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Are POS's being removed from the game??

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Cyborg Girl86 Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 8	Posted - 2015.05.23 11:13:59 - [1] - Quote Hi Everyone, So after skimming through the dev blogs something really caught my eye, and it has to do with the new gameplay mechanics CCP wants to introduce for Citadels and Starbases and stuff. I read through them, but found it all to be a lot to take in and sort of confusing. Long story short, are POS's, as they are now, being totally removed from the game and replaced by these new structures? When I say POS I mean the player-owned bases the for forcefield bubbles that require fuel and can have other stuff anchored around them. Thanks for clarifying!!
permion Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave 19	Posted - 2015.05.23 11:25:17 - [2] - Quote Eventually.
Solecist Punk Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 57	Posted - 2015.05.23 11:26:37 - [3] - Quote Yeah they are ! <----- Profile pic - 1024x1024
Cyborg Girl86 Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 8	Posted - 2015.05.23 11:37:10 - [4] - Quote Ah I see, thanks for clarifying! I wonder how these new structures and their mechanics are going to affect small-scale manufacturers/indy groups consisting of only 1 or 2 players like myself in times of a war and how the offlining/repackaging/deploying mechanics will work. A RL example of how the current POS mechanics saved my hide: I got wardecced by a griefer/wardeccer corp a month ago and immediately after finding out, tore down and stored my POS during the 24hr grace period. To my amusement, every other corp in my system got systematically wardecced by the same corp, and sure enough a fleet of 20+ Apocs showed up and began wiping out all of the other corps' POS's one-by-one until nearly two thirds of all the POS's in my home system were wiped out. I seemed to be the only smart person other than the wardeccer corp in that system that day Let's just say I saved myself quite a bit of ISK Being in a tiny one-man corp consisting of a handful of Alts with absolutely no ability to defend against something like a fleet of POS-bashing Apocs, I used brains over brawn. Will the new structure mechanics still allow this? I ask because if they don't, they seem to me to only favour larger corps/alliances with the manpower to defend them, while little corps like myself who relied on the current POS mechanics to make some money have just lost out on a bunch of industry options available.
Abadayos Caldari Provisions Caldari State 10	Posted - 2015.05.23 12:42:34 - [5] - Quote Simply put, we don't know. The info released is pretty sparse on detail and big on vision. Give it a month or two and we will find out more info regarding the PoS situation, new structures and how wardec mechanics will interact with them.
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 5288	Posted - 2015.05.23 18:16:49 - [6] - Quote As new structures and service modules for those structures are release, old structures will be phased out. An example given in the fanfest presentation: A new manufacturing facility (and the service modules to make it work) is released. The Old structures will continue to work for a while, but their bonuses will be removed. A while after that, they will cease to function. A while after that, they will be removed in some fashion. (refunded, allowed to be reprocessed, something. That's not detailed yet) Woo! CSM X! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Jenshae Chiroptera 1576	Posted - 2015.05.23 18:34:10 - [7] - Quote POSes won't have shields so something like this will be needed. CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids . High Sec needs a stepping stone to other areas of space, where they can grow Fozzie is treating a symptom.
Kashadin Big Johnson's 29	Posted - 2015.05.23 18:40:04 - [8] - Quote They are already saying that they are thinking of implementing some sort of "invulnerability link" for ships that just undocked/unmored from a Citadel. Ontop of that the personal defenses of the Citadels will outshine the old POS defenses.
Yazzinra Scorpion Ventures 74	Posted - 2015.05.24 01:01:09 - [9] - Quote Cavemen had better weaponry than POS currently do. Let's no get excited just get.
Kashadin Big Johnson's 33	Posted - 2015.05.24 01:18:21 - [10] - Quote http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/back-into-the-structure/ very bottom of the page. Hell, I will even link the little graphic they made to show the plan. http://cdn1.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/67008/1/Transition2.png

13kr1d1 Hedion University Amarr Empire 144	Posted - 2015.05.24 04:54:49 - [11] - Quote Right now my industry character is running a chain of highsec POSes for logistics in mining operations. If they get removed and I can't run this chain effectively, due to costs or other issues, I'll be pretty upset. Its nice to have an open field where ships can warp to an array, dump stuff, and immediately be warping back. Some of us like having outposts rather than full-blown stations. At 5 drones of T2, the Tristan is nearly as powerful as the Algos, with a cheaper price tag, better maneuverability and speed, and smaller sig radius to avoid the lazy carebearish T3 station blapping -10s who have no life. Pick tristan for FW.
