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calaretu
Honestly We didnt know Unsettled.
234
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Posted - 2014.11.12 07:44:20 -
[1] - Quote
So for those who, like me, like to listen to a podcast on their way to work before getting their morning coffee might have heard Fozzie tease with some information on the new Crossing Zebra episode (50:00 and onwards) .
Thera will be among 101! new wormholes added.
So that basicly puts it on level with adding another class to wormholespace. Which sounds very much like some ideas floating around on this subforum earlier.
I would suggest that this might have a slightly bigger impact than a single system that we could view as part of 0.0 really. So in waiting for the upcoming devblog, what is your immidiate reaction?
~Bringer of happiness
http://collapsedbehind.blogspot.no/
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Luwc
Confederation of Independent Contractors Swamphole
290
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Posted - 2014.11.12 09:01:27 -
[2] - Quote
idc aslong as I dont have scrubs flooding my c5.
http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif
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Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
843
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Posted - 2014.11.12 14:10:11 -
[3] - Quote
As a friend recently said.
Stations in wormholes? No Thanks.
I would personally prefer they fix POS's in total rather than go off on some test of Spacestations in multi 100 au gateless systems. Since they are doing it anyway...
Dunno. I see Offgrid boosters being exceedingly annoying and maybe virtually unprobable (heck of alot to probe down to catch one guy). I would see this as a viable option if the following is addressed.
1) Boosts were changed to be "Ongrid" because probing a offgrid booster in a 500+ AU piece of space will be the biggest pain in the ass on the planet. 2) Docking had "fees" (your going to play station games, its going to cost you). 3) At least a few of these holes (heck lets say at least 50% of these new wormholes) had nothing but w-space statics and there was NO k-space Static and wandering hole (I'd rather a deeper wormhole space similar to how C4's function vs easy access holes). 4) The amount of planets would have to be significant for people to plant PoCo's. 5) No jump clones from/to this space (because this will be pretty moronic for wormhole space). I would perfer a clone swap option (swap your implant clone for a clean one). Something like this should be more of a pos mod but since those don't exist yet, nor can pos's be anchored here, the station should offer it. We keep talking about occupancy sov, lets have occupancy wormhole. You live there, not jump there whenever someone "pings".
Yaay!!!!
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Steven Hackett
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
94
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Posted - 2014.11.12 15:30:32 -
[4] - Quote
I don't see these new systems as part of w-space since there havn't been any reveals saying the systems will be included in the w-space static system.
What I see this being? A new kind of system that has nothing to do with w-space and @ worst, takes people away from w-space or keeps K-space people from going into w-space because they can get a lot of the bonuses of w-space in these new systems.
Imo. CCP is taking a huge stinking dump on w-space with what is released so far. I hope Im wrong on this part though, but experience with Fozzie makes me very hessitant about these new systems. |
MooMooDachshundCow
Incertae Sedis
128
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Posted - 2014.11.12 15:38:07 -
[5] - Quote
Early reports indicate that this system will be more akin to NPC null w/o gates and local. It's not going to be a WH system in the true sense for a couple reasons: 1. Stations rather than POS 2. No W-space static 3. System is named
So, let's not pretend that these 100+ new systems are real extensions of WH space, because there's nothing to indicate that they are. In fact, I agree with Mr. Hackett, this is likely to reduce people moving in WH space due to it being a middle-ground that many may prefer.
@Phoenix: Good luck with your ideas. They seem well-intentioned, but unlikely. Especially docking fatigue - not gonna happen, but we'll see.
Yeah, well, it's just like my-áopinion, man.
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Michal Swiostek
X Legion
3
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Posted - 2014.11.12 15:48:04 -
[6] - Quote
MooMooDachshundCow wrote:Early reports indicate that this system will be more akin to NPC null w/o gates and local. It's not going to be a WH system in the true sense for a couple reasons: 1. Stations rather than POS 2. No W-space static 3. System is named
So, let's not pretend that these 100+ new systems are real extensions of WH space, because there's nothing to indicate that they are. In fact, I agree with Mr. Hackett, this is likely to reduce people moving in WH space due to it being a middle-ground that many may prefer.
@Phoenix: Good luck with your ideas. They seem well-intentioned, but unlikely. Especially docking fatigue - not gonna happen, but we'll see.
c1 and c3 got no W space static they are W space arent they? Every system is named, what is the name of your J?
The systems don't have static or player build gates = W space - simples. |
Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
843
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Posted - 2014.11.12 15:48:24 -
[7] - Quote
MooMooDachshundCow wrote:Early reports indicate that this system will be more akin to NPC null w/o gates and local. It's not going to be a WH system in the true sense for a couple reasons: 1. Stations rather than POS 2. No W-space static 3. System is named
So, let's not pretend that these 100+ new systems are real extensions of WH space, because there's nothing to indicate that they are. In fact, I agree with Mr. Hackett, this is likely to reduce people moving in WH space due to it being a middle-ground that many may prefer.
