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Alexander Perrin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
0
   |
Posted - 2014.06.14 15:11:00 -
[1] - Quote
Recently returned to Eve, and even with my old character I hadn't been playing very long. Decided to give it another go.
I want to build my own Industrial corp in high sec, for now just building T1 items and reselling them for a profit. As time passes I'll broaden my selection and deepen the tech level.
Some of the problems I seem to be having, both last time and this:
* No way to research. Research station slots are booked up for a month! Do I basically need my own POS for this? In which case, I'd need corp mates *cough*minions*cough* to help finance it, I suppose?
* Other sellers selling well below cost - is there something I am missing, or are they ignoring opportunity costs? I want to manufacture, not spend all my time mining!
* Industry corps - all seem to want miners. Which I sort of get. You need miners. But so few seem to have a manufacturing focus. Is this another example of ignoring opportunity costs - those corps do manufacture, but with materials mined by the corp, and so it is another example of ignoring opportunity costs at the corp level?
Any tips people would be willing to share, about these and other topics, would be greatly appreciated! |
Elena Thiesant
Sun Micro Systems
1368
|
Posted - 2014.06.14 17:12:00 -
[2] - Quote
Buy researched BPCs to start, they're not expensive. Research (and pretty much everything else indy-wise) is changing dramatically in about 5 weeks.
Other sellers may be selling below your cost, not theirs. Make sure your skills are trained and your BPs are researched.
Indy corps want miners because manufacturing doesn't need a corp, to be honest it's better in a small corp or solo. No, it's not an example of ignoring the cost of minerals. |
Alexander Perrin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.06.14 18:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
Thank you! |
Netan MalDoran
Yumping Amok
Circle-Of-Two
16
|
Posted - 2014.06.14 23:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
What he said ----------/\, anyways the new update will drastically change industry, there will be an unlimited # of slots for BPO R&D, the trade off? Higher costs that are directly proportional to the number of jobs in a system. Also Material efficiency will be different. Right now a ME of 2 will cut down waste from 10% to 2.5% all the way out to .0000000000000001 waste. Now ME of 2 will be a wastage of 8% to a max of 0% at a ME of 10, skills will account for the rest of the savings.
"Your security status has been lowered." - Hell yeah it was! |
Erik Sokarad
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
7
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Posted - 2014.06.15 04:03:00 -
[5] - Quote
corps wanting miners is basically a scam. these corps offer to buy ore at a certain rate, which generally means selling for less than the local buy orders for that ore, so the miner gets less isk. once they have the ore, they refine it and either sell the minerals, or manufacture with it.
people selling below cost happens because 'cost' changes over time with new patches. this is why the procurer is so much cheaper than it costs to make, because there is still an overstock of them from before extra materials were added to the process. sometimes however its from people who are bad at math (they mined it, so the ore was 'free').
on july 22nd, all of the manufacturing and research will change, and there will no longer be limited slots. when that happens, everyone will have to revise their spreadsheets again. |
Temudjen Khann
Arnon Mining Initiative
0
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Posted - 2014.07.01 14:13:00 -
[6] - Quote
Erik Sokarad wrote:sometimes however its from people who are bad at math (they mined it, so the ore was 'free').
I kep seeing this around a lot. I am a complete noob so what I have to say doesn't matter much. However how I see it is that mining the Ore may actually have a cost since it is taking your time and the resources used to mine it.
However I don't think I will ever think that I have to sell a ship I made at the cost it would have been had I bought the Ore off the market.
If I mined the Ore for the ship I made then I can put the ship up at a much reduced price and still come away with profit. Profit as in I had 10 mil today after I spent 5 mil to make this ship and now it sold and i have 20 Mil now.
You can get complicated with ISK per hour i lost while mining and the cost of my Barge into the cost of the ship I made. But the fact is I still made money because my ship sold for less than yours.
If Wal-Mart decides it is going to open a textile factory next to each and every store after start up costs they could sell shirts for 5 cents and still make money since everyone in the world would then only buy their shirts. Could they still sell the shirts at market value and make money sure but by selling cheaper they are selling more of them.
More efficient ways? Sure! More lucrative ways? Sure! Which ship are you going to buy? The one for 20 mil or the same one for 10 mil?
Plus you HAVE to take into account in a video game that some people ENJOY the idea of going out mining their own material and doing everything it takes to make a ship from scratch on their own. I love making little Frigs that I was a part of the whole logistical train. It isn't always the number one top priority to maximize profit to the fullest. Sometimes it is just the point to make a little money on the actual process that I enjoy. |
Elena Thiesant
Sun Micro Systems
1382
|
Posted - 2014.07.01 16:22:00 -
[7] - Quote
So you'll mine 20 mil worth of ore and, instead of selling it for 20 mil, use it to make a ship and sell the ship for 10 mil?
I mean, you can do that if you want, but you're not reducing the costs, you're using your mining profit to hide a manufacturing loss. |
Temudjen Khann
Manu Fortius
space weaponry and trade
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.03 16:55:00 -
[8] - Quote
Elena Thiesant wrote:So you'll mine 20 mil worth of ore and, instead of selling it for 20 mil, use it to make a ship and sell the ship for 10 mil?
I mean, you can do that if you want, but you're not reducing the costs, you're using your mining profit to hide a manufacturing loss.
The difference is the act of mining it and using it for my own purpose is FUN. It isn't about maximizing the profit. For me at least and probably a lot of people out there. |
Gorinia Sanford
Big n Large
61
|
Posted - 2014.07.06 19:31:00 -
[9] - Quote
Erik Sokarad wrote:corps wanting miners is basically a scam. these corps offer to buy ore at a certain rate, which generally means selling for less than the local buy orders for that ore, so the miner gets less isk. once they have the ore, they refine it and either sell the minerals, or manufacture with it.
people selling below cost happens because 'cost' changes over time with new patches. this is why the procurer is so much cheaper than it costs to make, because there is still an overstock of them from before extra materials were added to the process. sometimes however its from people who are bad at math (they mined it, so the ore was 'free').
on july 22nd, all of the manufacturing and research will change, and there will no longer be limited slots. when that happens, everyone will have to revise their spreadsheets again.
Basically, this is kind of what our corp does. We use a little site called Mining Buddy, put our ore hauls in and take it from there. We also do manufacturing as well, so if you're looking for a home OP, contact Jack Barrowman in game, he'll get you into the corp. Although, if you do join, I'd recommend you at least train to fly a barge of some type, just for the corp ops. And we'll be moving soon to null sec, so even more manufacturing opportunities and increased profits out there.
But the reason I don't mind selling my ore to the corp for either manufacturing or selling outright is I spend less time transporting my stuff to market. I just go back and forth from the belts to the station in my retriever and more time spent mining, the more money I earn. That and our CEO pays us a fair rate. However, I refine my own veldspar to make giant secure containers. That's a nice little side income in addition to my mining.
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