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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Celthric Kanerian
Ascendance Of New Eden Workers Trade Federation
2
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Posted - 2014.06.13 10:22:00 -
[61] - Quote
"Once I am no longer on trial and I have paid any amount of money to CCP to play the game"
Sure, you've done your trial and you're paying for the game now, but saying that the way skills are should be changed is completely disrespectful towards older players like myself, and even to the veteran players from 03.
In a few words: You are still a noob to this game, you do not fully understand the way of things in this game yet. So wait a while before posting stuff on forum before you understand things better. |
Ihazcheez Hashur
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
9
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 10:40:00 -
[62] - Quote
Bittervets want to keep ahead as they have 11+years of continual skill queuing. if some newb can sign into eve and on day 30 can fly a titan, then it'll just be alts-in-space and the game would just be absolute chaos. Throw-away-alts would be absolutely viable as a mechanism to wreck havoc on unprecedented scales. It would do more harm than good in every angle and direction conceivable.
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Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
4002
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 11:04:00 -
[63] - Quote
Ved Riru wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote:In the end, we understand you want to speed up training for your characters. Before we go down the path of how "best" to implement it, I'd like you to explain what is wrong with the current progression! CCP, and the player base, are willing to listen to the problems and difficulties that new players experience, and wants to improve that experience. So please outline what isn't working for you, and we can talk about solutions from there! Two things: 1.) It seems to me old-time players are accustomed to spending a lot of real-life time like days, weeks and in some bad cases even months to get a specific degree of a skill. You revolted against CCP and yet you tolerate this BS? And many of you preach the mantra GÇ£An achievement feels much better if you spend longer getting thereGÇ¥. Months and years longer when combined? That sort of blindness that is enforced on new players as a standard everyone has to accept I donGÇÖt like one bit. EliteGǪ A unique gameGǪ 2.) Then I donGÇÖt like that I have to wait for days or weeks to get some skills. It is too long. And if I have spent the remaps available for a year, then getting some skills takes even longer. Life goes on. I donGÇÖt have an infinite amount of days that I can spend waiting to be able to equip some tier two modules or squeeze a little bit more out of power grid or CPU enhancing skills so that I can fit ships properly the way Battleclinic tells me to. And I donGÇÖt care about officer, factions, or deadspace modules or whatever. Those are too expensive. Just regular T2 that seems to be the standard gear.
1.) Yes, us older players are accustomed to spending lots of RL time like days, weeks, and/or months to train the final rank of a skill. Reasons we tolerate this: GÖª We KNOW that you do NOT NEED level 5 in all these skills to be competitive. That last rank usually adds only a minor boost, leaving us with a real choices in how we progress our character. GÖª If we reduced the time to train skills by 10 fold across the board, every 3 yr old character would have every skill in the game at max. Do you really think an environment where every other character is max skilled would be a good thing? I don't. GÖª It creates a crawl, walk, run progression in the game. You can quickly access most activities in this game, but if you want to "master" it, it takes time.
2.) Tier 2 modules offer drawbacks as well as benefits. They usually are harder to fit, and quite often meta 4 modules perform on par with them for about the same price. And quit putting so much stock in Battleclinic's "perfect fit". Also, why are you waiting? Why do you NEED the t2, perfect fit ship before you take it out for a spin? Can you not use meta 4 modules? Can you not attempt an activity before you are perfectly skilled for it? One of the major strengths of EvE is you don't need max skills to play.
It really sounds like your primary dislike is that it takes a significant amount of time to train skills to level 5. You seem to ignore the point that you don't need skills at level 5 to play. And you seem unwilling to use the character bazaar because you don't like the "baggage" that comes with older characters. Is this really the best case you can offer for dramatically changing the skill system?
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
563
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 11:08:00 -
[64] - Quote
Point to note, there will be a time in any characters development where they will have all base skills at V and their favoured ship at all V's. I betting this would take less than a year unless you want to fly a cap/super/titan at all V's.
