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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:06:00 -
[1]
How about an active resist module that RANDOMLY selects a resist each time it's activated ?
"Well, that can't be good for anything, dammit !" you might be tempted to say... but what if this module was BETTER in "raw numbers" than one active hardner ?
Take an invul field. Or take one EANM II with maxed out compensations. Base is 25% to all resists (+33% effectiveness vs all damages). Stack four of them and you barely get over 50% to all resists (double effectiveness).
Now, consider a T1 active hardner. 50% resist. +100% effectiveness. Use one of each, and you get the same overall effect as four invuls, for half the power. Yikes.
T2 invul fields are a bit nicer. You almost get 60% to all resists with four of them, while one of each T2 hardners get you 55%.
Now, on to 8 invuls (what?). Obviously, about the same as with four.
What about 2 of each hardner ? Hmmz, well, actually, almost 72% with T1s and over 76% with T2s. Wow.
So, what about ONE MODULE that gives you 70% to a RANDOM resist each cycle for T1, and 75% for T2 ?
Well, or 75% and 80% even. It's random each cycle, you know ? ;)
Statistically speaking, you might get almost the same average results as with hardners, BUT it's only meaningfull if you have a large number of them fitted in the first place, to make sure you cover the resist you want.
In other words, almost useless in PvE... but either a doombringer or a lifesaver in PvP... depending on enemy damage and your own luck.
Stupid module, or would you use it ?
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Always question everything. Including yourself. |
Guurzak
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:12:00 -
[2]
Bad idea. If it were good enough to be worth fitting, then it would turn battles into dicerolling fests rather than skillbased competitions. I'd rather win or lose on my own merits than flip a coin.
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Ishmael Hansen
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:12:00 -
[3]
Question is, why would you use it? You would build a gun that would make random damage types 
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:16:00 -
[4]
Hmmz... flip a coin...
Oh, you mean like EW "maybe it jams, maybe it doesn't" ?
Or like "glancing blow" vs "wrecking shot" ?
What about blasters/ACs "fighting around or above optimal+falloff, just because my optimal is diddly squat" ?
EVE is full of coin tosses already.
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Always question everything. Including yourself. |
Woopie
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:16:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: Guurzak
Bad idea. If it were good enough to be worth fitting, then it would turn battles into dicerolling fests rather than skillbased competitions. I'd rather win or lose on my own merits than flip a coin.
Indeed, ECM is bad enough already.
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Pestillence
Chav-Scum
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:34:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Akita T
Or like "glancing blow" vs "wrecking shot" ?
Bad example, you fire so much in a fight that the glances off are offset by excellent hits giving you a pretty good "average" over the course of a fight.
As a general rule chance based stuff sucks. Who wants to lose their hard bought ship because of a random number generator?
There are enough uncertainties in EvE without resorting to the role of a dice for modules.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:38:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Pestillence
Originally by: Akita T
Or like "glancing blow" vs "wrecking shot" ?
Bad example, you fire so much in a fight that the glances off are offset by excellent hits giving you a pretty good "average" over the course of a fight.
As a general rule chance based stuff sucks. Who wants to lose their hard bought ship because of a random number generator?
There are enough uncertainties in EvE without resorting to the role of a dice for modules.
Uh, I really, really fail to see the difference.
Heck, they're actually almost the SAME thing.
One deals less or more damage (no idea how much less minimum, but wrecking is *3 average/normal damage), AT RANDOM, but with an average of *1 of "normal" damage.
My "proposed module" does the exact opposite... you have a 1 out of 4 chances to receive 1/4 or 1/5 damage for each module during each cycle for each damage type. Overall, same damage received over time as if you had a mix of hardners.
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Always question everything. Including yourself. |
Shamis Orzoz
SniggWaffe
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:45:00 -
[8]
random mods are dumb.
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Derrios
Dirty Deeds Corp.
Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:49:00 -
[9]
Yah well jam strength vs sensor strength = chance to jam.
yah its random, but what would u rather make it?
Jam = yes or Jam = no?
-----------------------------------------------
Originally by: wierchas noobhunter
hmm blowing ascn carebears in empire ?
can i join ?
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Dr Fighter
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Posted - 2006.10.13 17:58:00 -
[10]
The idea of random effects destorys the illousion of skill.
And the fact that ccp moved ECM to random luck or what ever, make me sick. Thank god ECCM was boosted, or i would hav given up pvp a long time ago.
So to recap, Random = bad. I cant train a skill to be more lucky, a ECM guy can train to be more lucky with jamming.
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Ishquar Teh'Sainte
Euphoria Released
Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2006.10.13 18:00:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Ishquar Teh''Sainte on 13/10/2006 18:00:16
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Pestillence
Originally by: Akita T
Or like "glancing blow" vs "wrecking shot" ?
Bad example, you fire so much in a fight that the glances off are offset by excellent hits giving you a pretty good "average" over the course of a fight.
As a general rule chance based stuff sucks. Who wants to lose their hard bought ship because of a random number generator?
There are enough uncertainties in EvE without resorting to the role of a dice for modules.
Uh, I really, really fail to see the difference.
Heck, they're actually almost the SAME thing.
no they are not - you can affect the "quality" of your shots ... minimize transversal/gettting better tracking, getting into optimal range, boosting the signature of your target (targetpainter) .. your target boosting it's own signature (mwd, shield extender) ..
while ECM is mainly: lock target - activate ECM mod - hope it hits.
___________________
-Skellibjalla- Life is a garden of perceptions. Pick your fruit.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2006.10.13 18:16:00 -
[12]
You CAN'T affect quality of shots significantly after a certain point.
Sit perfectly still, shoot at a huge, immobile target at optimal range. Like, say, a GSC ?
See how many wrecking shots you get, and how much average damage you deal over time.
And this specific module, WHILE somewhat luck-based, by its very nature is much LESS luck-dependant as, say, any ECM.
It is just as luck dependant as quality of hits, actually.
Where you replace the word "turret" with the word "my proposed module".
That is, either given enough time, or given enough modules running on yourself.
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Always question everything. Including yourself. |
Ishquar Teh'Sainte
Euphoria Released
Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2006.10.13 18:21:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Akita T
You CAN'T affect quality of shots significantly after a certain point.
you answered it by yourself - yes .. at a certain point you can't affect it anymore ... but 'til your reach this point you can.
while your proposed module (like ECM) has zero margin to affect it .. it's to 100% luck based.
80% luck based and 20% affected is still substantial better than 100% luck based.
___________________
-Skellibjalla- Life is a garden of perceptions. Pick your fruit.
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Pestillence
Chav-Scum
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Posted - 2006.10.13 19:13:00 -
[14]
You do what so many people do.
You nitpick the fine details of my example but miss the main point made.
LET SKILL DECIDE, NOT THE ROLL OF A DICE.
Anyway, to be pedantic, the guns vs Ewar is very different. Guns fire with far more frequency than ewar cycles. A miss with a gun is not catastophic, in fact, it can go unnoticed. A missed EWAR cycle can turn a battle. Also, guns are not all or nothing like ewar is. A glancing blow still deals damage.
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Vincent Almasy
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Posted - 2006.10.13 20:10:00 -
[15]
ok, i'll let you have this mod if it strips the power form your other resists aswell as it takes up massive amount of space or high cap as it is not a passive took but a active. say your great with 80%, for lets say exp, resist for 15sec but then for the next atleast 15sec your have 0% resist, because what resist you had would be put into the new resist. Lets see who would really use that mod in pvp or pve, if it's not predictable it is useless, EW is a chance yes as your foe influences it because if it was a 100% it would be a "I WIN BUTTON". Being a Gallente I do atleast 2 damage types, Thermic and Kinetic, with drones I could possible preform Explosive aswell, so please let this mod go though and let me pop the fools who use it.
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