Mara Pahrdi The Order of Anoyia 952	Posted - 2015.05.24 09:40:37 - [12] - Quote Cyborg Girl86 wrote: I ask because if they don't, they seem to me to only favour larger corps/alliances with the manpower to defend them, while little corps like myself who relied on the current POS mechanics to make some money have just lost out on a bunch of industry options available. It is going to be pretty much this. Many small hs indy corps primary line of defense are POS structure hitpoints and a low profile. This is not going to work anymore. You will have to adapt. Remove insurance.
Drago Shouna Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 254	Posted - 2015.05.24 09:55:41 - [13] - Quote Mara Pahrdi wrote: Cyborg Girl86 wrote: I ask because if they don't, they seem to me to only favour larger corps/alliances with the manpower to defend them, while little corps like myself who relied on the current POS mechanics to make some money have just lost out on a bunch of industry options available. It is going to be pretty much this. Many small hs indy corps primary line of defense are POS structure hitpoints and a low profile. This is not going to work anymore. You will have to adapt. Agreed..I only use my own POS for refining and compression so it only goes online now and then. But i'm still gonna be gutted when I have to lose it. Like you, I'm not sure how it's going to end up, but it does seem to give everything to the big boys. It is a kick in the teeth from CCP to small corps on the face of it.
Cyborg Girl86 Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 16	Posted - 2015.05.24 10:07:26 - [14] - Quote Mara Pahrdi wrote: Cyborg Girl86 wrote: I ask because if they don't, they seem to me to only favour larger corps/alliances with the manpower to defend them, while little corps like myself who relied on the current POS mechanics to make some money have just lost out on a bunch of industry options available. It is going to be pretty much this. Many small hs indy corps primary line of defense are POS structure hitpoints and a low profile. This is not going to work anymore. You will have to adapt. Kind of disappointing if you ask me Still, its all just speculation and heresay for the time being. I did read somewhere, whether it was a forum post or a dev blog on the subject i can't recall, that the new citadels/starbases/whateverthef**theircallednow will no longer have to be anchored around a moon. Instead they can be anchored absolutely anywhere in the system and bookmarked. This is kind of cool as theoretically you could hop in a BS, warp to any random location and MJD like 2 dozen times, bookmark the spot and then setup shop in a little corner of space only you know about I'd really like to see more info about the wardec mechanics and the new mechanics for setting up and tearing them down. Maybe I'll get lucky and my strategy of "Pack up shop and move like some kind of space Gypsy"* will still work fingers crossed Further still...f*** it if hs indy ops in a tiny HS corp are no longer feasible. My main gets offers to go back to Null every second day. I might just go back to Null and leave everything my corp has and my alts in my current home system, in-effect turning my once efficient HS Indy corp into a glorified offshore bank staffed by 3 beautiful ladies (myself included)
Cyborg Girl86 Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 16	Posted - 2015.05.24 10:08:14 - [15] - Quote Drago Shouna wrote: Mara Pahrdi wrote: Cyborg Girl86 wrote: I ask because if they don't, they seem to me to only favour larger corps/alliances with the manpower to defend them, while little corps like myself who relied on the current POS mechanics to make some money have just lost out on a bunch of industry options available. It is going to be pretty much this. Many small hs indy corps primary line of defense are POS structure hitpoints and a low profile. This is not going to work anymore. You will have to adapt. Agreed..I only use my own POS for refining and compression so it only goes online now and then. But i'm still gonna be gutted when I have to lose it. Like you, I'm not sure how it's going to end up, but it does seem to give everything to the big boys. It is a kick in the teeth from CCP to small corps on the face of it. ^Also This^
Mara Pahrdi The Order of Anoyia 952	Posted - 2015.05.24 10:19:36 - [16] - Quote Drago Shouna wrote: Like you, I'm not sure how it's going to end up, but it does seem to give everything to the big boys. It is a kick in the teeth from CCP to small corps on the face of it. CCP mentioned in the past, that they would look into improving single player and small group game play. They also mentioned personal structures somewhere. A highly specialized T2 variant of the Orca supporting compression and / or refining would also be an option for small groups. We will simply have to wait and see what happens. And adapt. Remove insurance.
