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FrostFire UberTank
Grand Cayman Corp
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 06:12:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hi guys,
I have been out of the game for many years, and even when i was playing I was never in to PvP due to the latency and semi-frequent disconnects I have because of my location (Thailand).
Therefore I do not know the rules... and need some info.
I am running level 4 missions, and over the last couple days I have noticed one particular criminal (yellow/red) warp in to where I am running missions. this is in .5+ space.
When he/she does that I tend to just warp out and go back later to finish the mission, but its damn annoying. He does not seem to interfere or steal loot or anything... but its my worry since I don't really know the mechanics of PvP that he will be able to somehow trick me in to attacking or something so that he can kick my ass lol.
Can someone please explain what can and cannot be done in a situation like that, and if there are alternatives to running away? Fighting is out of the question - I am not geared for it, and have no PvP skills at all yet. On the positive side my connection issues are much better now (350 ping with no disconnects, but occasional bump to 700-1000 ping), and they just upgraded us to 50mb/s internet, so speed is no longer an issue. So I may get in to PvP eventually... but need to know how to deal with this type of guy for now. (I know to stay out of .4 and below)
Thanks much,
Frosty |
Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
3852
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 06:36:00 -
[2] - Quote
Typically what this person is trying to do is bait you into attacking him after he steals your mission item. He'll then come in fast with a mwd and orbit you and kill you. Since you aren't going to engage him you should be fine, but you may lose out on completing a mission if he grabs something you need for it.
There is also another possibility: he may be a ganker. These pilots will try to kill you in one or two salvos before CONCORD shows up and destroys them. I doubt this is the case here if he or she is coming to your mission pocket though by themselves. If you have a very expensive fit however, be on the lookout for tornados or other ganking ships outside your station. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
4067
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 06:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
They are baiting you. If you engage them, you will lose your ship.
If they are ninja-salvaging or looting my wrecks, I often send them some ISK, because they are obviously destitute.
I also like to engage them in conversation, if they'll chat. I treat them with politeness, good-natured humour, and kindness, regardless of how they treat me.
If the mission objective requires you to obtain an item, they can "steal" it (obtain it before you do), preventing you from completing the mission. They typically well sell it to you for an inflated price. For these missions, it may be better to complete them later, though the intruder might complete the mission for you to get the item (rare).
If you see a lot of them, you are likely in a high-population mission hub. I've not seen any of them for a few years now, since moving to a low-population constellation.
EDIT: Gankers rarely arrive solo, and often have a neutral scout. Only bling-fits really need to be concerned, but if you are piloting a bling-fit, you should be taking precautions, and been long gone before they even got close. |
FrostFire UberTank
Grand Cayman Corp
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 07:18:00 -
[4] - Quote
Thanks for the replies guys.
It was a single guy... so likely going to steal something, yes.
I do have a very expensive fit... Proteus fully loaded with deadspace type A gear.
The good point there is I can armor tank 600/sec, so hopefully gankers would be unable to kill me. I always keep both core-a repairers running when on a mission no matter if I am damaged or not lol.
Will just continue to warp out then and complete the mission later when that happens.
Thanks guys,
Frosty |
Cerisia
Loyal Fortune
863
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 07:40:00 -
[5] - Quote
FrostFire UberTank wrote:Thanks for the replies guys.
It was a single guy... so likely going to steal something, yes.
I do have a very expensive fit... Proteus fully loaded with deadspace type A gear.
The good point there is I can armor tank 600/sec, so hopefully gankers would be unable to kill me. I always keep both core-a repairers running when on a mission no matter if I am damaged or not lol.
Will just continue to warp out then and complete the mission later when that happens.
Thanks guys,
Frosty
Yeah , he'll be using a neut or nos of some variety. The thing about mission runners tanks is that they tend to break when their cap is drained - that will be a crucial part of his tactics when he engages you.
Good call however , warping off and leaving him in the mission is absolutely the best thing to do in these circumstances. This space for rent.. |
erg cz
Sliperer
107
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 07:49:00 -
[6] - Quote
Mission intruders often go for your mobile tractor unit. They will try to destroy it (it takes long since MTU does have some kEHP) which gives them suspect flag. If you ignore them (MTU is too far away and you do not have speed to get there in time) - they will destroy it and get the loot, that was inside. If you defend it - they will attack you without interference from CONCORD and kill you.
Since you are flying quick ship you will most probably get back to your MTU just intime to pick the loot and scope the poor thing into your cargo hold. But if you will go with MJD Battleship, you should try to always be able to jump back to your MTU and grab it before it will be too late. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
5986
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 08:09:00 -
[7] - Quote
All the above advice is sound, but I must point out two things...
FrostFire UberTank wrote:I do have a very expensive fit... Proteus fully loaded with deadspace type A gear.
The good point there is I can armor tank 600/sec, so hopefully gankers would be unable to kill me. I always keep both core-a repairers running when on a mission no matter if I am damaged or not lol. The bolded words are the points of concern.
Having an expensive fit like that does make your a target for gankers.
And just because you can rep 600 hp/sec it does not mean you are immune to ganking. In fact... you might be more vulnerable to it.
The gist of suicide ganking is to try and "punch" right through any "buffer" hp you have before reps kick in and/or the NPC police arrive.
For example: Imagine 10 or so Catalysts (each doing about 200-400+ dps and worth 2 or 3 million) landing right on top of you and applying their damage. That is easily a combined 2000 - 4000 damage per second until CONCORD arrives to kill the gankers (which, in 0.5 security space, is about ~15 seconds... which means they can potentially deal about 30,000 to 60,000 damage total).
Now... combined with the potential value of the loot you may drop (50% chance of a module dropping as loot) the gankers may want to bring in more people just to be sure they kill you.
I suggest you tread carefully from now on now that you have publicly admitted to having such a ship with such a fit. I suggest "travel fitting" you ship (see: after you get a mission, slap on a 1600mm plate until you get to the system you are supposed to go to, dock, refit, and then go to the mission). And always remain mobile and away from the warp-in during the mission itself lest they follow you in. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective.
"How did you veterans start?" |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
20370
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 08:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
^^ Pretty much this, you may have just painted a giant bullseye on your Proteus.
Shiny fits attract gankers like flies around turd. For that sort of potential loot drop even non gankers, like me, may be tempted.
Nil mortifi sine lucre. |
Marc Durant
106
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Posted - 2014.08.26 08:41:00 -
[9] - Quote
Yup, the best way to avoid gankers killing you is to avoid gankers seeing you as a target. You don't need all that fancy lol nonsense gear (apart from that, Proteus isn't exactly amazing for lvl 4 missions). Drop your module cost below 200-300 mil and no one will try and gank you. Yes, yes-áI am. Thanks for noticing.
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Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
4239
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 10:55:00 -
[10] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:^^ Pretty much this, you may have just painted a giant bullseye on your Proteus.
Shiny fits attract gankers like flies around turd. For that sort of potential loot drop even non gankers, like me, may be tempted.
confirming, in fact, i was torn between running a locator agent or advising you. i would leave the deadspace gear at home for a while. =][= |
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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
20372
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 11:23:00 -
[11] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:confirming, in fact, i was torn between running a locator agent or advising you. i would leave the deadspace gear at home for a while. Ralph, I'm shocked....
Nil mortifi sine lucre. |
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
4244
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 11:30:00 -
[12] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:confirming, in fact, i was torn between running a locator agent or advising you. i would leave the deadspace gear at home for a while. Ralph, I'm shocked.... call me soft but FrostFire UberTank wrote: On the positive side my connection issues are much better now (350 ping with no disconnects, but occasional bump to 700-1000 ping) this would feel like kicking puppy in the face. what id like to know is how bad the internet was. =][= |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
20377
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 12:35:00 -
[13] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:what id like to know is how bad the internet was. Probably about this bad.
Nil mortifi sine lucre. |
Morwen Lagann
Tyrathlion Interstellar
1286
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 13:23:00 -
[14] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:Imagine 10 or so Catalysts (each doing about 200-400+ dps and worth 2 or 3 million) landing right on top of you and applying their damage. That is easily a combined 2000 - 4000 damage per second until CONCORD arrives to kill the gankers (which, in 0.5 security space, is about ~15 seconds... which means they can potentially deal about 30,000 to 60,000 damage total).
A Proteus might very well tank that, given native resists on top of a deadspace tank. He said 600dps tank but he's probably talking about an omni resist situation. You'd probably be looking at at least 80% resists in kin/therm at least, which would bring your hypothetical situation of 10 Catalysts down to under 1000 dps. :P
Thrashers, on the other hand... Morwen Lagann CEO, Tyrathlion Interstellar Owner, The Golden Masque
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Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
1314
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 14:32:00 -
[15] - Quote
The short answer is if a mission runner isn't willing to defend what is his, someone can take it, and complaining isn't part of accepted EvE HTFU culture.
The simple formula is thus: Ownership in EvE is directly proportional to a willingness to assert it (with holy void or antimatter...)
So, If someone rolls into your mission, steals all the wreck loots, tags and even mission completion items like the damsel, you have a choice...
You can assert your ownership, or you can accept the loss and move on.
Complaining is tears, and they are rumored to be delicious, in all their various forms.
F
Would you like to know more? |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
20386
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 15:52:00 -
[16] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:The short answer is if a mission runner isn't willing to defend what is his, someone can take it, and complaining isn't part of accepted EvE HTFU culture. The simple formula is thus: Ownership in EvE is directly proportional to a willingness to assert it (with holy void or antimatter...) So, If someone rolls into your mission, steals all the wreck loots, tags and even mission completion items like the damsel, you have a choice... You can assert your ownership, or you can accept the loss and move on. Complaining is tears, and they are rumored to be delicious, in all their various forms. F Dat incoherent rage after getting killed, in Uedama, by war targets
That guy needs to seek help, before he hurts someone IRL.
Nil mortifi sine lucre. |
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
1320
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 20:54:00 -
[17] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:The short answer is if a mission runner isn't willing to defend what is his, someone can take it, and complaining isn't part of accepted EvE HTFU culture. The simple formula is thus: Ownership in EvE is directly proportional to a willingness to assert it (with holy void or antimatter...) So, If someone rolls into your mission, steals all the wreck loots, tags and even mission completion items like the damsel, you have a choice... You can assert your ownership, or you can accept the loss and move on. Complaining is tears, and they are rumored to be delicious, in all their various forms. F Dat incoherent rage after getting killed, in Uedama, by war targets That guy needs to seek help, before he hurts someone IRL. Great to have a guest appearance & update by Erotica 1 in the comments as well.... Would you like to know more? |
Christopher Mabata
Dominion Tenebrarum Reverberation Project
160
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 21:26:00 -
[18] - Quote
Back when i used to do missions someone was ninja-looting my mission in an ishkur, he had the item he wanted that i needed to do the mission so i warped my alt in, suicide ganked him, and took it back ( thank you RNG ).
it was a happy ending. Is it bad if your friend says "that was a Metaphor" and you say "Meta 4? Get Tech II or faction" ?I love the sound of silent explosions in Space.-á |
Luwc
Brodozers Inc.
198
|
Posted - 2014.08.27 06:51:00 -
[19] - Quote
simple rule : if you engage first. he can engage you back. if you dont do anything. neither can he. http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif |
Sabriz Adoudel
Mission BLITZ
3471
|
Posted - 2014.08.27 07:31:00 -
[20] - Quote
FrostFire UberTank wrote:Thanks for the replies guys.
It was a single guy... so likely going to steal something, yes.
I do have a very expensive fit... Proteus fully loaded with deadspace type A gear.
The good point there is I can armor tank 600/sec, so hopefully gankers would be unable to kill me. I always keep both core-a repairers running when on a mission no matter if I am damaged or not lol.
Will just continue to warp out then and complete the mission later when that happens.
Thanks guys,
Frosty
Thank you for the intel. I might drop by and say hello.
Serious advice - don't use A-type modules unless it's to achieve a very important strategic objective (for instance, you might use them in a PVP encounter if you thought they might turn the tide of a battle, and losing the battle would result in you losing a Player Owned Starbase).
For ISK generating activities, such as PVE, it's usually optimal to use cheap deadspace local repair modules and *maybe* propulsion, and just tech 2 modules for weapons, weapon upgrades (like magstabs) and tank.
This is because you will only make an extra 10m ISK per play session from the improved mission clear speed, but you will attract organised predators looking to blow you up and take those modules for themselves. This only needs to happen once per hundred play sessions for you to be behind the person using tech 2 modules. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=366607 - Gank incursion runners, win prizes! August 26-Sept 30. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. www.minerbumping.com - ganking miners and causing chaos |
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Sabriz Adoudel
Mission BLITZ
3471
|
Posted - 2014.08.27 07:32:00 -
[21] - Quote
Luwc wrote:simple rule : if you engage first. he can engage you back. if you dont do anything. neither can he.
Not true. If the OP is being honest about using a full A-type fit, I could put together a fleet of insta-nados and suicide gank him mid mission pocket. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=366607 - Gank incursion runners, win prizes! August 26-Sept 30. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. www.minerbumping.com - ganking miners and causing chaos |
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
4279
|
Posted - 2014.08.27 10:21:00 -
[22] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:Luwc wrote:simple rule : if you engage first. he can engage you back. if you dont do anything. neither can he. Not true. If the OP is being honest about using a full A-type fit, I could put together a fleet of insta-nados and suicide gank him mid mission pocket. He's on point with regards bear flipping/shinaniganising though, the only other thing one of us might do would be, hit all the triggers and pull all the rats onto him (one of my corpies did this lastnight and popped an A type fit rattlesnake) =][= |
Luwc
Brodozers Inc.
200
|
Posted - 2014.08.27 11:02:00 -
[23] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:Luwc wrote:simple rule : if you engage first. he can engage you back. if you dont do anything. neither can he. Not true. If the OP is being honest about using a full A-type fit, I could put together a fleet of insta-nados and suicide gank him mid mission pocket.
5x neutron t2 cats can handle that by the way. (including mission dps)
In all honesty. sure if he doesn't have expierence it is one thing
but if I see more than 2x nados or catalysts appear in my mission its time to run.
Whoever is able to fly a pimped and skilled proteus should also be smart and skilled enough to avoid suicide ganks in missions.
I am on the agressor part here. I warp to missions and I suicide gank.(usualy because I get paid for it)
The easiest prey is the people that just start blazing away as soon as you go suspect (flip loot or kill a MTU)
A succesful suicide gank requires in essence 2 things :
a) stupid or inexpierenced prey b) organisation with multiple fleet members
Factor a) OP seems neither stupid or very inexpierenced Factor b) OPs agressor seems to be flying solo
Also :
Drop by in the pub channel RDNEX bar & grill if you are looking for merc services to grid of the annoying dude. http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif |
Sabriz Adoudel
Mission BLITZ
3477
|
Posted - 2014.08.28 02:18:00 -
[24] - Quote
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:He's on point with regards bear flipping/shinaniganising though, the only other thing one of us might do would be, hit all the triggers and pull all the rats onto him (one of my corpies did this lastnight and popped an A type fit rattlesnake )
I've experimented with the 'Shoot All The Triggers' approach before without luck, jumping into various missions in an Ishtar. Perhaps I should give it a go in a Kronos some time, where I can just tank everything (maybe even looking like i'm helping) then MJD away and POQ.
Or maybe fit out an Eos (kin/therm tanked) with a medium MJD and look for someone doing Blockade 4 in Dodixie..... https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=366607 - Gank incursion runners, win prizes! August 26-Sept 30. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. www.minerbumping.com - ganking miners and causing chaos |
Sabriz Adoudel
Mission BLITZ
3477
|
Posted - 2014.08.28 02:25:00 -
[25] - Quote
Luwc wrote:Sabriz Adoudel wrote:Luwc wrote:simple rule : if you engage first. he can engage you back. if you dont do anything. neither can he. Not true. If the OP is being honest about using a full A-type fit, I could put together a fleet of insta-nados and suicide gank him mid mission pocket. 5x neutron t2 cats can handle that by the way. (including mission dps) In all honesty. sure if he doesn't have expierence it is one thing but if I see more than 2x nados or catalysts appear in my mission its time to run. Whoever is able to fly a pimped and skilled proteus should also be smart and skilled enough to avoid suicide ganks in missions. I am on the agressor part here. I warp to missions and I suicide gank.(usualy because I get paid for it) The easiest prey is the people that just start blazing away as soon as you go suspect (flip loot or kill a MTU) A succesful suicide gank requires in essence 2 things : a) stupid or inexpierenced prey b) organisation with multiple fleet members Factor a) OP seems neither stupid or very inexpierenced Factor b) OPs agressor seems to be flying solo
Also : Drop by in the pub channel RDNEX bar & grill if you are looking for merc services to grid of the annoying dude.
Catalysts don't work well in missions because neutron cats can only apply damage within about 3km, and most bears are either in a Marauder, or move in missions for the benefit of a speedtank (or just because the mission somewhat requires it). I could be wrong, but IIRC Neutron cats can't even fit an afterburner without significant sacrifices like downgrading two guns (and an MWD requires much bigger sacrifices like a whole rack of ions).
Instanados provide plenty of warning if you watch D-scan, but if you do not, they do not give much warning at all. They appear on grid, lock you in a couple seconds, then you die to alpha unless you are effectively speedtanking the instanado already (and most mission ships do not have the agility to do this unless they saw the instanados on D-scan, in which case any competent pilot will warp out. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=366607 - Gank incursion runners, win prizes! August 26-Sept 30. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. www.minerbumping.com - ganking miners and causing chaos |
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
4345
|
Posted - 2014.08.28 08:14:00 -
[26] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:Ralph King-Griffin wrote:He's on point with regards bear flipping/shinaniganising though, the only other thing one of us might do would be, hit all the triggers and pull all the rats onto him (one of my corpies did this lastnight and popped an A type fit rattlesnake ) I've experimented with the 'Shoot All The Triggers' approach before without luck, jumping into various missions in an Ishtar. Perhaps I should give it a go in a Kronos some time, where I can just tank everything (maybe even looking like i'm helping) then MJD away and POQ. Or maybe fit out an Eos (kin/therm tanked) with a medium MJD and look for someone doing Blockade 4 in Dodixie..... I cant get it to work either but Faylee managed it. =][= |
Baneken
Arctic Light Inc. Arctic Light
316
|
Posted - 2014.08.28 08:51:00 -
[27] - Quote
when I did my lvl 4's years ago I did them in quiet system (ie. not in motsu or dodixie) and if I saw probes and more then 3-5 guys from the same corp in d-scan/local respectively it was the time to bail out and come back later.
With that being said a normal domi in T2 fit is enough to do any lvl 4 missions, it won't blitz them though but it's not getting ganked for goodies either. |
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