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Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
29
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Posted - 2014.06.29 21:37:00 -
[1] - Quote
Okay, this question might easily be laughed off, but here it goes anyway. Would anyone out there be willing to lend me 3 or 4 billion ISK @ 5% interest per month for a period of 2 or 3 months, uncollateralized?
Yes, basically the worst terms ever.. Haha. xD But hey, I would actually pay you back, and it would earn you ~200 million monthly.
I do not even know if I could achieve that kind of deal here on MD yet, but it would be pretty awesome. A longer term would mean I could pick up a few new BPOs with high IPH & SVR and reach break-even before the principal was due. Combined with my current liquid ISK, I would be in a great position to profit highly during the Crius storm. I could pay you the interest each month or all at the end.
I have been API checked before by Koniforous. I could provide you my limited API, depending on who you are. The only alt I trust on here so far is Isaac Schwartz, who I see as a father figure.
You can find a lot of detailed info about me and my financials in my most recent loan thread. I am worth nearly 19B with no outstanding debt and monthly earnings of 3.7B. I have been building things for profit since I was a baby podling back in 2006. I did spend a while in cryosleep after my alliance was slaughtered by BoB's invasion of Providence. Those were dark times.. But now I am stronger and looking to surpass god!
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
2034
|
Posted - 2014.06.30 10:12:00 -
[2] - Quote
have you ever taken part in patch speculation before?
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |
Dead Ash
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
2
|
Posted - 2014.06.30 10:42:00 -
[3] - Quote
So the CEO of the scam bank verifies you're trustworthy........ |
Koniforous
Tauren Transit
121
|
Posted - 2014.06.30 11:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
Dead Ash wrote:So the CEO of the scam bank verifies you're trustworthy........
While I cannot, and will not, vouch for people's trustworthiness: I can and will confirm I loaned Plleasure Hub 500mil and the loan was repaid in full on time.
TAUTX Bank: 12.5% of profits paid to investors monthly. More info: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=322582&find=unread |
Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
29
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Posted - 2014.06.30 12:55:00 -
[5] - Quote
Daniel Plain wrote:have you ever taken part in patch speculation before? Probably not in the sense that you mean. I am a manufacturer, first and foremost. I have done a tiny amount of trading when I saw opportunities within the markets I normally deal in, but most of my ISK comes from building things in high demand.
Patches always bring about a flurry of activity, and that is what I want in on. With Crius being such a promising overhaul, I imagine there is going to be a huge amount of change in player behavior. There is the potential for a lot of carebear death, too, which is great for sales. :D
Most importantly, the changes in mechanics Crius offers (such as much easier copying and the ability to build runs of an item in a trade hub without wait times) may give me the ability to quickly expand the systems and items I deal in. It will be much faster to produce copies and cart them to far-away systems, set up a PUSH contract to provide the materials I need there, and start supplying other areas of New Eden.
Dead Ash wrote:So the CEO of the scam bank verifies you're trustworthy........ Let me clarify that I only said he API checked me, not that he vouches for my trustworthiness. I do have references who can vouch for me from my previous corp. If there is an interested lender who wants this info, I can provide that.
To answer the question that you are wondering, "Well, why don't they just lend you the ISK?" Only one of them is actually wealthy enough to finance a loan of this size, and sadly, he said he plans to take a break from EVE. So he does not want to start up any new deals. He was the sugar daddy who gave me my first 500M loan last year. The others are rather poor compared to me, I think, but they are good people.
Koniforous wrote:the loan was repaid in full on time. Thanks for confirmation, Koniforous. I have also completed loans with Bayaz Sharvas and Trader Frank. Again, they cannot vouch for my noble heart, but they can confirm I repaid their loans according to the agreed upon terms.
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
Cavalira
The Greater Goon
Clockwork Pineapple
371
|
Posted - 2014.07.01 09:25:00 -
[6] - Quote
I might actually believe you, but 5% for an uncollateralized loan is way too low. |
Zappity
Stay Frosty.
A Band Apart.
1190
|
Posted - 2014.07.01 11:23:00 -
[7] - Quote
At least the thread title was accurate.
Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec. |
Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
32
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Posted - 2014.07.01 11:54:00 -
[8] - Quote
5% is, indeed, quite low. This is a lowball offer in case there is some hairy, pale investor lurking in the shadows of MD who has no better plans for the ISK. I will let this offer sit for a little while longer as I get caught up on my coursework. In the event that this goes unfilled, I will consider setting up a more competitive package between now and the 12th.
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
lanyaie
DEEP-SPACE CO-OP LTD
Exit Strategy..
1050
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Posted - 2014.07.01 12:58:00 -
[9] - Quote
Plleasure Hub wrote:5% is, indeed, quite low. This is a lowball offer in case there is some hairy, pale investor lurking in the shadows of MD who has no better plans for the ISK. I will let this offer sit for a little while longer as I get caught up on my coursework. In the event that this goes unfilled, I will consider setting up a more competitive package between now and the 12th.
So.....you're basically saying that if this loan doesn't get filled you will offer something better? Well you can certainly expect someone to fill this loan now.
Spaceprincess. |
Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
32
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Posted - 2014.07.01 13:15:00 -
[10] - Quote
lanyaie wrote:So.....you're basically saying that if this loan doesn't get filled you will offer something better? Nope, what I said was:
Plleasure Hub wrote:I will consider . . . As in I might not offer another deal at all. I have not decided yet. A higher interest rate would make a significant cut into my profits (~10.8% of my monthly profit on a 4B, 10% interest loan). I might be willing to take that hit when my classes are done and I have time to make lots of ISK, but I may just roll with the free capital already in my wallet. So if you want some return out of me, you better snatch this deal up quick! :)
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
SCLZ
New Eden Shipyards
3
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Posted - 2014.07.02 07:10:00 -
[11] - Quote
Heh, Plleasure Hub I have to say I've rather enjoyed reading your posts in MD - especially the rather detailed progress reports on your previous loans. I get the impression you genuinely like playing with the market and manufacturing in EVE which I can relate to and it was good to see someone else really getting into it.
Uncollateralised loans are a bit outside my comfort zone at the moment otherwise I probably would have jumped in on your previous offers but 5% for 3 or 4bil for 2 or 3 months... got to say I think you're pushing things a bridge too far with this latest offer  Though you kinda already thought that yourself from the start of the thread.
I guess the relative silence from MD forum goers on this offer speaks volumes about what people here think of you though, I reckon most folks who tried these terms would have been ridiculed relentlessly within minutes of the first post 
Who knows you might find that angel investor that would agree to these terms. If not I hope you do rework the offer to make it more palatable for the more average investor.
Anyway that was my 0.01 ISK, best of luck with the offer - either way I hope to see more of your posts around  |
Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
32
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Posted - 2014.07.02 12:05:00 -
[12] - Quote
SCLZ wrote:Heh, Plleasure Hub I have to say I've rather enjoyed reading your posts in MD - especially the rather detailed progress reports on your previous loans. I get the impression you genuinely like playing with the market and manufacturing in EVE which I can relate to and it was good to see someone else really getting into it. Uncollateralised loans are a bit outside my comfort zone at the moment otherwise I probably would have jumped in on your previous offers but 5% for 3 or 4bil for 2 or 3 months... got to say I think you're pushing things a bridge too far with this latest offer Though you kinda already thought that yourself from the start of the thread. I guess the relative silence from MD forum goers on this offer speaks volumes about what people here think of you though, I reckon most folks who tried these terms would have been ridiculed relentlessly within minutes of the first post Who knows you might find that angel investor that would agree to these terms. If not I hope you do rework the offer to make it more palatable for the more average investor. Anyway that was my 0.01 ISK, best of luck with the offer - either way I hope to see more of your posts around
Angel investor?
snorts
I do not deal with pirate scum.
xD Seriously though, thanks for your kind words and encouragement, SCLZ. I am glad you enjoyed the reports. They were a lot of fun to put together, too. One enjoyable aspect of running a decent size public loan like that was the challenge to see if I could profit enough to beat the interest rates and still significantly increase my wealth.