Mara Pahrdi The Order of Anoyia 952	Posted - 2015.05.24 10:43:20 - [17] - Quote Cyborg Girl86 wrote: Further still...f*** it if hs indy ops in a tiny HS corp are no longer feasible. My main gets offers to go back to Null every second day. I might just go back to Null and leave everything my corp has and my alts in my current home system, in-effect turning my once efficient HS Indy corp into a glorified offshore bank staffed by 3 beautiful ladies (myself included) Good for you. RL being what it is currently, I cannot be online regularly or for extended periods. I'll most likely unsub my indy accounts during the year. Maybe keep one to be able to build my own stuff when needed and go to lowsec for pi most of the time. Remove insurance.
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn Department 10 233	Posted - 2015.05.24 10:51:51 - [18] - Quote Cyborg Girl86 wrote: Hi Everyone, So after skimming through the dev blogs something really caught my eye, and it has to do with the new gameplay mechanics CCP wants to introduce for Citadels and Starbases and stuff. I read through them, but found it all to be a lot to take in and sort of confusing. Long story short, are POS's, as they are now, being totally removed from the game and replaced by these new structures? When I say POS I mean the player-owned bases with the towers that make forcefield bubbles that require fuel and can have other stuff anchored around them. Thanks for clarifying!! You need to read the latest dev blog on Citadels properly. There isn't any mention of labs and production arrays in it but I presume they will be fitted to the new Citadel structures. The medium sized Citadel description states it will be for single pilot or small groups of capsuleers to use so similar to the small and medium POS we currently have. They will be attackable using the Entosis Link system. The dev blog doesn't mention war-decs but I presume, or hope, that a war-dec has to be initiated first before an attack can begin. Alternatively an attack can take place within a time window of your choice without a war-dec which wouldn't be quite so attractive. " They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. "-áRick. " Find out what ? "-áAbraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. "-áRick. Season four.-á-á ' The Walking Dead. ' .
Seven Koskanaiken Positive Failure Black Legion. 1511	Posted - 2015.05.24 13:47:01 - [19] - Quote Given that safe towers, super staging, fleet form ups and titan bridging are so ingrained into the game I'd say the chance of the forcefield style POS disappearing was close to zero. The clue is in "announced at fanfest".
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 5291	Posted - 2015.05.24 15:56:25 - [20] - Quote Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote: Cyborg Girl86 wrote: Hi Everyone, So after skimming through the dev blogs something really caught my eye, and it has to do with the new gameplay mechanics CCP wants to introduce for Citadels and Starbases and stuff. I read through them, but found it all to be a lot to take in and sort of confusing. Long story short, are POS's, as they are now, being totally removed from the game and replaced by these new structures? When I say POS I mean the player-owned bases with the towers that make forcefield bubbles that require fuel and can have other stuff anchored around them. Thanks for clarifying!! You need to read the latest dev blog on Citadels properly. There isn't any mention of labs and production arrays in it but I presume they will be fitted to the new Citadel structures. The medium sized Citadel description states it will be for single pilot or small groups of capsuleers to use so similar to the small and medium POS we currently have. They will be attackable using the Entosis Link system. The dev blog doesn't mention war-decs but I presume, or hope, that a war-dec has to be initiated first before an attack can begin. Alternatively an attack can take place within a time window of your choice without a war-dec which wouldn't be quite so attractive. The ability to do things in structures will depend on the service modules you fit to the structure. (High, mid, low, rigs, services) Most services won't be limited to particular types of structure. However, there'll be bonuses on the structure itself, which you may want. Citadel are the defensive storage structures. You'll be able to build in them, but it won't be optimal. (once the service modules are released) Woo! CSM X! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

Kiandoshia Applied Anarchy SpaceMonkey's Alliance 2284	Posted - 2015.05.24 16:26:01 - [21] - Quote permion wrote: Eventually. This eventually means in 2 or 3 years ^^

