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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Ryoko Hunter
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Posted - 2006.07.10 23:15:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Ryoko Hunter on 10/07/2006 23:16:53
Edited by: Ryoko Hunter on 10/07/2006 23:15:55
Heist
A true scammer can work themselves into any position of trust.
Edit: fixed link |
Mr Happ
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Posted - 2006.07.11 02:24:00 -
[32]
Found It - Wondered where this had gone lol.
Okay so now where *sticky*
Please feel free to add any ideas on how corp thieves, escrow scams etc can be avoided by new ceos etc.
Thank you to the mods for sticky stuff attached
LDT Recruitment |
Mr Happ
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Posted - 2006.07.11 02:28:00 -
[33]
 Originally by: Jacques Archambault
Gave this some temporary glue for now.
-Jacques'
Thank you and ill stop spamming your mailbox now :)
LDT Recruitment |
Mr Happ
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Posted - 2006.07.11 02:28:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Joshua Foiritain
The people you dont trust arent the ones you should worry about.
Its the ones you do trust and that have access toi everything, the biggest thefts in eve where done by people who trusted, those that where there from the beginning and put major effort into the corporation.
I agree with this statement Josh but..
I have always tried to make sure that i watch members with full access, if they start to becoem dispondent and argue with me alot i remove there roles. An early sign just needs to be watched out for
LDT Recruitment |
mazzilliu
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Posted - 2006.07.11 02:57:00 -
[35]
oh, oh, i know. how about searching for the player's name on eve-search.com and see their history on the forums. that would of course be the logical step to take before #3 happens.
io hope that hasnt been posted already im getting terrible at reading nowadays
---------
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Azirapheal
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Posted - 2006.07.11 13:49:00 -
[36]
right. ive seen one bit of "advice" given out which i utterly disaggree with.
"never accepta player that has a long list of corps in their employment history"
im about 4 months old or whatnot
ive been in about 15 corps in that time.
ive left them for various reasons.. one was getting ripped off BY the corp, the rest were mainly compatibility issues, people with different goals to me, and who wanted things done differently.
i have now, happilly found a corp, and a group of people im happy to spend my hard purchased time with.
yes, i have access to corp hangars, and have been entrusted with various things.
this is a trust i do not wish to break with a group of guys that have made me very happy in game.
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Mr Happ
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Posted - 2006.07.11 13:57:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Azirapheal
right. ive seen one bit of "advice" given out which i utterly disaggree with.
"never accepta player that has a long list of corps in their employment history"
im about 4 months old or whatnot
ive been in about 15 corps in that time.
ive left them for various reasons.. one was getting ripped off BY the corp, the rest were mainly compatibility issues, people with different goals to me, and who wanted things done differently.
i have now, happilly found a corp, and a group of people im happy to spend my hard purchased time with.
yes, i have access to corp hangars, and have been entrusted with various things.
this is a trust i do not wish to break with a group of guys that have made me very happy in game.
the employment history doesnt really mean anything. im pretty sure i enver said that. Standings matter. U should see my ceos history :) Thank you for your input
LDT Recruitment |
Malthros Zenobia
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Posted - 2006.07.11 15:58:00 -
[38]
If you can't physically meet and wtfbbq them if need be, don't give them full access.
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Mr Happ
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Posted - 2006.07.12 03:18:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Malthros Zenobia
If you can't physically meet and wtfbbq them if need be, don't give them full access.
not really a good things but okay, if it works for u then it works :)
Sister Zoot Is My Stalker - I Love Her! |
Sergeant Spot
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Posted - 2006.07.13 11:37:00 -
[40]
Edited by: Sergeant Spot on 13/07/2006 11:40:00
Excellent Thread:
CRITICAL DETAIL ON SECURITY:
Do not fall into the "hurt feelings" trap.
You will almost invariably get members who complain that it is not fair to trust only some members.
MUCH worse, are the members who want a specific set of goals to achieve in order to become what they view as "Full members". You might as well hand corp thieves a step by step guide of how to access your secure assets.
Complaints of an "inner circle" and "lesser members" are also something to watch out for.
The above examples are just a few, but they all revolve around a members complaining about hurt feeling because you "don't trust him".
Whatever you do, DON'T TRUST HIM, not even if you are sure he is being honest. Once you trust one guy due to hurt feeling, there will be more. Then the Thief WILL get in.