A new player will *allways* be able to catch up to a bittervet in SP terms as the SP used in a cruiser 1v1 for instance is only a specific subset. Given that the bittervet may have been here since day 1 of Eve and the newb can effectively 'catch them up' in a given hull within 1 year or so (except for bigger hulls which in my view is fair enough) I'd say the skill system works pretty damn well.
on a side note I just lost a cheap thorax in losec to an older player. Do I think this is unfair? Nope, they only caught me as I made a mistake from being distracted (note to self, don't fly losec when the gf is working from home, she has many ways to be distracting :D). Had I jumped out at the correct point they wouldn't have had the chance to catch me. This wasn't due to them having more SP or a better ship (tengu in a combat anom, I had no chance!). They dictated the engagement in a manner that I could not win. Even by getting under his missiles I lost as the rats were pounding me from range.
He won because he used his player experience and profited from my inexperience. That's player skills not SP. His extra SP would have made no difference had I bugged out 3 seconds earlier.
There is always only a limited amount of 'ahead' in SP terms for any given hull. if you want to really **** off the bittervets train up all V's for an interceptor over the first few months and go flashing by their gatecamps in null...You'll lose the odd ship to particularly vigilant camps but you'll severely wind up many more... |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
563
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 11:16:00 -
[65] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:Why do you NEED the t2, perfect fit ship before you take it out for a spin? Can you not use meta 4 modules? Can you not attempt an activity before you are perfectly skilled for it? One of the major strengths of EvE is you don't need max skills to play.
It really sounds like your primary dislike is that it takes a significant amount of time to train skills to level 5. You seem to ignore the point that you don't need skills at level 5 to play. And you seem unwilling to use the character bazaar because you don't like the "baggage" that comes with older characters. Is this really the best case you can offer for dramatically changing the skill system?
Agreed entirely on this. The thorax I had was one just lay around so I cobbled a fit together out of looted junk and took it into losec. I was killing rally points and yards with it and I have very few skills at V (drones mainly, going to be fun when I buy a gila...). I had a lot of fun visiting losec in the thorax. I will be going back in another no doubt, probably with a better fit as I'll actually think about it. In no way was I disadvantaged other than taking longer to kill the rats and there are many ways I can speed that up.
I went for fun not perfect and in doing so had a lot of it even to the point of being blown up. I also got my pod out so had I been flying with +5 learning implants it wouldn't have mattered.
Perfect is over-rated folks, just have fun from the start *whilst* the level V's are training in whichever area of space and whichever career you choose. Stop being hung up on SP and you'll enjoy Eve so much more... |
Kaeda Maxwell
Calamitous-Intent Feign Disorder
305
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 11:17:00 -
[66] - Quote
Ved Riru wrote: Then I donGÇÖt like that I have to wait for days or weeks to get some skills. It is too long. And if I have spent the remaps available for a year, then getting some skills takes even longer. Life goes on. I donGÇÖt have an infinite amount of days that I can spend waiting to be able to equip some tier two modules or squeeze a little bit more out of power grid or CPU enhancing skills so that I can fit ships properly the way Battleclinic tells me to.
For the record most actually competitive players in this game avoid Battleclinic fits like the plague, they're notoriously atrocious.
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
564
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 11:36:00 -
[67] - Quote
Kaeda Maxwell wrote:Ved Riru wrote: Then I donGÇÖt like that I have to wait for days or weeks to get some skills. It is too long. And if I have spent the remaps available for a year, then getting some skills takes even longer. Life goes on. I donGÇÖt have an infinite amount of days that I can spend waiting to be able to equip some tier two modules or squeeze a little bit more out of power grid or CPU enhancing skills so that I can fit ships properly the way Battleclinic tells me to.
For the record most actually competitive players in this game avoid Battleclinic fits like the plague, they're notoriously atrocious.