CCP Darwin C C P C C P Alliance 1438	Posted - 2015.05.24 16:43:48 - [22] - Quote Cyborg Girl86 wrote: Being in a tiny one-man corp consisting of a handful of Alts with absolutely no ability to defend against something like a fleet of POS-bashing Apocs, I used brains over brawn. Will the new structure mechanics still allow this? I ask because if they don't, they seem to me to only favour larger corps/alliances with the manpower to defend them, while little corps like myself who relied on the current POS mechanics to make some money have just lost out on a bunch of industry options available. The goal is for the new structure systems to offer more, not fewer, options for small groups. I would suggest posting your specific experience, and your question, in the comments thread for the Citadels dev blog, here. Edit: I'm not on the structures team, so I am not able to answer specific questions. However, posting in that thread will get the question you raise in front of the right team. CCP Darwin GÇó Senior Technical Artist, EVE Online GÇó @mark_wilkins

Carrie-Anne Moss Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 154	Posted - 2015.05.24 17:23:03 - [23] - Quote CCP Darwin wrote: Cyborg Girl86 wrote: Being in a tiny one-man corp consisting of a handful of Alts with absolutely no ability to defend against something like a fleet of POS-bashing Apocs, I used brains over brawn. Will the new structure mechanics still allow this? I ask because if they don't, they seem to me to only favour larger corps/alliances with the manpower to defend them, while little corps like myself who relied on the current POS mechanics to make some money have just lost out on a bunch of industry options available. The goal is for the new structure systems to offer more, not fewer, options for small groups. I would suggest posting your specific experience, and your question, in the comments thread for the Citadels dev blog, here. Edit: I'm not on the structures team, so I am not able to answer specific questions. However, posting in that thread will get the question you raise in front of the right team. Guns arent automatic though so you or your alts need to be online to defend against the apoc fleet. So no you will lose it but dont worry ccp will protect your ships and stuff with their Unlimited storage or whatever its called where a can only you can access and that is un-scanable and un dieable gets put randomonly somewhere in space and gives you a bookmark to it. Also Ccp Darwin, you seemed to talk to us a lot about all that skill attribute stuff and other topics like this. Since you are an art dude, can you give us an update on the Skins Devblog Falcon promised us over 2 weeks ago and give us an eta on it? Thanks
Vol Arm'OOO Bagel and Lox 380	Posted - 2015.05.24 17:48:34 - [24] - Quote Carrie-Anne Moss wrote: CCP Darwin wrote: Cyborg Girl86 wrote: Being in a tiny one-man corp consisting of a handful of Alts with absolutely no ability to defend against something like a fleet of POS-bashing Apocs, I used brains over brawn. Will the new structure mechanics still allow this? I ask because if they don't, they seem to me to only favour larger corps/alliances with the manpower to defend them, while little corps like myself who relied on the current POS mechanics to make some money have just lost out on a bunch of industry options available. The goal is for the new structure systems to offer more, not fewer, options for small groups. I would suggest posting your specific experience, and your question, in the comments thread for the Citadels dev blog, here. Edit: I'm not on the structures team, so I am not able to answer specific questions. However, posting in that thread will get the question you raise in front of the right team. Guns arent automatic though so you or your alts need to be online to defend against the apoc fleet. So no you will lose it but dont worry ccp will protect your ships and stuff with their Unlimited storage or whatever its called where a can only you can access and that is un-scanable and un dieable gets put randomonly somewhere in space and gives you a bookmark to it. Also Ccp Darwin, you seemed to talk to us a lot about all that skill attribute stuff and other topics like this. Since you are an art dude, can you give us an update on the Skins Devblog Falcon promised us over 2 weeks ago and give us an eta on it? Thanks apoc fleet wont matter b/c they cant damage the structure - instead its going to be some nonsense ship with an entosis link circling you flashing its magic light beam. They are taking the worst features of fw (circling a button for control) and grafting it onto structures ftl. I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Phoenix Jones Isogen 5 1337	Posted - 2015.05.24 17:53:05 - [25] - Quote Except they should be able to encap the weapons to make that entosising thing be able to entosis. We really don't know how the implementation will work. You will still need the apoc fleet. Yaay!!!!