If you engage in team play in Eve, you can either:
--Risk getting seriously robbed
--guarentee that you will be seriously robbed
Choose one.
If you let concern for hurt feeling affect security, you must choose "guarentee getting seriously robbed".
Tell new member up front, in Corp intro information, that their "feelings" will NOT be a factor in corp security for major assets.
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ClarCE
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Posted - 2006.07.13 14:46:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Qinoly
As a general rule.. don't even think about taking in corp hoppers. (you know these players that have 30+ different corporations in their employment history)
I couldn't disagree more, I have a serious problem with staying in one place, always have done - its never driven me to steal anything from anyone, tvm.
Don't tar everyone with the same brush its bloody rude. You should be recruiting people based upon their individual merits, and whats stopping you from contacting the ceo's in their old corps for references?
You could always /engage brain.
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2006.07.14 02:25:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Mr Happ
4. When claming escrows in the amounts above 200mil or even below. Always check the product before claiming it. This will help avoid potential loss.
Good advice.
Has nothing to do with corp thieves though.
Anyway, ALWAYS inspect
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Oldmanclay
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Posted - 2006.07.14 15:19:00 -
[43]
One measure that is quite good to root out alts applying is that of getting them at the interview stage to take a screen pic of the login page and mail it to the CEO's mail account, or a hotmail account if you don't want to divulge personal mail accounts. They are online so should have no problem doing this immediately. It will show you where they are, what their wallet contains and who else is on the account. A check of these other characters can be revealing! As already mentioned, never give access to anything you cannot afford to lose. Giving access to general module hangars will give the genuine applicant a sense of trust and worth whereas the little toerag who rips you off will only be getting away with modules you can afford to lose. You write off every ship you take out as lost so that you know you can sustain that loss should it happen, do the same with the content of your hangars.
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Mr Happ
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.07.14 16:32:00 -
[44]
Totally agree with the above poster, LDT have started to put this into practice.
Keep the ideas coming :)
Sister Zoot Is My Stalker - I Love Her! |
swisher
The Lost Souls
Curse Coalition
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Posted - 2006.07.22 16:46:00 -
[45]
I am always willing too assist in information too help with others...in this area..I have some experience :P but all in the past..
I will give you some insight on the main keys and points as a once ripper too rip off some of the biggest mega corps in eve..now retired I am.
As a theif you look at who has access too what you want..this is ez done by checking members stats on if there a director or where they have access at.
You then check assets where there located at..so you can clone jump there fast also loging time when people are online or offline..mainly noticed..directors...cause everyone else doesnt matter cause they cant see or know what your doing unless its a dir or CEO..
As a thief ..you look at how you can play your cards atleast a good one that wants the mother load which is normally corp isk or corp bps or mins..
A thief can be stopped...I have ripped off back in my days of doing it 58 corps 20 big nammed corps with alts. so I have some insight if the wise take note you will be secured from others that want too do you harm.
Keeping a corp secured is number 1. Personally I have never been ripped..cause I know the game of a theif..I know the mind I know cause I am still temped even now at times..but dont..
As a CEO your the man..its up too you too secure your corp stuff..have your directors and you close let them know your alts and how you talk setup passwords..cause I could tell you stories of people I have ripped where I was like I'm the alt CEO..XXX and bs em too give me all access rights..you have too setup a opsec system within your directors cause they will always be someone that wants too rip you off..a good theif is a smart one..he will watch for your weak points..and use them against you. He will wait till the corp is 16 jumps out til he asks for something...cause he can see where your at on map...
Trust no one..is my point..only the people you know ingame for a long time and know...it always comes down on your management of your assets..if you get ripped it was because some director was stupid or your CEO didnt take the needed steps too do so.
You will have thief which I can legit for ...come into a corp as a female char..which works great..and play a mindgame and use that as there door too get in..which in the background its a guy who is just playing the game..always keep your bps secured either in the CEO hangor or copies in the prod hangor..
Hope some of this has helped you out...but in the end if you do get ripped..its your problem...you F up somewhere..every corp I ripped off back in my day of that time...I explained why and how I did it ..and would come back a few months too see if they learned..some did some didnt..but still the door is always there for the openning..its up too the leadership.
