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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:25:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Humpalot on 05/07/2006 21:25:39
As carebearish as I may seem at times I really do not think there should be 100% safe places in EVE and desire game balance overall. Towards that end I was thinking on hi sec empire ganks and how to have something that could make both sides happy*.
My idea is for a mod that will allow a ship to know when it is being passively targetted and/or cargo/fitting scanned. So, if you are in a hauler and have this mod on (it should be passive I think) and someone targets you you will know about it (either by an autolock back or a popup message or whatever people/CCP thinks best). An indicator that you are being cargo/fitting scanned would also be good although perhaps just knowing you are being passively targetted is sufficient.
This allows haulers to know when someone is taking an interest in them and give them a heads-up. What they choose to do with that info is up to them.
For the Empire ganker they can still nail AFK haulers or someone who thinks they can bust through the ambush or, if they are fast enough to have someone scan and still attack, then go for that.
Yes this would lower the number of successful ganks but I think it lends some balance to the equation. The hauler now has some info and can choose how to act upon it and the gankers can still nab AFK toons or others if they feel like giving chase (which could be fun for both in its own right).
Easy on the flames...just thinking out loud.
*-"Happy" insofar as it is not a whine and not asking to utterly strip them of the ability to mug someone.
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CrayC
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:28:00 -
[2]
The whole point of PASSIVE targetters are that there are no countermeasures to them. And haulers are ALWAYS interesting  so people flying them boats should always be aware...
Mod useless, sorry...
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:30:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Humpalot on 05/07/2006 21:31:10
 Originally by: CrayC
The whole point of PASSIVE targetters are that there are no countermeasures to them.
Fine....skip the passive targetter if you do not like that but have a mod that does detect the cargo scan.
Although what is wrong with the notion of a countermeasure? EVE is loaded with such things. You do X and I can do Y to counter it.
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Erik Pathfinder
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:37:00 -
[4]
This is a good idea. How would it work with cloaked ships passively scanning you though?
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:39:00 -
[5]
Imagine if we had mods to stop suicide ganks
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:40:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Erik Pathfinder
This is a good idea. How would it work with cloaked ships passively scanning you though?
Thats not an issue... you can't scan people while cloaked.
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:42:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Humpalot on 05/07/2006 21:44:50
Originally by: HippoKing
Imagine if we had mods to stop suicide ganks
Those do not stop ganks.
People have already figured how to gank freighters whenever they start dropping loot FFS.
Yes you can make it harder on the ganker but if the math is right the gank will happen (I'll see if I can find for the thread where someone showed how a buffed Transport could be solo ganked)
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Deva Blackfire
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Posted - 2006.07.05 21:58:00 -
[8]
Yeah... people also figured out you need abt 15-20 HIGH skilled BS pilots piloting gank set-up BS to kill freighter.
For the investment used to pop freighter you can always hire 3-5 apocs with remote shield/armor transfers + command ship with proper gang modules. They are ALSO defence against ganks.
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:19:00 -
[9]
Oh, you are looking to fit one of these
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:21:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Yeah... people also figured out you need abt 15-20 HIGH skilled BS pilots piloting gank set-up BS to kill freighter.
For the investment used to pop freighter you can always hire 3-5 apocs with remote shield/armor transfers + command ship with proper gang modules. They are ALSO defence against ganks.
Yeah but doable and the pilots need not have T2 setups. So well skilled pilots but not uber l33t pilots.
The shield armor transfers will not help much. The gank relies on something close to an instapop (not quite but we are talking taking one down in 30 seconds or less). That does not give enough time for reppers to do much. When faced with the kind of fire a gank would employ against a freighter I doubt the freighter could be saved...just add a few more shots needed to take it down.
Not to mention the notion that you MUST have a fleet with your freighter everywhere you go sucks. Would you be happy playing EVE if the only way you could manage to do anything was with a group? Granted if you are carrying something super valuable then yeah....get the fleet going. But for day-to-day milk runs? Forget it.
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:24:00 -
[11]
Originally by: HippoKing
Oh, you are looking to fit one of these
People Who Live In Glass Houses Should Not Throw Stones
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Kalaan Oratay
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:26:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Humpalot
Edited by: Humpalot on 05/07/2006 22:25:35
Originally by: HippoKing
Oh, you are looking to fit one of these
People Who Live In Glass Houses Should Not Throw Stones
404 ftl
--- Originally by: Archilies
Ignore what others say: Fit what you want, with what you have, whenever you want.
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:27:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Humpalot
Edited by: Humpalot on 05/07/2006 22:25:35
Originally by: HippoKing
Oh, you are looking to fit one of these
People Who Live In Glass Houses Should Not Throw Stones
Fixed Linkage
Also, would you like a complete rundown of the number of haulers I have had suicided?