@Phoenix: Good luck with your ideas. They seem well-intentioned, but unlikely. Especially docking fatigue - not gonna happen, but we'll see.
The docking fatigue is a shot in the dark but to specifically address the issue of station games. These are npc stations. Why would they allow us to dock for free.
As much as people expect this to be like Jita, I don't want it to be exactly like Jita.
Bots spamming local for gambling websites, Isk doubling services and scam contracts.
500,000 hp boosted bait proteus orbiting the undock randomly shooting people, then deaggressing and docking. With 10 to 20 logi waiting. Mega tanked boosters sitting on the undock boosting the gang 400 Au away.
The basic Jita bullsh-t. Least bubbles won't be that big of an issue.
Yaay!!!!
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Michal Swiostek
X Legion
3
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Posted - 2014.11.12 15:51:09 -
[8] - Quote
Steven Hackett wrote:I don't see these new systems as part of w-space since there havn't been any reveals saying the systems will be included in the w-space static system.
What I see this being? A new kind of system that has nothing to do with w-space and @ worst, takes people away from w-space or keeps K-space people from going into w-space because they can get a lot of the bonuses of w-space in these new systems.
Imo. CCP is taking a huge stinking dump on w-space with what is released so far. I hope Im wrong on this part though, but experience with Fozzie makes me very hessitant about these new systems.
Thats a good point, would be nice if they add statics from existing holes to that group oh WHs (at least to some of them). |
Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
843
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Posted - 2014.11.12 15:52:22 -
[9] - Quote
If Wspace is the nullsec equivalent. Then this new space is essentially the low sec of Wspace.
Basically the issue of it is that it needs a name. It ain't wspace (no j number) but it is Wspace (named). Just like nullsec is kspace, but we call it nullsec.
This could be as simple as clarifying the name of what it is.
Yaay!!!!
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King Fu Hostile
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
227
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Posted - 2014.11.12 16:09:05 -
[10] - Quote
Can't help but think how much better this would have been if it only had w-space connections, and never any directly to k-space.
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Steven Hackett
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
95
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Posted - 2014.11.12 16:16:29 -
[11] - Quote
Michal Swiostek wrote: c1 and c3 got no W space static they are W space arent they?
The systems don't have static or player build gates = W space - simples.
C1 and C3 systems are still part of the w-space static system though, as in other wormholes have static connections to C1 and C3 and C1+3 is connected to the rest of w-space trough these.
There are no(revealed atm.) static connections between any part of w-space and the new space. As of current reveals, Highsec is more connected to W-space than the new space is.
And in your own "simple" argumentation. The systems have stations, not POSs = Not W-space (Obv. this argumentation is just as flawed as yours ;)) |
scorchlikeshiswhiskey
interstellar initiative Incorporated
335
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Posted - 2014.11.12 16:23:37 -
[12] - Quote
King Fu Hostile wrote:Can't help but think how much better this would have been if it only had w-space connections, and never any directly to k-space.
Then the null babies would cry. I mean, then the large and powerful null src entities would lodge complaints with their pocket-csm.
I'm not sure what this new space is really supposed to accomplish, but I can't help but feel like wormholes are being "replaced" in a way. Maybe ccp will allow sov in this new quasi-wh and goons will settle in and marmite will park alts on the gates, errr... wormholes. I'm mostly being a smartass here, but I really, really don't see what CCP is trying to accomplish. |
Ya Huei
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
187
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Posted - 2014.11.12 16:24:07 -
[13] - Quote
King Fu Hostile wrote:Can't help but think how much better this would have been if it only had w-space connections, and never any directly to k-space.
This is true for every system in EVE though.
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Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
844
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Posted - 2014.11.12 16:43:53 -
[14] - Quote
scorchlikeshiswhiskey wrote:King Fu Hostile wrote:Can't help but think how much better this would have been if it only had w-space connections, and never any directly to k-space.
Then the null babies would cry. I mean, then the large and powerful null src entities would lodge complaints with their pocket-csm. I'm not sure what this new space is really supposed to accomplish, but I can't help but feel like wormholes are being "replaced" in a way. Maybe ccp will allow sov in this new quasi-wh and goons will settle in and marmite will park alts on the gates, errr... wormholes. I'm mostly being a smartass here, but I really, really don't see what CCP is trying to accomplish.
Null is not particularly interested in this. No cyno, no black ops, no bridging, no control, no local, no Intel, no docking lockout, no capitals, no jump freighters, no bubbles, can't lock it down.
They would be interested in this because?