Kashadin Big Johnson's 47	Posted - 2015.05.24 17:54:55 - [26] - Quote They have already said several times that they are planning on making sure that a single ship with a entosis link WON'T be able to take down a Citadel structure as long as that structure has some kinda defenses, even if they aren't manned. That being said you will nee to defend against a dedicated force attacking you, but seeing as how the defenses of the things are going to be made to be able to defend against Caps, you should be ok unless they show up with a lot of stuff.
evotta Territorial Hanseatic League 2	Posted - 2015.05.24 18:52:05 - [27] - Quote Still i haven't understand if citadels are gonna replace POSs or outposts.
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 5291	Posted - 2015.05.24 18:59:18 - [28] - Quote evotta wrote: Still i haven't understand if citadels are gonna replace POSs or outposts. Yes and no. Outpost and POS are going away. Citadels are one of the options for replacements. They're just the first to be talked about. There will, likely, be many of other options. As per the blog and fanfest presentation. It won't be a 'citadels are release, all outposts and POS vanish'. It'll be a phased approach. Woo! CSM X! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Carrie-Anne Moss Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 154	Posted - 2015.05.24 19:42:50 - [29] - Quote Kashadin wrote: They have already said several times that they are planning on making sure that a single ship with a entosis link WON'T be able to take down a Citadel structure as long as that structure has some kinda defenses, even if they aren't manned. That being said you will nee to defend against a dedicated force attacking you, but seeing as how the defenses of the things are going to be made to be able to defend against Caps, you should be ok unless they show up with a lot of stuff. Stop lying to the poor dude. He was asking SPECIFICALLY about a corp of him and his alts in hisec. That means the window time frame thing will be like 18hrs cuz only null can upgrade the system to get a smaller engagement window hour. Also the citadel will be able to repel a SINGLE ship. Not several with entosises while the dude is asleep. And if he gets wardecced for one week, im sure the attackers will show up to the timers and if dude misses one cuz of work or sleep or real life anything, goes to next timer. I.e. a corp in hisec filled with only alts CAN NOT STOP A CITADEL LOSS FROM WAR.
Kashadin Big Johnson's 55	Posted - 2015.05.24 19:54:42 - [30] - Quote Then play the multilayer part of this MMO. Get friends or even hire someone to fight the war for you. Helpful video for those who can't be arsed to interact to defend their stuff.

Cyborg Girl86 Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 20	Posted - 2015.05.24 21:01:54 - [31] - Quote Kashadin wrote: Then play the multilayer part of this MMO. Get friends or even hire someone to fight the war for you. Helpful video for those who can't be arsed to interact to defend their stuff. Honestly I'd probably, actually more than likely, just go back to Null I've lived in Null before, it isn't so bad actually. I only went back to highsec to try my hand at operating my own manufacturing business, which was going really well until I found out about all of this

CCP Darwin C C P C C P Alliance 1441	Posted - 2015.05.24 23:34:55 - [32] - Quote Carrie-Anne Moss wrote: Also Ccp Darwin, you seemed to talk to us a lot about all that skill attribute stuff and other topics like this. Since you are an art dude, can you give us an update on the Skins Devblog Falcon promised us over 2 weeks ago and give us an eta on it? Thanks No, sorry I can't. :) That said, here's what I'd like to see on my ship in the new SKINs! CCP Darwin GÇó Senior Technical Artist, EVE Online GÇó @mark_wilkins

Ivant Sumboodi Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 0	Posted - 2015.05.24 23:42:00 - [33] - Quote Okay so basically the emerging idea here is that 1) new POSs will be 'deadlier' for the bashers, yet have less hp 2) when successfully bashed, your blueprints will fall into an Only For Me box 3) the difference here is that once your tower is popped, you just have to physically grab your Only For Me box at some point in time 4) no one is 100% sure if there is still the 24h griefer dec grace period
Cyborg Girl86 Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 20	Posted - 2015.05.25 00:01:13 - [34] - Quote Ivant Sumboodi wrote: Okay so basically the emerging idea here is that 1) new POSs will be 'deadlier' for the bashers, yet have less hp 2) when successfully bashed, your blueprints will fall into an Only For Me box 3) the difference here is that once your tower is popped, you just have to physically grab your Only For Me box at some point in time 4) no one is 100% sure if there is still the 24h griefer dec grace period Yep, I think its safe to say we've arrived at that so far
Yarda Black Militaris Industries Northern Coalition. 661	Posted - 2015.05.25 00:23:58 - [35] - Quote evotta wrote: Still i haven't understand if citadels are gonna replace POSs or outposts. If you put all the options both give into one pool and clean out overlap, you can make new (destroyable) structures with new distributions of those options. Including your own (destroyable) station. And cool new structure models in space (most important really) Thats what I make of it sofar anyway.
Ivant Sumboodi Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 0	Posted - 2015.05.25 00:36:49 - [36] - Quote It would seem "most important" is that you have to go retrieve your box, during a griefer dec which could/should get you killed if you didnt skill for a cloaky frigate. These new POSs will be popped as easily as the old ones and maybe even cost a newbie more money, will be popped by the same griefers, but now the griefers actually get to hawk over your box and laugh while you try to retrieve it over and over.
Cyborg Girl86 Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 20	Posted - 2015.05.25 00:56:26 - [37] - Quote Quote: These new POSs will be popped as easily as the old ones and maybe even cost a newbie more money, will be popped by the same griefers, but now the griefers actually get to hawk over your box and laugh while you try to retrieve it over and over. It's for this reason why I'm anxious to see if the 24hr griefer dec grace period will still be there after the changes, and on top of that if it will still be possible to use the deactivate>unanchor>store safely in an NPC station method of avoiding such a thing from happening to the structures in the first place
Ivant Sumboodi Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 0	Posted - 2015.05.25 01:17:03 - [38] - Quote yeah the NPC station storage was really 1 of 2 reasons to even attempt Industry in HS, at least initiating jobs from NPC station and having the spoils of a grief dec reverting to NPC corp storage. That was the main reason really. People so desperate to pop your tower wasn't a big deal to me if they wanted it so so bad to go throught all the trouble. It made me sad for them really. It looks like the MMO just wants to up the price for the same operation by a lot, and make the whole thing a lot worse for the owner, at face value. I
Cyborg Girl86 Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 20	Posted - 2015.05.25 01:20:28 - [39] - Quote That's what I'm worried about Worst case scenario I convert my corp into nothing more than an entity to store all my stuff and alts and move my main back to Null. Not the ideal, but at least I have a backup plan
Lil' Brudder Too Pistols for Pandas 133	Posted - 2015.05.25 01:21:20 - [40] - Quote CCP Darwin wrote: The goal is for the new structure systems to offer more, not fewer, options for small groups. Except that all indications from the relatively few useful Dev responses makes it seem like it won't be worth the hassle for small/solo groups to even try. CCP Darwin wrote: I would suggest posting your specific experience, and your question, in the comments thread for the Citadels dev blog, here. You mean the thread that most Dev responses have been answering the same repeated dumb questions that were actually answered in the initial blog? They have deliberately avoided responding to many of the legitimate concerns that have been raised, like for instance, the absolute ease that a single ship will have at RF'ing these new structures if the owners don't spend their whole window POS-sitting. (just as an example) The most recent (over a week ago) response was the token "We're noting things, thanks for your feedback." Which is usually CCP speak for, "we don't believe you, we're doing it our way because we know best." Occasionally it doesn't mean that, but more often than not, that's what happens. --just remembered the likelyhood of this post actually getting posted due to this whole "connection reset" problem that is obviously not on CCP's end.--

Ivant Sumboodi Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 1	Posted - 2015.05.25 01:25:55 - [41] - Quote Null is truly the new HS, no troll for real. It's better to build there. It's better to pvp there than LS. It's better to live there. It's better to not affect your sec there. Why do anything else? edit: incursions ovbbut that's alt stuff that everybody needs to do these days
Joe Atei Aes Dei Asher 11	Posted - 2015.05.25 16:24:23 - [42] - Quote While I will use the "only for me" box, that's a lame feature that goes against the core values of this game I believe. Awfully reminiscent of BoP items in other games. Oh well, it's the direction people think the game needs to head into. Personally, it's a turn off.