I haven't actually liked one yet and I'm a PvP noob...Even the ones for PvE don't do it for me, and they are the most straightforward
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Fer'isam K'ahn
None Of One
82
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Posted - 2014.06.13 12:21:00 -
[68] - Quote
Why, oh - why ?!
I totally don't get the max skill, faster skill need at all. But coming from WoW or any other skill / char level based game, you misunderstand how EVE works. You don't need to max or 'level' (a term widely misunderstood in regards to EVE) anything to access any space or content, sure, you might die alone in the cold of space, but so can any other.
I trained in only 1 month into a Rattlesnake (was month 2nd to 3rd, since I spend my second month, as mentioned earlier, for the all destroyer, all battlecrusier reiburcement, and yes, decided that as a 1 month old player) and used it efficiently right away and continuously sicne then with fun.
I could do everything with it that I expected to be able to from day one, my closest call was a 6% hull warp out, and trained since then to fly it better and more efficient. But even with 9 months worth of training jsut for this ship, and I am close to max damage, application and support, ISIS for example shows that I only have the mastery level 1 !!! Does it hinder my performance? No! Does it keep me from doing what I expect to be able to do with the ship regardless of my skills ? No! Do I feel preassured to train more or faster ? No! Does it keep me from having fun ? No! Was I disappointed and disheartend as a beginner looking at the requirements ? No! Does it matter in any way ? No!
One thing I noticed in Eve is when you are looking for a new ship type, no matter the skills or the ISK requirements, once you committed and got the skills trained, the money to afford it has appeared somehow. Or in case you focus on the money side and accumulate wealth,a s soon as you did you will noticed that the skills somehow are ready too. If it doesn't for you, then you are clearly doing something wrong.
It is well balanced this way, which keeps most people from flying what they should not, especially young PLEX buyers. |
Samillian
Angry Mustellid
544
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 12:26:00 -
[69] - Quote
Kaeda Maxwell wrote:Ved Riru wrote: Then I donGÇÖt like that I have to wait for days or weeks to get some skills. It is too long. And if I have spent the remaps available for a year, then getting some skills takes even longer. Life goes on. I donGÇÖt have an infinite amount of days that I can spend waiting to be able to equip some tier two modules or squeeze a little bit more out of power grid or CPU enhancing skills so that I can fit ships properly the way Battleclinic tells me to.
For the record most actually competitive players in this game avoid Battleclinic fits like the plague, they're notoriously atrocious.
While many (if not the majority) of the available Battleclinic fits are not optimal even the poor ones serve a useful function in that they show you how best not to fit your hulls.
Negative examples have there place as do positive ones. NBSI shall be the whole of the Law |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1666
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 12:53:00 -
[70] - Quote
Ved Riru wrote: Two things: That sort of blindness that is enforced on new players as a standard everyone has to accept I donGÇÖt like one bit. EliteGǪ A unique gameGǪ Then I donGÇÖt like that I have to wait for days or weeks to get some skills. It is too long. And if I have spent the remaps available for a year, then getting some skills takes even longer.
Dont like it? dont play. Eve is not for everyone. Hence ur other thread.
Anyone with a little experience could have said its a bad idea to remap right away. U were in eve uni for a whole week, perhaps one could have asked more experienced players about remaps?
The fool that does no research and dives in often shoots himself in the foot. This game rewards careful planning and patience. Again, this is exactly why we like it. Ur not totally screwed over because of ur poor remap however, but u may be at a slight disadvantage compared to someone who had the common sense to reach out to other players and find out some more information before making that decision.
It does sound like u are the kind of person that screams 'i want, and i want it NOW'. and if u are, this game will not satisfy ur need for instant gratification.
Its not just skill training that takes time, everything takes time.
