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Morijah d'Hanguest
Ishtirak d'Hanguest
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Posted - 2011.11.27 17:20:00 -
[1] - Quote
In the Name of the Lord
To whom it may concern,
it shall be public knowledge that the house of dGÇÖHanguest condemns the +ôuvre titled GÇ£Odelya dGÇÖHanguest in Sensitive GirlGÇ¥ and that we opine that this so called GÇ£work of artGÇ¥ consists of nothing else than insidious, distasteful, and blasphemous pornography.
By unanimous decision of the family council Odelya dGÇÖHanguest shall not be considered a member of the family dGÇÖHanguest anymore. Her rights to inheritance are deemed null and void. Independent lawyersGÇöfrom both royal and imperial law firmsGÇôhave rendered expert opinions that her status as Duchess of Pallas, and 1st Baroness of Artusci and Chitarus forfeited lat+ª sententi+ª (by opinion of imperial law), or rather is in abeyance (by opinion of royal law). The public may account for that in its correspondence with the aforementioned party.
Yours sincerely,
Morijah dGÇÖHanguest
CEO of Ishtirak dGÇÖHanguest |
Cosmo Cyrano
October Country
1
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Posted - 2011.11.27 17:40:00 -
[2] - Quote
This condemnation is worthless without pictures. Please attach the material in question so that we can all learn to recognise distateful blasphemy when we see it, and avoid it in future.
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Graelyn
Wolfsbrigade
84
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Posted - 2011.11.27 18:50:00 -
[3] - Quote
Well, that'll happen.
Bringing shame to the family has consequences.
+ Cardinal Graelyn +
Owner/Operator, "The Summit"
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Katrina Oniseki
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
182
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Posted - 2011.11.27 19:18:00 -
[4] - Quote
On the IGS of all places. Public shame to the family brings public shame from the family. |
Silas Vitalia
Khanid Provincial Vanguard
17
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Posted - 2011.11.27 20:03:00 -
[5] - Quote
Interesting. Would Odelya deem to comment on this? |
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
415
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Posted - 2011.11.27 21:22:00 -
[6] - Quote
I refuse to believe this until I've examined the evidence.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Gottii
Lutinari Syndicate
Electus Matari
17
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Posted - 2011.11.27 21:36:00 -
[7] - Quote
Rodj Blake wrote:I refuse to believe this until I've examined the evidence.
No doubt alone....in your quarters....throughout the night. |
Thgil Goldcore
PIE Inc.
140
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Posted - 2011.11.27 23:25:00 -
[8] - Quote
Gottii wrote:Rodj Blake wrote:I refuse to believe this until I've examined the evidence. No doubt alone....in your quarters....throughout the night.
Glad we got the mature Matari' opinion on the matter.
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Kel hound
Traveler 52
D-Collective
3
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Posted - 2011.11.28 00:30:00 -
[9] - Quote
So... wait. A young Amarrian lady stars in an independent film that happens to deal with adult themes in a mature and (in my opinion) tasteful manner and her family's response is to disown her?
...I do not think I will ever understand the Amarrian people. |
ValentinaDLM
Ubi Concordia Ibi Victoria
408
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Posted - 2011.11.28 00:34:00 -
[10] - Quote
Rodj Blake wrote:I refuse to believe this until I've examined the evidence.
For once, I approve your statement Rodj, I too want a copy to examine to be sure, this is indeed not of an artful nature. I would be remiss to blindly agree to denouncing something as pornographic without a thorough investigation. |
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Mikkel Lybecker
Gradient
Electus Matari
8
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Posted - 2011.11.28 01:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
I always thought that the smooth, rounded surfaces of Amarr ships, stations and architecture were a subconscious attempt by Amarrian designers to externalise and fetishise internally-repressed sexuality. Just saying. |
Aestivalis Saidrian
SplitPush Mercantiles
6
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Posted - 2011.11.28 02:10:00 -
[12] - Quote
Close enough.
Then you have some of the Minmatar designs where I looked at it and said to myself "Stabber? I know what this stabs."
That being said, the crew aboard Stabbers are good folk and having flown a Stabber for a bit, I have nothing but respect for them.
Also, I have to say that the girl knew what she was getting into. Do I think its a bit overboard? Sure. But all the same, things such as that Independent Movie, are against cultural norms.
Also, yes, most of the Amarr ships look pretty phallic to me. |
Morwen Lagann
Tyrathlion Interstellar
18
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Posted - 2011.11.28 02:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
Katrina Oniseki wrote:On the IGS of all places. Public shame to the family brings public shame from the family.
Katrina, given the context, are you sure you didn't mean pubic shame instead?
Given the rather broad and vague definition of pornography used by many Amarrians (at least among the capsuleer class, and presumably among a fair amount of the Empire's baseliner population), I'm left wondering if it was actually something that most other people would consider pornographic in nature, and not just something that would serve as an example for some of the stereotypes that are perpetuated by this sort of incident.
