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Benglada	Posted - 2006.07.12 04:16:00 - [1] First of all im outlaw. So im sitting outside of my home station in a stabber setup for 100% tackling, rupture warps in and engages me. i figure np, so i dock and get my brutix for some good ole fun. I un dock in my brutix and scramble the rupture (about 30 seconds after he aggroed my stabber) So i attack him but WTF SENTRYS ARE ATTACKING ME???.....So i launch my ecm drones on the rupture hoping to jam him so i can warp off, luckily they do just as i hit 2% structure and i warp off. Anyway, if i switch ships do i not get to attack them anymore or what ?? --------------------------- Originally by: Wrangler Unfrtinately you dnot get to vote..
Rasitiln	Posted - 2006.07.12 04:24:00 - [2] bug as far as I know file a bug report Want to be a pirate? Join Sniggwaffe
Sakura Nihil	Posted - 2006.07.12 05:58:00 - [3] From what you said, bug, as I've pulled the old "shoot me I'm in a Rifter" routine, then switched out to something a tad bigger trick a few times without incident .
Haceldema	Posted - 2006.07.12 08:48:00 - [4] Sounds like he had killrights on you. I believe killrights won't let you fire back without being flagged.
Benglada	Posted - 2006.07.12 08:55:00 - [5] Originally by: Haceldema Sounds like he had killrights on you. I believe killrights won't let you fire back without being flagged. They fixed that months ago. --------------------------- Originally by: Wrangler Unfrtinately you dnot get to vote..
Haceldema	Posted - 2006.07.12 09:37:00 - [6] Originally by: Benglada Originally by: Haceldema Sounds like he had killrights on you. I believe killrights won't let you fire back without being flagged. They fixed that months ago. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if CCP had 'accidentally' rolled that back. Much like the accidentally slipped in Kali features that broke CONCORD.
Dr Conelli	Posted - 2006.07.12 13:52:00 - [7] Edited by: Dr Conelli on 12/07/2006 13:53:34 Its intended, because its very lame to lure a ship into combat with a stabber and then switch to a brutix because u cant handle a simple rupture.
Ryoko Hunter	Posted - 2006.07.12 13:58:00 - [8] Originally by: Haceldema Originally by: Benglada Originally by: Haceldema Sounds like he had killrights on you. I believe killrights won't let you fire back without being flagged. They fixed that months ago. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if CCP had 'accidentally' rolled that back. Much like the accidentally slipped in Kali features that broke CONCORD. I appologize if this is offtopic; I'd do this via a "PM" but this board doesn't seem to have that function... What is broken about CONCORD? Just out of curiosity, though if it's some kind of exploit, forget I asked.
Phelan Boots	Posted - 2006.07.12 14:02:00 - [9] Quote: Its intended, because its very lame to lure a ship into combat with a stabber and then switch to a brutix because u cant handle a simple rupture. What world do you live in again? Jita IV-4? In my world, where we actually kill stuff besides Macro Miners, rupture > stabber. Far, far greater. Quote: info It's not a good idea to place an Exotic Dancer in a Giant Secure Container. The Exotic Dancer will not survive intact, if transported in such a container.
JoeT	Posted - 2006.07.12 18:44:00 - [10] Originally by: Haceldema Sounds like he had killrights on you. I believe killrights won't let you fire back without being flagged. If they shoot you, you can shoot back, even with killrights all well, -10 anyway, not like they do much --- Murder Murder, yes indeed, K-I-L-L-I-N-G
Luigi Fourty	Posted - 2006.07.12 19:17:00 - [11] Originally by: Ryoko Hunter What is broken about CONCORD? Just out of curiosity, though if it's some kind of exploit, forget I asked. CONCORD was completely broken a few months ago.
Yanis Khade	Posted - 2006.07.13 00:27:00 - [12] Are you talking about the great donut famine last june?
Ryoko Hunter	Posted - 2006.07.13 00:32:00 - [13] Originally by: Luigi Fourty Originally by: Ryoko Hunter What is broken about CONCORD? Just out of curiosity, though if it's some kind of exploit, forget I asked. CONCORD was completely broken a few months ago. Yes but how or in what way is it broken?
Epsilon 1	Posted - 2006.07.13 01:38:00 - [14] The flag only applies to 1 ship, in your case - the stabber. Originally by: Steven Gerrard Why do those minmatarians throw their ships together from toilet paper and junk? Originally by: Eltigre Crime in EVE pays the victim.
Benglada	Posted - 2006.07.13 08:17:00 - [15] Wow that kind of sucks />.<\ And yes it was a fleet tackling stabber, it was fit for speed, more speed, and some agility. --------------------------- Originally by: Wrangler Unfrtinately you dnot get to vote..
