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Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
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Posted - 2015.12.14 15:56:21 -
[4561] - Quote
Karous
Well, the echo chamber that gives you all your thoughts on Eve immediately leapt to "woot, Fozie is talking about wh-local. Yay!"
I am not for or against introducing some, any, or all of the "good reasons for that" afk cloaks are not an issue in wormhole space. I am interested in itemizing what those reasons might be, and examining what their null-sec equivalents could look like.
Brokk
If you still do not understand what "pretty big psychological effect" Fozie is speaking of, then I cannot help you. People worry about what is reasonably likely to happen. Its reasonable to expect a few yolo morons try to emulate a tactic they stole off redit. An actual well-thought out and pre-meditated attack is much less likely.
I don't fly anything that would be embarrassing to lose that could be lost to yolo morons is the short of it. But its still not about me, friend.
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
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Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
15471
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Posted - 2015.12.14 16:04:41 -
[4562] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:
Well, the echo chamber that gives you all your thoughts on Eve immediately leapt to "woot, Fozie is talking about wh-local. Yay!"
Nah, I came up with that about forty seconds after I read the post.
I honestly cannot figure out where you're getting "we're going after gates!" from that, aside from your attempting to project your desperation to not admit that local is the problem onto the developers.
Quote:
I am interested in itemizing what those reasons might be, and examining what their null-sec equivalents could look like.
Oh, that's easy.
They will delete local. And then, neither the player ratting nor the cloaked player will know the other person is there without seeing them on grid or d-scan. All passive gameplay and intel is thereby gone, both players have to engage in more active piloting.
The ratter has no one to be annoyed at, and the cloaked player has no way to annoy the ratter with his presence alone.
And afk cloaking is instantly gone.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
Best Meltdown Ever.
|
Brokk Witgenstein
Extreme Agony
The Wraithguard.
132
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 16:07:53 -
[4563] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:But its still not about me, friend.
Then maybe you should let the guys whom it does concern speak for themselves?
At any rate, if they were "yolo morons" we'd be having a good laugh at their expense. Judging by the endless threads, however, it would seem the yolo is real  Never underestimate your enemy. One one hand you claim it is a technique used in sov warfare - on the other hand you blurt out they're nothing but a handful of yoloscum.
Please pick and choose what exactly you're trying to argue; right now you're just vomiting words. And yes, that IS about you. I may not always agree with Mike, nor did I always agree with Mag's or Teckos or Kaarous ; but they at least took a stand and argued their side of the story. You're merely shifting position on a whim, claiming both one thing and its exact opposite at the same time.
This is pointless. Please note that any lack of reply from now on is not because I agree but because I give up. |
Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 16:21:38 -
[4564] - Quote
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:Jerghul wrote:But its still not about me, friend.
Then maybe you should let the guys whom it does concern speak for themselves? At any rate, if they were "yolo morons" we'd be having a good laugh at their expense. Judging by the endless threads, however, it would seem the yolo is real Never underestimate your enemy. One one hand you claim it is a technique used in sov warfare - on the other hand you blurt out they're nothing but a handful of yoloscum. Please pick and choose what exactly you're trying to argue; right now you're just vomiting words. And yes, that IS about you. I may not always agree with Mike, nor did I always agree with Mag's or Teckos or Kaarous ; but they at least took a stand and argued their side of the story. You're merely shifting position on a whim, claiming both one thing and its exact opposite at the same time. This is pointless. Please note that any lack of reply from now on is not because I agree but because I give up.
It is used in sov warfare. It is also used by yolo morons who are trying to copy some idea they ripped off redit to justify a bloated sense of leet skillz and use of pirate emoticons. These groups are not mutually exclusive and both contribute to the "pretty big psychological impact" Fozie is talking about.
It is up to you if wish to contribute or not. But there is a certain wisdom in disengaging from an argument you simply do not understand.
There may be hope for you yet 
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
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Wander Prian
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
109
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 16:37:32 -
[4565] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:Quote:CCP Fozie wrote:
It's very important that it be possible to disrupt peoples' money-making in nullsec, and AFK cloaking is one of the most effective ways. We're not worried about cloaked ships being overpowered because cloaked ships do very little DPS.
But we understand it has a pretty big psychological effect. We would like to make some changes...it may not be the changes people are expecting, though. For instance, I can tell you that AFK cloaking is not an issue in wormhole space and there are pretty good reasons for that Wander Fozie said that the changes may not be what we are expecting and then referred to wh space. Its not much of a leap. But nothing is given of course. Time will tell. I am not trying to predict what changes may or may not come from wormhole space. I am itemizing mechanisms or "pretty good reasons" that make afk cloaking not an issue in wormhole space and seeing what they might look like in null-sec. Entosing gates open/shut, or placing combat modules right beside gates (a different way of "closing" gates) would certainly shake things up in null sec. But that is really a topic for a different thread if we do agree that closing gates (or gate surrogates) lessens the "pretty big psychological effect" afk cloaky camping has. Brokk If the visitor is prepared, then he is not an opportunistic predator. Which in turn reduces the "pretty big psychological effect" afk cloaks have. The number of incidents people doing PvE need to worry about decreases. Sidepoint Players ratting do not really mind getting caught. They dislike being yolo killed by a few morons imitating some tactic they read on reddit and think that gives them leet skilz. Take PvE players seriously and they will die without complaint (the mechanism here is being able to justify the killboard loss to corp or alliance members. No one likes being embarrassed in front of their peers). Edit Its still not about me, friend. I don't give a crap about isk/hr (as should be obvious when I pointed out how you maximize it. You get a McJob and transfer real life money into Eve. That should give you 500 mill/hr or whatever). I also don't give a crap about losing ships (as you could tell from the ships I do lose on my kb), and I seldom lose ships because I know what I am doing.
Then refrase your idea as such. Now it sounds like you are trying to copy the same mechanics to nullsec, which DOESN'T WORK. Also, your interpretation of those mechanics and how they effect to "lessen" the psychological effect are way off the mark. I've lived in wormholes for 5 years now and I've NEVER met anyone who thought that omni-tanking or wormhole-effects or no cloning into a w-space system or any other on that list of yours makes doing PVE in wormholes "safer" That's not how people work.
At least 2 things on your list were right though. Closing of wormholes is done to increase the safety of PVE. The other being no local, which just makes us think like there's always someone with us in the system and act accordingly
You should go try some ratting in nullsec and in wormholes before you start trying to get into their minds and how they think. You have zero experience and it shows in all of your ideas. |
Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 16:52:21 -
[4566] - Quote
Wander
Still not about me.
I have tried to be pretty clear on what my agenda is. It has changed. So I apologize for it not being clear despite my best efforts.
You do not really need to know what mechanisms reduce a "pretty big psychological effect" to enjoy the reduction, and easy answers do cloud the issue ("we are a breed apart" is a comfortable wh answer that sort of stops further thought on the matter for example). So I am rather unsurprised that you have never met anyone pointing out that flying with implants they can afford to lose makes them less worried about being podded (to name one example).
I am not insisting you agree on every detail in an analytical approach either. There is room for disagreement, though not in absolute terms as we are simply looking at things that can reduce a "pretty big psychological effect" without there being any certainty if they do - or if they do not (a pedant might argue that virtually anything has at some point in EvE history reduced a pretty big psychological effect for at least 1 player. But we are looking at the big picture, so that line of thinking is not relevant).
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
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Wander Prian
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
109
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 17:01:09 -
[4567] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:Wander
Still not about me.
I have tried to be pretty clear on what my agenda is. It has changed. So I apologize for it not being clear despite my best efforts.
You do not really need to know what mechanisms reduce a "pretty big psychological effect" to enjoy the reduction, and easy answers do cloud the issue ("we are a breed apart" is a comfortable wh answer that sort of stops further thought on the matter for example). So I am rather unsurprised that you have never met anyone pointing out that flying with implants they can afford to lose makes them less worried about being podded (to name one example).
I am not insisting you agree on every detail in an analytical approach either. There is room for disagreement, though not in absolute terms as we are simply looking at things that can reduce a "pretty big psychological effect" without there being any certainty if they do - or if they do not (a pedant might argue that virtually anything has at some point in EvE history reduced a pretty big psychological effect for at least 1 player. But we are looking at the big picture, so that line of thinking is not relevant).
What you are looking for is people who agree with you, nothing else. Every time someone says something you don't agree with, you just skip over it. |
Brokk Witgenstein
Extreme Agony
The Wraithguard.
132
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 17:09:17 -
[4568] - Quote
Don't worry Wander. He's playing a quiz: every time you post something, he'll say "still not about me" until somebody can figure out who he is. Like those drinking games where you hold a card against your forehead and you have to guess which card you're holding |
Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 17:09:29 -
[4569] - Quote
Wander
I addressed every point you made.
*its not about me. This is an analytical discussion. Make your point about the argument instead of about pedigree requirements.
*Rephase. I apologized that my agenda did not come across clearer.
*Mechanics discussion not taking place. That did not surprise me. There is no reason to chat about underlying mechanisms
*Off the mark. Well, make the argument.
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
|
Wander Prian
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
109
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 17:20:22 -
[4570] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:Wander
I addressed every point you made.
*its not about me. This is an analytical discussion. Make your point about the argument instead of about pedigree requirements.
*Rephase. I apologized that my agenda did not come across clearer.
*Mechanics discussion not taking place. That did not surprise me. There is no reason to chat about underlying mechanisms
*Off the mark. Well, make the argument.
How is it analytical if all you are doing is sticking fingers into your ears if someone says something you don't agree with? I have pointed out multiple times how your assumptions are wrong and included my own experiences in the subject. So far all you have done is make wild assumptions, logical leaps and moving goals.
You have been asked how is NPC-null or lowsec any different from sov-null, which seems to be the only place in New Eden where "AFK-cloaking" is an issue. Yet somehow, "That's not important"
If you want to do this scientifically, then you first start with an assumption, then you research that assumption and see what your research tell you. Then you make corrections to your assumption and do it again.
You don't just take random things, call them important somehow without any proof or experience in the subject matter. |
Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 17:45:39 -
[4571] - Quote
You limit and define the scope when studying something analytically (What do they teach at school these days?)
If you want to explore what mechanisms are specific to low-sec lessen a pretty big psychological effect that cloaks cause in null-sec, then be my guest. Hell, I might even contribute.
I am interested in examining what reasons (mechanisms) in wh space that lessen a pretty big psychological effect cloaks cause to the point of them not being an issue.
Did you want me to add a sentence saying "however, further study into how afk cloaks impact on other areas of space is recommended"?
I can do that
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
|
Wander Prian
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
109
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 17:49:29 -
[4572] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:You limit and define the scope when studying something analytically (What do they teach at school these days?) If you want to explore what mechanisms are specific to low-sec lessen a pretty big psychological effect that cloaks cause in null-sec, then be my guest. Hell, I might even contribute. I am interested in examining what reasons (mechanisms) in wh space that lessen a pretty big psychological effect cloaks cause to the point of them not being an issue. Did you want me to add a sentence saying "however, further study into how afk cloaks impact on other areas of space is recommended"? I can do that
Because you aren't doing any kind of studying, you are just making wild guesses based on what are the dfiferences between K-space and W-space without any kind of experience or learning of the matter at hand |
Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 17:59:42 -
[4573] - Quote
And yet, you agreed with at least two of them. You do not have to agree with all of them and I never claimed I would successfully find all of them.
The study moves forward. You can contribute or not as you wish.
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
|
Wander Prian
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
111
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 18:36:31 -
[4574] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:And yet, you agreed with at least two of them. You do not have to agree with all of them and I never claimed I would successfully find all of them.
The study moves forward. You can contribute or not as you wish.
Even those 2 I gave you because
1) No cyno's so you don't have to worry about them, though you do have to worry about K162's spawning
2) closing wormholes is done to increase security overall, not because there's someone with a cloak. We do not care about one person in a cloak. There's always someone in the system in a cloak. It's not the cloak you are afraid of, it's the people coming after him
In short: In W-space, you aren't afraid of a guy with a cloak. You accept that there most likely is one in the system. |
Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 20:04:26 -
[4575] - Quote
Cloaks are fine (Fozielaw).
"It's not the cloak you are afraid of, it's the people coming after him"
Well, yah. Or rather afraid of the potential that it could happen, and in particular the potential that it could happen in a way that makes the pilot caught look stupid.
That is the "pretty big psychological effect" we are looking at
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
|
Teckos Pech
The Executives
Executive Outcomes
4060
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 21:11:42 -
[4576] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:
My goodness. I am not the one projecting normative moralism into this thread. You guys are. "EvE should be this, Eve should be that, Jerghul is such a meanie, I am going to tell on that meanie, Carbears suck, wormholers are soooo hipster..." (I am paraphrasing sentiment, not quoting verbatim)..
No, we are telling you how Eve is, you are the one saying how it should be. Eve is a sandbox PvP MMO game with a science fiction setting. And it is not just us, it is CCP saying this too. They have a video out there on youtube talking about the butterfly effect/sensitivity to initial conditions/sandbox (in fact, I think that is the name of the video, The Butterfly Effect). The whole point of that video is that your actions in game can impact lots of players, directly and indirectly and CCP is not only fine with that that is how they want it to be.
Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence
So Local Chat vanished, now what?
|
Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 21:25:51 -
[4577] - Quote
Teckos
I am also not the one struggling with non-linear logic. You are. Hence your small army of pretty puny straw men.
To rehash yet again.
I am just looking at what wormhole mechanisms that reduce a pretty big psychological effect might look like in nullsec.
I am not making an impact study beyond that stated objective.
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
|
Teckos Pech
The Executives
Executive Outcomes
4062
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 21:44:22 -
[4578] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:Teckos
I am also not the one struggling with non-linear logic. You are. Hence your small army of pretty puny straw men.
To rehash yet again.
I am just looking at what wormhole mechanisms that reduce a pretty big psychological effect might look like in nullsec.
I am not making an impact study beyond that stated objective.
Jesus, get off this non-linear stuff it is a load of crap.
If anyone is having any trouble here, it is you. You don't seem to get what we are saying
Jerghul wrote:Teckos
I am also not the one struggling with non-linear logic. You are. Hence your small army of pretty puny straw men.
To rehash yet again.
I am just looking at what wormhole mechanisms that reduce a pretty big psychological effect might look like in nullsec.
I am not making an impact study beyond that stated objective.
WTF? That whiffing sound you heard was my last post literally sailing over your head. I wasnGÇÖt addressing your precious non-linear logic crap, I was pointing out that the GÇ£pretty big psychological effectGÇ¥ you are so fixated onGǪit is fine, it does not need to be reduced.
Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence
So Local Chat vanished, now what?
|
Mag's
the united
20852
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 21:46:21 -
[4579] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:I am also not the one struggling with non-linear logic. Oh I agree. So far the mental gymnastics you have performed, to fudge the issue and ignore local as being what Fozzie (with two Zs) was actually talking about, is quite amazing.
Completely none linear, but utterly clueless never the less.
Please, do carry on with this one man show that's not about you.
Destination SkillQueue:-
It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
|
Maria Dragoon
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
59
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 21:49:02 -
[4580] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:Teckos
I am also not the one struggling with non-linear logic. You are. Hence your small army of pretty puny straw men.
To rehash yet again.
I am just looking at what wormhole mechanisms that reduce a pretty big psychological effect might look like in nullsec.
I am not making an impact study beyond that stated objective.
Man, I'm all over non-linear logic. I love that ****. However, what you are doing is not only non-linear, but also non-logical.
I mean, I'm all up for people thinking outside the box, having some creative thought.... Which by the way non-linear logic is also called Creative thought process. Which your thought process has done leap and bounds on word games. I mean DAMN.
So far your only non-linear logic has been word games to avoid subjects, on how you are /wrong/. Your pattern is actually rather predictable.
Issue how your thought process is out of line: Redirect
Issue how people say you are wrong on a subject: Redirect
Issue on how people are telling you, you have no clue what you are talking about: Ignored. |
Brokk Witgenstein
Extreme Agony
The Wraithguard.
137
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 22:00:35 -
[4581] - Quote
So, I take it there are no objections then? Onward to point 4.
I'll rehash it plain and simple this time, so that your feeble minds can grasp the basic concepts contained within: to counter the implicit threat aka the "big psychological impact" of the game, it is important to realise it's not about you. Despite being an invested stakeholder I want to point out it's still not about me either. Because Fozzie.
Thank you for your constructive input. Onward to point 5! |
Brokk Witgenstein
Extreme Agony
The Wraithguard.
137
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 22:15:04 -
[4582] - Quote
Unfortunately, something interesting Mike said got lost amidst the clutter... I was hoping the Sov null guys could enlighten me about this: apparently, defense fleets are a long way from where the ratting happens.
This is not the case where we live; but then again, we're small so we only occupy 3-5 systems.
I was wondering ... is it possible in these instances where there's a no-man's land between the PvP-wing (chokepoints, pipelines) and the ratting fleet exists, ... is it possible this alliance is in fact trying to hold on to more space than its memberbase can support? Or, in other words, is it common in nullsec to take up so much space your guys can't even reach you in time if/when sh!t hits the fan?
Seems a bit odd; though I wouldn't want to dismiss it off hand because on roams I have seen plenty of free space so I suppose it is possible he's spot on there. Anyone care to enlighten me? Thanks |
Teckos Pech
The Executives
Executive Outcomes
4062
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 23:02:36 -
[4583] - Quote
Jerghul wrote:Cloaks are fine (Fozielaw).
"It's not the cloak you are afraid of, it's the people coming after him"
Well, yah. Or rather afraid of the potential that it could happen, and in particular the potential that it could happen in a way that makes the pilot caught look stupid.
That is the "pretty big psychological effect" we are looking at
Edit
It could possibly be that no-local widens the scope for losing a ship without looking like an idiot no matter the cause. So it may after all have a slight effect on lowering the "pretty big psychological effect".
Well no. See, what this all revolves around is ATK play. Wander and his guys worry about a gang coming in. This is true in NS as well. If a gang of 30+ dudes come inGǪthatGÇÖs a problem, especially if you donGÇÖt see them coming. Not seeing them coming is much more of a ThingGäó in w-space (if I have understood Wander and Morrigan correctly). Why? Because their intel network is much, much more limited. Why is their intel much, much more limited? Could it beGǪno local? No local is, for w-space the GÇ£pretty big psychological effectGÇ¥. Cloaks? Not at all. Why? Also because of no local. The effectiveness of cloaks is due in large part to local. Local always shows the pilot as there irrespective of their keyboard status. Once at a safe spot and cloaked, they can have the GÇ£pretty big psychological effectGÇ¥.
However, it is not impossible to deal with. Again, the list:
- Move over a system.
- Rat in a group.
- Find out when the guy is most likely to be ATK.
All of these things can GÇ£reduceGÇ¥ that GÇ£pretty big psychological effectGÇ¥.
Further, if we are going to either change cloaks (make them scannable) or change local (make it delayed chat) then the other must change as well to preserve balance. While some here, whose reading ability is seriously gimped, might cry that removing local increases the GÇ£implicit threatGÇ¥ this person is forgetting that there is going to also be a way toGǪ.wait for itGǪwaitGǪ.scan for cloaked ships. In this case, AFK cloaking is dead. Local as a source of intel is dead. Further, intel will move into a POS (Player Owned Structure) and will be vulnerable. Now players can manage their own risk (IGÇÖm done with the stupid GÇ£implicit threatGÇ¥, WTF are we using GÇ£implicit threatGÇ¥ when the word risk is more than sufficient?). Which is the way it should be. Players mitigating their own riskGǪdoing stuff, interacting, creating opportunities for having fun.
Having CCP come out and hold your hand while you PvE should never be the solution.
Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence
So Local Chat vanished, now what?
|
Teckos Pech
The Executives
Executive Outcomes
4065
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 23:14:32 -
[4584] - Quote
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:Unfortunately, something interesting Mike said got lost amidst the clutter... I was hoping the Sov null guys could enlighten me about this: apparently, defense fleets are a long way from where the ratting happens.
This is not the case where we live; but then again, we're small so we only occupy 3-5 systems.
I was wondering ... is it possible in these instances where there's a no-man's land between the PvP-wing (chokepoints, pipelines) and the ratting fleet exists, ... is it possible this alliance is in fact trying to hold on to more space than its memberbase can support? Or, in other words, is it common in nullsec to take up so much space your guys can't even reach you in time if/when sh!t hits the fan?
Seems a bit odd; though I wouldn't want to dismiss it off hand because on roams I have seen plenty of free space so I suppose it is possible he's spot on there. Anyone care to enlighten me? Thanks
Where I live we donGÇÖt do defensive fleets. We do a standing fleet. The idea being that with everyone in one fleet if the **** hits the fan the other guys will come help you out. Of course, if it is a 10 man gang you are screwed, but typically it is 1-2 guys in a stratii or the like. But you have to be in the fleet and on comms so you can yell for help. We have 14 systems of which about 8 or 9 are good for ratting. So most people are GÇ£pretty closeGÇ¥.