This is solely for corporations and hunters who don't want to deal with lossec gate gun, doc mechanics, fighters, pos and doc sieging, security status, gate camps, and who want to be nomadic but don't want to upend their entire crew every week to move.
This is in its purest form, a subcap system.
You can really delve into it once it's on sisi
Yaay!!!!
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Kynric
Sky Fighters
201
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Posted - 2014.11.12 17:32:38 -
[15] - Quote
Phoenix Jones wrote:As a friend recently said.
2) Docking had "fees" (your going to play station games, its going to cost you). I would make it based off time. You dock first time, costs maybe 10,000 isk, undock and redock within 1 hour, costs you 1 million isk. Have the redock compound. You undock and redock 100 times in 1 hour, could potentially cost you a billion isk as they continue to escalate cost because you redock so often in a short timespan. As time expires, so does the fee. You undock and dock once an hour, shouldn't cost you much. You dock and undock 100's of times in a 1 hour timespan, proceed to go broke.
Docking fatigue sounds awful complicated. Why not just equip the station with some amazing dread-blap style station guns which salvo misbehavior? I cant imagine docking games being an issue in that context and the station would still fulfill the role of a place to come and go from. |
Ilaister
Task Force Proteus Protean Concept
124
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Posted - 2014.11.12 17:33:25 -
[16] - Quote
Think people really need to start relaxing and learning to love the bomb here.
With the new release schedule 'It's ready? Ship it - Your thematically related and slightly more complex project has succumbed to gremlins? Hold it til next month' we have to accept that there are things being put in that don't always make complete sense yet.
e.g. - Low mass unkillable WHs -> D3's.
CCP are listening, and iterating extremely frequently. And for some reason w-space is getting all kinds of attention atm (not that we don't deserve it, we are awesome).
Let's chill, be grateful some of our friends in Iceland still know what a WH is, and provide as much reasoned feedback as we can.
That is - try the content & perhaps then even listen to others' learned opinions before sperging negativity everywhere. |
Ilaister
Task Force Proteus Protean Concept
124
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Posted - 2014.11.12 17:39:10 -
[17] - Quote
Kynric wrote:Phoenix Jones wrote:As a friend recently said.
2) Docking had "fees" (your going to play station games, its going to cost you). I would make it based off time. You dock first time, costs maybe 10,000 isk, undock and redock within 1 hour, costs you 1 million isk. Have the redock compound. You undock and redock 100 times in 1 hour, could potentially cost you a billion isk as they continue to escalate cost because you redock so often in a short timespan. As time expires, so does the fee. You undock and dock once an hour, shouldn't cost you much. You dock and undock 100's of times in a 1 hour timespan, proceed to go broke.
Docking fatigue sounds awful complicated. Why not just equip the station with some amazing dread-blap style station guns which salvo misbehavior? I cant imagine docking games being an issue in that context and the station would still fulfill the role of a place to come and go from.
Hm... Blap guns good - maybe some kind of blacklist system even better? Entities with high standing/frequent contact with Thera NPC residents or just length of stay can add weight to some kind of petition for preventing future docks. Would be cool to have a way to 'run people out of town' cos nobody likes em anymore.
Prolly too abusable I guess, easiest way would be to make them all kickouts and make sure the station model geometry prevents people barnacling up in crevices so you can't bump them off.
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350125GO
Transcendent Sedition Protean Concept
125
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Posted - 2014.11.12 19:22:05 -
[18] - Quote
What hasn't been released yet is the availability of manufacturing slots in these stations. If they have all the amenities of K-space stations then this looks like a bear playground. It makes some sense too with the introduction of D3's and the new anoms dropping sleeper loot, I could see these becoming big manufacturing hubs for w-space. Would be nice to stop having to find an entrance close to Jita or Amarr.
With the force projection changes, which greatly expanded the size of the universe again, it seems odd that they would add more systems, unless there's also a plan to make them more connected. The frequency of frig holes and wandering holes being increased seem to make sense as being connected to this expansion of space.
More systems, and more wandering connections. Does that make a bigger sandbox or a smaller one?
You're young, you'll adjust.
I'm old, I'll get used to it.
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calaretu
Honestly We didnt know Unsettled.
234
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Posted - 2014.11.12 19:42:12 -
[19] - Quote
Doubt they would make them completely cut of frlm rest of wspace. I expect a lot of random wormholes connecting to these systems. Maybe a 2nd static to c6 even :P
~Bringer of happiness
http://collapsedbehind.blogspot.no/
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Jack Miton
Isogen 5
3941
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Posted - 2014.11.12 21:18:19 -
[20] - Quote
If these also have stations then I am totally out. Stations in WHs are a terrible idea, always have been, always will be. If theyre just new systems with new effects/sites ect then sure, why not.
