones, so better than faction or T2 hardeners)
Slovenian EVE forum |
NoNamium
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Posted - 2006.05.02 14:17:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Shinca
*snip*
as for getting better resistance with passive hardeners... no, you can't since best active ones are 64% but you can get resistance pretty high (over 55% with best passive ones, so better than faction or T2 hardeners)
Well, the point isn't to have the highest amount of resist, but to be able to withstand as much damage per time as possible 
- NoNamium
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AaronKennedy
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Posted - 2006.05.02 19:06:00 -
[19]
Quote:
example: 30% passive resistance plate, skill at lvl 5, you end up with 30%*1.25=37.5% resistance
so using your calculations
if i use a energized reactive membrane ll which has a base resistance of 37.5
i should get 37.5*1.25= 46.875% resistance if i have the armour exp skill to lvl5
hmmmm...that'll b going on my Ishkur then
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Neothas
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Posted - 2006.05.02 21:35:00 -
[20]
Originally by: AaronKennedy
Quote:
example: 30% passive resistance plate, skill at lvl 5, you end up with 30%*1.25=37.5% resistance
so using your calculations
if i use a energized reactive membrane ll which has a base resistance of 37.5
i should get 37.5*1.25= 46.875% resistance if i have the armour exp skill to lvl5
hmmmm...that'll b going on my Ishkur then
The calculations are a bit off....though not much. *1.25 is a good ballpark figure, but the true equation would be 37.5*(1.05^5) or (37.5*1.05*1.05*1.05*1.05*1.05) which equals 47.86%
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wired2kill
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Posted - 2006.05.02 22:40:00 -
[21]
anyone know the resistances you would get if u used 2x tech2 energized adapative nano's with all the armour skills to lvl4.
i know theres a stacking penalty, but maths really isnt my strong point
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Benglada
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Posted - 2006.05.03 03:33:00 -
[22]
you can get faction 40% passives for about 10m (not much) with perfect armor comp skills its about the same as active more or less.
---------------------------
Originally by: Wrangler
Unfrtinately you dnot get to vote.. 
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Lorette
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Posted - 2006.05.03 09:27:00 -
[23]
I believe theres a very nice faction mod (thats never up on escrow for some odd reason ^^) that can give about 48% passive to all stats with max compensation skills. VERY nice indeed  , EANM II gives 25% to all with max skills and if you look at 3 of them it comes quite close to 3x active (+ you get the 4th dmg type as a bonus).
60->70.00->76.00->80.80
10->32.50->47.70->58.16
35->51.25->62.25->69.80
35->51.25->62.25->69.80
Thats with 3 EANM's (and before anyone shoots that down i guessed the stacking penalty ^'s based on 100% on the first 90% on the 2nd 80% on the third).
60->60.00
10->59.50
35->70.75
35->70.75
3 active hardners (55%) on all but EM, as you can see its pretty close with either its likely the stacking penalty is worse than i have accounted for but they are still fairly close imo.
If your running missions 2-3 actives are always > than passives (unless your in a frig)
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Kanuo Ashkeron
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Posted - 2006.05.03 11:20:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Kanuo Ashkeron on 03/05/2006 11:21:30
Originally by: Neothas
The calculations are a bit off....though not much. *1.25 is a good ballpark figure, but the true equation would be 37.5*(1.05^5) or (37.5*1.05*1.05*1.05*1.05*1.05) which equals 47.86%
So this skill works different than all other skills? Normally you get a factor of (1+x*lvl), where x is the bonus (like 0.05 or 5%).
Furthermore you took the final result of the above equation, as the start value for your computation.
The correct comparison is following:
a) 30% * 1.25 = 37.5
b) 30% * 1.05^5 ~= 38.3
If same like all the other skills, method a) is the correct one.
Kanuo
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Neothas
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Posted - 2006.05.03 19:53:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Kanuo Ashkeron
Edited by: Kanuo Ashkeron on 03/05/2006 11:21:30
Originally by: Neothas
The calculations are a bit off....though not much. *1.25 is a good ballpark figure, but the true equation would be 37.5*(1.05^5) or (37.5*1.05*1.05*1.05*1.05*1.05) which equals 47.86%
So this skill works different than all other skills? Normally you get a factor of (1+x*lvl), where x is the bonus (like 0.05 or 5%).
Furthermore you took the final result of the above equation, as the start value for your computation.
The correct comparison is following:
a) 30% * 1.25 = 37.5
b) 30% * 1.05^5 ~= 38.3
If same like all the other skills, method a) is the correct one.
Kanuo
You're right. It's a), I just verified it on my main character. It seems that skills don't follow the same math as modules. Sorry for the confusion.
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Passepartout
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Posted - 2006.05.04 11:36:00 -
[26]
With very few exceptions(The fubared Margin trading fx):
Skill levels are additive.
Skills are multiplicative.
Modules are multiplicative.
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