-swish
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Mr Happ
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.07.23 08:40:00 -
[46]
Totally agree with the above poster, thanks for your input, appreciate it :0
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Istvaan Shogaatsu
Guiding Hand Social Club
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Posted - 2006.07.23 19:57:00 -
[47]
Any self-respecting corp thief will have a doctored screenshot of their login screen ready for sending to prospective marks.
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Deja Thoris
Contraband Inc.
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Posted - 2006.07.24 10:54:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu
Any self-respecting corp thief will have a doctored screenshot of their login screen ready for sending to prospective marks.
Any smart CEO will then send a small random amount of ISK to said "potential thief" and ask for a subsequent screenie.
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Mr Happ
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.07.24 13:27:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu
Any self-respecting corp thief will have a doctored screenshot of their login screen ready for sending to prospective marks.
Well your corp would know now wouldn't they?
The point that you can tell doctores images if u look closely enuff and tbh, u just gave away one of your corps ways of entering a corp
So in responce - Check for doctred images and then do what deja said :L()
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Gallente Citizen 1515
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Posted - 2006.07.24 13:49:00 -
[50]
Edited by: Gallente Citizen 1515 on 24/07/2006 13:49:25
Originally by: Mr Happ
Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu
Any self-respecting corp thief will have a doctored screenshot of their login screen ready for sending to prospective marks.
Well your corp would know now wouldn't they?
The point that you can tell doctores images if u look closely enuff and tbh, u just gave away one of your corps ways of entering a corp
So in responce - Check for doctred images and then do what deja said :L()
Gaaaaah! the dumb streaming off you in waves, it burnssss, it burrrrnnnnnnsssss!!!oneEleven
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Mr Happ
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.07.24 14:06:00 -
[51]
How you haven't been banned yet is beyond me
Again mods mailed
I don't think ive ever used my mail account so much
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Gallente Citizen 1515
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Posted - 2006.07.24 14:41:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Mr Happ
How you haven't been banned yet is beyond me
Again mods mailed
I don't think ive ever used my mail account so much
Here's a thought for you, perhaps you're not the only person with an email account, eh?
Here's another free thought, when you don't post stupid things, I don't call you on it...
Just sayin'
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Jacques Archambault
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Posted - 2006.07.24 16:28:00 -
[53]
Thread cleaned.
Please keep it polite and on topic.
-Jacques'
forum rules | [email protected] | Our Website!
Want to be an EVE-Online forum moderator? click here!
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0o0Preatorian0o0
Crest Tech
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Posted - 2006.07.25 23:29:00 -
[54]
Brought to you by Crest Tech
Ok lesson 1, always interview your players, see if they have bad intentions
And where they want to head in eve life.. Always get screenshots of
Newcomers to the Corp, char login screen and a dropdown of their login
page so it shows all login names (this can be overcome by clearing the cache
folder in eve folder or name changed so it doesn't always work)
2. Hanger access..
What I have found useful is to create titles for access levels. 1-5 5 being
everything but blueprints in any station except HQ which has no mineral
access
AL4 pretty much the same but cannot take from minerals or factory
output (ships/expensive DIR only stuff)
3 my basic access for members, they get hanger access to equip, drones
skills,dropaccess to minerals, and weapons,
2 is the same as above except he cannot take from the drones/skills
1 is the lowest guy, set this guy with queue access only to equip weapons
and he can look at the rest...
now to the fun part... CANS... Station cans...
Now, first off there are a few ways to do this, IM going to suggest my
Personal fav.. I setup the titles to have access where I want, no items
Unless their under 10k stay out of a can.. and everything canned in HQ. NO
CAN TAKE ACCESS they can remove the cans entirely (pw or not) EQUIPMENT
CONFIG!!
This allows them to access (open/unlock and remove items from cans and
name them and config ectect.) So you setup a can (common DIR and CEO
known WP's for config and set a common pw for each level of access, I
have 2.) Config can check in the box for view log for normal cans for
members with lower access. They can open unlock and take what they need,
and lock it back.. If its not locked and someone takes it there is no log.... It
will show you who unlocked what and how many was taken and when they
locked it back. Now Access level 1 doesn't not have equip config so he
cannot look. so he has in hanger items. Now that the plebes don't have
access to Corp goods we can put them on a trial period..
ok now to move on to more secure setups for better equip..
