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Change Fleet Command Ship models to Tier II Battlecruiser models.

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Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 9	Posted - 2011.11.14 18:52:00 - [1] - Quote I'm sure this will have come up before (had a quick look but did not see it, probably on the old forum). I also know CCP have said they would not do this, in the past. But with the upcoming expansion and the introduction of Tier III Battlecruisers, I want to throw this out there again. If enough people want it, it may be considered. Fleet Command Ships would stay as they are: Amarr: Damnation - Prophecy hull Minmater: Claymore - Cyclone hull Gallente: Eos - Brutix hull Caldari: Vulture - Ferox hull Field Command Ships would move to Tier II models: Amarr: Absolution - Harbinger hull Minmater: Sleipnir - Hurricane hull Gallente: Astarte - Myrmidon hull Caldari: Nighthawk - Drake hull I would love to see Nighthawks as black with the red Kaalakiota diagonals on it. Or a gold and red harbi. Of course the problem will be in the blueprints people are using to make them. But I am sure some sort of fair way of sorting that could be found. Perhaps offering a one time only swap of the Tier I blueprint to the equivalent Tier II?
Kayla Wallows Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 0	Posted - 2011.11.14 18:54:00 - [2] - Quote I can agree with this idea, I would be more inclined to buying and flying a sleipnir as a hurricane hull, while the Claymore remained in the Cyclone Hull. I fully endorse and agree with this suggestion.
Lykouleon Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation 328	Posted - 2011.11.14 21:55:00 - [3] - Quote How do you propose the slot layouts be changed in order to accommodate the change in the hull? As well, how will the different characteristics of the hull (ie: the myrm is a drone boat versus the brutix which is a blaster boat) and the bonuses from the different hulls change in lieu of the new hull? hint think more hint Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER SO I CAN HIT THEM WITH MY SWORD WIdot Director of Quality Control and Ironically Signing My Title to Posts To Make People ~mad~
Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 13	Posted - 2011.11.14 23:12:00 - [4] - Quote Lykouleon wrote: hint think more hint I don't recall saying anything about fittings, slot layout or stats. All the Tier II models have enough gun ports to support the existing ship compositions. The Ferox if a gunship. The current Nighthawk is a missile boat. So your Myrm/Brutix analogy is already irrelevant. Another example is the Navy Issue Scorpion compared with the vanilla version. Same model, different ship style. Where is it written the T2 ships have to follow the style of the T1 ships? I'm not sure what your point is? This is purely an aesthetic change.
Jade Constantine Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 842	Posted - 2011.11.15 00:07:00 - [5] - Quote Agreed with this, will make for more variety for sure and I'd love to see the t2 versions of the cane and harbinger :) The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom. Jericho Fraction is Recruiting!
Mara Rinn Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium 275	Posted - 2011.11.15 01:00:00 - [6] - Quote Lykouleon wrote: As well, how will the different characteristics of the hull (ie: the myrm is a drone boat versus the brutix which is a blaster boat) and the bonuses from the different hulls change in lieu of the new hull? Funny thing with your specific comparison is that the Myrmidon has 6 prominent turret slots, and the Prophecy is a laser boat while the Damnation is a missile boat. Not to mention that CCP is working on visible missile launchers. Saul's suggested mapping is what I'd go with: why oh why wasn't the Nighthawk based on a Drake hull, since it gets similar bonuses to the Drake?
Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 15	Posted - 2011.11.15 01:09:00 - [7] - Quote Mara Rinn wrote: why oh why wasn't the Nighthawk based on a Drake hull, since it gets similar bonuses to the Drake? To be fair, on that specific point, the Command Ships were introduced before the Tier II Battlecruisers, so there was only one set of models to choose from at the time. I might photoshop up some screen shots of the Tier IIs into the relevant skins. For my own curiosity if nothing else.
Nick Bison Bison Industrial Inc Thundering Herd 2	Posted - 2011.11.15 02:29:00 - [8] - Quote Saul wrote: I would love to see Nighthawks as black with the red Kaalakiota diagonals on it. Or a gold and red harbi. This is a pretty thin reason for this drastic of a change. If you think it thru a bit better, as to slot layout changes to support this and any needed CPU/PG changes you may get some movement. But not just for seeing a black nighthawk. Side note: I really like the idea of each races command ships coming from the two different hulls.
Black Dranzer 69	Posted - 2011.11.15 08:19:00 - [9] - Quote Yes, for the love of God.I might actually be tempted to fly a command ship if it didn't look like ass.
Levistus Junior Trojan Trolls Controlled Chaos 1	Posted - 2011.11.15 12:56:00 - [10] - Quote Good idea. Would love to see some new models in game
Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 23	Posted - 2011.11.17 22:07:00 - [11] - Quote Ok first up... Astarte Absolution Nighthawk and Sleipnir to come.
Temmu Guerra Sickle Moon Intrepid Crossing 9	Posted - 2011.11.17 22:17:00 - [12] - Quote I support this for just being able to get a black harby on looks alone! =D
Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 23	Posted - 2011.11.17 22:33:00 - [13] - Quote Temmu Guerra wrote: I support this for just being able to get a black harby on looks alone! =D Um... assuming you mean the Damnation, as per the OP, it would retain the Prophecy model.
Aineko Macx Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 20	Posted - 2011.11.19 10:53:00 - [14] - Quote For consistency, the Field CS would then have to be invented using the tier 2 BC BPCs. I somewhat approve of this. But tbh, the biggest problem with CS is that they've become overshadowed by T3's (displacing Fleet CS) and tier 2 BCs (displacing Field CS).
Rawbone S3MINAL FLUID Below Me. 5	Posted - 2011.11.19 17:24:00 - [15] - Quote supported. Without introducing any significant change to mechanics, this proposal adds a little colour to the game.
Gerrick Palivorn Caldari Provisions Caldari State 10	Posted - 2011.11.20 11:29:00 - [16] - Quote Given the use and capability of CS's right now I think that a reworking of the hulls and the bonuses are in order. Right now the only CS that I know of being used on grid as a command ship is the Absolution, everything else seems to take a back seat or is covered by Tier II BC's and T3's. +1
Max Von Sydow Droneboat Diplomacy 52	Posted - 2011.11.20 13:44:00 - [17] - Quote Saul Dhampir wrote: Ok first up... Astarte Absolution Nighthawk and Sleipnir to come. Wouldn't the myrm be better for the Eos? Since the Eos is a droneboat and the astarte has more hardpoints than the myrm model?
Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 27	Posted - 2011.11.20 20:20:00 - [18] - Quote And the others: Nighthawk Sleipnir
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 941	Posted - 2011.11.21 10:16:00 - [19] - Quote Aineko Macx wrote: For consistency, the Field CS would then have to be invented using the tier 2 BC BPCs. I somewhat approve of this. But tbh, the biggest problem with CS is that they've become overshadowed by T3's (displacing Fleet CS) and tier 2 BCs (displacing Field CS). No they have not. 0.0 fleet warfare still depends heavily on Fleet Commands for links, since those ships can actually fit tanks unlike three-link T3s. Field Commands have T2 resists and dual bonuses, so they are not overshadowed by tier 2 BCs by a long shot.
Fon Revedhort Monks of War DarkSide. 27	Posted - 2011.11.21 19:16:00 - [20] - Quote How about this: Command ships remain as they are. Instead we change tier2 battlecruisers so that they aren't OP anymore: - harbinger gets one turret, one one hi-slot and one low-slot removed; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly; dronebay is now 25m3 - drake loses one launcher, one hi-slot and one medium slot; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly; shield resistance bonus is swapped for something more appropriate - myrmydon loses one low-slot; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly - hurricane loses one high- and one low-slot; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly; dronebay is now 15m3 2008, CCP Zulu(park): "command ships are fine as is" 2011, CCP Greyscale: "is the Nighthawk actually underpowered?" Nice progress, guys.
Julia Connor Caldari Provisions Caldari State 2	Posted - 2011.11.21 20:47:00 - [21] - Quote Ermm... good idea but can I haz the sleip the way it is.
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 961	Posted - 2011.11.22 10:24:00 - [22] - Quote Fon Revedhort wrote: How about this: Command ships remain as they are. Instead we change tier2 battlecruisers so that they aren't OP anymore: - harbinger gets one turret, one one hi-slot and one low-slot removed; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly; dronebay is now 25m3 - drake loses one launcher, one hi-slot and one medium slot; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly; shield resistance bonus is swapped for something more appropriate - myrmydon loses one low-slot; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly - hurricane loses one high- and one low-slot; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly; dronebay is now 15m3 Since when are they overpowered?
Fon Revedhort Monks of War DarkSide. 27	Posted - 2011.11.22 11:09:00 - [23] - Quote Andski wrote: Since when are they overpowered? Since the introduction. 2008, CCP Zulu(park): "command ships are fine as is" 2011, CCP Greyscale: "is the Nighthawk actually underpowered?" Nice progress, guys.
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 962	Posted - 2011.11.22 14:29:00 - [24] - Quote Fon Revedhort wrote: Andski wrote: Since when are they overpowered? Since the introduction. You're pretty dumb
Aineko Macx Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 21	Posted - 2011.11.23 07:36:00 - [25] - Quote Fon Revedhort wrote: How about this: Command ships remain as they are. Instead we change tier2 battlecruisers so that they aren't OP anymore I'm not sure about the exact proposed nerfs, but I tend to agree that the Drake and to a lesser extent the Cane are overpowered. If you do this for balancing, you also have to nerf command T3's.
Super Chair Hell's Revenge Flatline. 34	Posted - 2011.11.23 10:23:00 - [26] - Quote Nighthawk should always be the ferox hull, see enough drakes as it is
Jerick Ludhowe Shadow Legion Industries Dark Phoenix Rising. 26	Posted - 2011.11.23 13:22:00 - [27] - Quote Fon Revedhort wrote: How about this: Command ships remain as they are. Instead we change tier2 battlecruisers so that they aren't OP anymore: - harbinger gets one turret, one one hi-slot and one low-slot removed; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly; dronebay is now 25m3 - drake loses one launcher, one hi-slot and one medium slot; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly; shield resistance bonus is swapped for something more appropriate - myrmydon loses one low-slot; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly - hurricane loses one high- and one low-slot; CPU and grid are reduced accordingly; dronebay is now 15m3 I think that these nerfs are a little bit too steep. I'd much rather the tier 2 BC be treated as the benchmark that the entire class strive for. This would mean an increase to tier 1 BC performance with a possible increase to production cost to keep things balanced. I also believe that Field Commands should be re-evaluated and slightly improved as the introduction of tier 2 bcs and tech 3 cruisers has more or less removed any advantage these ships once had. At the very least Field and Fleet Command ships should be given the hp buff that was applied to BC hulls back in 2006ish, for some reason this hp buff was missed on the t2 ships. As for changing the field command ships models to tier 2 bcs... Why is it needed?
Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 30	Posted - 2011.11.23 18:16:00 - [28] - Quote Whilst I am pleased the thread is getting some attention, this is about simply changing the models of Field Command Ships to Tier II Bruiser models. By all means start a thread about Bruiser balancing if you think they need it.
Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 30	Posted - 2011.11.23 18:18:00 - [29] - Quote Jerick Ludhowe wrote: As for changing the field command ships models to tier 2 bcs... Why is it needed? There is no need at all. However I think they would look very good and it would create a very clear distinction between the Field and Fleet variants.
Takara Mora University of Caille Gallente Federation 16	Posted - 2011.11.24 16:29:00 - [30] - Quote Saul Dhampir wrote: Jerick Ludhowe wrote: As for changing the field command ships models to tier 2 bcs... Why is it needed? There is no need at all. However I think they would look very good and it would create a very clear distinction between the Field and Fleet variants. Heck Yeah! I'd fly a T2 Myrm just for the looks ... the T2 (and T1) Brutix hull is simply ugly ... will never use it ... please do this!!
Anshio Tamark Avitus Lugus 29	Posted - 2011.11.24 17:04:00 - [31] - Quote I'm strangely fine with that idea. I've been thinking of getting a Nighthawk myself, but I don't like the Ferox's hull. On the other hand, neither me nor my CEO like the Hurricane's design, so there would probably come a Sleipnir up for sale somewhere.
ShahFluffers Ice Fire Warriors 196	Posted - 2011.11.24 20:59:00 - [32] - Quote Supported on condition that the Myrmidon hull becomes the Eos and not the Astarte. "Just because I seem like an idiot, doesn't mean I am one." ~Unknown
Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 31	Posted - 2011.11.25 17:56:00 - [33] - Quote ShahFluffers wrote: Supported on condition that the Myrmidon hull becomes the Eos and not the Astarte. Hmm, well, if that was to happen you would have to be making the Fleet Command ships adopt the Tier II hulls as opposed to the Field Command ships. Thus you would have: Amarr: Damnation - Harbinger hull (A black Habi) Minmater: Claymore - Hurricane hull (Pale camo with blue lighting) Gallente: Eos - Myrmidon hull (Dark green and grey Myrm) Caldari: Vulture - Drake hull ('Tehno Camo') Amarr: Absolution - Prophecy hull (As normal) Minmater: Sleipnir - Cyclone hull (As normal) Gallente: Astarte - Brutix hull (As normal) Caldari: Nighthawk - Ferox hull (As normal) I would not be opposed to this either. I'm just biased as I tend to fly Field Command ships. Hmm now to decide it I should photoshop those up as well...
Tsubutai The Tuskers 30	Posted - 2011.11.25 18:21:00 - [34] - Quote Would be neat, but should be done as part of a broader rebalancing of CS as a whole.
ShahFluffers Ice Fire Warriors 199	Posted - 2011.11.26 05:57:00 - [35] - Quote Saul Dhampir wrote: ShahFluffers wrote: Supported on condition that the Myrmidon hull becomes the Eos and not the Astarte. Hmm, well, if that was to happen you would have to be making the Fleet Command ships adopt the Tier II hulls as opposed to the Field Command ships. No, no, no... The others are fine. But the Eos is a drone boat... the Astarte is a blaster platform. It makes more sense that the Myrm hull becomes a more specialized done ship than a pure gunboat. "Just because I seem like an idiot, doesn't mean I am one." ~Unknown
Saul Dhampir Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction 31	Posted - 2011.11.26 11:22:00 - [36] - Quote ShahFluffers wrote: The others are fine. But the Eos is a drone boat... the Astarte is a blaster platform. It makes more sense that the Myrm hull becomes a more specialized done ship than a pure gunboat. Mate, this has already come up in the thread and been covered. Nowhere is it written that T2/Fraction ships have to follow the format of there T1 hull counterpart: Ferox - Gunship Nighthawk - Missileboat Prophecy - Gunship Damnation - Missleboat Scorpion - EW Platform Navy Issue Scorpion - Missileboat Rattlesnake - Missile/Drone boat Just because a Myrm is a drone boat it does not mean that any ship that used the same model has to follow suit.

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