CCP Darwin C C P C C P Alliance 1446	Posted - 2015.05.25 19:06:05 - [43] - Quote Lil' Brudder Too wrote: The most recent (over a week ago) response was the token "We're noting things, thanks for your feedback." Which is usually CCP speak for, "we don't believe you, we're doing it our way because we know best." Occasionally it doesn't mean that, but more often than not, that's what happens. Of course they can't answer your questions, they haven't finished their design yet. Note that if they'd held the dev blog until they had all the answers and the feature were about to be released, your (valid) complaint would likely be that they hadn't ever consulted players for input. CCP Darwin GÇó Senior Technical Artist, EVE Online GÇó @mark_wilkins

Joia Crenca Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 108	Posted - 2015.05.25 21:15:55 - [44] - Quote CCP Darwin wrote: Lil' Brudder Too wrote: The most recent (over a week ago) response was the token "We're noting things, thanks for your feedback." Which is usually CCP speak for, "we don't believe you, we're doing it our way because we know best." Occasionally it doesn't mean that, but more often than not, that's what happens. Of course they can't answer your questions, they haven't finished their design yet. Note that if they'd held the dev blog until they had all the answers and the feature were about to be released, your (valid) complaint would likely be that they hadn't ever consulted players for input. True, true. And we need to remember that when 'still in development, send feedback' is very noted in the blog. You know, they forgot to consult me before they removed the Quafe Station/Pleasure Station background from the game. Gallente NPC stations have been less interesting, with only that green towered one, ever since.
Lijah Central Builders Incorporated Short Bus Syndicate 1	Posted - 2015.05.26 12:38:39 - [45] - Quote Steve Ronuken wrote: As new structures and service modules for those structures are release, old structures will be phased out. An example given in the fanfest presentation: A new manufacturing facility (and the service modules to make it work) is released. The Old structures will continue to work for a while, but their bonuses will be removed. A while after that, they will cease to function. A while after that, they will be removed in some fashion. (refunded, allowed to be reprocessed, something. That's not detailed yet) will the old defunct POS's not be 'allowed'? ie, the in game items will be removed? That makes POS structures as they are now, next to worthless, and prices should bottom out. Or will they 'change' into these new things? Will POS fuel still be required? or will PI become laregly pointless for all the POS fuel elements?
Vol Arm'OOO Bagel and Lox 381	Posted - 2015.05.26 13:30:37 - [46] - Quote Phoenix Jones wrote: Except they should be able to encap the weapons to make that entosising thing be able to entosis. We really don't know how the implementation will work. You will still need the apoc fleet. You wont be able to encap the guns because you wont be able to shoot the guns independently of the new pos. They are replacing the old pos with a structure that is built like a ship with mods that are fitted from a fitting window. For all intents and purposes, all you will see is a big red x that you shoot at. In short, complexity of game play is being sacrificed to simplicity. I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Oracle of Machina Brave Provisions Brave Collective 12	Posted - 2015.05.26 21:36:12 - [47] - Quote What happens to wormhole corps if POS's are removed? Are they forced to build citadels from now on?
Milla Goodpussy Federal Navy Academy 257	Posted - 2015.05.26 22:07:32 - [48] - Quote Oracle of Machina wrote: What happens to wormhole corps if POS's are removed? Are they forced to build citadels from now on? yep face it.. you will have to adapt.. pos's are going away at some point in time..
Oracle of Machina Brave Provisions Brave Collective 12	Posted - 2015.05.26 22:19:53 - [49] - Quote Milla Goodpussy wrote: Oracle of Machina wrote: What happens to wormhole corps if POS's are removed? Are they forced to build citadels from now on? yep face it.. you will have to adapt.. pos's are going away at some point in time.. Actually, I don't live in a hole anymore. I was just curious if they might have more specific plans for holes.
