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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Talon SilverHawk
Ronin Cartel
The G0dfathers
696
   |
Posted - 2014.10.24 11:44:09 -
[1] - Quote
HI
Would a duelling mechanic be a good thing ( I think yes as ppl don't honour them these days and haven't since about 2005) , say an interface that lets you set how far the duel can go, shields, armour, hull, pod, like the trade window where you both have to click to agree. Once you have got to the agreed threshold then maybe use the safety mechanic to turn it back on for both parties so damage stops. this would help bring duelling back and stop those instances where ppl make a verbal agreement that one party reneges on. Maybe you could then even have a duelling league table within Eve.
Hope that make sense
Tal
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Mark Hadden
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
36
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 11:56:46 -
[2] - Quote
consensual pvp is too eve-unlike. throw away duels all together.
If you want just a fair set up fight, why dont you go to sisi? |
xttz
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
437
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 12:10:27 -
[3] - Quote
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=375485 |
Petre en Thielles
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
76
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 15:03:25 -
[4] - Quote
Talon SilverHawk wrote:HI
Would a duelling mechanic be a good thing ( I think yes as ppl don't honour them these days and haven't since about 2005) , say an interface that lets you set how far the duel can go, shields, armour, hull, pod, like the trade window where you both have to click to agree. Once you have got to the agreed threshold then maybe use the safety mechanic to turn it back on for both parties so damage stops. this would help bring duelling back and stop those instances where ppl make a verbal agreement that one party reneges on. Maybe you could then even have a duelling league table within Eve.
Hope that make sense
Tal
No. "Safe" combat (ie, no chance of dying and some kind of permanent loss) hopefully never enters this game.
The only way a duel should be safe is if you duel against someone you trust enough to stop when you say stop. |
Talon SilverHawk
Ronin Cartel
The G0dfathers
696
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 16:09:56 -
[5] - Quote
Petre en Thielles wrote:Talon SilverHawk wrote:HI
Would a duelling mechanic be a good thing ( I think yes as ppl don't honour them these days and haven't since about 2005) , say an interface that lets you set how far the duel can go, shields, armour, hull, pod, like the trade window where you both have to click to agree. Once you have got to the agreed threshold then maybe use the safety mechanic to turn it back on for both parties so damage stops. this would help bring duelling back and stop those instances where ppl make a verbal agreement that one party reneges on. Maybe you could then even have a duelling league table within Eve.
Hope that make sense
Tal
No. "Safe" combat (ie, no chance of dying and some kind of permanent loss) hopefully never enters this game. The only way a duel should be safe is if you duel against someone you trust enough to stop when you say stop.
Rubbish, why should ppl be limited to who they can fight, this doesn't stop or affect any other PVP in game apart from duel's and only those where ppl can't keep there word.
Tal
|
Petre en Thielles
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
76
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 16:14:49 -
[6] - Quote
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Rubbish, why should ppl be limited to who they can fight, this doesn't stop or affect any other PVP in game apart from duel's and only those where ppl can't keep there word.
Tal
Because the idea that nothing is 100% safe is a fundamental principle this game is founded on. You are proposing 100% safe combat.
so, -1 |
scorchlikeshiswhiskey
interstellar initiative Incorporated
305
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 16:34:57 -
[7] - Quote
And here I thought this would be a discussion about the busted dueling we have now, where it's safe to assume that any given duelist has, at the least, a booster alt running links, and possibly even a rep alt in case things look like it might be anything besides a clean sweep.
How about we get the current dueling fixed before we start trying to build on a crap mechanic.
And, so this isn't just a gripe post, I propose that entering a duel removes both players from any fleets they might be in and blocks them from joining or forming fleets for the duration of the duel.
If that is received well, then I might go so far as to propose that repping a player who is on grid with the player they are dueling would give the rep ship a suspect flag. This would not have any effect on someone warping off and receiving reps off-grid, but would prevent reps landing mid-fight.
Then, if that goes over well, I might continue and suggest that dueling allow extensions, where you could select the number of players you are offering to duel, or name them specifically. This would allow 1 player to duel 2 players, in the same duel, by either picking the 2 players or allowing the player receiving the duel offer to name a partner. This would allow for both sides to agree to bring reps on-grid without going suspect, thus expanding the options available to duelists.
As for the go to SiSi argument, the same could be said for all pvp and the counter-argument is the same, Eve is a sandbox and people do what makes them happy.
Thoughts? |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
700
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 16:43:55 -
[8] - Quote
Stop dueling, don't trust anybody, and go learn real PVP experience. EVE has enough artificial limits that still make the "badazz" carebears whine that CONCORD, Incursion, or Level 4s ect to much isk/no risk where they need an area they can shoot people with impunity but won't go anywhere but the safe area where CONCORD is....highsec, yet low/null is the area where you can shoot with impunity and not worry about trusting people, might learn something more than "e-bushido" or "e-honor" or "e-chivalry" or fck anything that you expect "trust" to exist....just shoot people and learn. |
Talon SilverHawk
Ronin Cartel
The G0dfathers
696
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 16:50:07 -
[9] - Quote
Petre en Thielles wrote:Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Rubbish, why should ppl be limited to who they can fight, this doesn't stop or affect any other PVP in game apart from duel's and only those where ppl can't keep there word.
Tal
Because the idea that nothing is 100% safe is a fundamental principle this game is founded on. You are proposing 100% safe combat. so, -1
Erm no I'm not, as one of the options is pod, and that is no different than you saying fight someone you trust.
so -1
Tal
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Talon SilverHawk
Ronin Cartel
The G0dfathers
696
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 16:55:02 -
[10] - Quote
Aqriue wrote:Stop dueling, don't trust anybody, and go learn real PVP experience. EVE has enough artificial limits that still make the "badazz" carebears whine that CONCORD, Incursion, or Level 4s ect to much isk/no risk where they need an area they can shoot people with impunity but won't go anywhere but the safe area where CONCORD is....highsec, yet low/null is the area where you can shoot with impunity and not worry about trusting people, might learn something more than "e-bushido" or "e-honor" or "e-chivalry" or fck anything that you expect "trust" to exist....just shoot people and learn.
If that's what YOU want, not everyones cup of tea ... This adds an option for others, without removing anything for all you "badazz" "non carebear" players who whine and don't like anything that might remove their options at extracting tears out of ppl.
and some of us like to "Trust" peeps
Tal
|
Petre en Thielles
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
77
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 17:42:35 -
[11] - Quote
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Erm no I'm not, as one of the options is pod, and that is no different than you saying fight someone you trust.
so -1
Tal
You are proposing the option to let the game force combat to stop before someone's ship blows up. That is 100% safe combat. |
Discomanco
We pooped on your lawn
Resonance.
48
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Posted - 2014.10.24 19:05:10 -
[12] - Quote
As others has mentioned, safe combat or "force stops/interruptions" should never be a part of the game.
If you're in combat, you should have always have a chance to lose your ship.
Want to test fits or have "safe" duels? Find a corp mate and stop at hull. Even there, there are risks (a corp mate and I duel a lot with each other to test out fittings - I accidentally killed him once), or go on SISI.
-Disco |
Talon SilverHawk
Ronin Cartel
The G0dfathers
696
|
Posted - 2014.10.25 09:45:11 -
[13] - Quote
Not going to post in this thread anymore as it seems to have been hi jacked by peeps stating an argument that just doesn't stand and not going around in circles.
What I propose is between duelling parties that have agreed the rules before hand not open world PVP. If you can't get your head around that then nothing more I can say to you.
Tal out
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Evora Pirkibo
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
27
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Posted - 2014.10.25 11:21:04 -
[14] - Quote
Welcome to tricks and traps online.
Besides if they agree, than they comply. If they say they agree and double cross then they never really agreed, just made you believe so.
Eve is where you can make your own choices and decide your own path, not where everyone can do what they like.
And giving up rarely deserves respect.
-1 |
The Hamilton
Outer Ring Sleeper Collective
Illusion of Solitude
67
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Posted - 2014.10.25 11:39:59 -
[15] - Quote
Talon SilverHawk wrote:Not going to post in this thread anymore as it seems to have been hi jacked by peeps stating an argument that just doesn't stand and not going around in circles.
What I propose is between duelling parties that have agreed the rules before hand not open world PVP. If you can't get your head around that then nothing more I can say to you.
Because what other players want it isn't a good enough reason to add something to EVE though. Maybe other mmos sure, but with a game like EVE you have to balance all the features with everything else. Now if you made dueling more mainstream, you'd see a lot less solo roams in low and null, less people joining FW and probably a big decline in REAL solo PVP. Instead you'd be removing them from the vast interconnected "world" (for a lack of a better term) and instance them in separate little games that have no impact, no meaning and no value to the rest of the game. Do some players want this? Sure! Is it detrimental to the rest of the game? Unfortunately yes.
So no, I just don't see how this is an argument that doesn't stand.
Some other ideas about fixing the CURRENT duel mechanic have been alright, if only to impose repercussions if you involve yourself in a duel that isn't yours, is to the death and can have an impact on the world around it. It shouldn't stop you from involving yourself in someone else's duel. but it should be in line with the concept of suicide ganking really.
Trade doesn't stop because of suicide ganking, they learn to live with it and find ways to better avoid it. You should do the same for your duels. |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
700
|
Posted - 2014.10.25 12:30:44 -
[16] - Quote
Talon SilverHawk wrote:Aqriue wrote:Stop dueling, don't trust anybody, and go learn real PVP experience. EVE has enough artificial limits that still make the "badazz" carebears whine that CONCORD, Incursion, or Level 4s ect to much isk/no risk where they need an area they can shoot people with impunity but won't go anywhere but the safe area where CONCORD is....highsec, yet low/null is the area where you can shoot with impunity and not worry about trusting people, might learn something more than "e-bushido" or "e-honor" or "e-chivalry" or fck anything that you expect "trust" to exist....just shoot people and learn. If that's what YOU want, not everyones cup of tea ... This adds an option for others, without removing anything for all you "badazz" "non carebear" players who whine and don't like anything that might remove their options at extracting tears out of ppl. and some of us like to "Trust" peeps Tal
Its not what I want, if anything I want more risk to the choices people make like watching CONCORD pop all their ships after they shot a freighter plus their wrecks when they turn blue (BTW, mobile tractors in Uedema are getting worked like mad after a freighter gank, less lost even if a fraction is covered), their pods popped, no insurance as is now and the ganker pays that same insurance cost to the NPC (double loss), no medical clone coverage, and SP loss. Everything they risk, is lost, for what ever they get out of the freighter (the skillpoint and pod thing will never happen for all I wish it to happen, CCP coddles its customers to much). Basically, it costs more to gank than now and should be for tactical/strategic reasons or the freighter had way to much in the inside....not because they can replace ships easily and accept a small loss of sec status while "kill for thrills" and LARP spouting about protecting rocks like fat nerds in robes at gaming conventions.
As for dueling, fly cheaper. If your worried about losing something more expensive, something to think about is that T2 or pirate isn't much different than T1...they are just better, while being beefier or hit harder. Learn cheap, then apply that knowledge with the more expensive stuff and always have back up you "trust" with the expensive stuff. Otherwise, only fly what you can afford to replace cause once you undock its fair game since you just consented to being shot. |
Angeal MacNova
LankTech
237
|
Posted - 2014.10.25 14:57:54 -
[17] - Quote
With a mechanic in place that prevents the loss of ships, you will get more people who want to pvp using this mechanic. These people then become better at pvp'ing through practice. Something they would not of done before due to the risk of loss. So this means more players getting into and getting good at pvp. This leads to better quality fights in other pvp areas of the game (war decs, FW, low/null/W space).
This also means less one sided fights. Those who often win the one sided fights don't want fair/even fights that result in an increase risk to themselves. So they'll turn it down. EvE follows the philosophy of risk vs reward, not just risk. Such a mechanic would fall within the risk vs reward. There is no risk but there is no reward either. |
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
3014
|
Posted - 2014.10.25 16:21:11 -
[18] - Quote
Uh...
...so, don't we... you know, kinda already have a dueling mechanic?
Why do we need a dueling mechanic when we already have one? |
Ellendras Silver
The Scope
Gallente Federation
154
|
Posted - 2014.10.25 16:55:02 -
[19] - Quote
if you want risk less PVP may i suggest WoW 
[u]Carpe noctem[/u]
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Sugar Kyle
Snuff Box
723
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Posted - 2014.10.25 18:14:48 -
[20] - Quote
I'd love for dueling to receive another pass where fleet duels and such were supported as per the original plans.
But a duel is a duel and one enters into a battle with no clear outcomes. Just like instancing, I'd not support Eve stopping back stabbing and third party interference.
Low Sec Lifestyle - A Blog
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