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PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 10:21:00 - [1] Title says it all. im about 2 and a bit days from being able to get one of these beauties, but i dont kno which one to get... basically ill be wanting to use it in pvp...so which one gives a better edge? thanks in advance I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details
Kaylana Syi Minmatar The Nest	Posted - 2006.08.16 10:29:00 - [2] zealot is a good brute force ship while the sac is a good tank that can get a more variety of damage types. With t2 missiles/drones/lasers/armor mods I would take the SAC for solo work and the zealot for gang work. Team Minmatar Carriers need Clone Vats
PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 10:30:00 - [3] oh yea thought i might add...i cant use T2 guns yet...and ill be most likely goin solo I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details
Kaylana Syi Minmatar The Nest	Posted - 2006.08.16 10:38:00 - [4] If you can't use t2 guns yet I think you should stick to omens. Team Minmatar Carriers need Clone Vats
PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 10:40:00 - [5] Edited by: PKlavins on 16/08/2006 10:41:14 well they are next on my 'to train' list so i think i might get a sacrilege, wont hurt the wallet as much and i can train myself to use it in safe space before goin to pvp with it, and once i can use T2 med lasers (maybe T2 launchers too...?) ill go spank someone in 0.0 :P edit: i do have 3mill SP in gunnery and 10mill sp overall, im not a total n00b :P I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details
Kaylana Syi Minmatar The Nest	Posted - 2006.08.16 10:52:00 - [6] well... practice in an omen with modulated pulses and use gamma M to get a feel for how to fly a sac. The sac and teh omen are suprisingly similar ships. The SAC obviously is superior in every way but it requires imo that you use the t2 ammo's. 3 t2 small warriors, 3 focused medium pulse II w. conflag ( or heavy pulse IIs ) and 3 heavy launcher IIs with a strong t2 tank ( don't forget an internal force field array I ) and your in a very good ship despite what people jabber on the forums. Cheers, gratz on the HAC skills finishing up. Team Minmatar Carriers need Clone Vats
Lord WarATron Amarr Out Siders Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.16 10:53:00 - [7] Edited by: Lord WarATron on 16/08/2006 10:53:40 My advise is to not buy either of these and use your cruiser lvl5 to get into a curse/pilgrim. Tust me, I have used both these ships and every other HAC Pilot that can fly recons would mostly agree with the curse/pilgrim. --- Slot 10 Akemons Modified 'Noble'Zet 5000 implant +8% Armour FREE
Kaylana Syi Minmatar The Nest	Posted - 2006.08.16 10:57:00 - [8] Originally by: Lord WarATron Edited by: Lord WarATron on 16/08/2006 10:53:40 My advise is to not buy either of these and use your cruiser lvl5 to get into a curse/pilgrim. Tust me, I have used both these ships and every other HAC Pilot that can fly recons would mostly agree with the curse/pilgrim. I don't agree... I fly the HACs and the Recons and they are are different strokes for different folks. They have different roles where neither relace one another. Team Minmatar Carriers need Clone Vats
Buraken v2 Amarr Amarr Defence Initiative	Posted - 2006.08.16 11:12:00 - [9] Originally by: Lord WarATron Edited by: Lord WarATron on 16/08/2006 10:53:40 My advise is to not buy either of these and use your cruiser lvl5 to get into a curse/pilgrim. Tust me, I have used both these ships and every other HAC Pilot that can fly recons would mostly agree with the curse/pilgrim. I dont agree, I know my gank zealot can kill any pilgrim/curse so fast it'll make their head spin. It all depends on the situation =) If i was cloes to a curse or pilgrim then yea i'd be screwed though Quote: Mail from: Houvire Takaerne 2006.06.06 19:25 Our research has been fruity. If you're interested, I believe I have found what might be a banana in the corner of my office draw.
Gasi Kobayashi	Posted - 2006.08.16 12:16:00 - [10] Edited by: Gasi Kobayashi on 16/08/2006 12:17:56 Sac vs. Zealot? ...Zealot, it can tank really good and it hits very hard, sac relys on tank ... it has the best tank i've ever seen it can have all resistance 80-90& but it does bad damage(btw, can someone please tell me why is everyone using Gamma crystals on Sac?) i personaly would go for zealot for solo. curse/pilgrim are super duper amarr drone carrier ships. pilgrim is very good for solo 1vs1 and i think it would kill zealot cos it would suck all it's cap so cant even shoot or tank, curse is very good for gang and not really good for solo, cos it cant fit the best cloaking device. so if you want to solo gank someone in 0.0 then you should go for a Pilgrim. oh and btw... don't fly any T2 ship without T2 weapons on it.
