| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
LaCoHa
Caldari Deep Space Navy
Caldari Deep Space Industral
   |
Posted - 2006.10.12 22:16:00 -
[1]
Um.... I am actually a bit angered by the fact that i lost an enyo kill today because my Heavy drones refused to hit the very webbed ship.
They hit on approach, but for what felt like forever, propably more like 3 minutes, I tanked the sentries while my pathetic drones orbitted the helpless enyo.
Long story short, at 52ms he finaly made it to the gate and jumped. Im sure he was laughing at me. 
Shouldnt drones, yes EVEN heavies, hit if the target is sitting "still"??
|
Complacency's Bane
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 22:22:00 -
[2]
No, they shouldnt. Thats what tracking means.
Use smaller drones for frigates.
|
LaCoHa
Caldari Deep Space Navy
Caldari Deep Space Industral
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 22:27:00 -
[3]
The Enyo - which iirc has a larger sig than a T1 variant, was sitting STILL. So its not like the tiny little tracking computers on the Heavy drones had a lot of calculations to do. 
That said, gate ganking with 1.5 mil a pop hammerhead II's is just silly. They die almost instantly from sentry fire.
I dont know. Just seems a bit dumb to me. -the ueber crappy tracking that is.
|
Complacency's Bane
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 22:29:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: LaCoHa
The Enyo - which iirc has a larger sig than a T1 variant, was sitting STILL. So its not like the tiny little tracking computers on the ORBITING Heavy drones had a lot of calculations to do.
If anything, heavy drones already track too well.
And if t2 is too expensive for you, I hear there is some other tech level which also has equipment which is not as expensive.
|
LaCoHa
Caldari Deep Space Navy
Caldari Deep Space Industral
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 22:42:00 -
[5]
Edited by: LaCoHa on 12/10/2006 22:42:34
Yeah that is true. However, they are just not as cool! 
And honestly.. you can not say that they track too well if they cant hit an AF moving at a blisterin 52ms.
PS. They did not hit AT ALL once they started to orbit. Zip, nada, nill.
|
Foulis
Minmatar
Chosen Path
Lotka Volterra
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 22:43:00 -
[6]
Enyo has a pretty hard tank on it. And yes, by all rights a heavy drone should almost never hit a frigate.
----
Originally by: Nikolai Nuvolari
NO WORDS IN THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE ARE SPELLED WITH THE NUMBER "8" IN THEM GODDAMNIT!
|
Pan Crastus
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 22:51:00 -
[7]
Yes, drones are broken. They orbit too fast for their own tracking.
As for the trolls who wrote things like "heavy drones should not hit frigates" etc., ignore that nonsense. The tracking of the slowest drones - Ogre I - is nearly the same as that of light neutron blasters, i.e. frigate close range guns. If they cannot hit an immobilized target at their optimal, they are broken and useless. The fix would be to make them orbit at a speed that guarantees that their guns' tracking can keep up with it.
|
LaCoHa
Caldari Deep Space Navy
Caldari Deep Space Industral
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 22:53:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Yes, drones are broken. They orbit too fast for their own tracking.
Amen brother! Thats what I was trying to say, but it is getting late here, and my brain isnt working at 100%
|
Yakov Krasnov
Caldari
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 22:56:00 -
[9]
It's not just the tracking, it's the signature resolution. The resolution on a heavy drone is 125m, just like a cruiser gun. A frigate is usually somewhere around 30m signature, so you tend to miss lots of shots.
-----------------------------------------------
Mercenary minded - I'll fly whatever works best. |
Kathira
Gallente
Denial of Service
Freelancer Coalition
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:00:00 -
[10]
Pan is right.
I tested the same in some missions.
1. I webbed some elite frigs and let my small drones fight them .. Result .. long time living frigs.
2. I stopped webbing ... frigs died faster
3. I changed from webber to targetpainter ... Result frigs died a bit faster than without.
So my webber are now fine resting in my hangar ... and I use the slot for something real useful on my Dom.
Webber + Drones != good combination for fast small ships.
|
Hllaxiu
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:05:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Yakov Krasnov
It's not just the tracking, it's the signature resolution. The resolution on a heavy drone is 125m, just like a cruiser gun. A frigate is usually somewhere around 30m signature, so you tend to miss lots of shots.
However deimos vs heavily webbed friggie = very dead friggie.
---
Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson |
Guillame Herschel
Gallente
Cheers Restaurant and Bar
Nova Republic
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:16:00 -
[12]
Originally by: LaCoHa
PS. They did not hit AT ALL once they started to orbit. Zip, nada, nill.
I find this is generally true all the time. Once the Heavies start orbiting a frigate - or try to orbit a frigate that is travelling too fast for them - they stop hitting. But if I recall them and order them to attack again right away, boom-boom-boom, dead friggies in a heartbeat. They seem only able to hit on approach. But they hit real good.