A clarfication would be rather beneficial here, I think - specifically, an explanation of what exactly made the +ôuvre qualify as pornography in the family's eyes. |
Gottii
Lutinari Syndicate
Electus Matari
17
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Posted - 2011.11.28 03:00:00 -
[14] - Quote
Thgil Goldcore wrote:Gottii wrote:Rodj Blake wrote:I refuse to believe this until I've examined the evidence. No doubt alone....in your quarters....throughout the night. Glad we got the mature Matari' opinion on the matter.
I thought you would be pleased with the comment, Lady Goldcore.
If it makes you feel better, think of it as one more reason you need to enslave my kind and further our development as mature human beings.... |
Leopold Caine
Stillwater Corporation
18
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Posted - 2011.11.28 04:49:00 -
[15] - Quote
Gottii wrote:
If it makes you feel better, think of it as one more reason you need to enslave my kind and further our development as mature human beings....
Heeeeeere we go again.
.domination sentinel
.stillwater |
Mikkel Lybecker
Gradient
Electus Matari
8
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Posted - 2011.11.28 05:15:00 -
[16] - Quote
It's all a bit academic really. I guess my point was that if everything else in your society is designed like a sexual fetish object, you don't really need pornography.
Also, publicly announcing reputation-cleansing activities is actually a really bad way to cleanse your reputation. |
Katrina Oniseki
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
184
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Posted - 2011.11.28 06:44:00 -
[17] - Quote
Morwen Lagann wrote:
Katrina, given the context, are you sure you didn't mean pubic shame instead?
No. I did not.
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Astrid Stjerna
Teraa Matar
105
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Posted - 2011.11.28 07:36:00 -
[18] - Quote
Thgil Goldcore wrote:Gottii wrote:Rodj Blake wrote:I refuse to believe this until I've examined the evidence. No doubt alone....in your quarters....throughout the night. Glad we got the mature Matari' opinion on the matter.
I can provide the immature Matari opinion, but you should be warned ahead of time that it involves fart jokes and horrible innuendo. |
Thgil Goldcore
PIE Inc.
140
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Posted - 2011.11.28 07:37:00 -
[19] - Quote
while this news is important, I think what may be more important is to discuss what exactly is the line between art and ****. To be honest its a fairly vague line with no easily defined rules.
Some material is obviously art, while others are obviously nothing more than, well, pornography.
I haven't exactly come across any material from the Theology council on the matter, nor is it ever discussed in any detail. |
Mikkel Lybecker
Gradient
Electus Matari
8
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Posted - 2011.11.28 09:25:00 -
[20] - Quote
Thgil Goldcore wrote:while this news is important, I think what may be more important is to discuss what exactly is the line between art and ****. To be honest its a fairly vague line with no easily defined rules.
Some material is obviously art, while others are obviously nothing more than, well, pornography.
I haven't exactly come across any material from the Theology council on the matter, nor is it ever discussed in any detail.
That's because it's a massively non-useful dead horse go-nowhere discussion.
I get a furniture catalogue sent to me by email, I see furniture. Someone else with a furniture fetish (probably an Amarrian) gets the same catalogue sent to them and sees arousal material. To them, it's ****. To me, it's shopping. Likewise, some people like to watch holoreels of adults in consenting reproductive situations. I really don't. To them, that's ****. To me, it's either comedy or tragedy, or in some cases horror - but it's definitely not ****.
There's just nothing more to say about this beyond "I like X, you like Y, so what of it'. Pornography, like art, is 100% in the eye of the beholder, so you can't ever really make any sensible or useful conclusions from this question.
And kicking the girl out of the family for stashing a bit of film seems a bit harsh, but then, we are talking Amarr here, so I guess whatever. I'm sure the family will sort it out somehow. Or maybe they wont. In any event, there are more important things to think about. Like what I'm having for dinner tonight. Who votes that I start a cooking thread? |
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Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor
302
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Posted - 2011.11.28 12:15:00 -
[21] - Quote
Leopold Caine wrote:Heeeeeere we go again.
Did someone say my name? My ears are all a-twitch!
Andreus Anthony LeHane Ixiris
CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Animated Corporate Logos |
Telegram Sam
The Drones Club
61
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Posted - 2011.11.28 17:52:00 -
[22] - Quote
Many of us in the Minmatar Republic look forward to seeing this Amarrian work of art. |
Kalaratiri
Teraa Matar
37
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Posted - 2011.11.28 18:43:00 -
[23] - Quote
Telegram Sam wrote:Many of us in the Minmatar Republic look forward to seeing this Amarrian work of art.
And many more of us don't give a **** |
Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
13
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Posted - 2011.11.28 18:45:00 -
[24] - Quote
down with this sort of thing |
Thgil Goldcore
PIE Inc.
