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temporaryalt
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Posted - 2006.08.23 16:21:00 -
[1]
Warp Core Stabs, Warp Scramblers and Disruptors
This would probably be the hardest to balance. What would happen to these facets of PVP? These modules would have to change as well. Instead of being composed of points (stabs giving +1 for instance) stabs would be like todays cap batteries, adding a %. Likewise would the Scramblers and Disruptors snag a % of the targets warp cap instead of todays -1 or -2. Incredibly nasty to balance though, ugh.
Benefits
Obviously weÆd get rid of instas that have been ravaging these boards, game and database for so long. We would have a tool available to everyone to run gatecamps without the need for instas (but theyÆd probably be short on warp cap for the coming warps!). We would have a tool to further balance the different shipclasses (inties and cov ops for instance being able to accurately warp more often, battleships of course being the opposite ). This balancing could even be extended to the different races, but thatÆs a question for Tux.
Drawbacks
No more insta-travel everywhere for everyone with the bookmarks. Balance issues (omg, I donÆt want to be Tux) taking quite some time to get somewhat right. Another thing for players to learn how to use effectively (not necessarily, depending on implementation. But very likely.). No more safe travel everywhere. You need to know the way ahead so you can plan ahead with a 0km warp-in in order to be safe for that particular gate. EVE would get alot more interesting, to say the least
I think itÆs very important that we have an alternative to instas that actually depend on your ship, and to a smaller extent your skill(s), and not the size of your people and places folder. An alternative that would enable players to bypass the occasional gate camp but not to travel safely pretty much everywhere. Smaller ships would be much safer than larger, being able to warp faster and more accurately.
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temporaryalt
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Posted - 2006.08.23 16:21:00 -
[2]
The original idea was proposed by j0sephine somewhere in BoB, but itÆs been a long time since I saw that post and I canÆt really find it. The avid whorum fore can probably find it But this is my version of that idea, which may or may not be very very similar to hers. Apologies if so, but since itÆs such a good idea IMHO it can stand being posted again
Warp Capacitor (the main idea)
The main idea is to separate warping from the capacitor entirely and creating a Warp Capacitor. The Warp Cap would function in the same way as the normal Cap in every way, except that it powers the warping capabilities and nothing else. The bigger the ship, the bigger warp cap (but more expensive warps!) it has, just like the regular capacitor. A feature with this would be that you would be able to set how accurate your warp-in point will be, but those warps would be more Æcap-intensiveÆ.
Want to warp in 0 km from the gate? Set that accuracy for your warp but be prepared to pay up with a lot of your warp cap. Warp in 15 km from your destination and your warp will cost a lot less. Warping further out would *not* cost less warp cap. 15 km would be the ÆminimumÆ so to speak. Before you can warp again your Warp Cap has to regenerate ofc.
A small breakdown perhaps in warping with a frigate:
100 au warp with 15 km warp-in = 100 warp cap point cost
100 au warp with 0 km warp-in = 150 warp cap point cost
100 au warp with 100 km warp-in = 100 warp cap point cost
(JUST EXAMPLES, NOT PERFECTLY BALANCED NUMBERS!)
Purpose (ugh, this sucks! We donÆt need it! Waaahwaaahwaah)
It all comes down to instas and their use, database related problems and whatnot. We need an alternative, something that can be balanced and not create *another* skill that everyone needs to train. Our current Warp Drive Operation fills that slot nicely. If we were to have a smooth implementation of this then all bookmarks within 100 km of gates and stations can be thrown to húll. I bet the database-person-thingie would be a lot happier because of this.
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Dred 'Morte
Minmatar
Sammael's Legion
Arkhangelos Command
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Posted - 2006.08.23 17:17:00 -
[3]
Not perfect. Not going to happen.
People want fast travel because they believe that AFK traveling is the only "sane" thing to do when your ship takes more than one minute to reach gate, but AFK traveling is dangerous. So it's unaccetabe.
CCP however believes game must be slow and boring.
Non-pirates feel entitled to escape pirate camps.
Pirates feel entitled to succeed in ganking every passerby.
etc...
I don't believe in a solution that pleases both sides.
Signature made by Mr Floppykickners |
Razin
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Posted - 2006.08.23 17:28:00 -
[4]
Here's j0sephine's thread on instas: Warping and scrambling and instas, oh my
Still the best idea for replacing instas (great idea all by itself for augmenting the travel mechanics).
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Maya Rkell
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2006.08.23 17:41:00 -
[5]
I proved conclusively that that idea, while nice in concept, is fatally flawed.
It simply slows travel and replaces instas with mid-warp recharge spots, as well as making any form of chase impossible, since you WILL either catch them or they will go safe.
Further, you have no real way to SEE how much cap you need for an insta-jump, so you must wait for 95%+ on every warp.
If you ban safespots entirely, then you're back in the position where you can insta once then you're dead. That's no good in hostile space!
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Razin
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Posted - 2006.08.23 21:12:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: Maya Rkell
I proved conclusively that that idea, while nice in concept, is fatally flawed.
YouÆve simply pointed out some areas that needed balancing and/or further development; however most of those were obvious.
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It simply slows travel and replaces instas with mid-warp recharge spots,
ôMid-warp recharge spotsö are at the expense of travel time. Travel speed is determined by shipÆs inherent stats and warpcore and velocity augmentation modules. Simple balance.
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as well as making any form of chase impossible, since you WILL either catch them or they will go safe.
And itÆs different now?
Quote:
Further, you have no real way to SEE how much cap you need for an insta-jump, so you must wait for 95%+ on every warp.
This complaint is based on a user interface issue. How unimaginative.
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Zeknichov
Amarr
Black Avatar
Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2006.08.23 22:20:00 -
[7]
Implementing "Warp to 0km" is the best instas replacement. That way I can set autopilot, afk and travel with the safety of instas. Travelling is the most boring thing in this game no need to make it even more time consuming and boring.
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Tristan Acoma
Caldari
The Eleventh Commandment
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Posted - 2006.08.23 22:27:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Dred 'Morte
Not perfect. Not going to happen.
People want fast travel because they believe that AFK traveling is the only "sane" thing to do when your ship takes more than one minute to reach gate,
Boo Hoo - you're traveling across the galaxy in ~ 60 min (0.0 to 0.0) and that takes too long? 
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but AFK traveling is dangerous. So it's unaccetabe.
Only for the lazy. And it's not extremely dangerous in empire :)
Quote:
CCP however believes game must be slow and boring.
Nah, it's only boring if you're 100% safe :) The problem with auto-instas is it facilitates cheap escapes from systems as much as it facilitates travel.
Not to mention I doubt that any indy pilot who's lost a ship slowboating to a gate in .3 space (ha!) is -bored-. Angry, perhaps, bored no.
I can think of little that would be more boring than a game where players can evade anything except a camp - the game would turn into campers versus runners. *Yawn*
Quote:
Non-pirates feel entitled to escape pirate camps.
And there should be ways to do it. Just not auto-instas.
Quote:
Pirates feel entitled to succeed in ganking every passerby.
Some pirates might like that, and there are idiots out there who feel they get bragging rights from insta popping ibises at 300km in their "uber sniperthron", but most pirates would rather simply A. see more commercial activity in the area they're in B. Have at least -some- chance of catching a target
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I don't believe in a solution that pleases both sides.
Sure - thank goodness CCP has their head on straight ^_^
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Price Watcher
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Posted - 2006.08.23 22:36:00 -
[9]
Make every warp to gate or station come in at 0km if the player chooses that setting.
Make it work with autopilot.
For everyone. No penalty. No special skills.
I don't care if it makes the griefers cry, in fact, that is a bonus! 
Please, Sir. May we have another server crash to go along with all the wonderful NEW CONTENT? May we have more LAG? More BUGS? Pretty please with sugar on top? |
Maya Rkell
Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2006.08.23 22:46:00 -
[10]
Razin, so obvious you addressed them. Oh wait, you didn't.
""Mid-warp recharge spotsö are at the expense of travel time."
Correct. And slowing down industrial transport is something which CCP refused to consider for WCS alteration, and will refuse to consider for this! It's not balanced to slash travel speeds from today WELL below even 15km warping.
"And itÆs different now?"
Yes, it's drastically different. You can chase across several systems. Under this system, after the first warp, you can't insta again, and missing the insta is a death sentence. There is NO choice but to safespot (and log).
"This complaint is based on a user interfarce issue. How unimaginative"
Dosn't make it ANY less valid. In fact, CCP's terrible record on UI's makes it MORE valid than otherwise. Who cares if it's "origional" or not if it's TRUE.
Zeknichov, the VAST majority of people promoting 0km warps, like me, want 0km manual and 15km AP for that very reason.
Tristan Acoma, given instas only protect you one side of the gate, your postulants are provably flawed. CCP haven't found a soloution in over two YEARS. That's not "head on straight". It's time to campaign for 0km warps / new ways to catch.
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hendo001
Caldari
Quantum Tech Mining
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Posted - 2006.08.23 23:01:00 -
[11]
we have interdicters
with warp spheres.
allow them in empire if ur at war with the corp ur in
easy solution to stop em warping.
allow the use of warp spheres in low sec as well.
even now ppl use a ton of warp stabs and mwd to make sure they are safe, and a 0km warp manual be it instas or in game isnt going to change anything imho.
And the idea of a seperate warp cap is great, using the warp drive skill it allows u to go further, maybe make a new skill advanced warp drive op to make it go to 0km at lvl 5?
why should gate campers always own ppl at gates?
maybe make a new mod that prevents ppl jumping with a % chance? only able to use in low sec/0.0 or wars?
just my ideas into the mix. I've played both carebear and pirate, sometimes half the fun is in the chase.
QTM is currently recruiting miners and haulers
convo me or send an evemail in game
Visit our forums
Linkage
Link removed - Wrangler |
hendo001
Caldari
Quantum Tech Mining
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Posted - 2006.08.24 00:34:00 -
[12]
any other ideas?
QTM is currently recruiting miners and haulers
convo me or send an evemail in game
Visit our forums
Linkage
Link removed - Wrangler |
Elena Solis
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Posted - 2006.08.24 01:03:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Elena Solis on 24/08/2006 01:05:59
Edited by: Elena Solis on 24/08/2006 01:04:59
Implement Interbus fully. So that you can pay to have packaged items transported to another system. Items sent will arrive after a time determined by the distance as well as security status of the systems on the way.
Congratulations, there is now a way of moving your stuff that does not rely on freighters or vast, vast amounts of time flying thirty different ships the same damn journey.
Allow shorter warp-in distances the higher sec the system is. So in a 1.0 system, you warp in 5km from the gate. Add 1km for each 0.1 lower.
Congratulations, you have now majorly reduced travel times in empire. Now remove the ability to create bm's within 250km of a gate (even with an inty it's gonna take FOREVER to make a bm with THAT restriction, let alone a regions worth). Database strain eased considerably.
Live in 0.0? Get used to defending your space if you want to travel safely in it. Give alliances the ability to place new deployables in sovereign territory, namely:
> Sentry Guns: Automatically fires on any target not blue to the owner.
> Early Warning Radar: Automatically informs members of the owning corp/alliance of exact number of pilots in the same system AND their standing with that corp. No names etc, just something like: 6 pilots with -10 standing in system BLAH BLAH. Works through the map screen.
Both these items are destructable, and have a maximum number anchorable in each system (for the guns).
Congratulations, you have now given alliances the means to detect intruders in their space and provided a deterrent to disreputable types sneaking about. Yes, they will suffer horrible travel times in 0.0 without their instas but I'm sure the big rich alliances can cope with that.
Posted and in fact entirely dreamt up whilst tired and hungry. Constructive criticism welcome, flaming merrily ignored.
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