-- Guile can always trump hardware -- |
Izo Azlion
Veto.
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:21:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Complacency's Bane
Originally by: LaCoHa
The Enyo - which iirc has a larger sig than a T1 variant, was sitting STILL. So its not like the tiny little tracking computers on the ORBITING Heavy drones had a lot of calculations to do.
If anything, heavy drones already track too well.
And if t2 is too expensive for you, I hear there is some other tech level which also has equipment which is not as expensive.
Fancy losing 1.5mil x 5 for killing a ship you *MIGHT* get 5 mil return off?
No, thought not.
Gate ganking, belt murdering, piracy and ransoms are all based on risk:reward. When you understand that losing more than you gain is a bad thing, come and tell us to use T1 gear again.
Izo Azlion.
---
|
Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari
Worms Corp
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:27:00 -
[14]
so erm why didnt you just shoot at the target with the guns on your ship?
|
Gloria Pao
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:39:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Izo Azlion
Fancy losing 1.5mil x 5 for killing a ship you *MIGHT* get 5 mil return off?
No, thought not.
Gate ganking, belt murdering, piracy and ransoms are all based on risk:reward. When you understand that losing more than you gain is a bad thing, come and tell us to use T1 gear again.
Umm, I think that's precisely what they were saying. Don't waste 5 1.5 million isk drones on a target that you *might* get 5 million back from.
I love how violently people manage to agree.
|
Zed Nash
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:50:00 -
[16]
Originally by: LaCoHa
Um.... I am actually a bit angered by the fact that i lost an enyo kill today because my Heavy drones refused to hit the very webbed ship.
They hit on approach, but for what felt like forever, propably more like 3 minutes, I tanked the sentries while my pathetic drones orbitted the helpless enyo.
Long story short, at 52ms he finaly made it to the gate and jumped. Im sure he was laughing at me.
Shouldnt drones, yes EVEN heavies, hit if the target is sitting "still"??
I've noticed that webbing frigs causes heavies to hit less, so use mediums instead, pack a drone tracking mod, or don't web. Their orbits are too tight to hit.
You can see this in PvE as well, it's not new, and it's definately "functioning as intended". There should be a reason for packing smaller drones for smaller targets, instead of loading up only on heavies and being effective across all ship classes.
"Maya Rkell is my online stalker." |
Audri Fisher
Caldari
The Keep
THE R0CK
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:51:00 -
[17]
heavy drones cannot hit frigs very well if the frigs are webbed...
If you had turned off your webber, chances are, that enyo would have been toast.
If you still can't kill it, consider useing one of the many great antifrig platforms out there. Some can even tank sentries for a good long while.....
|
xenodia
Gallente
RONA Corporation
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:55:00 -
[18]
Originally by: LaCoHa
Um.... I am actually a bit angered by the fact that i lost an enyo kill today because my Heavy drones refused to hit the very webbed ship.
They hit on approach, but for what felt like forever, propably more like 3 minutes, I tanked the sentries while my pathetic drones orbitted the helpless enyo.
Long story short, at 52ms he finaly made it to the gate and jumped. Im sure he was laughing at me.
Shouldnt drones, yes EVEN heavies, hit if the target is sitting "still"??
Just out of curiosity.... what level is your drone sharpshooting at ? And are you positive they were missing, and the enyo wasnt simply tanking them ? Which type of drones were they ?
Because if you were shooting an enyo with wasps or ogres, chances are they WERE hitting, and you just didnt have enough damage to break the enyos tank because you were hitting his resists. Even if you were using berserkers, he could easily have had an explosive hardener on to plug his resist hole.
The enyo is a ver hardy little ship if set up for it (as long as its not nossed). In a big 3 way furball a couple weeks ago, I was in my enyo and tanked a raven and about 5 t1 frigates long enough for my gang mates to kill them all (we were all in frigates/ceptors/AFs). They simply couldnt do enough damage to break the tank, and the only reason they finally started to was that one of them got a clue and put a couple NOS on me. By then it was too late though as most of their frigates were dead and the raven followed not long behind.
This signature space for rent |
xenodia
Gallente
RONA Corporation
|
Posted - 2006.10.12 23:57:00 -
[19]
Originally by: LaCoHa
Originally by: Pan Crastus
Yes, drones are broken. They orbit too fast for their own tracking.
Amen brother! Thats what I was trying to say, but it is getting late here, and my brain isnt working at 100%
Easy solution to that is to recall them to your ship, and then send them back again when they get halfway there. Then rinse and repeat once they start missing or hitting for less again.