140
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Posted - 2011.11.28 18:54:00 -
[25] - Quote
Mikkel Lybecker wrote:
That's because it's a massively non-useful dead horse go-nowhere discussion.
I get a furniture catalogue sent to me by email, I see furniture. Someone else with a furniture fetish (probably an Amarrian) gets the same catalogue sent to them and sees arousal material. To them, it's ****. To me, it's shopping. Likewise, some people like to watch holoreels of adults in consenting reproductive situations. I really don't. To them, that's ****. To me, it's either comedy or tragedy, or in some cases horror - but it's definitely not ****.
There's just nothing more to say about this beyond "I like X, you like Y, so what of it'. Pornography, like art, is 100% in the eye of the beholder, so you can't ever really make any sensible or useful conclusions from this question.
And kicking the girl out of the family for stashing a bit of film seems a bit harsh, but then, we are talking Amarr here, so I guess whatever. I'm sure the family will sort it out somehow. Or maybe they wont. In any event, there are more important things to think about. Like what I'm having for dinner tonight. Who votes that I start a cooking thread?
Intent is huge here though. If she intended to make smut, then her family has every right to striking her from the family. If she was tricked into making smut (but otherwise intended well), it may be harsh, but she should know better... someone in her position should have plenty of people around her to warn her. Though if she did mean it as art, and it was done well as such, then perhaps its a little hyperbolic...
As far as the furniture example, I don't buy it. If your familiar with the test of an idiot in a hurry test, it wouldn't stand up. For those unfamiliar, the idiot in a hurry test is basically a simple question, 'would an complete idiot (with no knowledge of the subject matter) passing by it quickly confuse it for anything other than what it is.' No one, no matter how stupid or rushed would ever confuse a furniture catalog with ****. If they had some strange fetish, they still would know it was not smut, just that they liked what they saw. Likewise there are some works which are clearly pornographic, and while they may include some elements of an artistic work, they aren't art.
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Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
420
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Posted - 2011.11.28 19:15:00 -
[26] - Quote
Valerie Valate wrote:down with this sort of thing
Careful now.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Astrid Stjerna
Teraa Matar
105
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Posted - 2011.11.28 19:17:00 -
[27] - Quote
Thgil Goldcore wrote:Likewise there are some works which are clearly pornographic, and while they may include some elements of an artistic work, they aren't art.
So, the issue becomes: who decides what's 'art'?
There was an artist, some time ago, that purchased a waste recycler, gave it a fancy-sounding title and entered it in an artshow unaltered. When they asked him why it should be called 'art', he said 'Because I say so'.
The Idiot in a Hurry test is a good standard by which to judge the value of an artistic work, but the test is dependent on what the viewer defines as 'art'. Some may actually find the idea of 'furniture-as-art' appealing, and view a furniture catalogue as an example of artistic expression. |
Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor
302
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Posted - 2011.11.28 19:36:00 -
[28] - Quote
Likewise, you get some people who equivocate even within art forms. For instance, imagine the hidebound critic who insists that piano concertos stop at Vierre, and refuses to accept that the latest release from Arella Kassigainen is even music. (Incidentally, seriously, listen to Arella Kassigainen's latest release. Proof, if proof were needed, that just because Nugoeihuvi are businessmen first and foremost, it doesn't mean they can't publish true gems in the music industry from time to time).
Andreus Anthony LeHane Ixiris
CEO, Mixed Metaphor
Animated Corporate Logos |
Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
42
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Posted - 2011.11.28 19:36:00 -
[29] - Quote
For such a supposedly pious and reserved lot you Amarr certainly enjoy a good public flogging. Totally aside from the argument of whether the work in question is artistic or prurient, why the need to air your dirty laundry in public? It seems to me that this is a private matter that should have remained within the family.
Thanks for the many jokes that are coming out of this, though.
What you want is irrelevant, what you've chosen is at hand. |
Tobias Primus
Laudate Domini
0
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Posted - 2011.11.28 19:45:00 -
[30] - Quote
Odelya d'Hanguest is a trusted and loyal Servant of God and Empire. Might I remind you all of her glorious work and theology leading to the devout Book of Prayers.
She has previously hinted to me of past behaviours not in keeping of the Faith, and devoid of her Family's pleasure, though I have never, along with her Father and the Empire, considered them sufficient cause to dispell my fervent belief in her true pure nature. It was perhaps a wandering from the enlightened path which gave her occasion for reflection, and a closer embrace of truth.
I see only malicious accusations from her Family. I see that she is condemned only by lawyers employed by them, without fair and open deliberation. Most importantly, I see no clear, irrefutable presented evidence that she has violated either Divine or Natural Law.
Let us remain silent on this matter and allow frivolous matters to fade.
Odelya d'Hanguest remains a trusted and loyal member of the Empire, with Unity and warm embrace.
Tobias Primus
Loyal Servant of the Empire |
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