Same canz, config setup checked for view log and unlock. and put a
password on the can as well as config pw. Now this is for good stuff (you
can have 2 or 3 levels of cans) I put anything over 300k into this can. If a
lower access member needs an item from here he has to ask a dir. or CEO,
or another with the pw to unlock.. but now if a noobie 20 days old wants to
use a mega particle blaster or some **** we know better right?!
If you do this with 2-3 levels say s under 200k unpw can, 201k-2m in
another, and everything above that for directors and trusties.. If a new
comer comes along and wants into the good stuff, Tough **** for them,
unlock for him just as the rest.
What to watch for..
If items that are good and you know the guy has taken from a can and its
just sitting in his hanger you know he's probably not using that **** he's
gonna sell it.. We don't want this right?!
If they ask for access they may be a thief. Their attitude towards you,
things they say, how they don't do much and allot more can be signs..
If and when you go to war, watch for members joining before and during
the war, normally I will kick recent members if they joined a day or so
before the war asking questions and ****..
Check members hangers often for Corp stuff and don't let ne1 have access
to Corp prints but a DIR, loan then out lock BPO's with a vote, DO NOT GIVE
SHARES TO normal members, as they can use 1 share and vote to be the
CEO and take over if no one see's the vote. an email is sent though. Also
Trader access can give them full access to spent the Corp wallet.. They can
buy and sell so you need to trust the person with this role. For more info
on titles and such feel free to eve mail me in eve I have a list of the rolls
and what they allow.... 0o0Preatorian0o0
Join CEO channel to ask for more info, a lot of them guys will help corps out
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Mr Happ
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.07.30 15:28:00 -
[55]
Id like to thyank everyone who has posted here and also the moderators for keeping those smacktards off the thread.
Keep the ideas coming - Im hoping that this thread will get proper recognition and really help people in eve and stop this stealing business.
Keep up the ideas and helpful commnets, doesn't matter how small your comment is, if it helps, please post it
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Scientist 8301
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Posted - 2006.08.11 13:43:00 -
[56]
I don't know if this is possible(I'm in a 3 man corp). If it isn't it should be recommended.
1. Restrict Access to BPO Hanger to View Only.
2. Give relevant users access to another hangar, for example MANUFACTURING OUTPUT
3. They can then put the materials required into the BPO hangar, and then retrieve their product from the manufacturing hangar.
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Mr Happ
Gallente
Hellbound Saints
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Posted - 2006.08.13 12:36:00 -
[57]
It is possible yes, you can infact give all members VIEW ONLY access instead of *take* access.
Keep the ideas coming, ive had sevral mails saying thank you about this thread
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Glengrant
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Posted - 2006.08.21 14:58:00 -
[58]
Sorry folks but a lot of the advice given as countermeasures are either worthless or carry their own cost.
The screenshot of login screen doesn't work. If one is going to abuse game mechanics and transfer stolen good - he can
a) do so with another account
b) use a graphics pogram of his choice and fake the screen.
But I'd consider using a throwaway char to transfer away the stolen good only to be deleted as a game mechanic exploit and petition that.
The trust nobody approach or looking at standings hardly is helpful either. If you trust nobody ever - yes - you cannot be robbed - but then you hardly have a working corp either.
Tips like age of the char and prior history can be used a secondary criteria - but don't help that much either. Many of our best members wouldn't be with us if we were paranoid about such things.
I believe that the best strategy versus corp thievs is to expect them. Simply assume that it will happen and limit the damage.
I very much agree with the post above that said that you shouldn't have lots of wealth in corp.
We keep simple T1 modules, Frigs and indus in corp hangars - free for use by almost all corp members - even and especialy young chars (who else needs free Indus/Frigs :-) ). That's the stuff that is most useful for all to have lying around all the time - and not such a big deal when it gets stolen.
Keep BPOs highly restricted. Who besides CEO and a couple of close reseachers ever needs them? The researchers make copies for the producers. If those BPCs get stolen - no terrible loss.
Crusers, Battleships, cool T2 stuff - should be individualy owned by those who use them. No need to have that lying around in corp hangar.
Never have large sums lying around in corp wallet. What for? Pool money from members when needed - not before. Only seduces people to robbery or quarrel about it.
In short protect the few really important things and risk the small utility stuff. If once a year somebody cleans out your MWDs, some ammo and such - plus gets away with a few frigs and indus - so what?
