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EULA - Does it mean anything, or is it just spam?

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Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 02:40:00 - [1] Im refering to section 2A para 3... Account sharing... Posted - 08/10/2003 17:36:00 - Quote -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- GM - I would believe them on this they did prove to me that my problem with our bp was not a bug, but I have log in access to all the core members that have access to that hanger and was able to go through the journal to find where the problem was. But even knowing that there is a valid bug that I have tested that you can remove a bp from a secure hanger and no one would ever know. We are changing our security measures to compensate for this exploitable bug, until I get a response on my bug report that I placed today. I will not list the details because of the possible expliot. But if your bp's are in your personal hanger this cannot happen. -- Datsevlu Blow'em up we'll build more. Posted - 08/10/2003 22:48:00 - Quote -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Or better yet if they have known each other 10 years they should be able to trust each other with the Login and password of each other's accounts. My core members are my Best Friends in RL I have thier L/p's and they have mine. That is how I was able to find the issue that we had and track the person that had our bp from the mistake that was made. -- Datsevlu Blow'em up we'll build more. ---------- A self confessed infringment of the EULA me thinks. I would be interested to hear an offical response to this. A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 02:46:00 - [2] Its interesting that 2 GM's and one Polaris guy have posted on the thread from which the above quotes originated and nothing was said. One rule for techell and one rule for the rest of us? They have been screwing over the EVE comunity on miner2's for months, lets see some poetic justice A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Thaos	Posted - 2003.10.09 03:03:00 - [3] Hmmm, intresting note indeed. Of this same rule does this also mean that I should be banned if I have two or more eve accounts? INtresting indeed I will further research the EULA agreement. Huh what?! I don't even play this game anymore I just sit around and chat and train skillz. yeah whatever :P
Vacuole	Posted - 2003.10.09 03:05:00 - [4] EULAs can never supercede established laws, including personal rights. Most of it is probably just fine, but it's not gospel just because you click accept.
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 03:06:00 - [5] I think it refers to logging into account which you do not own. "My core members are my Best Friends in RL I have thier L/p's and they have mine." Which clearly proves he is not the owner of the accounts.... A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 03:12:00 - [6] 2. YOUR ACCOUNTØ Ø You may establish only one (1) account for each copy of the Software licensed. If you wish to establish another Account, you must obtain another license for the Software (you may be able to do this by purchasing another boxed version of the Software).Ø Ø A. Establishing a New AccountØ Ø When it is first run, the Software will prompt you to register a new Account online. Upon establishing a new Account, you will be entitled to play EVEÖ for thirty (30) days without paying the subscription fee (the "Trial Period"). If your Account is not terminated in accordance with the procedures set forth below within that thirty (30) day period, you will be charged the subscription fees as described during the registration process when you established your Account.Ø Ø Only an individual, natural person who is an adult or, in the discretion of such an adult, his or her minor child, may establish an Account. You are responsible and liable for all activities conducted through your Account, regardless of who conducts those activities.Ø Ø You may not share your Account with anyone, or allow anyone other than you personally (or your minor child, if you have registered an Account on behalf of your minor child) to access or use your Account. Joint or shared ownership or use of an Account by more than one user is prohibited. A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Datsevlu	Posted - 2003.10.09 03:33:00 - [7] You may not share your Account with anyone, or allow anyone other than you personally (or your minor child, if you have registered an Account on behalf of your minor child) to access or use your Account. Joint or shared ownership or use of an Account by more than one user is prohibited. As you posted this I must respond you your igonorace. The reasons these are placed in EULA's is so you don't have a group of 10 guys sharing one account. One of the reasons you can't train more then one Character at a time. And notice that the Share is Underlined. This because we are definatly not sharing anything. I haev two accounts of my own. We do this for security if one of the other corp members were to Die in RL we would not want the other corp members to suffer if that charater held most of the corp assets. This is how Real Friends trust each other. The two guys that I trust with this information are the same two guys that I would trust to keep my wife and 3 kids safe if anything were to happen to me. So please stop your personal attacks. And it seems that you had an alternate reason for doing this in the first place which should be posted in a minute. -- Datsevlu Blow'em up we'll build more. Techell's ingame site
Thaos	Posted - 2003.10.09 03:37:00 - [8] You said: ------------------------------------------------------------ Channelname: Sinsemillia conversation Listener: Thaos Session started: 2003.10.09 02:52:12 ------------------------------------------------------------ [ 2003.10.09 02:52:18 ] Thaos > hello [ 2003.10.09 02:52:54 ] Sinsemillia > you may want to check the eve general forums, for a price i will edit my posts and give dats a chance to edit his before anyone else notices [ 2003.10.09 02:53:17 ] Sinsemillia > self confessed breaking of the eula [ 2003.10.09 02:53:21 ] Thaos > give me link when ready [ 2003.10.09 02:53:32 ] Sinsemillia > its just been posted [ 2003.10.09 02:53:59 ] Sinsemillia > http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=37549 [ 2003.10.09 02:54:23 ] Sinsemillia > I have screenshots and view sources to back up those quotes [ 2003.10.09 02:56:19 ] Sinsemillia > kinda implicates your "core members" [ 2003.10.09 02:56:31 ] Thaos > i see, that being said i have 3 eve accounts so should i be banned becasue i have access to all three accounts? intresting indeed, i would enjoy hearing dats response [ 2003.10.09 02:57:02 ] Thaos > dats will find this most amusing. [ 2003.10.09 02:57:06 ] Sinsemillia > nope because you are not logging into someone else account. [ 2003.10.09 02:57:31 ] Sinsemillia > Im not fussed, just trying to make some isk before the **** hits the fan..... [ 2003.10.09 03:02:50 ] Sinsemillia > for a mere 500mil i will edit my posts and forget about the whole thing, hopefully dats can edit his posts before anyone else notices. Interesting behavior on your part indeed. Huh what?! I don't even play this game anymore I just sit around and chat and train skillz. yeah whatever :P
Jash Illian	Posted - 2003.10.09 03:43:00 - [9] 1) It's not your job to interpret the EULA or violations of it. It's CCP's 2) Attempting to use a EULA infringement like this particular one says whatever axe you have to grind with Techell isn't sharp enough 3) In the end, most parts of EULAs are not written for any real enforcement but to protect the company from liability. With what Datsevlu wrote he has forever written off any claims of an account hack as his account is considered compromised and CCP gave him plenty of warning (through their EULA) not to do something like that. I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather *** my enemy.- Rohann Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!*- Lallante
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 03:43:00 - [10] Quote: You may not share your Account with anyone, or allow anyone other than you personally (or your minor child, if you have registered an Account on behalf of your minor child) to access or use your Account. Joint or shared ownership or use of an Account by more than one user is prohibited. As you posted this I must respond you your igonorace. The reasons these are placed in EULA's is so you don't have a group of 10 guys sharing one account. One of the reasons you can't train more then one Character at a time. And notice that the Share is Underlined. This because we are definatly not sharing anything. I haev two accounts of my own. We do this for security if one of the other corp members were to Die in RL we would not want the other corp members to suffer if that charater held most of the corp assets. This is how Real Friends trust each other. The two guys that I trust with this information are the same two guys that I would trust to keep my wife and 3 kids safe if anything were to happen to me. So please stop your personal attacks. And it seems that you had an alternate reason for doing this in the first place which should be posted in a minute. Respond to my ignorance eh? Im not the one who has openly admited to violating the EULA on a public forum. If you re-read the EULA it is quite specific, hell ill quote it again.. You may not share your Account with anyone, or allow anyone other than you personally (or your minor child, if you have registered an Account on behalf of your minor child) to access or use your Account. You have admitted to sharing your logins and accessing accounts which do not belong to you. Which no matter how you try to explain it, is in direct violation of the above paragraph. On a side note, the blackmail idea came to me after posting on the "playboy BP" thread/creating this thread, as the times should show. Yes, for a small fee i would have edited this post and forgot above the whole thing. Now the question is not have you broken the terms of the EULA, but more what will the gm's/devs/whoever do about it. Exploiters who are found to have violated the EULA get banned (apparently) just wondering if we will see some consistancy here or if Techell are above the rules.... A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Thaos	Posted - 2003.10.09 04:04:00 - [11] After some more research on the EULA I conclude the following: I understand how you could misinterpret CCP's meaning within the EULA. What CCP refers to in sharing passwords on an account is squatting. CCP does not want multiple players on one account and thus infringing upon CCP's right to make real life monies. Each individual who plays in the wonderful world of Eve must have his or her own user account. The term ôshareö refers to 2 or more peoples using the same account to play Eve. For your argument to be substantiated the ôcoreö members of Techell would all have to be using one account, thus sharing it, for the EULA rules an password/account access to apply . This is not the case with Techell we all have our own individual Eve accounts and most of us more than one. So I do not really see any validity to your claim that Techell is violating the EULA. Huh what?! I don't even play this game anymore I just sit around and chat and train skillz. yeah whatever :P
CHUMSICLE	Posted - 2003.10.09 04:20:00 - [12] The EULA means nothing until a court says it does. Remember the last time you went to the book store and bought a book that said what you could wo with the book? No? Oh yea, that was smacked down about a century ago in the courts. Anyway, I never agreed to any EULA. Up till this patch i used the prefs.ini switch that made the EULA go away. Now i deleted the EULA and have my roomate 'agree' to it. Whee. Sales Manager for Expanded Minds Inc - We suffer the tedium of R&D so you dont have to
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 04:50:00 - [13] The EULA says no sharing, you have admitted to sharing. How could my claim be anymore valid? I fail to see how i have misinterpreted anything, Its in plain english. Maybe there is a need for an American English version of the EULA While your assumptions make sense from a comercial point of view, thats all they are and we all know what happens when we assume something Chumsicle, if you read the EULA you will see that by installing/playing EVE you are agreeing to the EULA even if you bypass the "accept" button. While it is obvious certain people/corps are treated differently and are in effect above the rules in EVE. It would be nice to have some offical confirmation of this. A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Naz Farooq	Posted - 2003.10.09 04:55:00 - [14] Edited by: Naz Farooq on 09/10/2003 04:56:09 The EULA's wordage on not using another person's account is, I'm sure, there to allow CCP to pursue hackers who access an account they do not own. In this case it's so that if the Techell fellow complains that his friend stole all his stuff CCP can say 'didn't you read the EULA?'. The average computer user prolly violate a EULA every day. It's like why there's a law against jay-walking; so if someone gets killed they were breaking the law when they did it. But they don't enforce the law if no one gets hurt. (edit: conjugation error) Sure, everyone supports saving Einstein's brain, but when you put it in the body of a Great White Shark, suddenly you've "gone too far".
Sc0rpion	Posted - 2003.10.09 05:04:00 - [15] Quote: You may not share your Account with anyone, or allow anyone other than you personally (or your minor child, if you have registered an Account on behalf of your minor child) to access or use your Account. Whether the EULA is legal or not is irrelevant. If CCP decide they don't want you doing something, they CAN AND WILL ban the accounts in question. Sinsemillia, you are quite possibly the biggest p.rick I have ever met. WTF is your problem? "The true secret to enjoying life is to live it dangerously." -Freidrich Nietzche
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 05:58:00 - [16] I have no problem, just after some clarification. Account sharing will give those sharing the accounts an unfair advantage over those who dont. Player A has access to 5 accounts call it a syndicate, Player B only has access to his own... 1, Player A goes on vacation for 2 weeks, his training can be continued by the syndicate. Player B has to wait till he gets back. 2, The Syndicate each specialises in different skills. Need some refining, production, research, whatever.... Just log that particular character in and do it at will. Player B has to wait for a friend to come online, use his un specialised skills or pay someone to do it. 3, Found a decent camp/spawn/whatever you dont want to loose. The syndicate can perma camp it, where as player B has to log off to sleep sometime. 4, The syndicate places alts in the stations where the valuable trade goods restock on downtime. One person from the syndicate can log on after downtime and buy from numerous locations in a matter of minutes. Player B has to physically travel to each region. 5, The syndicate can easily find out what their enimies are upto at will, by logging into their mates alts. Player B has to wait for his mates to come online. Just a few examples how account sharing can give an unfair advantage over those who play by the rules. Also as the game developes it seems specialisation will play a more important role in the game. Which would give the account sharers an even greater advantage. A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Turtle	Posted - 2003.10.09 06:09:00 - [17] Quote: On a side note, the blackmail idea came to me after posting on the "playboy BP" thread/creating this thread, as the times should show. Yes, for a small fee i would have edited this post and forgot above the whole thing. Well this is called extortion. Whether Datsevlu is in violation or not is in question. You on the other hand can be prosecuted in a court of law. Of course this is just a game and no one is going to do anything about any of it.
Sc0rpion	Posted - 2003.10.09 06:18:00 - [18] Quote: I have no problem, just after some clarification. Account sharing will give those sharing the accounts an unfair advantage over those who dont. Player A has access to 5 accounts call it a syndicate, Player B only has access to his own... 1, Player A goes on vacation for 2 weeks, his training can be continued by the syndicate. Player B has to wait till he gets back. 2, The Syndicate each specialises in different skills. Need some refining, production, research, whatever.... Just log that particular character in and do it at will. Player B has to wait for a friend to come online, use his un specialised skills or pay someone to do it. 3, Found a decent camp/spawn/whatever you dont want to loose. The syndicate can perma camp it, where as player B has to log off to sleep sometime. 4, The syndicate places alts in the stations where the valuable trade goods restock on downtime. One person from the syndicate can log on after downtime and buy from numerous locations in a matter of minutes. Player B has to physically travel to each region. 5, The syndicate can easily find out what their enimies are upto at will, by logging into their mates alts. Player B has to wait for his mates to come online. Just a few examples how account sharing can give an unfair advantage over those who play by the rules. Also as the game developes it seems specialisation will play a more important role in the game. Which would give the account sharers an even greater advantage. Do you have ANY idea how infantile that is? Waah! Mommy! Billy's cheating! He took 300 dollars when he passed go! Ground him! "The true secret to enjoying life is to live it dangerously." -Freidrich Nietzche
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 06:46:00 - [19] Sc0rpion, considering my line of work, do you think i really care what yours or anyone elses opinion of me is? A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Khonsu	Posted - 2003.10.09 06:49:00 - [20] Just spam.
Molly	Posted - 2003.10.09 06:49:00 - [21] Sinsemillia, end yourself (tm). -- Kasha > Mastema, face the reality: All the juicy dots are gone. --
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 06:49:00 - [22] Quote: Well this is called extortion. Whether Datsevlu is in violation or not is in question. You on the other hand can be prosecuted in a court of law. Of course this is just a game and no one is going to do anything about any of it. Extortion. Is that the same as selling an item which costs around 50k to make and half an hour in time for 3.5mil? A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 06:50:00 - [23] My thoughts exactly Khonsu. At last someone has answered my inital question A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Drethen Nerevitas	Posted - 2003.10.09 06:55:00 - [24] TROLL ALERT! TROLL ALERT! TROLL ALERT! TROLL ALERT! Sinsemillia, do you know you could fit the definition of "insane"? Just checking . _______________________________________________________________________ *IMPORTANT: Devs (and players) please take notice.* 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7.
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 07:03:00 - [25] If insane means seedless then i guess so. So I ask a simple question requesting clarification of the EULA, this makes me a troll? A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Drethen Nerevitas	Posted - 2003.10.09 07:05:00 - [26] No, the way you said it, the reasons you did it for and the responses you were hoping to get makes it trolling. <will not be baited any further> _______________________________________________________________________ *IMPORTANT: Devs (and players) please take notice.* 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7.
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 07:12:00 - [27] Edited by: Sinsemillia on 09/10/2003 07:12:35 a, said in english, maybe not grammically correct but in english never the less. b, reason is simple, EULA spam or means something? c, hoping for an offical response to answer point b. (not my fault if people wish to spam this thread) A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Sc0rpion	Posted - 2003.10.09 07:21:00 - [28] Quote: Sc0rpion, considering my line of work, do you think i really care what yours or anyone elses opinion of me is? If you mean your real life line of work, I don't know since the only indication you have ever given me was an outright lie. If you are refering to your "salvage operations" and extortion, probably not. Either way, you are still a tool. "The true secret to enjoying life is to live it dangerously." -Freidrich Nietzche
Sinsemillia	Posted - 2003.10.09 07:35:00 - [29] Edited by: Sinsemillia on 09/10/2003 07:35:57 Yep and your the cool dude who uses numbers in your name to hide the fact you lack the imagination to come up with a name which isn't already in the the game. Please quit the spam, i want to hear a response from someone who's words actually mean something. A proud member of the Concord Waste Recovery Team
Baldour Ngarr	Posted - 2003.10.09 07:45:00 - [30] Quote: Extortion. Is that the same as selling an item which costs around 50k to make and half an hour in time for 3.5mil? Not unless Techell are threatening to have you banned from the game if you don't buy it. Seriously, at this moment in time I think you're in far more danger of getting banned than anybody from Techell. Datsevlu's made clear that he ignores that paragraph in the EULA: great. All the hackers out there know which account to go after, because if he gets all his stuff pinched, CCP won't give him squat in compensation. "Read the EULA, you idiot. You compromised your account, live with it." You, on the other hand, have broken common law, along with almost certainly legal law, both in Iceland, and whichever country you happen to live in. I don't like your chances. No skin off my nose either way. I never heard of you, and the only thing I know about Datsevlu is, he buys my minerals off me. _______ "Soon" is an ancient Icelandic word meaning "some time before the next Ice Age."

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