Syndic Mitth'raw'nuruodo	Posted - 2006.07.13 08:37:00 - [16] Edited by: Syndic Mitth''raw''nuruodo on 13/07/2006 08:37:31 Originally by: Ryoko Hunter I appologize if this is offtopic; I'd do this via a "PM" but this board doesn't seem to have that function... What is broken about CONCORD? Just out of curiosity, though if it's some kind of exploit, forget I asked. I've had three, yes, three petitions with regard to CONCORD blowing up my ship for non-violations. One had to do with fighting a corpmate in front of a station in a .5 system (target locked, hit NOS, wtfBOOM), another was a bugged overview (target locked, near a deadspace gate, flashing red target ye..wtfBOOM) and so it goes. There's been documented issues with CONCORD NOT coming to "aid" those in high-sec, I just have had a bad run of them being too zealous. CCP has so far been very good about looking into these issues and resolving them very well.
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.07.13 09:06:00 - [17] Concord are hardly decent. You can outrun them, you can tank them (with the best gear there is ^^), but to cover teh inadequacies, they simply say that if you do it, you're banned. Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Epsilon 1	Posted - 2006.07.13 10:35:00 - [18] Originally by: Nyphur Concord are hardly decent. You can outrun them, you can tank them (with the best gear there is ^^), but to cover teh inadequacies, they simply say that if you do it, you're banned. You CAN NOT outrun CONCORD. You can outrun the navy/customs if you enter a high security system with a -5 or lower security status. Go to kehour/jita/etc open fire and lets see how can you outrun CONCORD. Originally by: Steven Gerrard Why do those minmatarians throw their ships together from toilet paper and junk?
Nyphur	Posted - 2006.07.13 16:52:00 - [19] Originally by: Epsilon 1 Originally by: Nyphur Concord are hardly decent. You can outrun them, you can tank them (with the best gear there is ^^), but to cover teh inadequacies, they simply say that if you do it, you're banned. You CAN NOT outrun CONCORD. You can outrun the navy/customs if you enter a high security system with a -5 or lower security status. Go to kehour/jita/etc open fire and lets see how can you outrun CONCORD. I have personally outrun concord for the full 15 minutes and then docked again. Any more info would be posting exploits, which I won't do. Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Epsilon 1	Posted - 2006.07.14 04:09:00 - [20] Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Epsilon 1 Originally by: Nyphur Concord are hardly decent. You can outrun them, you can tank them (with the best gear there is ^^), but to cover teh inadequacies, they simply say that if you do it, you're banned. You CAN NOT outrun CONCORD. You can outrun the navy/customs if you enter a high security system with a -5 or lower security status. Go to kehour/jita/etc open fire and lets see how can you outrun CONCORD. I have personally outrun concord for the full 15 minutes and then docked again. Any more info would be posting exploits, which I won't do. In a shuttle Originally by: Steven Gerrard Why do those minmatarians throw their ships together from toilet paper and junk?
Xendie	Posted - 2006.07.14 04:35:00 - [21] Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Epsilon 1 Originally by: Nyphur Concord are hardly decent. You can outrun them, you can tank them (with the best gear there is ^^), but to cover teh inadequacies, they simply say that if you do it, you're banned. You CAN NOT outrun CONCORD. You can outrun the navy/customs if you enter a high security system with a -5 or lower security status. Go to kehour/jita/etc open fire and lets see how can you outrun CONCORD. I have personally outrun concord for the full 15 minutes and then docked again. Any more info would be posting exploits, which I won't do. you just admitted to exploiting, nice going lol Originally by: F'nog This would be great, because lag is not at all a problem currently.
Nyphur Pillowsoft Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.07.15 16:55:00 - [22] Originally by: Epsilon 1 Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Epsilon 1 Originally by: Nyphur Concord are hardly decent. You can outrun them, you can tank them (with the best gear there is ^^), but to cover teh inadequacies, they simply say that if you do it, you're banned. You CAN NOT outrun CONCORD. You can outrun the navy/customs if you enter a high security system with a -5 or lower security status. Go to kehour/jita/etc open fire and lets see how can you outrun CONCORD. I have personally outrun concord for the full 15 minutes and then docked again. Any more info would be posting exploits, which I won't do. In a shuttle In anything that can reach the speed of a shuttle. Like... a battleship? Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Merdaneth	Posted - 2006.07.15 23:10:00 - [23] What this about outrunning Concord being an exploit I keep hearing over and over. Where is this actually mentioned in the official documents? It's certainly not an exploit of game mechanics in itself. And yes, I've outrun Concord for 15 minutes in 1.0, its not really that hard to do. I got bored and wanted to see how fast Concord reacts. Pretty slow...
