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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Melkan Krow
The Scope Gallente Federation
3
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Posted - 2014.08.26 12:42:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hi guys,
Sorry, I don't get the whole point of taking risks mining Arkonor compared to Veldspar. I'll get, for the same investment in time, almost the same value in selling Veldspar compared to Arkonor. As an inspiring and debutant miner, I bought a Venture, 'just to see' what I could do with it, but the ship is basically useless. Bringing back a full cargo of Arkonor from null sec / WH will not make me richer selling it compared to mining in high sec Veldspar.
tl;dr : volume-wise, you get almost the same ISK profit selling Veldspar and Arkonor. Why mine the later? |
Chuk Ormand
El Diablo De Verde
11
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 14:11:00 -
[2] - Quote
I mostly agree with your observation, I used to mine my own minerals for my own manufacturing. Those ABC ores looked so much prettier in my cargo hold. And they also took up 10 times as much room.............so even at 10 times the price "per piece" i wasn't mining them for profit. When i lived in null last year i always had plenty of the premium minerals. It was trit and pyerite i needed. It never made much sense to mine spodumain in risky space when it is so easily and safely mined in empire. The rocks are much bigger in null. I've seem 150k veld rocks and spod so huge it took 5 guys days to pop. It was much more fun to mine in null (as a group). Staying alert keeps things interesting. -chuk |
Thur Barbek
Republic University Minmatar Republic
300
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 14:32:00 -
[3] - Quote
Chuk Ormand wrote:The rocks are much bigger in null. I've seem 150k veld rocks and spod so huge it took 5 guys days to pop.
Real miners have killed the king spod. It is not an easy thing to do. |
Zero Sum Gain
FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDOOOOOOOOM Silent Requiem
96
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 17:09:00 -
[4] - Quote
You don't go out and mine in null for the profit, or the community, or your alliance or your corp or even for yourself. You call in sick and set your alarm clock for low activity hours so you can fly out to null and mine just to spit in the face of God and logic. You get out there and mine arkanor not because you can or because you want to, but because some men just want to watch the world burn. |
Melkan Krow
The Scope Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 18:05:00 -
[5] - Quote
ok, but fun answer aside, any serious one? Is a whole part of the gameplay (having fun and thrill mining precious ore in dangerous places) crippled and now (insert the update changing ore worth/volume) worthless? |
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
309
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Posted - 2014.08.26 19:11:00 -
[6] - Quote
If you are mining purely to sell the ore in hisec for profit, choosing Arkonor over Veldspar doesn't make much sense.
If you're mining to support a ship-building program in nullsec and you need the Megacyte, choosing Arkonor over Veldspar makes perfect sense. Reading Comprehension: a skill so important it deserves it's own skillbook.
I want to create content, not become content. |
Zero Sum Gain
FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDOOOOOOOOM Silent Requiem
96
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 19:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
Melkan Krow wrote:ok, but fun answer aside, any serious one? Is a whole part of the gameplay (having fun and thrill mining precious ore in dangerous places) crippled and now
It never existed afaik. Maybe in the first year the game existed. |
Mr Omniblivion
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
41
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Posted - 2014.08.26 21:12:00 -
[8] - Quote
Right now, Arkonor is the second worst ore to mine next to Omber. So, the simple answer is, don't mine Arkonor, ever. Even if you need mega, there are much more profitable ores to get it from in null.
You can thank compression changes for that.
|
Ocih
Space Mermaids Somethin Awfull Forums
713
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Posted - 2014.08.27 07:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
Mining to sell has always favored Veld. It's everywhere and you will never need to worry about having too much trit. |
RAW23
857
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Posted - 2014.08.27 14:56:00 -
[10] - Quote
Anything mined in null gets quite a big bonus these days due to the refine changes. You won't see this if you ninja mine in null and take the ore back to high for processing but if you process in null you can get between 3 and 15% (iirc) extra yield depending on the facility you reprocess in. That gives a pretty huge boost to mining in null if you live there. There are two types of EVE player:
those who believe there are two types of EVE player and those who do not. |
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
5501
|
Posted - 2014.08.28 14:07:00 -
[11] - Quote
Melkan Krow wrote:ok, but fun answer aside, any serious one? Is a whole part of the gameplay (having fun and thrill mining precious ore in dangerous places) crippled and now (insert the update changing ore worth/volume) worthless?
Sit down a moment and look at the bigger picture. Stopping and looking at stuff with calm often yields more profit than jumping in the fray and getting smashed.
What do you see from far away?
You see a MMO economy. Even EvE cannot escape being a played by MMO mentality players. The random MMO player does not value his time at all and neglects any hidden costs, therefore they "farm for farming".
What you get is, you are in competition with them, a competition for the lowest common denominator price. Plus, EvE commodities tend to not be rare enough to cause scarcity induced appreciation. The rare times it happened (see a famous R32 material in the past years), the result became immediately evident in the form of prices rising by 7-800 and even 1000%.
Your ABC minerals are not rare enough to be priced for rarity. They are farmed by MMO players who don't price their time nor factor in their costs.
Result: whatever you gather is more or less irrelevant. There's a sort of "can't be arsed" thresold that supports prices when they tend to fall below it (people stop doing it so price rises again to it), everything more than that comes from stagional / 0.0 wars demand and supply appreciation. Outside of those appreciation times / causes there's little else that makes a digital, virtual item with a certain name different from another. So what becomes relevant is how much of that stuff you can carry around. If you can carry around 10 items A or 1 item B that takes the same volume, then you get a similar pricing for that volume. In RL it does not work like that, but we are not in RL, people in EvE don't have to pay onerous trucks insurance + fuel, don't pay employees for their time (hence in RL time is relevant. And in RL you actually die so time is always short and you want to be well rewarded for spending that short time doing something for somebody else). Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
Twitter channel |
Robert Morningstar
Morningstar Excavations LTD Business Alliance of Manufacturers and Miners
73
|
Posted - 2014.08.28 14:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
Chuk Ormand wrote:I mostly agree with your observation, I used to mine my own minerals for my own manufacturing. Those ABC ores looked so much prettier in my cargo hold. And they also took up 10 times as much room.............so even at 10 times the price "per piece" i wasn't mining them for profit. When i lived in null last year i always had plenty of the premium minerals. It was trit and pyerite i needed. It never made much sense to mine spodumain in risky space when it is so easily and safely mined in empire. The rocks are much bigger in null. I've seem 150k veld rocks and spod so huge it took 5 guys days to pop. It was much more fun to mine in null (as a group). Staying alert keeps things interesting. -chuk
that is not a big rock a 200k geniss is a large rock that is 1 mil m3 and that should only take about 10 hrs to mine
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Robert Morningstar
Morningstar Excavations LTD Business Alliance of Manufacturers and Miners
73
|
Posted - 2014.08.28 19:03:00 -
[13] - Quote
Also what is best to mine is always changing based on the supply and demand you have to check what is best daily to maximize your profit
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
5501
|
Posted - 2014.08.29 15:53:00 -
[14] - Quote
Robert Morningstar wrote:Also what is best to mine is always changing based on the supply and demand you have to check what is best daily to maximize your profit
Yeah 150k rocks are the basic rocks you may find even in 0.3 low sec. Nothing special and it takes little to suck them dry. Been there (corp fleet, a dozen Hulks + gate guards), done that. Auditing | Collateral holding and insurance | Consulting | PLEX for Good Charity
Twitter channel |
Lyris Nairn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
12320
|
Posted - 2014.09.01 15:24:00 -
[15] - Quote
You mostly mine in nullsec for the mid-grade minerals. Prior to the recent industry changes it was very difficult to acquire large amounts of mexallon in nullsec without having a huge surplus of tritanium, even with mineral compression through modules like 425mm railguns. I have not mined since the changes, but I imagine a similar problem remains: people across the universe choose to think as the OP does and places the value of ore and minerals at jita prices rather than on their scarcity and necessity for useful tasks. You would frequently encounter supercapital builderss complaining about the lack of mexallon and wondering why, when their own buy orders and spreadsheets offered the same prices as Jita -- which necessarily made mining the non-mexallon ores more profitable for the miner. Supply and demand don't quite work in EVE as they probably should. Sky Captain of Your Heart
Reddit: lyris_nairn Skype: lyris.nairn Twitter: @lyris_nairn |
Bluespot85
Cherry Popper Mining Company
8
|
Posted - 2014.09.01 20:23:00 -
[16] - Quote
This topic again.
It's evident that CCP dont plan on addressing this issue ever and yet it's so easy to put right.
There have been many ideas suggested over the years but reversing the minerals needed for building seems the most logical.
If we look at a tayra bpo it requires
53500 trit 13800 pyer 5250 mex 1251 iso 251 noc 40 zyd 7 mega
You see whats is wrong here?
It should be the opposite i.e
7 trit 40 pyer 251 mex 1251 iso 5250 noc 13800 zyd 53500 mega
Solves so many issues, is simple to implement and is common sense.
blue |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
618
|
Posted - 2014.09.03 04:01:00 -
[17] - Quote
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Melkan Krow wrote:ok, but fun answer aside, any serious one? Is a whole part of the gameplay (having fun and thrill mining precious ore in dangerous places) crippled and now (insert the update changing ore worth/volume) worthless? Sit down a moment and look at the bigger picture. Stopping and looking at stuff with calm often yields more profit than jumping in the fray and getting smashed. What do you see from far away? You see a MMO economy. Even EvE cannot escape being a played by MMO mentality players. The random MMO player does not value his time at all and neglects any hidden costs, therefore they "farm for farming". What you get is, you are in competition with them, a competition for the lowest common denominator price. Plus, EvE commodities tend to not be rare enough to cause scarcity induced appreciation. The rare times it happened (see a famous R32 material in the past years), the result became immediately evident in the form of prices rising by 7-800 and even 1000%. Your ABC minerals are not rare enough to be priced for rarity. They are farmed by MMO players who don't price their time nor factor in their costs. Result: whatever you gather is more or less irrelevant. There's a sort of "can't be arsed" thresold that supports prices when they tend to fall below it (people stop doing it so price rises again to it), everything more than that comes from stagional / 0.0 wars demand and supply appreciation. Outside of those appreciation times / causes there's little else that makes a digital, virtual item with a certain name different from another. So what becomes relevant is how much of that stuff you can carry around. If you can carry around 10 items A or 1 item B that takes the same volume, then you get a similar pricing for that volume. In RL it does not work like that, but we are not in RL, people in EvE don't have to pay onerous trucks insurance + fuel, don't pay employees for their time (hence in RL time is relevant. And in RL you actually die so time is always short and you want to be well rewarded for spending that short time doing something for somebody else).
Ark is the rarest so mine it first! heh, I almost wish my spreadsheets were updated so I could see what mining looked like now-a-days.
You can trust me, I have a monocole |
Sabriz Adoudel
Mission BLITZ
3528
|
Posted - 2014.09.03 23:15:00 -
[18] - Quote
I don't understand why you'd mine full stop. Pay a useful idiot to do it for you, that's what buy orders are for. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=366607 - Gank incursion runners, win prizes! August 26-Sept 30. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. www.minerbumping.com - ganking miners and causing chaos |
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