Making money takes time Making ships and equipment takes time Investments take time to become fruitful Fights take time to prepare for Targets take time to find Relationships take time to build
Its a complex, harsh, difficult to play, long-haul kind of game. Thats just how we like it. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
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Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
450
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 13:06:00 -
[71] - Quote
Mikael Menethil wrote:This kind of answer again... /sigh
There is a very good reason for it. /sigh |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
565
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 13:36:00 -
[72] - Quote
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:One thing I noticed in Eve is when you are looking for a new ship type, no matter the skills or the ISK requirements, once you committed and got the skills trained, the money to afford it has appeared somehow. Or in case you focus on the money side and accumulate wealth, as soon as you did you will noticed that the skills somehow are ready too. If it doesn't for you, then you are clearly doing something wrong. It is well balanced this way, which keeps most people from flying what they should not - This is towards you, you young PLEX buyers.
Exactly this, if you are out using the skills you have in some way then you simply don't notice the training time passing for the other skills, and generate isk/fun whilst doing so... |
Gospadin
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
161
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 15:29:00 -
[73] - Quote
A few things I have noticed in my ~8 years.
1. The pace of skill training is very well balanced with an actual new character's ability to make money and afford loss. It takes you three months to fly your drake half-decently, and it takes that much time to earn enough money to fit two or three of them. If you lose a raven or two in your first month because you raced to get 2 ranks of Caldari Battleship, you're probably broke and back to flying cruisers in L2 missions.
2. You can get a very good feel for new abilities in a VERY short amount of time. A few hours to train two ranks into ECM or jams or industry, means you can dabble without wasting weeks, to get a feel for what you like. This is good. The month-long training (e.g. Astrometric Rangefinding V) is for a minute benefit that only 1% of the population cares about or will ever get. This is a good thing.
3. I *would* appreciate a 6-month remap window instead of 12-month window. When I jumped into a new area, I burned a bonus remap to get back to my baseline spec, after only training in the new area for 5 months. Would have been nice to not have needed it.
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SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
968
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 16:20:00 -
[74] - Quote
Ved Riru wrote:Gizznitt Malikite wrote:In the end, we understand you want to speed up training for your characters. Before we go down the path of how "best" to implement it, I'd like you to explain what is wrong with the current progression! CCP, and the player base, are willing to listen to the problems and difficulties that new players experience, and wants to improve that experience. So please outline what isn't working for you, and we can talk about solutions from there! Two things: It seems to me old-time players are accustomed to spending a lot of real-life time like days, weeks and in some bad cases even months to get a specific degree of a skill. You revolted against CCP and yet you tolerate this BS? And many of you preach the mantra GÇ£An achievement feels much better if you spend longer getting thereGÇ¥. Months and years longer when combined? That sort of blindness that is enforced on new players as a standard everyone has to accept I donGÇÖt like one bit. EliteGǪ A unique gameGǪ
This is like sitting down to play a game of Chess and then complaining that the bishop can only move diagonally and it's not fair and you don't like it and the bishop should be able to move other ways. Those are the rules of the game that thousands of people have adhered to for years and years. Changing them isn't really on the table just because some newcomer sat down and tried it for the first time and decided they don't really like that rule.
Quote:Then I donGÇÖt like that I have to wait for days or weeks to get some skills.
This. Doesn't. Matter. Get that through your head. "I don't like it" is not an argument. Absolutely nobody cares, anymore than than they would care if you didn't like that bishops can only move diagonally.
Quote:It is too long. And if I have spent the remaps available for a year, then getting some skills takes even longer. Life goes on. I donGÇÖt have an infinite amount of days that I can spend waiting to be able to equip some tier two modules or squeeze a little bit more out of power grid or CPU enhancing skills so that I can fit ships properly the way Battleclinic tells me to.
A. Battleclinic fits are famous for sucking.
B. There is no rule stating that a fit is only proper if it includes a certain grade of module.
C. If you're waiting until you can do it "perfectly" you are doing it wrong. The problem isn't the game - the problem is you. Stop waiting and just go ******* do things. Can't fit all the T2 modules? Downgrade to meta-4 (or even 3 - you'll see plenty of J5B warp scramblers being used because they're so cheap and easy to fit, for instance) where necessary. You'll be 80-90% as effective in 20% of the time.