The urge to be transparent further motivated me, because I knew people would be watching to see whether I succeeded or failed. It prompted me to search for cool EVE tools like EVE Mentat and jEVEAssets, which now provide me with the detailed view of my in-game progression that I always wished I had.
I do love the EVE economy. I am a crafter / builder / trader in every game I play, but few games offer enough depth to sink your teeth into. In Star Wars Galaxy, I played a Wookiee shop owner, with my own brand of products, ZepCo. In Minecraft MP, I built a gigantic mushroom with a shopping center inside. I have always been drawn to games that encourage entrepreneurship, so New Eden is a fun place to live.
I am using this lull to deal with IRL stuff as well as conduct some market research into new products. I am already seeing some shakeups occur in the looming shadow cast by Crius. It is going to be a profitable summer.
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
Emma Pink45
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 13:01:00 -
[13] - Quote
haha, nice scam |
Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
33
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Posted - 2014.07.02 13:25:00 -
[14] - Quote
Emma Pink45 wrote:haha, nice scam
What is? Your sad excuse for a haircut? I agree. I was hoping those would go out of style once Bieber retired.
You should really stay on topic, though. MD is no place for your fashion-related self-reflection.
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
Emma Pink45
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 13:33:00 -
[15] - Quote
You say you're worth 19bl and your making 3.7bl a month. Work for another month and you'll have the 4bl. You don't need a 4bl loan.
|
Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders
Repeat 0ffenders
900
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 13:56:00 -
[16] - Quote
Emma Pink45 wrote:You say you're worth 19bl and your making 3.7bl a month. Work for another month and you'll have the 4bl. You don't need a 4bl loan.
If it smells like a scam, it probably is. Maybe she needs 8 Bil... just sayin'.
Also, how is someone clearly acknowledging she cannot ensure you'll get your money back a scam?
Finally, I do like her hair more than yours.
@Plleasure: sorry I don't have ISK to spare atm. |
Emma Pink45
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 20:27:00 -
[17] - Quote
sure, bring your alts to back you up |
Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
33
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Posted - 2014.07.02 20:55:00 -
[18] - Quote
Emma Pink45 wrote:You say you're worth 19bl and your making 3.7bl a month. Work for another month and you'll have the 4bl. You don't need a 4bl loan.
If it smells like a scam, it probably is.
Okay, since you offered a more serious criticism, I will give you a serious response.
Gully essentially has the answer:
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:Maybe she needs 8 Bil... just sayin'.
I do need 8B, not just 4B. For that matter, I could fully utilize up to 10-20B in additional funds right now. That figure will continue grow as the scale of my EVE operations increases.
Whether you are trading, manufacturing, or both, you will frequently use up every last ISK in your wallet trying to acquire materials and get items listed on the market.
I currently have a list of 82 items in my spreadsheet that are profitable and worthwhile to create. Due to capital limitations, I rarely get below my top 15 most profitable items before running out. I tend to make items in batches worth 500M-1B in order to increase my ISK per click and to lower the amount of time spent on setting up logistics to move and sell those items.
That means that while manufacturing just 10 of my best items, I can burn through 10B ISK overnight just to get them stocked. Double that amount if I want to go ahead and place buy orders to replenish the raw materials used to make said items. Of course, I will make that money back plus a return, but that can take a while. Traders have the exact same problem. My case is only slightly different, because I have more options to acquire items to sell than a buy order alone.
The main challenge for me is to keep as many of my profitable items stocked as possible, all the time. The more market share I capture for each of those items, the more profit margins I get to claim for myself. Every time I run out of stock for an item, I am missing out on an opportunity, until I restock it again.
I hope that explains why 8B is better than 4B and why I do actually need the ISK in order to increase my overall profit over time.
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
Emma Pink45
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 21:14:00 -
[19] - Quote
1) You say you're making 3.7bl a month. Keep doing it and in 2 months you'll have the 8bl you need.
2) 2 months shouldn't be alot of time for you since you've been playing for 8 years now (2006).
3) 3.7bl from a 19bl capital is about 20%. By the end of the year you'll be at 165bl.
To me it all looks like a scam. Your reasons are contradicting each other. |
Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
33
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Posted - 2014.07.02 21:54:00 -
[20] - Quote
Emma Pink45 wrote:1) You say you're making 3.7bl a month. Keep doing it and in 2 months you'll have the 8bl you need.
2) 2 months shouldn't be alot of time for you since you've been playing for 8 years now (2006).
3) 3.7bl from a 19bl capital is about 20%. By the end of the year you'll be at 165bl.
To me it all looks like a scam. Your reasons are contradicting each other.
1) I want to make more than 3.7B per month. What is currently preventing me from making more is running out of capital so often. Also, I do not need this loan. I want it. Because I can make more money faster.
2) Why be patient and slowly grow a business if you have a way to rapidly expand it and make more money over time? It is common business sense. Anything less would be a waste of opportunity, lazy, and generally a bad business decision.
3) You are oversimplifying the process. My profits are influenced more by the respective profit margins of the items I sell and their sales volume than simply being a set percentage of my total NAV. Competition is a big factor, both in affecting margins and the volume of sales. Assets, particularly materials used in production, are important to ensuring that stock can be produced, but that is the extent of their role.
May I ask if you have experience earning ISK through manufacturing? Because you seem to have a shallow understanding of how a large manufacturing operation actually works, yet you are accusing me of scamming because you do not understand my description of how my business operations have been running.
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders
Repeat 0ffenders
928
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 21:57:00 -
[21] - Quote
Plleasure Hub wrote:May I ask if you have experience earning ISK through manufacturing? Because you seem to have a shallow understanding of how a large manufacturing operation actually works, yet you are accusing me of scamming because you do not understand my description of how my business operations have been running. What do you expect from someone with such a terrible haircut?
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Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
34
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Posted - 2014.07.02 22:18:00 -
[22] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:What do you expect from someone with such a terrible haircut?
Good advice on which salons in town I should avoid. :3
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
36
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Posted - 2014.07.04 04:38:00 -
[23] - Quote
Offer Withdrawn
This post has now run for nearly 5 days without a single investor showing interest, which leads me to believe these terms are not currently possible for me to achieve. I am now withdrawing this offer.
I have been reflecting on many things discussed recently on MD regarding loans and the health of lending culture here. I will expand on one or two new ideas in a more appropriate thread.
Mods, if you could kindly close this thread, I would be much obliged.
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
Emma Pink45
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.04 06:21:00 -
[24] - Quote
Plleasure Hub wrote:Offer Withdrawn
This post has now run for nearly 5 days without a single investor showing interest ....
Wowww, that came as a shock!!!!!!
|
Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
36
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Posted - 2014.07.04 17:45:00 -
[25] - Quote
Emma Pink45 wrote:Plleasure Hub wrote:Offer Withdrawn
This post has now run for nearly 5 days without a single investor showing interest .... Wowww, that came as a shock!!!!!!
Not really, hence the title of the thread. :p I am partially glad it did not work out, as it shows that lenders value their ISK enough to demand better rates. After thinking a lot on RAW23's words in a recent thread, I think I will at least match my last loan's rate in my next offer. I will also be much more conservative in my requested amount, so I can prevent raising exposure to investors too much.
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
virm pasuul
Mine 'N' Refine
Yulai Federation
131
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Posted - 2014.07.04 23:34:00 -
[26] - Quote
You can't quickly manufacture off buy orders, the fulfilment is too haphazard and slow, you can't manufacture quickly to a plan off those. Slowly yes - you swap speed for steady profit - but quickly no.
And whilst some of your buy orders are coming in and sucking up your ISK others don't. So you can't build end product at proper margin, but you are hemorrhaging ISK. Double loose.
There are ways to deal with it but the market will be very chaotic.
When the market is most chaotic there is the most potential to make profit with station trading, but it plays havoc with manufacturing logistics and planning.
The time scale of manufacturing is not favourable too. Manufacturing is too slow to react to a fast chaotic market. You can predict and gamble. By the time your goods come out of the oven the peaks will have dropped.
If you are any good at predicting and gambling you are again better off station trading and not get bogged down into manufacturing.
Manufacturing shines for the long slow game when you are in no hurry to claim back the ISK and cash flow is not an issue.
This is the direct opposite situation to a chaos bringing patch.
Quite simply for me the logic of your plan does not stand up to scrutiny beyond the veneer sorry.
Your description shows a lack of subject knowledge I would expect you to display if your case was genuine.
Alarm bells are ringing.
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Plleasure Hub
Space Goat Logistics
37
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Posted - 2014.07.05 01:01:00 -
[27] - Quote
virm pasuul wrote:You can't quickly manufacture off buy orders, the fulfilment is too haphazard and slow, you can't manufacture quickly to a plan off those.
My experience has been quite different. I stockpile materials to avoid having to wait to restock anything. When one of my sell listings is sold out, I already have the materials ready for the next batch, most of the time. It is true that holding onto materials for a long time involves some risk, but EVE manufacturing is rather easy to win at.
I always check historical prices for materials and finished goods before starting work. I have only had a few instances of incurring a loss in the past, and those were easily absorbed by my overall margins. My spreadsheet automatically updates prices using EVE-Central, and when I see an item's ROI dip to low or negative, I flag the item so I know to be careful about making it.
Even items that see fluctuations will often raise back up to acceptable levels. You just have to pay attention, research the price histories, and restrain from panic selling during dips. One risk management strategy I employ is to limit my production of any specific item to a set amount of ISK and a certain quantity relative to that item's historical sales volume.
virm pasuul wrote:There are ways to deal with it but the market will be very chaotic.
When the market is most chaotic there is the most potential to make profit with station trading, but it plays havoc with manufacturing logistics and planning.
The most profitable way to play is to do both - manufacture and trade. I have made some trades before with materials or items I already understood well. If I noticed strange prices when setting up my orders, I would check to see if I could take advantage. Sometimes people sell items for bizarre prices, even below material costs. I have purchased items like that before, waited a week, and resold them once the prices improved again.
virm pasuul wrote:
The time scale of manufacturing is not favourable too. Manufacturing is too slow to react to a fast chaotic market. You can predict and gamble. By the time your goods come out of the oven the peaks will have dropped.
If you are any good at predicting and gambling you are again better off station trading and not get bogged down into manufacturing.
Again, I have to disagree, especially if you take into account reduced POS manufacturing times. Last night, I started 2 runs of a certain T2 item which took about 10 hours each to complete. I listed them this morning and was surprised when they sold within an hour. This is definitely not always the case, but if you choose your items wisely, you will be able to turn them around in an acceptable amount of time. I only deal in items with strong demand, because it means less 0.01 ISK'ing to get them sold. That said, the more effort you put into 0.01 ISK'ing, the easier it is to get your items sold quickly, just as it is with trading.
virm pasuul wrote:
Manufacturing shines for the long slow game when you are in no hurry to claim back the ISK and cash flow is not an issue.
This is the direct opposite situation to a chaos bringing patch.
It is different with every patch, but one thing I always look for are items with increasing demand due to the patch. For example, when the exploration changes came out, there were some new scanning modules released. There was a nice period of insane margins, even with some of the raw materials being hyper-inflated (I'm looking at you, Spatial Attunement Units). I made a ton of money from those.
Some very old items are currently seeing big spikes in demand already due to changes in game mechanics. Lots of players need them and are buying them more often, which is naturally going to lead to wider margins and higher prices. There are also old items with roles being changed or improved, which has started bringing their prices up, too.
virm pasuul wrote:
Quite simply for me the logic of your plan does not stand up to scrutiny beyond the veneer sorry.
Your description shows a lack of subject knowledge I would expect you to display if your case was genuine.
Alarm bells are ringing.
I appreciate you providing a lot of detail in your criticism. You are wrong, though. I have not lied about anything, and I can prove everything I have said with objective evidence. I am not the greatest expert of the EVE economy, but I have successfully amassed a small fortune purely from industry. I do my best to learn about and understand EVE economics and gameplay. I am sure I will suffer from attribution error sometimes. However, I am what I say I am, and I will continue having fun building things for profit. I may even expand how much I trade in the future. But for now, vive la industrie.
"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." GÇö Kazuto Kirigaya |
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