Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Antihrist Pripravnik
T-AFK and counting
230
|
Posted - 2014.04.16 16:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
As you might already know, the summer expansion will make many changes to the POSes. The main changes are: - POSes can be anchored in 0.8+ systems excluding highly congested systems (like JIta) and starter systems; - You will not require faction standings in order to anchor a POS; - Slots are being removed from the game and are being replaced by the tax. More slots used in the station equals higher tax. POSes will have lower tax than stations.
There are more changes announced, but the dev blog is too massive to list them all here.
Anyway, do you think that POS fuel prices will jump due to higher availability of POS gameplay to newer players/players without standings or even by the pretty decent amount of high-high security space (sorry ... can't find the better word for it ) that is free for spreading POSes?
Or will the prices drop because of the convenience of station industry without a limit on the number of slots? My signature got stolen (o.0) |
Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
1933
|
Posted - 2014.04.16 16:54:00 -
[2] - Quote
there is no reliable way of telling, as the popularity of station production will be determined by the (not yet released) progressive manufacturing costs formula. if CCP bungles it and production costs in and around jita become too high, POSes will become more popular. if they fail the other way, everyone will switch to station production in a radius of a few jumps around the trade hubs and no one will care about POSes.
personally, i have dropped a few bil into pos related stuff, just so i can later say i profited from it (if indeed i will).
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine In Tea We Trust
382
|
Posted - 2014.04.16 16:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
Could easily go either way.
Based on the little information we have, I would be planning to reduce the number of POSes I operate. That's something I'm very happy with. If a lot of other people do the same then we could see fuel prices fall back some. |
Proton Power
Evolution Northern Coalition.
7
|
Posted - 2014.04.16 18:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
My original thoughts: BUY Isotopes now!!!
After debating it in my head for a few hours, while I do believe at first POS's will go up all over the place, after a few months most will be offline.. Those that want POS's now can get one just as easy now as they can once a patch comes out, tons of corps for sale for very little isk with standings...
The other aspect of this is as I think bobby mentioned, how will Taxes work. We do know POS's will be hit with taxes, we also know that to use a POS you will need to use Copies or BPO in the POS now, where if taxes are low in system in station, a station would be just as good as a POS with not having to fuel the POS..
The other aspect is some people/corps/allainces have tons of POS's up for production/research and such because 1 POS isnt large enough for there needs, most of these people are the ones that will still be doing production after the first few months and everyone else got over the "NEW" feeling; But as Bad did say, they will now only require 1-2 POS's instead of God knows how many they have up. This means less fuel being used.
My Prediction: Short Term: Buy to resale quickly. Don't hold it to long. |
Knutto
Hajiilee
31
|
Posted - 2014.04.16 22:13:00 -
[5] - Quote
Where they exactly say that POSes will be hit by taxes? I can't find the part in the new dev blog where they clearly affirm this. |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
5371
|
Posted - 2014.04.16 22:33:00 -
[6] - Quote
Knutto wrote:Where they exactly say that POSes will be hit by taxes? I can't find the part in the new dev blog where they clearly state it.
They say it in the threadnought that spawned from the dev blog.
Also, I wanted to post an isotopes analysis of mine but as anyone may easily verify by reading the Reverence thread, CCP changed their stuff again so the market data extraction program does not work at the moment Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
Twitter channel |
Adunh Slavy
1359
|
Posted - 2014.04.16 23:06:00 -
[7] - Quote
It will depend on how high these taxes/fees go. If pos operation costs more than paying the tax, then pay the tax. I think we can assume greater demands on the fuel supply, with the tax/fee acting as a soft ceiling. Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.-á-á- William Pitt |
Sturmwolke
547
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 00:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
Most highsec towers churn out BPCs (and ME/PE research), barring the small number of production towers. Going by details from the first blog, EVERYONE will have near unlimited acccess to what was traditionally limited. You will literally see a flood of BPCs produced in the first several weeks - either for sale or for in-house consumption. You get less demand, massive overproduction. Long term, the entire BPC market will collapse on itself, with the flood of BPCs and competition - the higher end (i.e capital BPCs) will have some resistance, but it'll succumb sooner or later.
Need the details of the station charges before you can solidy the direction it's going into. Caldari ice may drop like a rock.
|
Loraine Gess
Confedeferate Union of Tax Legalists
217
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 03:13:00 -
[9] - Quote
Adunh Slavy wrote:It will depend on how high these taxes/fees go. If pos operation costs more than paying the tax, then pay the tax. I think we can assume greater demands on the fuel supply, with the tax/fee acting as a soft ceiling.
If pos are also being hit by the tax, then I see very little reason to continue to own one. |
Felicity Love
Whore and Peace
1680
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 05:00:00 -
[10] - Quote
If POS become the best place to do industry, period, then there will be a steady increase in fuels demand.
You can expect to the racial towers with the cheapest fuel to become more commonly used, if only for operating costs rather than the ability to host the most number of Labs or Assembly Arrays.
Mostly though -- expect a "Honeymoon" period where tonnes of players suddenly have access to a part of the game they just could NOT be arsed to grind standings for before the summer.
