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The Degrading Lack of Balls

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mishkof Caldari Emerald Empire Muffins of Mayhem	Posted - 2006.10.15 09:27:00 - [31] Originally by: SavageThrash Edited by: SavageThrash on 15/10/2006 04:06:17 I've recently been taking a look through out my employment history noting different dates and lenths of time in corps. The one thing that has caught me by surprise is I was in 0.4 and below within 3 months of starting eve. Now I have taken a look at a lot of the ever expanding population of eve only to notice that alot of pvpers in 0.4 and below are of my age or a little older. Vary rarley do a find someone younger then me (often if i do its by 1 month or so). This disturbs me a lot considering the amount of carebears in highsec, lagging out jita and causing the implementation of system jump qeues. One question that deeply intrigues me is why have all the people in eve lost there testosterone making organs (much respect for those few female pilots i see out here in 0.0 and the like) and stopped coming to low sec? What has happened to the bravery of coming into low sec and defending yourself? Why the stabs and logging of after jumping to save ur oh so precious raven? Why cant you stand to fight. Were not better then you, wow we may have a 2% damage increase in our guns over you that we spend 15 days for, or we can track you 3% better. Your not confined to stay in high sec. Were not out to "OMGWTFPWN" you everytime you step into lowsec. We want to kill you because your simple lack of bravery and use of stabs. Heck we want new friends out here to pvp with. All pvpers in low sec can benefit from newer players to pvp with. You dont need to sit in 1.0 and make 5 billion isk before u decided to set foot into 0.4 with your fully faction CnR thinking that its extra laucher will compensate for your lack of lvl 5 warhead upgrades. Just show your face here and earn soem respect. Unfit those stabs, get a real pvp fit and come join us here. Build eve and strengthen the community as currently the lowsec adn 0.0 pvp community is degrading. People are leaving. Theres a massive of pvpers and people who want to actully pvp in lowsec not just run away, finish there mission one jump out of highsec and run back home on insta to where its safe. I can gaurentee that if you showed some balls and come out to fight decently you would all enjoy it much more then running away in half assed fitted ships making us come chase u dont with 6 scrams to stop you from warping. Its honestly no fun havign to chase people down to get a kill when if there were properly fitted they could easily take us. We have no special talent that you dont posses, we just fit to fight and if all you people hiding away in high sec did that to we could all have a riot out here. Its more fun to fight fights that peopel want to fight and neither side knows who will win. Gankign is lame and boring, please stop making us do it to get kills. We kill because thats what fuels eve and with out who would need to maek new shisp to sell. Who would make eve continue to turn? Someoen has to die to keep eve moving, and we want to have fun doing it because frankly i am bored with kiling people over and over that think they have no chance to have a fair fight. Were all willing to fight fair out here and its more fun. Please come join us out here adn get out of high sec. Savage - Just a post before I decide what to do with my short remaining life in eve online. Dumbest post ever(and I have low standards). Can I have your stuff? If you are having such problems quit the gate camping, what do you seriously expect? Try fighting people with the same amount of "balls" that you are asking them to have and you may have more luck.
Snake Jankins Minmatar Veritas Immortalis	Posted - 2006.10.15 10:30:00 - [32] I was a mission runner in the beginning. One of my lvl.2 agents was in 0.2 aeditide on the egbinger route into 0.0 (Great Wildlands). I lived there quite some time without problems and did my missions in peace. But the population was also a lot lower. I knew the 2 or 3 dangerous people, who appeared in local every few days or so and that was it. The CA travelling to 0.0 usually left me alone. The population far away from the highway systems was even so low, that you could have a system in 0.6 with omber and a station mostly for yourself. I mined for my first ships. ___________ 'Only ships can be assembled, this is a Frigate.'
losmandy	Posted - 2006.10.15 10:36:00 - [33] Gate camps.
Eewec Ourbyni Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.15 11:19:00 - [34] Originally by: SavageThrash People who stay huddled in high sec should come out. Please come out, even if you have had a bad experiance. I want more real fights. Im tired of ganking people and chasign them down cause they dont want to fight. Thats one of the reasons i am leaving eve is beacuse its to ganky. Eve needs gate camps to be fixed. Ganking is boring and it sucks overall. No skill just the advantage of the other people coming into the system being unprepared. And yet time and again since that post you keep saying it's not about you ganking folks... you even said you don't ganmk folks several times since then.... be consistent about it at least. This is a sig... -- You think this guys post is nuts.... you should see his bio -- ... good, ain't it!
Elgar Lightfoot Lightfoot Industries	Posted - 2006.10.15 11:30:00 - [35] The reason we are all still in high security space is because we don't feel like handing you more targets to gank. The gank fests at gates prevent most from going there. It doesn't matter what you are flying, the gate ganks attack everyone, even pods (no cargo). It might be a different matter if it were fair fights, but cowards that gate gank do so purely because they know they'll outnumber the competition and there will be no chance of them losing (or very, very little). Some helpfull players have written tutorials on how to enter and stay in 0.0, but all of those include paying extortionate prices for instas that still take us through these gate ganks. Remove gate ganks so the fights have a chance of being fair and you'd see a HUGE influx of noobs into 0.0. Heck I'd fly down in my Thorax. I'd even go in a Catalyst for a fair fight.
Raynaar Amarr Intergalactic Mining And Trade Corp.	Posted - 2006.10.15 11:33:00 - [36] Originally by: Beffanie I've been playing for about 2 weeks. I've tried entering low sec space a number of times and it's always been the same result: instant death at a gate. I think the last one was in Mara. As soon as I warped to another gate to see what was in the next system, I had to wait forever to come out of warp because there was so much stuff around the gate. I didn't even get click anywhere to warp away. I was instantly locked by one of the 5 or 6 red flashing pilots and lost my ship. while it was exploding my pod was locked and shot. Something similar has happened every single time I enter .4 or lower. To tell the truth, I'm not even sure if I've been lower than .4. whatever low sec places there are around my starter system are where i get killed. I've tried asking for help to get past places like this, but nobody's willing to unless I pay but I have almost no money. The one time a group of people offered to help me, they blew me up after I joined thier group. I don't have a choice but to stay in high sec space and try to run missions, but that doesn't pay very well and the higher level agents I can access can only be gotten to by moving through low sec space to the high sec systems they are in. I'm trying my best, but I know that even if I train for a year, I can't beat 5 on 1 odds around the gates. Beff, Contact me in game via Evemail if you want to have a good experience with this game. We operate in high sec, low sec, and 0.0. We mine, run missions, trade, rat, and pvp... basically we do a bit of everything. This isn't a 'standard' bullcrap recruitment thread. I just hate reading posts like the one you made outlining how newer players find themselves in the wrong crowd and thereby get constantly owned or otherwise screwed. It doesn't in any way help the game that I and my friends love. Drop us a line, and we'll give you some help. Best regards, Ray
Miss Overlord Gallente EUROPEANS	Posted - 2006.10.15 11:41:00 - [37] be good to the corp the corp should be good back to u get up to no good and u get a reputation a bit like RL really
Fei Liu	Posted - 2006.10.15 11:55:00 - [38] That's funny because I had the feeling that pvper's and pirates in low sec were the cowards of EVE (many of them at least). I'm still new, I'm not rich nor very skilled or experienced. I lost a few ships, implants and clones to low sec gatecamp of course. But with a little feedback form older players, they become a minor annoyance. But my point is that I've made quite a few retribution ops with friends as experienced as me (and that's not much). Obviously it's uneasy to break a BS gatecamp with 2,3 or 4 T1 cruisers but we managed to engage several pirates solo or duo,whic were flying sniper BS, or T2 ships around gates or in belts. And those "pirates" almost always flee or go dock if they face a 2vs1 or 3vs2 situation against T1 ships and players less than half or a third their age in EVE Their most daring move are calling friends to get overwhelming numerical advantage and at least one force recon ship So to the OP : Maybe you seek fair fights in low sec, but you're a dying breed. The norm there is gatecamping and one sided fights... Too bad for both of us . And that's also why people often choose to avoid low sec : It's not a wonderful new land, full of dangers but where you can carve you're own piece of wealth and history against other knights. It's a shady neighboorhood full of thugs avoiding carefully anyone except helpless lost peoples to stab them in the back (And I like it that way ,thx) PS : I say nothing about 0.0, as I'm still discovering how's life out there PS 2 : Just a tip to the OP : try fitting a minig laser on you're pvp ship and looking like an innocent BS miner, you may be lucky, get ganked and a nice fight Just hope they won't bring 2 navy issue BS and a force recon (you may also consider fitting wcs just in case )
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2006.10.15 12:41:00 - [39] Edited by: Venkul Mul on 15/10/2006 12:43:12 Edited by: Venkul Mul on 15/10/2006 12:42:10 I have 6 month of life and little 0.0 experience. Only travellin through, nost staying there. But: 1) gatecamps: I have meet a good number of them, both in low sec and 0.0, with 1 exception there where always 3+ ships, so where is the "fair fight" ? a frigate against 3 BS (my fisrt encounter)? A cruiser against 4 T2 ships? 2) Stabbers: yes I mount them, and as I sayd to the pirate asking indignated "You mount stabbers [on a Iteron]?" my reply is "Yes, you don't?" 3) You have 6 month and don't want to play war with me: exactly, I have six month, and of my 7 million skill points 3 are in science skill, 1,5 in industrial and anoter 2 million in learning. I can fly decently a BC. Why I should play gunslinger when I am interested in playing mad scentist? 4) pod killing: reading the forum I find references to people ransoming the pod and maybe some of your stuff back, never meet one person doing that. It is always kill the ship (acceptable, you get loot) kill the pod. Comment by a pirate aI know: "It is so nice the sound when you squish them." 5) We have only a 2% more in some skill we aren't unbeatable. Maybe you, but most of your mates have plenty of money and buy all t2/faction/officer items, and all those "little" 2% stack. To sum it up you ask: came to play on my ground, with my rules, against me and my friends, if you don't do that you are a coward. Fossi scemo. (to translate: I am not an idiot).
SavageThrash 0utbreak	Posted - 2006.10.15 12:46:00 - [40] Well i have read all of your posts through and it leads me to one thing like evistin stated. Its mostly because teh newer population of eve hasnt been exposed to the way low sec really is once your past the gate camps. And yet time and again since that post you keep saying it's not about you ganking folks. No ewec its not about ganking folks and sure read my bio I fought and ganked people in the past and i can see why that gives a bad impression. TBH i havent ganked anyone for atleast 4 months and its changed my perspective. I want more people to enjoy low sec. Its not about me gettign you to 0.0 and killing you its the point that most people would find low sec more fun if theyed come out and tryed it. I can understand that some people simply dont want pvp. They enjoy empire more and like hanging with friends. But to the people that want low sec but only get ganked and such as they try to make it through choke systems, i urge you ot try and make it past teh chokes and see what low sec can really be aside from ganking. sorry i had to cut this post short. Savage snip Please do not discuss moderation in your signature -Eldo Woah^^^

Del369 Caldari Office linebackers Blood of the Innocents	Posted - 2006.10.15 12:47:00 - [41] Originally by: Beffanie I've been playing for about 2 weeks. I've tried entering low sec space a number of times and it's always been the same result: instant death at a gate. I think the last one was in Mara. As soon as I warped to another gate to see what was in the next system, I had to wait forever to come out of warp because there was so much stuff around the gate. I didn't even get click anywhere to warp away. I was instantly locked by one of the 5 or 6 red flashing pilots and lost my ship. while it was exploding my pod was locked and shot. Something similar has happened every single time I enter .4 or lower. To tell the truth, I'm not even sure if I've been lower than .4. whatever low sec places there are around my starter system are where i get killed. I've tried asking for help to get past places like this, but nobody's willing to unless I pay but I have almost no money. The one time a group of people offered to help me, they blew me up after I joined thier group. I don't have a choice but to stay in high sec space and try to run missions, but that doesn't pay very well and the higher level agents I can access can only be gotten to by moving through low sec space to the high sec systems they are in. I'm trying my best, but I know that even if I train for a year, I can't beat 5 on 1 odds around the gates. Been there, done that, depending what race you are hang around the main noob systems for a few months, do the missions there, get skilled up, learn about instas how to make them etc, make some friends (but trust no one lol) it'll come together. I want to die quietly in my sleep just like my dear old grandma, and not screaming in terror like her passengers!!
Grimpak Gallente Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.10.15 12:50:00 - [42] Originally by: Reckless Eddie Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker only way to draw people into low sec is to push CCP to nerf the gate camp. or they could just have concord gank everyone in sight ...or we could nerf piracy even more tbh, only way I'm seeing more people going to low sec is to nerf hi-sec empire. risk vs reward. oh and there is a misconception about low-sec gatecamping, since not all low-sec entries are camped, and there are tools to avoid such thing too btw (omfg use the map!). ------- Originally by: Abdalion Originally by: Jebidus Skari What, in EVE, is a Tyrant? Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
Sorja E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2006.10.15 12:52:00 - [43] It's far more profitable and far less dangerous to carebear in 0.0 Most empire dwellers simply don't realize how many carebears live in 0.0 ____________________ Darko1107 > does anything in ascn space have tech II fittings? Quillan Rage > Iron ships
Elgar1 Lightfoot Industries	Posted - 2006.10.15 13:09:00 - [44] Originally by: Grimpak tbh, only way I'm seeing more people going to low sec is to nerf hi-sec empire. risk vs reward. oh and there is a misconception about low-sec gatecamping, since not all low-sec entries are camped, and there are tools to avoid such thing too btw (omfg use the map!). Nerfing high Sec in an attempt to FORCE players in low sec won't work. For one I'd quit as would many others. Fix the gate camps and THEN players will venture into low sec space. Find some way to make gate camping impossible. Pirate all you like out in space, but at a gate it needs to be fair. Most players won't even venture near low sec because they've heard about the gate camps. Most have never seen or experienced one, but hearing about it is enough to deter them. That and that alone is what keeps many players out of low sec.
Jenny Spitfire Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.15 13:29:00 - [45] Originally by: Elgar1 Most players won't even venture near low sec because they've heard about the gate camps. Most have never seen or experienced one, but hearing about it is enough to deter them. That and that alone is what keeps many players out of low sec. This is the problem. So-called vets in noobcorps giving bad advices. --------- Cruelty is God's way of showing kindness and God is kind. Minmatar Hate Club.
Mr Popov Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.15 13:33:00 - [46] Faswiba is 0.4 and I would consider it safer than some hub systems.
Scagga Laebetrovo Veto.	Posted - 2006.10.15 13:38:00 - [47] Gatecamping requires less balls than trying to pass through one.
Viktor Fyretracker Caldari Worms Corp	Posted - 2006.10.15 13:41:00 - [48] stacked with WCS and Nanos and charging a gate camp at 1000m/s+ is more ballsy then the camper will ever have, its why they are gate camping infact because pirates with balls hit up the belts where they just might loose the fight.
Scagga Laebetrovo Veto.	Posted - 2006.10.15 13:46:00 - [49] Edited by: Scagga Laebetrovo on 15/10/2006 13:47:19 Hi-sec residents should try taking down -10 gatecamps - the sentries will be on your side, and you can take them (edit: the campers) down one by one. The enemy cannot use small inties or af's to tackle due to risk of instapoppage - as the attacker, you can. Doing this isn't as hard as it sounds, and you'll probably bag quite good loot :
vanBuskirk Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.15 13:47:00 - [50] Nobody else has mentioned this so I will. Mission runners: Some of them are pretty damn tough against rats, even when not using faction mods. But PvE is all about tanking vast amounts of damage from huge numbers of rats, at least in level 4 it is. ECM doesn't work. NOS doesn't work properly. Some of the rats use ECM of one sort or another, but it's easy enough to counter, and I have never heard of them using NOS. Simply put, PvE is very little like PvP, and a good fitting for one is utter garbage for the other (example; very few people fit plates on mission BS). The AI of mission rats isn't good enough, and it may be impossible for it to be good enough, so the designers compensate with enormous firepower. Player pirates generally have less firepower but more intelligence. One small example; rats often drop smartbombs. Has anyone ever seen them using the things? A solution would be less rats with much better AI. But it isn't going to happen. Do missions in groups? Sure. But then the rewards are so pitiful (due to endless nerfing over the years) that it isn't worth the effort and risk. Mining in lowsec: Do me a favour. All the guards in the world won't help you if the pirate decides to target a hauler or barge first. it is quite literally impossible to defend a vulnerable ship - in the sense that in RL antiaircraft and antimissile ships are tasked with defending a carrier, for example. ---------------------------------------------- "Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent." ----------------------------------------------

Grimpak Gallente Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier	Posted - 2006.10.15 13:49:00 - [51] Edited by: Grimpak on 15/10/2006 13:51:40 Originally by: Elgar1 Originally by: Grimpak tbh, only way I'm seeing more people going to low sec is to nerf hi-sec empire. risk vs reward. oh and there is a misconception about low-sec gatecamping, since not all low-sec entries are camped, and there are tools to avoid such thing too btw (omfg use the map!). Nerfing high Sec in an attempt to FORCE players in low sec won't work. For one I'd quit as would many others. Fix the gate camps and THEN players will venture into low sec space. Find some way to make gate camping impossible. Pirate all you like out in space, but at a gate it needs to be fair. Most players won't even venture near low sec because they've heard about the gate camps. Most have never seen or experienced one, but hearing about it is enough to deter them. That and that alone is what keeps many players out of low sec. as I said, some people in hi-sec think that all low-sec is riddled of pirates. And today's gate camping is basically the by-product of CCP's attempt to make eve safer. I lived in low-sec on my first year of EVE, and I tell you this: usage of the map and less-known entry points = win. heck I even know of low-sec systems that are safer than hi-sec, considering how rampant the hi-sec pirating is today. ------- Originally by: Abdalion Originally by: Jebidus Skari What, in EVE, is a Tyrant? Me. Especially when it comes to troll threads.
Raquel Smith Caldari Ferengi Commerce Authority	Posted - 2006.10.15 14:04:00 - [52] Originally by: SavageThrash One question that deeply intrigues me is why have all the people in eve lost there testosterone making organs (much respect for those few female pilots i see out here in 0.0 and the like) and stopped coming to low sec? I don't get off on ruining other players' day.
vile56 Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.10.15 14:09:00 - [53] the problem is vlill has always had a lack of targets
Xs 142	Posted - 2006.10.15 14:13:00 - [54] So you have something against female players then? Show us your true colours Originally by:* Oveur Eternally yours, The other dumbass
Elgar1 Lightfoot Industries	Posted - 2006.10.15 14:18:00 - [55] Originally by: Grimpak as I said, some people in hi-sec think that all low-sec is riddled of pirates. And today's gate camping is basically the by-product of CCP's attempt to make eve safer. I lived in low-sec on my first year of EVE, and I tell you this: usage of the map and less-known entry points = win. heck I even know of low-sec systems that are safer than hi-sec, considering how rampant the hi-sec pirating is today. But your knowledge isn't going to get more players into low Sec. Only the sure knowledge that there is NO gate ganking.
Lisento Slaven Amarr The Drekla Consortium New Eve Order	Posted - 2006.10.15 14:46:00 - [56] I think the reason most people don't go into low sec (that often...EVERYONE goes in there eventually) is because they don't want to lose their stuff. What is one way to prevent losing your stuff? Warp core stabs and a little hope! Or instas... I don't think pirates want to lose their ships either. I never fit WCS on ships I don't carea bout. I put them on ships I don't feel comfortable losing usually =P That's because I don't make any money pretty much. --- Lisento Slaven wants to be a Space Whaler in EVE. Put in space whales!
MissileRus	Posted - 2006.10.15 14:53:00 - [57] Edited by: MissileRus on 15/10/2006 14:56:35 tbh pirates shouldnt blobb. make it less chance to leave any loot at all depending how many ships are shooting you. bubbles are fine, their a bit to easy to set up anywhere though. imo i would like bubbles only to be usable between planets/gates etc. not at them. with defensive stuff comming for the people that have sov systems this shouldnt matter mutch, only 0.0 would get more inviting and fights would be moved away from the gates a bit more. blobbing at gates is to beneficial and risk free tbh. this isnt about bigger alliances, they will get their goodies in a kali patch. bounty hunters should hunt pirates, thet professions is almost non-existing, but its getting love. pirates can be pirates, but pirates today are blobbs. bounty hunters usualy are lone so pirates have no real counter and more and more are becomming pirates pirate profession does not need a boost, gate camping needs a nerf, fighting inside systems needs a boost, and bounty hunters needs a boost to hunt pirates and getting more rewarded for it. edit: ok.. pirates needs a boost, but the right kind. --------------------------- 4. i like pizza
Elgar1 Lightfoot Industries	Posted - 2006.10.15 14:57:00 - [58] ^ totally agree.
Nebuli Caldari Art of War Cult of War	Posted - 2006.10.15 15:04:00 - [59] Havnt read the whole thread so forgive me if any of this has been said already. First off im a 2003 player, started a few weeks after release, took about 2 weeks to mine for a blackbird then joined a pirate 0.0 corp, which didnt pirate much while I was with them due to the great northern war (the first one) they were part of, with Tagart transdimensional vs Jade constantine etc. Now I have lived out in 0.0 pretty much the whole time, scratching a living killing NPCs etc. I'm a poor player, I dont have billions of ISK, I've never had a faction ship, I do have a tech II torp BPO which makes me a bit, but not much. I've only ever broke a billion isk twice. Why is this you ask? because 0.0 sucks for making ISK frankly, each region can have anything between none and several systems that are actualy worth a damn, I'd say on average a 0.0 region has three systems that are worth anything, decent ore, low sec for good rats etc, the rest of it is completely rubbish, good for nothing crap space. Just to prove my point a little, I was down to 50mil ISK a few weeks back, spent 3 days rattring and made about 100mil, if that, rubbish. So this week, having only ever run missions once before for about 3 weeks to help a newbie friend out decided to go and use a lv4 I could use but never had before. Guess what? 4 days and I've made about 600mil!!! About 7 +4 implants, loads of +3's, Dread guristas siege launcher, some hardwiring thing worth 90mil, its insane. This I believe is a big part of why people dont go to 0.0, there is NO INCENTIVE to go and live in 0.0. From now on I shall go live in 0.0 to pvp as I always have done, but now I'm going to head into nice safe cosy empire to make ISK, doesnt add up does it? CEO - Art of War
Big Al The Aftermath	Posted - 2006.10.15 15:04:00 - [60] There is no incentive to go to low sec, be you new or old. The minerals are generally crap, the rats are crap. The only reasons ANYONE would even bother with it are: Moon mining, mission running, and killing people. If you could make 10-20m/hr on a consistant basis ratting or mining in low sec it would be PACKED with targets. No one wants to risk their setups which they probably worked for weeks cobbling together to get blown up by a sad git sitting 150km off the gate just for the chance to make slightly better money than they could in empire. Either that or nerf the hell out of empire, maybe that would help fix the damn lag.



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