Replaced in short order by mission crap loot and some cheap production. Meanhwile you had a corp that doesn't have to be overly restrictive and paranoid.
I'd rather be robbed once a year than distrust my mates all the time - 99% of which are good people.
And yes - above policy can cost a few tens of millions once in a while - no big deal in the long run and probably much less cost than paranoid measures that slow down the corp.
And many of the real big ripoffs have been made by trusted long tern members of corps who were restrictive about access. A few people have to have access to some things - otherwise they would be useless - and if these core people rip the corp off - nothing can prevent that.
Glengrant
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Capt Tripps
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Posted - 2006.08.23 02:49:00 -
[59]
Edited by: Capt Tripps on 23/08/2006 02:51:34
Edited by: Capt Tripps on 23/08/2006 02:50:24
My first corp theft was small, about 50 ships and tons of mods, nothing too exciting.
2nd one was better, several POS that were in hangers, TONS of mission loot, total value about 1.5 billion.
3rd one was a smaller one but nice, 5 tech II cruisers and quite a few tech II frigates, faction ships etc. and a tons of mods.
But my 4th one, which took over 1 year to complete, was a doozie. About 11 billion in loot, isk and ships, everything you can think of just about including a dreadnaught, BS Bpo's, and a lot of zydrine, goodies like that.
I never did get any Tech II bpo's though. I'm still working on that one. 
All your advice here would be worthless against me. With 7 accounts and numerous major characters, unless you never trusted anyone, sooner or later I'd own you.
Sorry for posting on a alt but I gotta protect my interests, hope you understand. 
You can hate theives all you want but it's part of EVE.
This is one of the few places left online you can "steal" be a theif and have it be worth the effort.  |
Mr Happ
Gallente
Hellbound Saints
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Posted - 2006.08.23 17:34:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Glengrant
Sorry folks but a lot of the advice given as countermeasures are either worthless or carry their own cost.
The screenshot of login screen doesn't work. If one is going to abuse game mechanics and transfer stolen good - he can
a) do so with another account
b) use a graphics pogram of his choice and fake the screen.
But I'd consider using a throwaway char to transfer away the stolen good only to be deleted as a game mechanic exploit and petition that.
The trust nobody approach or looking at standings hardly is helpful either. If you trust nobody ever - yes - you cannot be robbed - but then you hardly have a working corp either.
Tips like age of the char and prior history can be used a secondary criteria - but don't help that much either. Many of our best members wouldn't be with us if we were paranoid about such things.
I believe that the best strategy versus corp thievs is to expect them. Simply assume that it will happen and limit the damage.
I very much agree with the post above that said that you shouldn't have lots of wealth in corp.
We keep simple T1 modules, Frigs and indus in corp hangars - free for use by almost all corp members - even and especialy young chars (who else needs free Indus/Frigs :-) ). That's the stuff that is most useful for all to have lying around all the time - and not such a big deal when it gets stolen.
Keep BPOs highly restricted. Who besides CEO and a couple of close reseachers ever needs them? The researchers make copies for the producers. If those BPCs get stolen - no terrible loss.
Crusers, Battleships, cool T2 stuff - should be individualy owned by those who use them. No need to have that lying around in corp hangar.
Never have large sums lying around in corp wallet. What for? Pool money from members when needed - not before. Only seduces people to robbery or quarrel about it.
In short protect the few really important things and risk the small utility stuff. If once a year somebody cleans out your MWDs, some ammo and such - plus gets away with a few frigs and indus - so what?
Replaced in short order by mission crap loot and some cheap production. Meanhwile you had a corp that doesn't have to be overly restrictive and paranoid.
I'd rather be robbed once a year than distrust my mates all the time - 99% of which are good people.
And yes - above policy can cost a few tens of millions once in a while - no big deal in the long run and probably much less cost than paranoid measures that slow down the corp.
And many of the real big ripoffs have been made by trusted long tern members of corps who were restrictive about access. A few people have to have access to some things - otherwise they would be useless - and if these core people rip the corp off - nothing can prevent that.
Glengrant
Hi, ive mailed the mods as your post is bascially aload of crap. All the comments here have merits, and either use your main or show your corp ticker. Your objective is derail the thread, dont waste your time.
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