And then the slump as the novelty wears off, a new game comes out on PS4 or they go back to school.
Boom and bust economics. Huzzah.
... and I was just saying the other day, "Damn, I miss Soundwave"....
|
|
Qmamoto Kansuke
Killing with pink power
1
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 07:08:00 -
[11] - Quote
Pos has never been about cost, its about how well you can use them.If said taxes are less than station poses are still worth owning because they still provide speed that stations can't match, and with this change for standings say hi to poses in sobaseki |
Elizabeth Norn
Nornir Research
209
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 10:58:00 -
[12] - Quote
Sturmwolke wrote:Most highsec towers churn out BPCs (and ME/PE research), barring the small number of production towers. Going by details from the first blog, EVERYONE will have near unlimited acccess to what was traditionally limited. You will literally see a flood of BPCs produced in the first several weeks - either for sale or for in-house consumption. You get less demand, massive overproduction. Long term, the entire BPC market will collapse on itself, with the flood of BPCs and competition - the higher end (i.e capital BPCs) will have some resistance, but it'll succumb sooner or later.
Need the details of the station charges before you can solidy the direction it's going into. Caldari ice may drop like a rock.
Capital BPC prices are already half of what they were compared to 6 months ago. .
|
Cyniac
Twilight Star Rangers
184
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 17:19:00 -
[13] - Quote
Loraine Gess wrote:If pos are also being hit by the tax, then I see very little reason to continue to own one.
The level of tax will be determined by the degree of use of the production / research asset.
Thus while the station tax might be very high (because of overuse) the tax which you pay in your own POS may be at a minimal level.
To my knowledge the only system which we have on these scaling taxes is the corp offices - and they can get very expensive very fast.
So - still very much worthwhile having a POS if the tax differential is high (and my guess is - it will be).
As an aside it makes POS accounting a bit simpler, you know much more clearly how much you are saving by running a POS. |
350125GO
Transcendent Sedition Dustm3n
34
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 17:41:00 -
[14] - Quote
Felicity Love wrote:If POS become the best place to do industry, period, then there will be a steady increase in fuels demand.
I didn't see where POS becomes good for industry as a whole (I read industry as manufacturing), we DO know that POS will become go-to for refining. Seems like they'll still be the go-to for research/copying as well. Manufacturing will still be best done in a station, except for low-level stuff like T1 ammo and small mods/rigs.
I don't see this resulting in a long-term increase in demand, though it may be good speculation for a short-term gain, but I think smarter money would invest in small/med towers. |
Erik Sokarad
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 19:27:00 -
[15] - Quote
what i get from reading the devblog, is that we will see a lot of small corps suddenly using POS for the first time. this will result in a learning curve, and some of them will get wardecced and lose their POS (some will take the pos down first). it will probably take a couple months to settle down again, but in that time ice prices will probably spike for the POS fuel, before it returns to equilibrium. anyone who is in a position to supply fuel during the spike will make a good return on investment, but the best ISK will likely be from sales away from the trade hubs (where the POS cannot place), in whatever systems the new POS tend to get put in. we may see a ripple effect into mining barge demand for ice mining, probably starting before the update actually hits. whoever is manufacturing the POS components will make the most income short-term,unless speculators flood the market.
changes to the slot system will most likely mean we will see a lot more research and invention take place. this will probably show a short-term spike, as more people try out the system than before, resulting in short-term demand spikes for things like datacores. demand for researched BPOs will probably fluctuate for a while. after a lot of people lose money to not knowing what they are doing, the market should stabilize again.
in general, the safest assumption is that a lot of people will not read the update carefully, and then waste money as they learn the hard way.
|
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
3087
|
Posted - 2014.04.17 23:37:00 -
[16] - Quote
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Knutto wrote:Where they exactly say that POSes will be hit by taxes? I can't find the part in the new dev blog where they clearly state it. They say it in the threadnought that spawned from the dev blog. Also, I wanted to post an isotopes analysis of mine but as anyone may easily verify by reading the Reverence thread, CCP changed their stuff again so the market data extraction program does not work at the moment
You know there's a json export for market data now? Sure, it doesn't contain everything you want, but it does contain the majority of what you'd need to see consumption. ish.
https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/market/marketdisplay.php Steve Ronuken for CSM 9! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4236322 http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
Soldarius
Deadman W0nderland Test Alliance Please Ignore
637
|
Posted - 2014.04.21 16:25:00 -
[17] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/market/marketdisplay.php
Dat tool, awesome.
GÇ£I personally refuse to help AAA take space from itself so it can become an even shittier version of itselfGÇ¥
-Grath Telkin, 2014. |
Dachhan
Pnex Pwn Squad
2
|
Posted - 2014.04.23 14:53:00 -
[18] - Quote
Soldarius wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/market/marketdisplay.php Dat tool, awesome.
Seconded.. this tool is great.
|
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
3110
|
Posted - 2014.04.23 15:04:00 -
[19] - Quote
Dachhan wrote:Soldarius wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/market/marketdisplay.php Dat tool, awesome. Seconded.. this tool is great.