This signature space for rent |
Awox
Minmatar
Corsets and Carebears
Whips and Chains
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 00:08:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Awox on 13/10/2006 00:10:45
Edit: To Summarise,
-ecm jammer
+target painter
-nosferatu
+small railgun
or..
Use smaller drones. Can't use smaller drones? Use a turret boat. 
|
Hllaxiu
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 00:31:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Hllaxiu on 13/10/2006 00:31:31
Originally by: Awox
Use smaller drones. Can't use smaller drones? Use a turret boat.
Smaller drones can't hit anything while in orbit either. Heck, I'm happy when they actually orbit me inside scoop range!
(Yeah, I know that last one was fixed a while ago)
---
Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson |
Elliott Manchild
omen.
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 00:59:00 -
[22]
How i kill frigs with heavy drones :)
Attack
return and orbit
Attack
return and orbit
they always hit on the approach and t2 heavies + max skills only take a few times to pop any frigs.
|
Flesh Eater
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 02:26:00 -
[23]
Why don't you web the target frig AND your own heavy drones?
|
Adoran Wa'alle
Caldari
Herzfall Armory
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 05:22:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Flesh Eater
Why don't you web the target frig AND your own heavy drones?
If you web one of your drones, the other drones will start attacking it. Not a very effective tactic 
-------------------------------------
CEO, Herzfall Armory |
Rorix Whitecloud
Caldari
Eve Defence Force
Ascendant Frontier
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 06:20:00 -
[25]
if you try to shoot at optimal while orbiting in a, say, Ranis, with T2 neutrons, you'd find that you will miss quite a bit too. Small guns doesnt mean that you can hit everything at optimal while orbiting.
Sig pic too old... and lost the template during reformatting (doh!)
Goal: To blaster-fit every Caldari ship that has a turret slot.
~I don't remember. That's the second thing they teach you. |
CptEagle
Gallente
Stargate Command...
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 08:21:00 -
[26]
My Vespa II's medium drones dont hit webbed npc inty's either, they do hit em if its not webbed. I wish we could set drone orbit speed ourself.
|
Ripline
FinFleet
Lotka Volterra
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 08:31:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Elliott Manchild
How i kill frigs with heavy drones :)
Attack
return and orbit
Attack
return and orbit
they always hit on the approach and t2 heavies + max skills only take a few times to pop any frigs.
And we have a winner here. Admittedly it's still not very effective but with good skills heavies don't really need to hit that many times either.
|
Laythun
Undercover Brothers
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 09:24:00 -
[28]
right.
For all u nub hats the athink heavy drones should hit frigs easily. reality check
NO HEAVY WEAPON SYSTEM SHOULD PWN ALL CLASSES OF SHIPS.
the fact that heavies can is broken, drones were changed a while ago to try and make them more akin to the other weapons systems, and i dont think they went far enough.
Heavy drones should NOT be the only option to kill all. if so we may aswell rebuff torps to pwn ceptors and frigs again.
Heavies should have a damn hard time of hitting frigs whether moving or not.
Proud Member of the Anti Whine 14 |
Khajit Smitty
Minmatar
MisFunk Inc.
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 09:41:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Khajit Smitty on 13/10/2006 09:42:43
Tracking is broken, the mathematics around it are broken.
Dont believe me, fine, jump in a rapier, toss 4 webbs on it with 3x 720mm or even 650mm Artillery projectiles then webby an inteceptor,shuttle,t1 frigate once that is done. Start orbitting the target and whatch your lovely turrets miss 9 out of 10 times.
Fine you dont believe me, you got unlucky, no worries. Do the same on the same target EXCEPT this time stop your ship, dont move, dont orbit.... just sit there, and watch your lovely turrets rip that poor target to absolute shreds.
Oh and 4 webbys on a target = 0m/s.
DO NOT RESPOND ANY FURTHER UNLESS YOU HAVE DONE THIS TEST IN THE GAME !!!!
|
marioman
Caldari
Eye of God
Axiom Empire
|
Posted - 2006.10.13 09:53:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Laythun
right.
For all u nub hats the athink heavy drones should hit frigs easily. reality check
NO HEAVY WEAPON SYSTEM SHOULD PWN ALL CLASSES OF SHIPS.
the fact that heavies can is broken, drones were changed a while ago to try and make them more akin to the other weapons systems, and i dont think they went far enough.
Heavy drones should NOT be the only option to kill all. if so we may aswell rebuff torps to pwn ceptors and frigs again.
Heavies should have a damn hard time of hitting frigs whether moving or not.
I can 1 volley a ceptor in my blastathron with 7x t2 neutrons using an x-5 proto web and 5x SW-900 web drones....why cant my heavies in my domi even lay a scratch on a ceptor webbed with 2 webs?
|
| |
|
| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |