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Battleship or Command Ship?

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Prokonsul Piotrus	Posted - 2006.09.28 06:01:00 - [1] I am wondering if I should train for battleships or command ships for best mission performance. Any suggestions?
Ather Ialeas Amarr	Posted - 2006.09.28 06:13:00 - [2] I'd choose battleship and then I'd start training for command ships. In fact I did since getting a bs is easier and cheaper and you make more money with it which enables you to save ISK faster for the command ship.
Kilwen	Posted - 2006.09.28 06:23:00 - [3] Battle ship has the added training time of large weapons where as COmmand usese the same mediums you probably already trained. For me Command is 1st BS later.
Mikal Drey Angels and Demons	Posted - 2006.09.28 11:10:00 - [4] hey hey Battleship is easy Command is the sex. currently doing L4's in my claymore. and its outperformed the Tempest. less damage but slavers (both level) and Zor with no warp outs :)
Depko	Posted - 2006.09.28 12:04:00 - [5] Originally by: Ather Ialeas I'd choose battleship and then I'd start training for command ships. In fact I did since getting a bs is easier and cheaper and you make more money with it which enables you to save ISK faster for the command ship. I do think the same as you.
Cupdeez	Posted - 2006.09.28 14:02:00 - [6] 3 years ago when i started playing i would have never trained for a BS if the command ship was out then. The command ship eats up lvl4 missions
FireFoxx80 Caldari E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2006.09.28 15:05:00 - [7] How do you guys break tanks in command ships? At least Caldari ones. What I do the rest of the time - Vote for a Jita bypass!
Guurzak Minmatar	Posted - 2006.09.28 15:38:00 - [8] Originally by: Kilwen Battle ship has the added training time of large weapons where as COmmand usese the same mediums you probably already trained. For me Command is 1st BS later. Yeah, the training time to train up battleship sized weapons is so much longer than the Cruiser V, BC V, Leadership V, Weapon Upgrades V, Mechanic V, Engineering V, Assault Ships IV, Heavy Assault IV, and Squad Command IV that a command ship requires. You can comfortably run level 4 missions in a torp raven <6 weeks from character creation, less if you push it. Command ships are a much much more skill intensive investment. If you're training for a commmand ship anyway, you'll also be able to do missions in it. But if your goal is specifically to do missions, there's no reason to look past battleships.
Captain CB	Posted - 2006.10.01 11:37:00 - [9] The same question for me... Apoc or Absolution, what to train - commandships or T2 mega lasers... who will suggest?
Raquel Smith Caldari Ferengi Commerce Authority	Posted - 2006.10.01 12:19:00 - [10] A friend of mine helped me out on a level 3 Angel Strike 10/10, the one with lots of battleships and battlecruisers. She was in a Nighthawk and had zero problems tanking each group of 4 battleships and 8 battlecruisers. Completely passive tanked it all. Me in a Ferox and her in the Nighthawk went through both groups. It was a little slow getting through the 1.2 mil ISK battleships with only heavy missiles and drones but they went down and we both got paid. If training for a command ship didn't take months and months I'd train for that instead of a battleship, however, battleships are easy to train for (and less expensive to buy) so I'd train for them first and bring in the ISK doing missions with the battleship whilst training for command ships.