You can thank FoxFour for it (along with some other devs helping with his heavy lifting)
I just slapped a frontend together for it, using Google charts. Steve Ronuken for CSM 9! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4236322 http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
ChromeStriker
Chrome Exploration
717
|
Posted - 2014.04.25 07:42:00 -
[20] - Quote
If there isnt Moon and PI changes this summer i will be hugely surprised. Theyre hitting everything else, and putting a new UI to it all...
Nulla Curas |
|
Myassa
Chaktaren Industries
2
|
Posted - 2014.04.25 12:28:00 -
[21] - Quote
I believe fuel blocks, isotopes and small and medium towers will all rise in the short term after the summer expansion. After about 6 months or so I do see the market for these products starting a downward slide and continuing down for a long time.
New players and smaller corps will be thrilled to own a POS. Most likely they will start with a small or medium tower in a close to hub location. Given how easy it is to destroy a small or medium tower, new or tiny corps will get a wardec and their towers will be destroyed. We all know that some larger corps love to dish out grief or these corps will be allowed to stay if they pay a "fee". Either way some players are going to learn the hard way about owning a POS.
In about 3-6 months after players get sick of having their POS's blown up, paying fees to "stay safe" or realize it is not very profitable I think you will see the market start to get flooded with towers and fuel. In the end only larger corps who can defend themselves will be able to sustain research/manufacturing POS's. The biggest reason to own a POS, post expansion is the compressing array.
In the end tiny alt corps (1-5 members) will have to move to the far ends of EVE to have profitable research in a station or give up entirely. I have already taken down my research POS's and will try the station route. I know of other tiny corps doing the same thing.
I am not complaining, it is what it is. In EVE you either adjust or die. I believe this will not work as CCP predicts and will actually make the science industry much less appealing. The little 1 or 2 player alt corps that currently run a lot of POS's will slowly die as possibly having to defend them will be a huge issue. The question is will those POS's be replaced by larger research corps?
My prediction is in 6 months or so after the expansion, the prices of everything related to the POS will have suffered except large POS's and the new compressing array.
|
Felicity Love
Whore and Peace
1712
|
Posted - 2014.04.27 04:23:00 -
[22] - Quote
... now if ONLY we could get POS's revamped, too... Fanfest coming soon... all eyes on the Keynotes.
... and I was just saying the other day, "Damn, I miss Soundwave"....
|
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3519
|
Posted - 2014.04.27 06:39:00 -
[23] - Quote
Whether isotopes change in price largely depends on those that are currently manipulating them.
I'm quite impressed at the job they've been doing too. |
Adunh Slavy
1367
|
Posted - 2014.04.27 12:24:00 -
[24] - Quote
Loraine Gess wrote:Adunh Slavy wrote:It will depend on how high these taxes/fees go. If pos operation costs more than paying the tax, then pay the tax. I think we can assume greater demands on the fuel supply, with the tax/fee acting as a soft ceiling. If pos are also being hit by the tax, then I see very little reason to continue to own one.
Quite true. Hopefully CCP is not that short sighted. Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.-á-á- William Pitt |
Bob ran
Old American Syndicate Silent Infinity
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.27 12:41:00 -
[25] - Quote
I wouldn't be surprised i pos taxes end up like the other tax and fees we have so far. Like broker fees and the tax on reprocessing that are reduced as your standing increases with the faction or npc station holder |
Felicity Love
Whore and Peace
1721
|
Posted - 2014.04.29 23:59:00 -
[26] - Quote
Tau Cabalander wrote:Whether isotopes change in price largely depends on those that are currently manipulating them.
I'm quite impressed at the job they've been doing too.
Indeed... the prices have taken quite a jump in JITA today...love those Dev Blogs... lovely, tall spikes on volume...
... and I was just saying the other day, "Damn, I miss Soundwave"....
|
Loraine Gess
Confedeferate Union of Tax Legalists
240
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 00:10:00 -
[27] - Quote
Adunh Slavy wrote:Loraine Gess wrote:Adunh Slavy wrote:It will depend on how high these taxes/fees go. If pos operation costs more than paying the tax, then pay the tax. I think we can assume greater demands on the fuel supply, with the tax/fee acting as a soft ceiling. If pos are also being hit by the tax, then I see very little reason to continue to own one. Quite true. Hopefully CCP is not that short sighted.
New info makes me happy, I predict POS usage will stay the same though, because of the dropping of lots of research towers. Will probably see a shift away from Caldari towards minmatar (beefier defense). It's no longer necessary to stack tons of CPU-intensive structures, after all. |
Dachhan
Pnex Pwn Squad
2
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 13:26:00 -
[28] - Quote
Topes already climbing ~ |
Captain IQ
Innocent Traders Ltd
56
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 13:36:00 -
[29] - Quote
Dachhan wrote:Topes already climbing ~
O RLY?
Gladly I bought the wrong racial type for the last Ice Interdiction, 20mil gone so far gonna hold out for 1100 mark but tbh I'm just glad to finally get rid of them. |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
3150
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 15:07:00 -
[30] - Quote
Topes will be climbing, because there's been an announcement that jump fuel usage will be going up 50% Steve Ronuken for CSM 9! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4236322 http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |