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why do hacs have 0% resist

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Makmakis	Posted - 2006.08.21 17:29:00 - [1] my understand is that a Hac is surposed to be a tought to kill ship right ,, Still both caldari hacs get no resist to EM on there shield where as a sacrilidge gets a 35% resists lowest to thermal on its armour and the rest are in the high 70% or 80% surely if a hac has a 0% resist it isnt a tough ship ?? Am i the only one who thinks this ? or am i totally wrong ? makmakis
Bazman Caldari The Establishment	Posted - 2006.08.21 17:33:00 - [2] HAC's have 2 Boosted resists over normal ships (Primary boost is 75% resist, Secondary is 50%) Caldari get a 75% Thermal, 50% Kinetic resist boost Gallente get 75% Kinetic, 50% Thermal resist boost Minmatar get a 75% EM, 50% Thermal resist boost Amarr get a 75% Explosive, 50% Kinetic resist boost Most HAC's will end up with a gaping hole in their resists (Caldari EM, Gallente Explosive, Minmatar on Kinetic and Amarr on Thermal) Those are easily boosted by using standard hardeners. Not much more to it really ----- Sig removed, maximum allowed image dimensions are 400x120 and maximum allowed size is 24,000 bytes. Please contact [email protected] for more info (including a copy of your picture!) -wystler Hi TUXFORD! Blasterboat for tier 3 Gallente battleship please! Make it look cool too. Thanks. I am a
Christopher Dalran	Posted - 2006.08.21 17:33:00 - [3] Have you ever flown or tried to blow up a HAC? They are indeed EXTREMELY difficult to damage.
slothe Caldari Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2006.08.21 17:35:00 - [4] Edited by: slothe on 21/08/2006 17:37:04 look at eagles bonus's it has base shield em resist of 25% imho having flown both minmatar hacs and caldari hacs, even with the caldari em low reist their easier to tank than minnie ships which have 2 major holes in their tank.
HippoKing Caldari Beagle Corp	Posted - 2006.08.21 17:35:00 - [5] Edited by: HippoKing on 21/08/2006 17:35:39 Originally by: Bazman HAC's have 2 Boosted resists over normal ships (Primary boost is 75% resist, Secondary is 50%) Caldari get a 75% Thermal, 50% Kinetic resist boost Gallente get 75% Kinetic, 50% Thermal resist boost Minmatar get a 75% EM, 50% Thermal resist boost Amarr get a 75% Explosive, 50% Kinetic resist boost Most HAC's will end up with a gaping hole in their resists (Caldari EM, Gallente Explosive, Minmatar on Kinetic and Amarr on Thermal) Those are easily boosted by using standard hardeners. Not much more to it really Pretty much it. The only difference is how gaping they are (caldari most, minmatar shield tanking least) edit: and are you trying to claim that the cerberus (the only HAC with a 0% on it it's tanking level) is worse than the sacrilege?
Hellspawn666 Minmatar Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.08.21 18:30:00 - [6] Most hacs have a pretty low resist on them even if the guy is tanking, thats why a raven can be useful to take them out quickly since they can change missile damage type accordingly. But only the raven can really properly change damage type so a hole in one resist aint so bad. The main problem taking them down is they tank fairly well put that in line with its speed and damage output and their very nasty ships to come up against.
Leon 026 Caldari Blood Inquisition	Posted - 2006.08.21 18:37:00 - [7] The most advanced race using heavy shields have yet to discover that their shield systems are horrible vulnerable to EM. On the other hand, the most ghetto of all races that fly space-faring trashcans put together with duck-tape, have mastered shield technology to ward off EM attacks. ------------------------------- [ 2006.06.22 04:28:01 ] Leon 026 > My Crow dances like she's on ecstasy
Tar om Minmatar Octavian Vanguard RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2006.08.21 18:41:00 - [8] Its duct tape. For mending ducts (and other things). Ducks don't have tape, they have no use for it. -- We are the Octavian Vanguard www.octavianvanguard.net "The belief in the possibility of a short decisive war appears to be one of the most ancient and dangerous of human illusions."
Iota Belisarius Procurare Novus Ordos Seclorum	Posted - 2006.08.21 18:45:00 - [9] Originally by: Tar om Its duct tape. For mending ducts (and other things). Ducks don't have tape, they have no use for it. PWNT. ---------------------
HippoKing Caldari Beagle Corp	Posted - 2006.08.21 18:48:00 - [10] Edited by: HippoKing on 21/08/2006 18:50:29 Originally by: Tar om Its duct tape. For mending ducts (and other things). Ducks don't have tape, they have no use for it. The OED states that it was originally called duck tape, but this became distorted over time into duct tape. edit: As for your point, further research tells me that it was originally called Duck tape because in world war II, it was developed to seal ammo containers so they were waterproof (like ducks)

Arknox	Posted - 2006.08.21 18:50:00 - [11] actualy "Duck tape" is a brand of duct tape ... i like beans
Emperor D'Hoffryn Low Grade Ore	Posted - 2006.08.21 18:57:00 - [12] Also important to note that the resists that a race's tech2 ship gets is against that race's racial enemy. Hence Minnies get EM resists bonus cause they fight amarr. Thats the backstory behind it anyway. I can speak from exprience that coming up against a tech2 minnie ship when you are flying amarr makes for a bad day. Originally by: Tuxford Yes we don't play on our main accounts simply because you would lose all respect for us
Derrys Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Kimotoro Directive	Posted - 2006.08.21 18:57:00 - [13] Originally by: Leon 026 The most advanced race using heavy shields have yet to discover that their shield systems are horrible vulnerable to EM. I like the HAC resistance boosts, actually. It makes sense in terms of storyline: each race's T2 ships are boosted against the damage types typically dealt by their main enemies. From a Caldari point of view, their HACs don't need an EM boost because Gallente ships (which they were designed to fight) do primarily thermal and kinetic damage. Conversely, Amarr ships get boosts against Explosive and Kinetic, since that's what Minmatar ships tend to do the most of. But, since Minmatar ships can deal all damage types, Amarr T2 armor resistances tend to be more well-balanced to deal with the threat. It all works out rather nicely. -- Admiral Derrys Otireya Commander, Fleet Operations, Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Fleet Admiral, Kimotoro Directive
Commander Thrawn Fluffy rabbit killer's inc	Posted - 2006.08.21 18:59:00 - [14] if i cerberus is so bad, why does it sell for 250mill
Bazman Caldari The Establishment	Posted - 2006.08.21 19:11:00 - [15] They cost 250m because they let you sleep through level 4 missions ----- Sig removed, maximum allowed image dimensions are 400x120 and maximum allowed size is 24,000 bytes. Please contact [email protected] for more info (including a copy of your picture!) -wystler Hi TUXFORD! Blasterboat for tier 3 Gallente battleship please! Make it look cool too. Thanks. I am a
Grimpak Gallente Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.08.21 19:15:00 - [16] Originally by: Arknox actualy "Duck tape" is a brand of duct tape ... "if you have any doubt, just duck it!" ...ok too much megas XLR ------- Originally by: Abdalion Originally by: Jebidus Skari What, in EVE, is a Tyrant? Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
Liu Kaskakka PAK	Posted - 2006.08.21 19:52:00 - [17] Originally by: HippoKing further research tells me that it was originally called Duck tape because in world war II, it was developed to seal ammo containers so they were waterproof (like ducks) Nah, the American soldier boys just thought it was called duck tape. King Liu is RIGHT!!
AlphaBaker	Posted - 2006.08.22 00:09:00 - [18] It was initialy invented to fix bullet holes on the plane wings, and it was called "100 m/h" tape, since it was rated to stay in place up to that speed. (WWI). The tape used in WWII to seal ammo boxes is a further development of the 100m/h tape. Useless information ftw
ELECTR0FREAK Eye of God Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.08.22 01:22:00 - [19] Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 22/08/2006 01:22:29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duct_tape From HACs to a discussion of the origin of Duct Tape. Sometimes I wonder about these forums. Discoverer of the Missile Damage Formula
Jalia Kovac Placid Reborn Placid Coalition	Posted - 2006.08.22 02:21:00 - [20] Thank god someone referenced Wikipedia! A 100% reliable and accurate resource! Oh wait... ► ► Placid Reborn Headquarters ◄ ◄

Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.08.22 02:30:00 - [21] Originally by: Jalia Kovac Thank god someone referenced Wikipedia! A 100% reliable and accurate resource! Oh wait... So clearly the OED, the New York Times, the Associated Press, and the US Navy aren't reliable sources? Because claiming that an encyclopedia article isn't accurate is the same as claiming the sources aren't accurate. --[23] Member-- Originally by: DB Preacher The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when Backdoor Bandit is in local.
Malthros Zenobia Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Kimotoro Directive	Posted - 2006.08.22 02:46:00 - [22] Originally by: Tar om Its duct tape. For mending ducts (and other things). Ducks don't have tape, they have no use for it. Duck Tape is a durable water-proof tape used to patch numerous things, and yes, if you look around you WILL find duck tape. Duck Tape Duct Tape Any questions?
Kenz Rider	Posted - 2006.08.22 05:34:00 - [23] Te funniest part is that it isn't even that effective at sealing ducts: "The name "duct tape" came from its use on heating and air conditioning ducts, a purpose for which it, ironically, has been deemed ineffective by the state of California and by building codes in most other places in the U.S."
Dexter Rast Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2006.08.22 05:50:00 - [24] electricians tape 4tw --------------------------------------------- Please resize your forum signature graphic to be smaller than 24,000 bytes in filesize - Jacques
Jaeuhl	Posted - 2006.08.22 06:43:00 - [25] I can't find the skill on the market... is [Duct Tape Management] under Mechanic, Industry, or Science? As mentioned earlier, resistances on most ships really are based on their most common enemy and not their allies' main form of damage.
Kaylana Syi Minmatar The Nest	Posted - 2006.08.22 07:32:00 - [26] Originally by: Liu Kaskakka Originally by: HippoKing further research tells me that it was originally called Duck tape because in world war II, it was developed to seal ammo containers so they were waterproof (like ducks) Nah, the American soldier boys just thought it was called duck tape. because the british boys don't know how to properly use the english language /me ducks and hides Team Minmatar Carriers need Clone Vats
The Fates	Posted - 2006.08.22 09:34:00 - [27] Edited by: The Fates on 22/08/2006 09:43:39 Never mind that neither duck nor duct tape will stick to a duct in most cases anyway. Use the waterproof aluminum tape, its magic stuff. Uh yeah.. well to the original poster... Yes indeed you have noticed a hole in this ships defenses. Here's something you might find interesting... Amarr Sacrilege 180228408 Zealot 180238418 Caldari Cerebus 210219429 Eagle 210219429 Gallente Demios 205222427 Ishtar 205222427 Minmatar Muninn 235196431 Vagabond 235196431 Numbers are in the order of SRP, ARP, and TRP. Shield Reistance Points, Armor Resistance Points, and Total Resistance Points. Numbers arrived at by adding the % of each resistance together for the correct category. That doesnt take into account fitting or ship bonuses. Yeah, I said bonuses. Well, amarr seems a little weaker here, unless you count the sac's 5% per level bonus to armor resists. The eagle gets 5% per level to shield. The other ones are left with the numbers they have. You could easily adjust these numbers to match your skills. But just to make a point, if you were to compare these numbers with other ships you'll quickly find out these ships are tough. A well trained sac or eagle pilot is going to have better resistances before fitting than any others, if toughness is your thing. Of course fitting changes everything. In particular it would seem the eagle could be hardened down pretty well, if you chose to do so and had good skills. Add to that the range and damage bonus of the eagle and I'd say thats a mean hac. I'm not speaking from experience, tho, so someone with more experience in these ships might be able to give me, and you for that matter, some more insight into them... I could stand to hear some more opinions from people who fly them. I ask every time I get the chance. EDIT: In further looking at it, the sac with already a high armor resistance could be further locked down, and with armor tanking... I'd say that could be quite tough as well.
Paper Airplane Aurum Technologies Limited Novus Ordos Seclorum	Posted - 2006.08.22 20:03:00 - [28] Originally by: Tar om Its duct tape. For mending ducts (and other things). Ducks don't have tape, they have no use for it.
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2006.08.22 22:14:00 - [29] I support this thread _________________________________________________
Jalia Kovac Placid Reborn Placid Coalition	Posted - 2006.08.23 05:13:00 - [30] Originally by: Dark Shikari Because claiming that an encyclopedia article isn't accurate is the same as claiming the sources aren't accurate. Really? Not in my world it isn't. How about transcription errors or deliberate distortion of the source material? How about changes or omissions from the original text that take quotes out of context? Anyway, I wasn't challenging the veracity of that particular article. I was merely expressing a growing disgust with the notion that Wikipedia has come to be seen as a canonical resource seemingly on most topics. Given that it can be edited to various extents by any individual at all, whether they have any credible information to add or not, relying on it solely for any kind of authoritative answers is dubious. I'm sure it's a growing trend for university students to simply cut and paste from Wikipedia - something which I'm sure gives staff a headache and leads to a lot of claims of plagiarism. ► ► Placid Reborn Headquarters ◄ ◄

Nicose Caldari Wreckless Abandon	Posted - 2006.08.23 08:11:00 - [31] if the OP took an overall look at the resistances of all the HAC's he would see that yea caldari is getting a bit of a raw deal but your only hole is EM and a slight tank could dispense of that. that and imagine the price of a cerberus if it had as standard 60% res across the board, say hello to the new "i win" button! plus it would cost you about 400mil for one!
Celeste Storm Gallente Elite United Corp Antigo Dominion	Posted - 2006.08.23 08:33:00 - [32] Originally by: Tar om Its duct tape. For mending ducts (and other things). Ducks don't have tape, they have no use for it. In germany it's actually called panzer tape, which I like. whiners make m3 s!ck \| Do you like farmers?
Skeltek Caldari Asgard Schiffswerften Dusk and Dawn	Posted - 2006.08.23 09:04:00 - [33] Originally by: The Fates Amarr Sacrilege 180228408 Zealot 180238418 Caldari Cerebus 210219429 Eagle 210219429 Gallente Demios 205222427 Ishtar 205222427 Minmatar Muninn 235196431 Vagabond 235196431 Numbers are in the order of SRP, ARP, and TRP. Shield Reistance Points, Armor Resistance Points, and Total Resistance Points. Numbers arrived at by adding the % of each resistance together for the correct category. That doesnt take into account fitting or ship bonuses. Yeah, I said bonuses. Let¦s get something hypotheticaly thoughgt: Ship A: 0 0 100 100 ShieldResists 100 100 0 0 ArmorResists Ship B: 75 75 75 75 ShieldResists 25 25 25 25 Armor Resists Ship A Resist Total: 400 points Ship B Resist Total: 400 points Thus following your logic, both ships are the same tankability. Even if Ship B had it¦s resistance balanced on both Shield and Armor like for example Shieldresists50/50/50/50 and Armorresists50/50/50/50, Ship A would heavily have to struggle with stacking penalties, while Ship B would just fit 1 hardener each. Sorry, it just does not make sense adding up armor and shield resist points, since on evens the other out and I never saw anyone fly around with a totaly ineffective dual-tank.
Kunming Amarr adeptus gattacus Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.08.23 10:18:00 - [34] Its quite balanced IMO. Caldari have more mids than minmatar and are active shield tankers. If you gonna give caldari EM resistance on shields then you also have to reduce their mid-slot power or we gonna see tanking+ganking+jamming missile spammer all over the place, just like domis.
Norris Neophitus Minmatar Hidden Agenda	Posted - 2006.08.23 10:39:00 - [35] Well to cover everything i need time and space but im lazy so i'll only waste a bit of both. HACs do have good resists not rediculous resists, Caldari have an Em hole, oh big deal 1 hardener sorts that out. Plus storyline wise the EM dealers are amarr who the caldari are allied too so another thing thats not a problem. Also there are other things that make it harder to hit for example higher speed for example the vagabond is like greased lightning, i know im not gonna hit it often with any large projectiles tho that may change with improved skills. Duct tape is great stuff accept it and i dont know why you guys care why or where it came from, accept its now greatness for what it is. Tho personally i prefer elephant tape which i found only once in my searches, as far as i know it has nothing to do with elephants other than if you wanted to stop one this would be the stuff to use. I couldn't beat the stuff, knives and scissors really struggled with the thin metal threads in it. I finally took sharpened sheers to it and got roughly the amount i wanted and seveer dulling of my blades, its good **** if u see it. oh and wikipedia is full of lies but if you go to the sources to confirm stuff it can be good. Has anyone ever heard the sayin "don't believe everything you read" no matter who publishes it.
d'hofren Queens of the Stone Age Chimaera Pact	Posted - 2006.08.23 10:57:00 - [36] In England it's called Gaffa tape. The minmatar resist is easily explained, Gaffa tape is a glue and fabric composite and is designed to be fire retardant, there is your thermal resist . Minmatar use the silver stuff and that adds to the em shielding.
Benglada Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2006.08.23 12:02:00 - [37] To answer OP: because your to stupid to fit a hardaner? --------------------------- Originally by: Arkanor 0.0 is the Final Frontier. Bring money and friends.
Apollo Balthar Minmatar The Bratwurst Burglars	Posted - 2006.08.24 12:20:00 - [38] Edited by: Apollo Balthar on 24/08/2006 12:20:45 lag doubleposts ftl This post represent my own, my Corporation's, my mother's and my father's, my mates' and the royal families'point of view. Now shut up and be happy!
Apollo Balthar Minmatar The Bratwurst Burglars	Posted - 2006.08.24 12:20:00 - [39] Originally by: Jalia Kovac Thank god someone referenced Wikipedia! A 100% reliable and accurate resource! Oh wait... Well, he actually provided a source instead of senseless trolling.... Oh, wait.. This post represent my own, my Corporation's, my mother's and my father's, my mates' and the royal families'point of view. Now shut up and be happy!
Mik Nostrebor Minmatar ORKS	Posted - 2006.08.31 01:57:00 - [40] I love the tape spamming. And the urban rumour styled facts. Here is some facts for you. 1. Gaffer (not gaffa) tape is not the same tape as what duck tape used to be prior to the 70's. Gaffer is a cloth and polyurethane sealant based tape. Gaffer tape is known for tearing off in a straight line and for being very sticky. 100 or 200 mile an hour tape is the same sort of tape. 2. Duck/duct tape is now silver grey and made of vinyl. Vinyl tape was invented by 3M in 1945 (see Linkage and search for 'vinyl') as used as ELECTRICAL TAPE. What we know as duct/duck tape now did not come into usage until the 1970's. For more info go to Linkage :)

Mr Peanut The New Empire R i s e	Posted - 2006.08.31 02:53:00 - [41] Fit an EM hardener and 1-2 invul fields. Problem solved.


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