Quote: Once I am no longer on trial and I have paid any amount of money to CCP to play the game, I have every right to speak what I want and how I want in accordance with the terms of service.
You do have the right to say it, but you don't really have any right to be listened to, acknowledged, or treated as an equal because, simply put, you are not. You simply do not know enough about the game to have an informed opinion. You know just enough to have ignorant, misinformed opinions that lead to ****** ideas that the vast majority of people with informed opinions hate. "Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
451
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 16:27:00 -
[75] - Quote
6 months for remaps seems somewhat reasonable. However I think anything less than 6 months would be bad. |
Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders Repeat 0ffenders
570
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 16:53:00 -
[76] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:- you DO NOT NEED to have level 5 in any specific skill to be competitive. Having level 5 in a skill is simply an edge (exception: when it is required for something else). Lvl 5 prereqs is the only thing CCP could tweak, imo.
As the already did, for example, with Thermodynamics and Carrier prereqs.
For example, PVP could maybe be more entertaining for everyone (including vets) if it were faster to get into T2/T3 cruisers with T2 tank and weaponry.
Looking at it from the vets' perspective: they wouldn't have to wait for an year to fly their advanced cruisers alongside - or against - promising and enthusiastic PVP newbros. |
Fer'isam K'ahn
None Of One
87
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 17:00:00 -
[77] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:6 months for remaps seems somewhat reasonable. However I think anything less than 6 months would be bad.
It sounds good, but how about a 12x multiplier skill with -1 month per level *twink* *twink* .... hehe, maybe not.. would just enrage OP.
I think the better solution would be that the bonus remap should only appear after the first 3 months in any case.
Players who haven't figured it out by then don't deserve better, but it gives those a chance that ruined them in the first 3 days and find out after more then a month what that actually meant. And cheap alts don-¦t profit from it too soon either.
I could also imagine remaps just appearing on EVE anniversaries, that way you migth accumulate some or use 2 in a short amount of time if its around that time of the year...
... but it will never outweigh careful planning. |
Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
451
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 17:37:00 -
[78] - Quote
More frequent random bonus remaps from CCP would go a long way to easing things a bit. Since bonus remaps can't be predicted or planned for you still have to plan around the one year cycle but when you do get one you get to make new choices about what you want to do.
This is probably the only way that a truly random element could add meaningful choices to the game. |
Fer'isam K'ahn
None Of One
87
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 17:45:00 -
[79] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:More frequent random bonus remaps from CCP would go a long way to easing things a bit. Since bonus remaps can't be predicted or planned for you still have to plan around the one year cycle but when you do get one you get to make new choices about what you want to do.
This is probably the only way that a truly random element could add meaningful choices to the game.
The randomness might be a good idea.
If the one year cycle stays, we could have some difficult task in the way the 'Gecko drone event' was hosted. But instead of 1 big event we get like max 6 over the year, each hard enough to fail for the community and once acchieved, no further event will take place which limits bonus remaps to 1 extra a year. If too few participate there will be 0 bonus remaps.
But I think we are high-jacking the thread (not that this is bad in this case).
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Iain Cariaba
In Over Our Heads
39
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 17:59:00 -
[80] - Quote
Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote:Exactly this, if you are out using the skills you have in some way then you simply don't notice the training time passing for the other skills, and generate isk/fun whilst doing so... I've been doing my thing out in null, having fun with the corp, and I didn't realize until I got the notice on my phone's Eve app that my 20 day level V skill train is almost done.
Watching the skill train counter makes trains take longer. If I agreed with you, we'd both be wrong. |
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Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
453
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 18:10:00 -
[81] - Quote
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:The randomness might be a good idea.
If the one year cycle stays, we could have some difficult task in the way the 'Gecko drone event' was hosted. But instead of 1 big event we get like max 6 over the year, each hard enough to fail for the community and once acchieved, no further event will take place which limits bonus remaps to 1 extra a year. If too few participate there will be 0 bonus remaps.
But I think we are high-jacking the thread (not that this is bad in this case). The idea behind the randomness was that, unlike community events that are planned and announced before hand, you can't make an EVEMon plan around it. So you make your EVEMon plan around the one year cycle and then at some point in the year you get a bonus remap that makes you go back and make more choices.
Continue with the thread hijacking. The OPs topic has been discussed to death in this and many other threads like it anyway. |
Ved Riru
8
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 18:21:00 -
[82] - Quote
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:But I think we are high-jacking the thread (not that this is bad in this case). If you are a pirate and generally not a nice person, you are free to do it. And I word it in a very caring way.
I am satisfied with how this thread has turned out. As expected, the diehard fans say that skills are not important, that real mastery, which is not measured in skill points, is what the game is all about yet they deny me the ability to get those GÇ£skills that donGÇÖt matter that muchGÇ¥ in any way sooner than it is now. GÇ£WeGÇÖve spent years learning them, you must do the same and you will like it!GÇ¥
And yet IGÇÖve heard several voices in favor of changing the system albeit not on the scale I propose. And then there is an audience that never speaks up in pay2win arguments yet they make the decisions that matter in the end. TheyGÇÖve read it, too. Or at least they will get excerpts with the juicy bits.
Too bad the average thinking does not have the reach to see the current time requirements of skill acquisition the way I do. PavlovGÇÖs dogs must have thought like that: press button GÇô get cookie. You get the next skill not sooner than CCP gives it to you. No amount of effort can get it done sooner. Changing the current way of life is perceived as a blasphemy. Some players even go as far as saying it will be the end of the world. That anyone will be able to fly titans and every single player will be mad enough to do so despite the quite reasonable fear of losing that much ISK.
YouGÇÖve had your fun. And IGÇÖve had mine. I thank you for your attention! ItGÇÖs been a pleasure getting to know those of you who can think out of the box and phrase it nicely.
There are multiple truths in every fact. I protect my truths with a passion. |
Fer'isam K'ahn
None Of One
87
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 18:22:00 -
[83] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: The idea behind the randomness was that, unlike community events that are planned and announced before hand, you can't make an EVEMon plan around it. So you make your EVEMon plan around the one year cycle and then at some point in the year you get a bonus remap that makes you go back and make more choices.
Continue with the thread hijacking. The OPs topic has been discussed to death in this and many other threads like it anyway.
Agreed, but still, each event doesnt need to have a fix timetable and its not guaranteed that you will get it on the try you'd like to succeed on, so I think it will still be random enough and you have to work for it. And there is competition too, if you and your friends decide the mai event (early mai announcment) might be good point and others look for one in early autumn, none might get it, since its a combined effort that would be necessary to succeed. Or at least a 3/5th majority of active players or 4/10th or whatever a good breaking point would be. ... Isn't there a statistics devision in CCP ? |
Frostys Virpio
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
1116
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 18:37:00 -
[84] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:ShahFluffers wrote:- you DO NOT NEED to have level 5 in any specific skill to be competitive. Having level 5 in a skill is simply an edge (exception: when it is required for something else). Lvl 5 prereqs is the only thing CCP could tweak, imo. As the already did, for example, with Thermodynamics and Carrier prereqs. For example, PVP could maybe be more entertaining for everyone (including vets) if it were faster to get into T2/T3 cruisers with T2 tank and weaponry. Looking at it from the vets' perspective: they wouldn't have to wait for an year to fly their advanced cruisers alongside - or against - promising and enthusiastic PVP newbros.
This is something I think need to be completed when possible. When I started wanting to do group stuff some time ago, I was interested in Logi work but upon researching on the matter, I realized there was nothing built for it at a rookie level. Mining had frigs and cruiser, PvE and the shooting side of PvP had all progressive ship class in term of SP requirement but logi only seemed to be worth with the T2 ships. Before they changed the mining cruiser/frigs to logi, all you could do is pretend to try by slapping remote reps on a non bonused ship and pretend you could do it because you would cap out after 3 cycles and never have the rage to pull it in a decent way.
Making sure every path has a "beginner" path to it so people can wet their feet into it before committing months of training is good for the game. Training to Logistic IV and then realizing it's not for you would be a waste of your own time. Yes the SP is still there to use later but you learned too late it was not something you enjoy. |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1669
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 18:40:00 -
[85] - Quote
Ved Riru wrote: Too bad the average thinking does not have the reach to see the current time requirements of skill acquisition the way I do.
'Im not wrong its the worlds that wrong'
ha ha ha EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Fer'isam K'ahn
None Of One
87
|
Posted - 2014.06.13 18:48:00 -
[86] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:
'Im not wrong its the worlds that wrong'
ha ha ha
Well, on this comment I have to defend the accused from the argument from popularity, just because everyone else thinks its right, doesn't make it so, but it doesnt excuse the lone indivuduum from doing proper research and applying some braingoo before complaining to the world.
ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRR Fallacy pirate at work.
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SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
968
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Posted - 2014.06.13 18:57:00 -
[87] - Quote
Fer'isam K'ahn wrote:Daichi Yamato wrote:
'Im not wrong its the worlds that wrong'
ha ha ha
Well, on this comment I have to defend the accused from the argument from popularity, just because everyone else thinks its right, doesn't make it so, but it doesnt excuse the lone indivuduum from doing proper research and applying some braingoo before complaining to the world. ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRR Fallacy pirate at work.
Given that the OP's entire position reduces to, "Grrr, I don't like it!" there actually isn't any need to refute it; merely mocking it is entirely adequate. They have mistaken their complaint for an argument.
In another thread on the same topic, the OP (and **** her for making a brand new thread about the same thing, btw) was complaining about the length of time to train for Gallente Battleships, wherein they included skills like Large Railgun Specialization 5, but skipped over, literally, the entire drone skillset.
It's not just that her position isn't popular, but that she quite demonstrably lacks an informed opinion.
"Hello, I quite provably know abso-*******-lutely nothing about this, but here's what I think should be changed because reasons and my feelings," is not something that deserves any actual consideration.
OP also reeks of entitlement, having quite literally complained that there's no practical way she can ever train a character to do everything in the game, while wholly failing to realize that that's an actual, intentional, vital aspect of the game. "Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1669
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Posted - 2014.06.13 19:08:00 -
[88] - Quote
When the purpose of the proposal is to make things better for the majority then the opinion of the majority counts. Plus, this is just so pathetic it would be criminal to not mock.
Ved Riru wrote:Too bad the average thinking does not have the reach to see the current time requirements of skill acquisition the way I do.
several arguments have been put forward for keeping it as is. The OP's response to these arguments is to say 'well i dnt like it', stomp his feet, huff and puff and even insult his peers.
The OP's entire argument for the proposed change has been rejected by all but one person. That one person was then challenged by two players to back up their claims and that was the last we read of that.
OP does not have a leg to stand on and has thrown a wobbler. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Mag's
the united
17420
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Posted - 2014.06.13 19:20:00 -
[89] - Quote
Ved Riru wrote:If you are a pirate and generally not a nice person......... From my experience, people who play pirates are some of the nicest people in this game. But then I can differentiate a play style from the actual person, because I know it's a game.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1672
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Posted - 2014.06.13 19:20:00 -
[90] - Quote
SurrenderMonkey wrote: It's not just that her position isn't popular, but that she quite demonstrably lacks an informed opinion.
"Hello, I quite provably know abso-*******-lutely nothing about this, but here's what I think should be changed because reasons and my feelings," is not something that deserves any actual consideration.
OP also reeks of entitlement, having quite literally complained that there's no practical way she can ever train a character to do everything in the game, while wholly failing to realize that that's an actual, intentional, vital aspect of the game.
Hear hear,
or read read EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
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