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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Tasty Burger	Posted - 2006.10.24 23:40:00 - [1] I can understand the falloff nerf, but why does it now do less damage than void/conflagration? Thats just unfair. With the falloff penalty an 800mm II now barely outranges a Neutron II, both with hail/void, has worse tracking, etc. This is fine if hail still did the same amount of damage. But now not only does the autocannon itself do less damage (because it uses no cap), the ammo does less too! Why is this? It's ridiculous! It makes an autocannon into a crappier, weaker blaster. (as a side note, please make projectile rounds smaller)
Garkaleth Amarr Staboholics Anonymous	Posted - 2006.10.24 23:59:00 - [2] It does less damage to compensate for the removal of the speed penality. IMO its a good change, it needed a different penality and at least Hail is worth using now. The blaster and pulse high damage ammo variants both have increased cap usage which is not viable for Hail.
Tasty Burger	Posted - 2006.10.25 00:42:00 - [3] Originally by: Garkaleth It does less damage to compensate for the removal of the speed penality. IMO its a good change, it needed a different penality and at least Hail is worth using now. The blaster and pulse high damage ammo variants both have increased cap usage which is not viable for Hail. It got a FALLOFF penalty to compensate for the velocity penalty, silly. It needs to do the same damage because otherwise hail just makes ACs into crappy blasters with worse tracking. And the cap use... that is balanced by the fact that autocannons do less damage in the first place. Equal ammo is just fair.
Fanzen	Posted - 2006.10.25 01:32:00 - [4] Hail now has half the tracking and one-third the falloff of Barrage, for 15% more damage... and you have to go into blaster range to use it o_O
Tasty Burger	Posted - 2006.10.25 01:40:00 - [5] Christ, I just noticed that Void only has a 25% tracking penalty compared to barrage at 50%... this is just ridiculous.
Copine Callmeknau The Splinter Syndicate SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.25 02:00:00 - [6] Hail just became the most useless T2 ammo in the game. Speed penalty was a non-issue on anything but a frig and a vaga. Now we can't use the ammo at all without being shredded by any blasterboat using Void. Restore all T2 ammo to how it was in RMR, the kali changes are pure **. Better that they are unbalanced in RMR than completely broken in Kali. -- Originally by:** RUNYOUFOOLS wrong on so many levels you could only be more wrong if you where tuxford.
Dahak2150	Posted - 2006.10.25 02:04:00 - [7] /emote hails thread. Sorry, I had to. ---------- My sig is boring.
Tasty Burger	Posted - 2006.10.25 04:05:00 - [8] nobody cares. It's great being Minmatar, ain't it?
Ath Amon	Posted - 2006.10.25 04:57:00 - [9] Originally by: Tasty Burger nobody cares. i care.... but i stopped to complain about large ACs somemonths ago... looked in all perspective they are just crap... but they use no cap!!! ohhhh they are uber!!!!
Karn Mithralia Minmatar Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2006.10.25 05:46:00 - [10] Edited by: Karn Mithralia on 25/10/2006 05:54:57 For agile ships with small/medium AC's it kinda makes sense, but for large AC's it sucks. The speed penalty was totally able to be worked with, need speed/flexibility, use barrage, need heavy dps use hail. It was great in a stand up 'I really need dps now' fight. It actually gave an ACpest some grunt and added a lot of flavour by giving such a huge speed penalty. A nice balance IMO. Now its just a non-event with no real use, not enough DPS to warrant the narrow range it will work in. ----------------------------------------- Now recruiting.
Wrayeth Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.25 05:50:00 - [11] ** you, CCP. ** you. -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!" R.I.P. AC tempest R.I.P. Torp raven Thanks, CCP. R.I.P. My account, after the next cycle.
Tek'a Rain Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2006.10.25 05:53:00 - [12] your stuff, can I have it? come on people, is it really the end of the world? really? Blaque or Foiritan
Ephemeron Crimson Crusaders Knights Of the Southerncross	Posted - 2006.10.25 05:56:00 - [13] All t2 ammo got nerfed, especially the blaster one. Minmatar should consider themselves lucky, as the blasterboat is no longer a threat.
Dragy	Posted - 2006.10.25 05:56:00 - [14] Autopest with 3 dmg mods and nice skills ( all lvl4 related) could do around 800-900 raw dps ... now it really can't stand vs other ships ... thank you ccp. After training for naglfar, i'll go for gallente and caldari. large blasters II with rokh and hyperio 4tw.
Great Artista Veto.	Posted - 2006.10.25 05:56:00 - [15] Boohoo. Use barrage like I do. ___________________________________ ___________________________________
Wrayeth Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.25 05:57:00 - [16] Edited by: Wrayeth on 25/10/2006 05:58:05 Originally by: Tek'a Rain your stuff, can I have it? No. I won't have any stuff by the time my account runs out - I will have used it all. Quote: come on people, is it really the end of the world? really? Not by itself. Combined with all of the other changes, however, it's enough for me to cancel my account. The AC tempest will suck ass after the patch due to low DPS ships being more affected by an across-the-board hitpoint increase than high DPS ships, hail will suck even more, and the torp raven will be useless since javelins will now inflict less damage to any given ship class than tech 1 torpedos. ** this *. My account's getting cancelled once I've gone through all of my assets. I'm going to attempt to go out with a bang, though (knowing my luck) it'll be more like a thud. -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing* to this thread!" R.I.P. AC tempest R.I.P. Torp raven Thanks, CCP. R.I.P. My account, after the next cycle.
Tasty Burger	Posted - 2006.10.25 06:01:00 - [17] Originally by: Ephemeron All t2 ammo got nerfed, especially the blaster one. Minmatar should consider themselves lucky, as the blasterboat is no longer a threat. Not a threat? WTF? Null still tracks decently at those ranges, plus blasterthron tracking bonus. Void actually got BOOSTED with a tracking boost. Hail still has a 50% tracking penalty, AND does a bunch less damage than Void. Absolutely unacceptable. The velocity penalty went, and we got the falloff penalty, FINE. Making it weaker than void was TOTALLY UN-NECESSARY. Wrayeth, I feel your pain. It's great being Minmatar, ain't it?
dalman Finite Horizon	Posted - 2006.10.25 06:53:00 - [18] The T2 ammo is very poorly balanced :/ Just looking at blasters vs AC; Void is alot better than Hail. Barrage is alot better than Null. It's quite obvious that hardly no minmatar will use hail and no gallante will use null. Am I forced to have any regret? I've become the lie, beautiful and free In my righteous own mind I adore and preach the insanity you gave to me
Mila Prestoc	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:25:00 - [19] Edited by: Mila Prestoc on 25/10/2006 08:28:50 Speed penalty wasn't THAT bad, it was bad because it stacked! But tux doesn't want the ammo affecting the ship now, just the turret stats so its screwed unless he removes that general rule from his mind. I'd love to know why he lowered the damage AND range AND tracking so drastically? So we can only use it against BS's and hit? ------------------------- Originally by: "Lord Violent" EvE is slowly becoming a game for the stupid, catered to by devs as they lack ability to kill/survive anything.

Tuxford	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:26:00 - [20] Originally by: Tasty Burger Edited by: Tasty Burger on 24/10/2006 23:51:41 I can understand the falloff nerf, but why does it now do less damage than void/conflagration? Thats just unfair. With the falloff penalty an 800mm II now barely outranges a Neutron II, both with hail/void, has worse tracking, etc. This is fine if hail still did the same amount of damage. But now not only does the autocannon itself do less damage (because it uses no cap), the ammo does less too! Why is this? It's ridiculous! It makes an autocannon into a crappier, weaker blaster. And think about it: They boosted HP by 50%, and now they make our high damage ammo do less damage than the others? Ridiculous. (as a side note, please make projectile rounds smaller) Its not, I was playing around with numbers and forgot to actually update the last batch of changes. _______________

turnschuh Eye of God	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:30:00 - [21] I agree hail is useless now the speed penalty was ok but the tracking penalty is rediculos.
Max Teranous Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:32:00 - [22] People flying off the deep end based of numbers off a test server that's already shown to be work in progress = priceless Max --------------------
Druid R Murder of Crows E N I G M A	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:37:00 - [23] Originally by: Tuxford Originally by: Tasty Burger Edited by: Tasty Burger on 24/10/2006 23:51:41 I can understand the falloff nerf, but why does it now do less damage than void/conflagration? Thats just unfair. With the falloff penalty an 800mm II now barely outranges a Neutron II, both with hail/void, has worse tracking, etc. This is fine if hail still did the same amount of damage. But now not only does the autocannon itself do less damage (because it uses no cap), the ammo does less too! Why is this? It's ridiculous! It makes an autocannon into a crappier, weaker blaster. And think about it: They boosted HP by 50%, and now they make our high damage ammo do less damage than the others? Ridiculous. (as a side note, please make projectile rounds smaller) Its not, I was playing around with numbers and forgot to actually update the last batch of changes. so what are they...
Mila Prestoc	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:39:00 - [24] Edited by: Mila Prestoc on 25/10/2006 08:39:18 Originally by: Max Teranous People flying off the deep end based of numbers off a test server that's already shown to be work in progress = priceless Just making the point, like I said, I'd love to know Tux's thoughts on how its going and the effect the penalties are meant to do, ie. make the max damage ammo for breaking larger ships tank and not for same ship class fights (making combat longer). ------------------------- Originally by: "Lord Violent" EvE is slowly becoming a game for the stupid, catered to by devs as they lack ability to kill/survive anything.
Isonkon Serikain Gallente Band of Builders Inc. Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:42:00 - [25] Originally by: Tasty Burger nobody cares. I got used to minnies getting shafted through and through... IM sticking to gallente/caldari... they seem to have it easy. Pity the fool
Kapitanleutnant Mei	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:49:00 - [26] yeah cause the hurricane shows such evidence of Minnie being shafted though and through... its a test server- the stats are TEST stats, please do discuss this kind of thing but don't cry hell and murder- if you've played kali you'll realise just how much content there is in kali 1-there are typos/mistakes/arbitrary values needing tweaking all over the place- you might get a better response if you didn't cry bloody murder but acted like adults?- or is that too much to ask
Jim McGregor Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.25 08:53:00 - [27] Originally by: Isonkon Serikain Originally by: Tasty Burger nobody cares. I got used to minnies getting shafted through and through... IM sticking to gallente/caldari... they seem to have it easy. I think the devs have noticed that minmatar is subpar on some levels, and are trying to decrease the gallente dominance a bit. At least it feels like it. After all, game balance is what we want here. For example, do you like fast ships with less tanking ability (raiders = minmatar) or do you want heavy, slow tanks (gallente/amarr). Or perhaps be a missile spammer with heavy shields? Caldari. All those different playstyles must be balanced in the game, and lately its been way too much gallente ships being the obvious choice for the task at hand. True balance is when you have to make hard choices about what ship to fly (assuming you can fly them all). Maybe im optimistic, but I feel that the devs kind of agree that balance can be tuned a bit. --- Eve Wiki \| Eve Tribune \| Eve Pirate
Stormhold FinFleet Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.10.25 09:14:00 - [28] Edited by: Stormhold on 25/10/2006 09:16:25 Anyone who is whining that blasters track so well because Megathron has a tracking penalty should try to look at Kali changes. Gallente got a new battleship which is supposed to be 100% blasterboat, and it DOES NOT have a tracking bonus. Not to say though, many smaller gallente ships lack a tracking bonus too. I don't like the idea of balancing blasters around megathron's bonus because of Rokh either. While it's made to be a railship, it shouldn't be forced to fit rails (like Hyperion is pretty much forced to use blasters due to the lockrange, but then again for sniping it's grid is too small to fit 8x425mm II so that it'd be worth to use it over a mega.) While I don't like the t2 blaster ammo changes on the test server, I'll adapt if that moronic changes really will be implemented.
Tasty Burger	Posted - 2006.10.25 16:43:00 - [29] Originally by: Max Teranous People flying off the deep end based of numbers off a test server that's already shown to be work in progress = priceless What good is a test server without player input? Tuxford, I'm glad you noticed the problem, but the thing is, most people can't even get on sisi to see the updated changes or test them. It's great being Minmatar, ain't it?
Tasty Burger	Posted - 2006.10.26 14:58:00 - [30] Tux, I got onto sisi, didn't see any changes. Just wondering what you're planning to do with all the t2 ammo, as its a big part of gameplay atm. - It's great being Minmatar, ain't it?

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