Stuck In Here With Me:-á http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/
Down the Pipe:-á http://downthepipe-wh.com/
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Rroff
Questionable Ethics. Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
862
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Posted - 2014.11.12 21:24:29 -
[21] - Quote
Has it been confirmed they will have stations other than thera? as that system having stations is for a reason and completely unrelated to any J system. |
Phoenix Jones
Isogen 5
846
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Posted - 2014.11.12 21:52:36 -
[22] - Quote
Rroff wrote:Has it been confirmed they will have stations other than thera? as that system having stations is for a reason and completely unrelated to any J system.
No it hasn't been confirmed if they will or will not have stations. Only Thera atm. The other 100 systems nobody knows nothing about.
Yaay!!!!
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Amak Boma
Dragon Factory
31
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Posted - 2014.11.12 23:57:28 -
[23] - Quote
so they are making class 7 wormhole? only 100 wormholes? very nice!!!
would be awesome if we get few unique wormholes with some suprises in lets say one of ithem would be sansha nation wormhole , what it would be like?
- sansha ships patrolling the wormhole , moving around system flying to planets,moons and on wormholes they could camp them a content of fleet for wormhole entrance guarding would be and what they would do fleet type 1 2x sansha battleship dps boats 4x sansha cruiser neut + trackin disruptor 4x sansha frigate web + warp disruptor
fleet type 2 4x sansha battleship dps boats 4x sansha cruiser neut + web 8x sansha frigate warp disruptor + tracking disruptor
for moon and planet patrols
fleet type 1 6 sansha cruisers neut + tracking disruptor 12 sansha frigates web
fleet type 2. 3 sansha battleships dps boats 6 sansha cruisers rr 6 sansha frigates web + warp disruptor
also sansa could have their control towers up and running in few of new class wormhole. to make it more realistic , sansha poses could be resupplied by npc haulers , they would never run out of fuel but would be nice to see a npc hauler enter the sansha pos close up to one of anchored structures and stay close to it for few minutes and then head back throught wspace/kspace exit and could be traced down and find out where it go,
the sansha pos structures inside forcefield after taking tower itself down , cant be unanchored but if you destroy the sentry turrets theres chance for faction ammo drop. destroying the npc sma gives an chance for sansha nation frigate/cruiser/battleship to be spawn in loot
when destroyed sansha ship assembly array we could have chance of drop sansha frigate/cruiser/battleship blueprint copy if we destroy npc sansha laboratory we would have chance that some implant bpc will spawn for destroying storage structures - chance to get ore /minerals and/or gas in loot.
sansha npc haulers could spawn also in ore sites - destroying these will spawn minerals or raw ore , and little chance to get expensive mining laser upgrades
what else for sansha nation wormhole? - sansha rats could be elite skilled and do lots of damage , also able to attack pods. - sansha control towers could respawn in wormhole with very low rate, lets say once per week theres 25% chance that sansha nation deploy their base - sansha nation could deploy mobile warp disrptors on entrances, cosmic signatures/anomalies not more than 2 fields per signature/anomaly these fields could have 10000 shields 7000 armor 5000 hull , warp disruption range 50km
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Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery Prolapse.
1873
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Posted - 2014.11.13 00:03:03 -
[24] - Quote
Mr jones, I hate to say this, but if you don't like station games (and i don't) then don't dock there, and you'll never be annoyed with it.
I agree station games are teh_dull and should be discouraged, but there will only be camping of said stations when the dullard boring Proteus idiots know someone is in station. Good luck keeping your spectacularly dull amount of logi alive and unmolested when there's no Local, either. It's not impossible to hammer down a few logi on undock - even moreso because the logi won't see you attacking till you decloak the neut legion on them at 2km and suck them dry instantly.
I however do think that docking fees are de rigeur for the new space. Lets just say Jove space, that's my stab in the dork. I can't see anything wrong with stiff docking fees if you don't have good standings.
I also can't really support an idea that all these systems are unfeasibly large. Even now there are a few 200 AU systems and you can end up with near 300 AU warps if you have saved Incursion beacons off overview in them, at opposite ends of the system. A good way to get enough time for a tea or pee break is to initiate a 300 AU warp in a battleship.
If all these systems are that big, screw that. I've got better things to do than waste 5 minutes at a time staring at a warp tunnel.
Finally...101 new systems. Cool. Even less population density than before, in the all of EVE. I did 28 jumps from highsec to a staging system in null yesterday. Two years ago it would have been suicide, but now it was a cake walk. There's already enough unoccpied, empty nullsec. Why not just convert 101 of these boring, useless systems t these new systems, by taking out the acceleration gates? Won't hurt anyone long-term.
J's before K's.
Prolapse. Turning holes inside out with pew pew.
http://www.localectomy.blogspot.com.au
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