Deja Thoris Revelations Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.01 14:46:00 - [11] Originally by: FireFoxx80 How do you guys break tanks in command ships? At least Caldari ones. I fly amarr, minnie and caldari. Caldari break the tanks but slowly. Asbolution and sleip chew through bs. Personally, I'd go bs first then command ship. Command ships are very skill intensive. You need cruiser V, battlecruiser V, leadership V, squadron command 4 etc etc. You can be competant and even good in a bs before you can get near a command ship. Originally by: Clementina If you bug report it, you get ignored. If you post about it on the forums, you get banned. If you exploit it, you get rich.
neutero	Posted - 2006.10.02 03:59:00 - [12] anyone using Eos or Astarte for solo level 4's?
Iudex Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2006.10.02 06:26:00 - [13] C'mon guys you are not really serious to say a command ship would do better in missions than a battleship. It can't possibly have the same damage output as a faction fitted navy ship. Yes, if you take a tech 1 bs you'r maybe right, but a true missionrunner (which tries to get the most isk / time possible) uses the finest weapons out there, and with this no commandship-fitting can compete. Just to give an example, i fly a caldari navy raven atm, as the defence with faction mods is so good (using dread guri invuls, x-type xl booster etc) i was able to fit 4 dread gurista ballistic controls for the extra high damage output. Currently my cruise missles hit with over 560 on structure (or on sansha bs shields ), 7 tech 2 cruise launchers with a rof under 7 (when bs skill will be at 5 in next week)) - this just eats through lvl 4s like nothing else (can complete gurista ev + bonusstage in far under 1h30min) - so really, show me a command ship that can do this solo. Ofc' this only applies to missionrunning in 0.5+ sec, but there a command ship can no way outperform a missionrunner-battelship.
wide Gallente	Posted - 2006.10.02 06:56:00 - [14] Astarte can do 500+ dps with rails and a T2 fit. Coupled with the armour rep bonus and decent resistences, it's a pretty sweet ship.
Hectaire Glade Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2006.10.02 07:38:00 - [15] Originally by: Iudex C'mon guys you are not really serious to say a command ship would do better in missions than a battleship. It can't possibly have the same damage output as a faction fitted navy ship. Yes, if you take a tech 1 bs you'r maybe right, but a true missionrunner (which tries to get the most isk / time possible) uses the finest weapons out there, and with this no commandship-fitting can compete. Just to give an example, i fly a caldari navy raven atm, as the defence with faction mods is so good (using dread guri invuls, x-type xl booster etc) i was able to fit 4 dread gurista ballistic controls for the extra high damage output. Currently my cruise missles hit with over 560 on structure (or on sansha bs shields ), 7 tech 2 cruise launchers with a rof under 7 (when bs skill will be at 5 in next week)) - this just eats through lvl 4s like nothing else (can complete gurista ev + bonusstage in far under 1h30min) - so really, show me a command ship that can do this solo. Ofc' this only applies to missionrunning in 0.5+ sec, but there a command ship can no way outperform a missionrunner-battelship. See, the thing is every mission has a good mixture of Frigs, Cruisers and BS, Command ships are using medium guns, and as such rip through the smaller NPCs much faster than your drones will, my Absolution takes down NPC cruisers faster than either a torp or cruise user in most sistuations + I can remove frigates in one-two rounds of fire. BSes take a little longer yes, but you are not facing 90% BS on Level 4s. Its not just pure DPS vs. structure that matters, its your ability to deal damage to all targets you are facing which sets the overall speed. On the whole for those who still fly Amarr, the Abolsution is a _lot_ faster than both a geddon and Apoc for level 4s.
Mikal Drey Angels and Demons	Posted - 2006.10.02 08:19:00 - [16] Originally by: Iudex C'mon guys you are not really serious to say a command ship would do better in missions than a battleship. It can't possibly have the same damage output as a faction fitted navy ship. oh oh oh yes. its not just about damage output either. Command Vs Battleship Command sig radius is lower - slightly longer to get targeted less damage taken from bigger weapons Command Resists - OMFG ive played with the sleipnir (kablamo twice) as it has a better damage output (bonuses) but im seriously loving my Claymore. the resists on all the command ships are awesome for missions and has a great impact on tanking ability. the more you tank the longer/closer you can last. Slot layout - Commands are designed for a very specific purpose and the Claymore's extra mid over the sleipnir has become a "utility" slot also having such perfect mids its shield tanking ability isnt ever compromised. Agility - yeah the agility in them sucks but compared to a Battleship its like driving a [insert brand name] Overall - with the temp i usually warp in , get range. with the Claymore its warp in and start shooting. To break some of the higher BS tanks you pilot your ship properly. eg. i was trying to shoot the Duo L4 at around 50km and generally i sucked and almost gave up. but i got alot closer tried to keep at optimum (little under) and po they went. another eg. I was low on ammo (nub) and also didnt have the correct ammo (nub) and i was having troubles with a BS. changed ammo and reloaded and the BS melted away. Messing about with the command in a l4 is alot more fun than the Battleship :) also (so they dont get nerfed) ive been in a fleet gang with a couple of command ships doing the gang thing and they certainly give that little extra and although IMHO they might not sway the tide of the battle i certainly loved the bonus i got.
Iudex Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2006.10.02 08:19:00 - [17] Originally by: Hectaire Glade See, the thing is every mission has a good mixture of Frigs, Cruisers and BS, Command ships are using medium guns, and as such rip through the smaller NPCs much faster than your drones will, my Absolution takes down NPC cruisers faster than either a torp or cruise user in most sistuations + I can remove frigates in one-two rounds of fire. BSes take a little longer yes, but you are not facing 90% BS on Level 4s. Its not just pure DPS vs. structure that matters, its your ability to deal damage to all targets you are facing which sets the overall speed. On the whole for those who still fly Amarr, the Abolsution is a _lot_ faster than both a geddon and Apoc for level 4s.[/quote Ok i agree, bs are not the main mass of ncps in lvl 4s, but cruise missiles are not designed for bs only either. I don't know much about turrets i must admint, but my cruises have a signature impact of like 228m atm (skill to 4 + implant)if i remember well, which means they hit bc perfectly and still do good damage on cruisers, frigs and even spider drones. And with missiles the speed or orbit radius is not an issue. The elite frigs (like mercenary wingman, gurista webifier, sansha demon etc..) are maybe a problem when starting with lvl4s, but after a while you know where they are in each mission, attack them as first ship from a spawn group, they use mwd and get killed with 2-3 cruises .. so like in 90% of all cases they are not a big issue.. but ok this is more a turrets - vs - missiles discussion. I don't know how it is with turrets bs and such, but in missiles the faction-fitted cnr owns a nighthawk (commandship) or cerberus (hac) concerning dps and therefore mission-speed in any ways on any target (except orbiting elite frigs maybe, which were not killed when approaching).


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