Our coalition has a pretty good intel channel as well. Not unusual to see 300 or more online in late USTZ. So, you have to be more AFK than semi-AFK to get caught completely unawares.
Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence
So Local Chat vanished, now what?
|
Brokk Witgenstein
Extreme Agony
The Wraithguard.
138
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 23:25:40 -
[4585] - Quote
Yeh - "Standing Fleet" is what it's called, and comms indeed go without saying.
So it is indeed very unlikely a cloaker jumps on you and there's nobody in a 5 system radius to help you out? That'd be my assessment as well: you need to be close to each other. If there's nobody within 5 jumps and you're not carrying a cyno yourself, you are in effect "solo"...
I already thought as much, but I wasn't sure how different NPC null and sov null were in that regard. Thanks for sharing. |
Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 23:30:10 -
[4586] - Quote
Anyway, moving back to topic: No more feedback on this?
Wormhole space has system effects that impact significantly on doctrine and tactical efficiency. This allows residents of specific systems to fine tune doctrine, skills, and tactics optimally adapted to their specific ecosystem. Visitors to that system must either fight at a serious disadvantage, or enter with a high degree of planned premeditation.
Giving sov holders access to infrastructure modules that allows them to tailor combat environments in systems they control duplicates that effect and could be combined with expanding wormhole star effects to more types of stars (in weaker or different incarnations).
Implicit threat is reduced by giving visitors the option of either fighting at a disadvantage, or by preparing sufficiently. In effect reducing the level of opportunistic predation a PvE player need worry about."
Addendum
This of course has everything to do with afk cloaky camping as the "big psychological effect" derived from it, and we are looking at things in wormhole space that can decrease the "big psychological effect" caused by afk cloaky camping if mirrored in nullsec.
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
|
Jerghul
Running with Dogs
Stella Nova
0
|
Posted - 2015.12.14 23:35:31 -
[4587] - Quote
You are incidentally doing nullsec wrong if you are ratting or mining at peak times.
" We have been doing a lot of challenging old assumptions of late, and often with delightful results. Just because something is doesn't mean it should be..."
-Team Game Of Drones (Dec 2015)
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Teckos Pech
The Executives
Executive Outcomes
4065
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Posted - 2015.12.14 23:49:39 -
[4588] - Quote
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:Yeh - "Standing Fleet" is what it's called, and comms indeed go without saying.
So it is indeed very unlikely a cloaker jumps on you and there's nobody in a 5 system radius to help you out? That'd be my assessment as well: you need to be close to each other. If there's nobody within 5 jumps and you're not carrying a cyno yourself, you are in effect "solo"...
I already thought as much, but I wasn't sure how different NPC null and sov null were in that regard. Thanks for sharing.
Correct, chances are there will be somebody within the very same system or 1 jump way, maybe 2. That is why Vic Jefferson was complaining about cynos, but not like youGÇÖd expect. He wanted to hunt capitals in Deklein, but ratting carriers fit cynos, so when they get in trouble they yell, pop cyno in suddenly the hunters have a titan, 4 supers, 10 carriers and a butt load of sub-caps dropped on their heads. He wanted anomalies to be conventional cyno free zonesGÇöi.e. you could fit them, just not light them.
Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence
So Local Chat vanished, now what?
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Wander Prian
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
120
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Posted - 2015.12.15 00:06:41 -
[4589] - Quote
Hmm.. Weird.. We usually have people on comms and in fleet if they are down the chain doing something. Solo-stuff is another story of course |
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
1076
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Posted - 2015.12.15 00:07:12 -
[4590] - Quote
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:So, I take it there are no objections then? Onward to point 4.
I'll rehash it plain and simple this time, so that your feeble minds can grasp the basic concepts contained within: to counter the implicit threat aka the "big psychological impact" of the game, it is important to realise it's not about you. Despite being an invested stakeholder I want to point out it's still not about me either. Because Fozzie.
Thank you for your constructive input. Onward to point 5!
Why does Brokk sound like Jerghul... |
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