Zions Child Caldari	Posted - 2006.07.15 23:21:00 - [24] that's concord for you. they run out of donuts, start attacking innocents and leaving the guys in need to be ganked. mainly cuz the gankers have no donuts. they should have made a system wide warning saying, DO NUT EQUIP YOUR SHIP WITH DONUTS!!! CONCORD HAS DONUT DOGS!! THEY WILL FIND AND KILL YOU! or concord may already be dead, sooooo, dont get shot. _________________________________________________________________ w00t yay no sig hijacking yet
Nyphur Pillowsoft Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.07.16 01:24:00 - [25] Originally by: Merdaneth What this about outrunning Concord being an exploit I keep hearing over and over. Where is this actually mentioned in the official documents? It's certainly not an exploit of game mechanics in itself. And yes, I've outrun Concord for 15 minutes in 1.0, its not really that hard to do. I got bored and wanted to see how fast Concord reacts. Pretty slow... Basically, CCP were unable to actually make CONCORD do what they are supposed to do, so they declared that surviving concord is an exploit. If concord are assigned to kill you and do not succeed, you have just committed an exploit. Back before remote shield boosting was considered aiding a criminal, the Zombies used a fleet of remote shield boosting ships to keep some battleships alive in Yulai, a 1.0 system that was the trade hub at the time. They sat at a gate and ganked every ship that passed all day, then were all promptly banned (temporarilly, if I recall correctly). The exploit was in evading justice in a 1.0 system. If you take a pot shot at someone and escape concord, that's hardly reason to justify a GM getting on the case but if you successfully destroy them and get away without losing your ship, that is a solid exploit of the game mechanics and may get you banned. So I think the general idea is that testing is fine but if you use it to actually do anything, expect a ban. By the way, you can also tank concord with specialised ships and gear. It's not even funny for ineffective they are. Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources.
Merdaneth	Posted - 2006.07.16 08:58:00 - [26] Originally by: Nyphur Basically, CCP were unable to actually make CONCORD do what they are supposed to do, so they declared that surviving concord is an exploit. If concord are assigned to kill you and do not succeed, you have just committed an exploit. I have seen no such declaration. And just other players saying it is in exploit doesn't make it so. I have read all the policies and rules, and it is not mentioned. Really, if it is a known bug, it is easy enough to fix. Just make the ship explode automatically after 15 minutes have passed. This is the only thing I see: Originally by: CCP The common definition of an exploit is ôto use the game mechanics in such a way as they were not intended for the purpose of gaining an unfair advantage over other players.ö If you are about attacked by a superior force, running away is a perfectly acceptable tactic and intended use of game mechanics, regardless if the superior force is Concord or not. Originally by: Nyphur Back before remote shield boosting was considered aiding a criminal, the Zombies used a fleet of remote shield boosting ships to keep some battleships alive in Yulai, a 1.0 system that was the trade hub at the time. They sat at a gate and ganked every ship that passed all day, then were all promptly banned (temporarilly, if I recall correctly). Yes, and according to the definition, this is indeed an exploit. It is obvious (to me) that the shield boosting ships are comitting a offense together with the attacker (aiding and abetting a criminal), and IRL police force would certainly attack the boosters, but Concord didn't because it wasn't coded: a bug. Additionally, they ganked ships, which gave them an the unfair advantage. If they just fired at a Stargate, they would't gain an unfair advantage, and wouldn't have comitted an exploit (although they would need to report it as a bug). All in all, I certainly believe evading Concord retribution can be bannable, but its unclear when. For all I know, suicide ganking in high sec could be bannable too (especially when using alts). If anything looks like an exploit of game mechanics (alts and insurance) this would be it.
Rodge Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.07.16 20:40:00 - [27] If Concord really do stop aggressing after 15 mins, then it would be easy enough to escape them if you really wanted to. The problem would be, how does the victim know if Concord have dispensed justice? If someone fires at you in high sec, then warps off, how do you really know if Concord has caught up with them? The GMs won't do anything without a petition, but how can you petition without knowing for sure what happened? Sig inappropriate-not eve related -Abdalion [ 2005.04.17 00:34:30 ] Nagilam > u better leave Rodge, u will not gank any1 else 2nite......
Nyphur Pillowsoft Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2006.07.16 22:12:00 - [28] Originally by: Merdaneth I have seen no such declaration. And just other players saying it is in exploit doesn't make it so. I have read all the policies and rules, and it is not mentioned. I believe it was in a dev post a very long time ago but I can't find it. I tried eve-search but you can't search the dev posts hint hint Chribba and looking for it manually would be like looking for a needle in a mound of **. Originally by:** Merdaneth Yes, and according to the definition, this is indeed an exploit. It is obvious (to me) that the shield boosting ships are comitting a offense together with the attacker (aiding and abetting a criminal), and IRL police force would certainly attack the boosters, but Concord didn't because it wasn't coded: a bug. Additionally, they ganked ships, which gave them an the unfair advantage. If they just fired at a Stargate, they would't gain an unfair advantage, and wouldn't have comitted an exploit (although they would need to report it as a bug). All in all, I certainly believe evading Concord retribution can be bannable, but its unclear when. For all I know, suicide ganking in high sec could be bannable too (especially when using alts). If anything looks like an exploit of game mechanics (alts and insurance) this would be it. Good point, perhaps tanking or outrunning concord aren't exploits in and of themselves, it depends what you do with them. But that's a dangerous stance to take. What if you found an exploit to generate a billion tritanium free without interaction with the community and you used it to amass a billion tritanium, but didn't do anything with it. It isn't an advantage until you use it. What if you used an exploit to generate 4000 billion isk in your wallet just so that you would show up as having it if a dev checked or put the bounty on your alt's head, never to be collected. It's not an advantage but you'll get banned for that (if it's possible). Also, suicide ganking is not an exploit but recycling alts to do it is. It evades punnishment (sec hits). Eve-Tanking.com - For tanking spreadsheet and resources.

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