Kaylana Syi Minmatar The Nest	Posted - 2006.08.16 12:22:00 - [11] Edited by: Kaylana Syi on 16/08/2006 12:22:41 Originally by: Gasi Kobayashi Edited by: Gasi Kobayashi on 16/08/2006 12:17:56 Sac vs. Zealot? ...Zealot, it can tank really good and it hits very hard, sac relys on tank ... it has the best tank i've ever seen it can have all resistance 80-90& but it does bad damage(btw, can someone please tell me why is everyone using Gamma crystals on Sac?) i personaly would go for zealot for solo. curse/pilgrim are super duper amarr drone carrier ships. pilgrim is very good for solo 1vs1 and i think it would kill zealot cos it would suck all it's cap so cant even shoot or tank, curse is very good for gang and not really good for solo, cos it cant fit the best cloaking device. so if you want to solo gank someone in 0.0 then you should go for a Pilgrim. oh and btw... don't fly any T2 ship without T2 weapons on it. I use conflag on t2 pulses... don't know about people using gamma on sac's... I only recommend gamma on an omen because of the range penalty without totally hurting the cap like MF. Anyways... a zealot is definately a great damage dealer but... don't dismiss a SAC with the proper skills. You will find it can hander different targets a little easier. Team Minmatar Carriers need Clone Vats
PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 12:42:00 - [12] ive decided to go for a sacrilege mostly cause it can tank like hell, and its mighty cheaper than the zealot too. not to mention i can put exp and kin missiles onto it to get all damage types hitting......and also cause the dark colours make me feel....evil ofc my next priority is to get T2 lasers (ill train for med pulse first right?) but that'll take me about a month (2 skills to get to lvl5, and some to lvl4)...so i might use the sac with T1 setup in high-med sec to get used to it :) thanks for the advice, all...feel free to spam the thread now :P I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details
PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 13:01:00 - [13] hm actually ive tried calculating my actual resists for the sac...here is wat i get... lets take therm as the first one... 351.051.051.051.051.05 = 44.7% (something with lots of decimals)... is this method correct? im assuming it is cause its a 5% increase per level of amarr cruiser (which i have at lvl5)... EM = 601.051.051.051.051.05 = 76.6% Exp = 801.051.051.051.051.05 = 102.1% (does this mean i'd get 100% exp resist?) Kin = 62.51.051.051.051.051.05 = 79.8% so why is therm so low? are my calculations wrong or is it just the way it is...? I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details
Gasi Kobayashi	Posted - 2006.08.16 13:04:00 - [14] Originally by: PKlavins ive decided to go for a sacrilege mostly cause it can tank like hell, and its mighty cheaper than the zealot too. not to mention i can put exp and kin missiles onto it to get all damage types hitting......and also cause the dark colours make me feel....evil ofc my next priority is to get T2 lasers (ill train for med pulse first right?) but that'll take me about a month (2 skills to get to lvl5, and some to lvl4)...so i might use the sac with T1 setup in high-med sec to get used to it :) thanks for the advice, all...feel free to spam the thread now :P i see you are caldari so you prolly have some good missile skills thts why you probably like sac, if you dont have much money then i would still recomend you a pilgrim its almost the same price as Sac i think and you can get some really nice prices on forums, pilgrim is using drones as weapon so you can do same all kinds of damage and you steal all targets cap so it cant tank (sometimes even shoot if its amarr or gallente), but if you made your choice, then enjoy in Sac ....
kessah Caldari Blood Corsairs	Posted - 2006.08.16 13:05:00 - [15] tbh i never thought much of the zealot. The sacrilege before the pilgrim\curse were introduced was my favourite ship. Could easily take on most hac's with it used this setup. 3x med nos 3x med focused pulse t2 1x warp disruptor 1x warp scramble 1x web 1x mwd 1x med armour t2 rep 1x small armour rep t2 3x Hardeners anything that fits basically. This was pre sacrilege boost so this is dated. Altho you can get an idea from it, Stay away from Recon's and such i know its hard becus there cloaked but just keep an eye on local. this setups a good-un also tho 4x t2 focused pulse 2x Assault missles launcher t2 1x mwd 1x med cap booster 1x web 1x warp disruptor 2x med t2 armour reps 2x energised therm 1x nano resistant plating Resistances with this tank are: 80\90\80\80 + 2 med t2 reppers. You are basically a heavy, heavy tackler there. But if you catch Northern EvE npc'ers you'll break tanks no probs. A cheap hac and im sure is still fully effective. Use its tank over its guns wear down your opponent and bring someone else in to do the damage if you cant. -------------------------------------------------------- Forever Pirate
kessah Caldari Blood Corsairs	Posted - 2006.08.16 13:07:00 - [16] Actually with the top setup i posted i did manage to fit dual Dark blood med armour reps and i think i changed the setup slightly cant remember what i did but it was still damned effective. -------------------------------------------------------- Forever Pirate
Gasi Kobayashi	Posted - 2006.08.16 13:19:00 - [17] Edited by: Gasi Kobayashi on 16/08/2006 13:20:04 Edited by: Gasi Kobayashi on 16/08/2006 13:19:38 Originally by: PKlavins hm actually ive tried calculating my actual resists for the sac...here is wat i get... lets take therm as the first one... 351.051.051.051.051.05 = 44.7% (something with lots of decimals)... is this method correct? im assuming it is cause its a 5% increase per level of amarr cruiser (which i have at lvl5)... EM = 601.051.051.051.051.05 = 76.6% Exp = 801.051.051.051.051.05 = 102.1% (does this mean i'd get 100% exp resist?) Kin = 62.51.051.051.051.051.05 = 79.8% so why is therm so low? are my calculations wrong or is it just the way it is...? hehe i dont know how is actualy calculated, but i know ^ this is wrong, but i think you must calculate from what is left in % ... like exp 20/1.05/1.05/1.05/1.05/1.05 = 15,6 ... 100 - 15,6 = 84,4% ... not sure is calculated like this but im sure none ship can have 100% resis
PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 13:31:00 - [18] Edited by: PKlavins on 16/08/2006 13:32:49 Originally by: Gasi Kobayashi Originally by: PKlavins ive decided to go for a sacrilege mostly cause it can tank like hell, and its mighty cheaper than the zealot too. not to mention i can put exp and kin missiles onto it to get all damage types hitting......and also cause the dark colours make me feel....evil ofc my next priority is to get T2 lasers (ill train for med pulse first right?) but that'll take me about a month (2 skills to get to lvl5, and some to lvl4)...so i might use the sac with T1 setup in high-med sec to get used to it :) thanks for the advice, all...feel free to spam the thread now :P i see you are caldari so you prolly have some good missile skills thts why you probably like sac, if you dont have much money then i would still recomend you a pilgrim its almost the same price as Sac i think and you can get some really nice prices on forums, pilgrim is using drones as weapon so you can do same all kinds of damage and you steal all targets cap so it cant tank (sometimes even shoot if its amarr or gallente), but if you made your choice, then enjoy in Sac .... heh but to get recons i'd have to train for like another 3 weeks (i dont have elec upgrades lvl5 nor sig anal. lvl5). im gona train for T2 med lasers after getting SAC too so... also can someone mathematical plz correct my resist calulations? I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details
Lady Explosion Caldari World Order The Imperial Order	Posted - 2006.08.16 13:50:00 - [19] Edited by: Lady Explosion on 16/08/2006 13:52:25 Originally by: PKlavins hm actually ive tried calculating my actual resists for the sac...here is wat i get... lets take therm as the first one... 351.051.051.051.051.05 = 44.7% (something with lots of decimals)... is this method correct? im assuming it is cause its a 5% increase per level of amarr cruiser (which i have at lvl5)... EM = 601.051.051.051.051.05 = 76.6% Exp = 801.051.051.051.051.05 = 102.1% (does this mean i'd get 100% exp resist?) Kin = 62.51.051.051.051.051.05 = 79.8% so why is therm so low? are my calculations wrong or is it just the way it is...? EXP : 100 - 80 = 20 20 x .25 = 5 80 + 5 = 85 KIN : 100 - 62.5 = 37.5 37.5 x .25 = 9.375 62.5.5 + 9.375 = 71.875 EM : (Just going to post since you should know the calcs by now) 70 Therm : 51.25 ----------------------
Gasi Kobayashi	Posted - 2006.08.16 13:58:00 - [20] Originally by: Lady Explosion Edited by: Lady Explosion on 16/08/2006 13:52:25 Originally by: PKlavins hm actually ive tried calculating my actual resists for the sac...here is wat i get... lets take therm as the first one... 351.051.051.051.051.05 = 44.7% (something with lots of decimals)... is this method correct? im assuming it is cause its a 5% increase per level of amarr cruiser (which i have at lvl5)... EM = 601.051.051.051.051.05 = 76.6% Exp = 801.051.051.051.051.05 = 102.1% (does this mean i'd get 100% exp resist?) Kin = 62.51.051.051.051.051.05 = 79.8% so why is therm so low? are my calculations wrong or is it just the way it is...? EXP : 100 - 80 = 20 20 x .25 = 5 80 + 5 = 85 KIN : 100 - 62.5 = 37.5 37.5 x .25 = 9.375 62.5.5 + 9.375 = 71.875 EM : (Just going to post since you should know the calcs by now) 70 Therm : 51.25 i was half right
Lady Explosion Caldari World Order The Imperial Order	Posted - 2006.08.16 14:10:00 - [21] Originally by: Gasi Kobayashi Originally by: Lady Explosion Edited by: Lady Explosion on 16/08/2006 13:52:25 Originally by: PKlavins hm actually ive tried calculating my actual resists for the sac...here is wat i get... lets take therm as the first one... 351.051.051.051.051.05 = 44.7% (something with lots of decimals)... is this method correct? im assuming it is cause its a 5% increase per level of amarr cruiser (which i have at lvl5)... EM = 601.051.051.051.051.05 = 76.6% Exp = 801.051.051.051.051.05 = 102.1% (does this mean i'd get 100% exp resist?) Kin = 62.51.051.051.051.051.05 = 79.8% so why is therm so low? are my calculations wrong or is it just the way it is...? EXP : 100 - 80 = 20 20 x .25 = 5 80 + 5 = 85 KIN : 100 - 62.5 = 37.5 37.5 x .25 = 9.375 62.5.5 + 9.375 = 71.875 EM : (Just going to post since you should know the calcs by now) 70 Therm : 51.25 i was half right Anyways to the OP, I haven't flown either one of them, so i can't help yah there. ----------------------
PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 17:47:00 - [22] Edited by: PKlavins on 16/08/2006 17:48:31 Edited by: PKlavins on 16/08/2006 17:47:23 thanks for all the help with the maths...now ive just got some questions about the fitting... i tried this setup on QuickFit and found that it can run infinately with everything that's active running constantly except for one med rep. 4x Afocal Maser 2x Heavy Launcher 1x Scram 1x Web 2x Barton cap rechargers 2x Med Reps II 1x PDU 1x Therm hardener 1x EANM (the one with 15% to all resists and its passive...) + 3 light drones in bay too only prob was that my DPS was 100. and that sounds pretty weak to me. so...wats a sac setup that can squeeze out as much DPS as possible? or at least something that isnt as weak as that? (dont say T2 guns, im training them ASAP but wil still take a month :P ) I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details
Deathbarrage	Posted - 2006.08.16 17:59:00 - [23] Originally by: PKlavins Edited by: PKlavins on 16/08/2006 17:48:31 Edited by: PKlavins on 16/08/2006 17:47:23 thanks for all the help with the maths...now ive just got some questions about the fitting... i tried this setup on QuickFit and found that it can run infinately with everything that's active running constantly except for one med rep. 4x Afocal Maser 2x Heavy Launcher 1x Scram 1x Web 2x Barton cap rechargers 2x Med Reps II 1x PDU 1x Therm hardener 1x EANM (the one with 15% to all resists and its passive...) + 3 light drones in bay too only prob was that my DPS was 100. and that sounds pretty weak to me. so...wats a sac setup that can squeeze out as much DPS as possible? or at least something that isnt as weak as that? (dont say T2 guns, im training them ASAP but wil still take a month :P ) m8, fly a maller till you can fly t2 guns/armor stuff
Isonkon Serikain Gallente Band of Builders Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.16 18:06:00 - [24] That setup isn't great... 2 reps is nice, but if you solo you'll want to tackle and might need at least an AB, otherwise you'll have lots of people getting away... Here's my sacrilege setup, I've killed quite a few HACs with it. 4 200mm AC II, 2 named medium nosferatus mwd, web, scram, and wildcard slot for ew of your choice rep, thermal hardener, eanm, 1600mm plate, power diag...damage control or damage mod You'll be able to fly 1200m/sec, and outlast any cruiser sized ship Pity the fool
PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 18:07:00 - [25] Edited by: PKlavins on 16/08/2006 18:09:33 Originally by: Deathbarrage Originally by: PKlavins Edited by: PKlavins on 16/08/2006 17:48:31 Edited by: PKlavins on 16/08/2006 17:47:23 thanks for all the help with the maths...now ive just got some questions about the fitting... i tried this setup on QuickFit and found that it can run infinately with everything that's active running constantly except for one med rep. 4x Afocal Maser 2x Heavy Launcher 1x Scram 1x Web 2x Barton cap rechargers 2x Med Reps II 1x PDU 1x Therm hardener 1x EANM (the one with 15% to all resists and its passive...) + 3 light drones in bay too only prob was that my DPS was 100. and that sounds pretty weak to me. so...wats a sac setup that can squeeze out as much DPS as possible? or at least something that isnt as weak as that? (dont say T2 guns, im training them ASAP but wil still take a month :P ) m8, fly a maller till you can fly t2 guns/armor stuff to get T2 hardeners (i can already use T2 reps) will take me 11 days. to get T2 guns (med pulses + crystals) will take me 27 days. in the meantime i will train in the sac with a T1/named setup in safe space so i dont lose it...so will people plz stop telling me 'wait for T2 guns' plz. now like i said in my last post, does anyone know a more damaging setup than 100dps? edit: something with lasers too since im training for the T2 ones, no time to train for T2 proj's till after lasers cause i dont use minny ships I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details
Trevedian Amarr KR0M The Red Skull	Posted - 2006.08.16 19:05:00 - [26] Both the Sacrilege and Zealot are solid HAC's... But I prefer to kill more than I prefer to live... So Zealot FTW Sex0r > you're bounty turns me on.. you seem like the kind of amarrian to dominate me
south24 Rage of Angels Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2006.08.16 20:09:00 - [27] Edited by: south24 on 16/08/2006 20:10:01 your going to fly around a 100+mil ship which is uninsurable... after only just getting hac level 1... without t2 fitting... in pvp[!!!] I hope you have deep deep deep pockets ------------------------------------ Originally by: Trepkos The only difference between GS and NPCs is that GS respawn quicker
PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 22:39:00 - [28] Originally by: south24 Edited by: south24 on 16/08/2006 20:10:01 your going to fly around a 100+mil ship which is uninsurable... after only just getting hac level 1... without t2 fitting... in pvp[!!!] I hope you have deep deep deep pockets wat part of 'i will train in safe space with T1/named setup till i get T2 guns' dont you understand? im not a noob, i kno it'd be stupid to lose an uninsurable ship. now, ffs, can someone help me out and give me a more damage-oriented setup plz? instead of criticising my ship choice or timing... I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details
Deathbarrage	Posted - 2006.08.16 22:48:00 - [29] Originally by: PKlavins Originally by: south24 Edited by: south24 on 16/08/2006 20:10:01 your going to fly around a 100+mil ship which is uninsurable... after only just getting hac level 1... without t2 fitting... in pvp[!!!] I hope you have deep deep deep pockets wat part of 'i will train in safe space with T1/named setup till i get T2 guns' dont you understand? im not a noob, i kno it'd be stupid to lose an uninsurable ship. now, ffs, can someone help me out and give me a more damage-oriented setup plz? instead of criticising my ship choice or timing... if you want a damage-oriented setup you bought the wrong ship
PKlavins Caldari 3rdlane Industries	Posted - 2006.08.16 22:57:00 - [30] Originally by: Deathbarrage Originally by: PKlavins Originally by: south24 Edited by: south24 on 16/08/2006 20:10:01 your going to fly around a 100+mil ship which is uninsurable... after only just getting hac level 1... without t2 fitting... in pvp[!!!] I hope you have deep deep deep pockets wat part of 'i will train in safe space with T1/named setup till i get T2 guns' dont you understand? im not a noob, i kno it'd be stupid to lose an uninsurable ship. now, ffs, can someone help me out and give me a more damage-oriented setup plz? instead of criticising my ship choice or timing... if you want a damage-oriented setup you bought the wrong ship right thanks fyi, i havent bought it yet. i just wanted to kno if the sac is capable of more than 100 dps, and if so, how... I make sigs/banners 5mill each, convo/evemail for details

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