I'll do it anyway if you like:
I think I got them all 
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:30:00 -
[14]
Originally by: HippoKing
Originally by: Humpalot
Edited by: Humpalot on 05/07/2006 22:25:35
Originally by: HippoKing
Oh, you are looking to fit one of these
People Who Live In Glass Houses Should Not Throw Stones
Fixed Linkage
Thanks....did the same in my above post. Stupid censor filters hit the URL 
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HippoKing
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:31:00 -
[15]
Also, just before I go to bed, I'm going to share a secret of success when hauling in a freighter into a hub. Bring a scout, and if you see 25 battleships all camping the gate, be interested 
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:40:00 -
[16]
Originally by: HippoKing
Also, would you like a complete rundown of the number of haulers I have had suicided?
I'll do it anyway if you like:
I think I got them all
In three years of EVE (minus a sabbatical) I have had one hauler nailed and that was in 0.0 by myself....had it coming (wouldn't call it a gank...just straight up got me).
Yes I fly smart and nerf what is in cargo to make it not worth ganking or MWD hauler or instas if I have them for the run plus use hardeners and bubblewrap and so on.
Nevertheless the Empire gank is still crap. That I HAVE to nerf my ship to make it less juicy is lousy gameplay. Hauling is awful enough without being forced to double the trip to carry it all and having to stare at the screen unable to take a **** without docking. Would be one thing in 0.0 but when I am less safe in 1.0 than most of 0.0 (assuming I belong to the local alliance) is messed up.
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.05 22:44:00 -
[17]
Originally by: HippoKing
Also, just before I go to bed, I'm going to share a secret of success when hauling in a freighter into a hub. Bring a scout, and if you see 25 battleships all camping the gate, be interested
Login gank FTW!
CCP seems ok with that too so I guess it must be cool.
Heck...have them 2 AU away in a safespot and warp to gate when their scout sees the freighter jump on the other side. Plenty of time to arrive and shoot. No need to mess with a login gank.
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Zac Dai
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Posted - 2006.07.05 23:16:00 -
[18]
What the hell is wrong with this idea?
I agree passive targeters should not have a counter but there definitely should be a module to show when your being scanned.
Better yet what we really need is messages that notify us when people are using active mods on us.
We already have this for scramblers and guns so why not for all active mods like EW and ship/cargo scanners.
Why the hell are you all flaming him??
He hasn't asked for an invunerability button just the info needed to help him take the right course of action.
Seriously getting sick of people on these forums. 
Btw before you flame me for being an alt, my main has been suspended and if you really want to know who my main is send me a mail ingame.
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vile56
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Posted - 2006.07.05 23:44:00 -
[19]
whats wrong with this idea is ccp should not hold your hand threw eve
simple as that.
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.06 01:16:00 -
[20]
Originally by: vile56
whats wrong with this idea is ccp should not hold your hand threw eve
Oh....you mean like the risk versus reward Empire gankers have to cope with?
Try it like this with a (made up) real world scenario:
George calls his buddy Jack and says he knows of a truck going down main street loaded with $300 million in goods.
Jack pulls up next to the truck in broad daylight in the main business district in front of a police station, hops out and hijacks the truck. Police see all of it and immediately bust Jack.
The police confiscate Jack's car and while they are doing the paperwork George proceeds to empty the truck and puts all the goods up for sale in a store next to the police station.
Jack leaves the police station and walks across the street to his insurance company and collects the payout for his car that was just confiscated by the police. Jack then buys a new car at the dealership nearby and gets new insurance.
All this takes 20 minutes and as Jack is leaving he sees another truck driving by that another friend of his told him was filled with $300 million in loot.
Rinse and repeat ad nauseum.
Does that make any sense to anyone? Yes this is a game and not RL but that is screwed up even in a game.
Empire gankers have NO worries about anything. They are gaming the system that protects THEM. It is one thing to chase a hauler down in 0.0 but quite another to do it more simply and with less risk in 1.0. It's just math and once they see a profitable mark it is all over.
In EVE there should be balance and my idea above I think offers some possibility for a hauler to avoid an Empire gank. You can make the reqs for the mod whatever you want or make it hard to fit (nerf the cap or something so hauler can't AB all the way to the gate for a tradeoff if you like...whatever). Still, AFK haulers or haulers who feel*****ey can still be had. Heck....you could even try chasing the hauler as he looks for an alternate route. Might even add some fun to the whole thing.
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Cade Morrigan
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Posted - 2006.07.06 01:55:00 -
[21]
Originally by: vile56
whats wrong with this idea is ccp should not hold your hand threw eve
simple as that.
Hm, yeah, that is simple! Let's get rid of insurance on ships.
-= Save the Gila! Fix its grid and cpu! =-
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Humpalot
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Posted - 2006.07.06 02:10:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Cade Morrigan
Originally by: vile56
whats wrong with this idea is ccp should not hold your hand threw eve
simple as that.
Hm, yeah, that is simple! Let's get rid of insurance on ships.
I bow to you.
Said everything I was trying to say in my last post a LOT more succinctly.
What Cade said.
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