Commander Spurty Dimension Door We need wards. 1462	Posted - 2015.05.31 11:21:05 - [50] - Quote Oracle of Machina wrote: Actually, I don't live in a hole anymore. I was just curious if they might have more specific plans for holes. MOAR HOLES "Pat'ch Notes" wrote: Exploration: New systems are available that can be accessed via the Unidentified wormholes. (Unidentified wormholes can be found in systems that contain the Jove Observatory) Patch Notes There are good ships And wood ships And ships that sail the sea But the best ships are Spaceships Built by CCP

Spurty Dimension Door We need wards. 1475	Posted - 2015.05.31 11:21:05 - [51] - Quote Oracle of Machina wrote: Actually, I don't live in a hole anymore. I was just curious if they might have more specific plans for holes. MOAR HOLES "Pat'ch Notes" wrote: Exploration: New systems are available that can be accessed via the Unidentified wormholes. (Unidentified wormholes can be found in systems that contain the Jove Observatory) Patch Notes There are good ships And wood ships And ships that sail the sea But the best ships are Spaceships Built by CCP
Corraidhin Farsaidh Farsaidh's Freeborn 1181	Posted - 2015.05.31 11:53:58 - [52] - Quote My same response here as in other threads on this (I like to be consistent :) ): I hate the idea of the entosis link for structure combat. For flag capture ops in sov warfare? Fine. But for destroying massive heavily armed and armoured structures? Don't be daft...it makes no sense! The entosis link should maybe be used to disable repair modules/ECM or to reduce resists (my preferred option) to cut the EHP grind. However such structures should need to be beaten down with heavy firepower, likewise they should be able to deploy such firepower in defence.
E1ev1n Unknown Crusade 3	Posted - 2015.05.31 23:32:28 - [53] - Quote CCP Darwin wrote: Lil' Brudder Too wrote: The most recent (over a week ago) response was the token "We're noting things, thanks for your feedback." Which is usually CCP speak for, "we don't believe you, we're doing it our way because we know best." Occasionally it doesn't mean that, but more often than not, that's what happens. Of course they can't answer your questions, they haven't finished their design yet. Note that if they'd held the dev blog until they had all the answers and the feature were about to be released, your (valid) complaint would likely be that they hadn't ever consulted players for input. It's encouraging to see you fine gentlemen addressing concerns from the public, perhaps answering some of the questions would lend capsuleer support or derision to the ideas and help devs put them up in the manner that would be best for everyone. Again I am certainly pleased you guys are responding.
E1ev1n Unknown Crusade 3	Posted - 2015.05.31 23:35:21 - [54] - Quote Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote: My same response here as in other threads on this (I like to be consistent :) ): I hate the idea of the entosis link for structure combat. For flag capture ops in sov warfare? Fine. But for destroying massive heavily armed and armoured structures? Don't be daft...it makes no sense! The entosis link should maybe be used to disable repair modules/ECM or to reduce resists (my preferred option) to cut the EHP grind. However such structures should need to be beaten down with heavy firepower, likewise they should be able to deploy such firepower in defence. I personally believe that the entosis link is a terrible idea for RFing player owned structures of any kind in any location other than in Null Sec, where the whole sov system is funny anyways.
Milla Goodpussy Federal Navy Academy 265	Posted - 2015.06.01 03:38:04 - [55] - Quote E1ev1n wrote: Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote: My same response here as in other threads on this (I like to be consistent :) ): I hate the idea of the entosis link for structure combat. For flag capture ops in sov warfare? Fine. But for destroying massive heavily armed and armoured structures? Don't be daft...it makes no sense! The entosis link should maybe be used to disable repair modules/ECM or to reduce resists (my preferred option) to cut the EHP grind. However such structures should need to be beaten down with heavy firepower, likewise they should be able to deploy such firepower in defence. I personally believe that the entosis link is a terrible idea for RFing player owned structures of any kind in any location other than in Null Sec, where the whole sov system is funny anyways. nobody asked for this link crap, no one, not on the CSM its not their idea.. look who came up with it and did it and pushed it forward.. fozzie.. the entire idea is whacked out.
Nevyn Auscent Broke Sauce 2217	Posted - 2015.06.01 06:03:45 - [56] - Quote Milla Goodpussy wrote: nobody asked for this link crap, no one, not on the CSM its not their idea.. look who came up with it and did it and pushed it forward.. fozzie.. the entire idea is whacked out. Except for you know, the fact that it's the best idea so far anyone has managed to come up with that addresses Sov. The problem is it seems to be likely to be applied very poorly to non sov space, resulting in indefensible structures without any occupancy bonus for defenders to get there, and the lack of AI defenses that a current POS does have, meaning that a single frigate will easily swan by and RF your structure in 20 minutes while no-one is around, and once it's on a timer it's easy for people to just drop a Blob. But for a Sov solution it's great.
E1ev1n Unknown Crusade 4	Posted - 2015.06.27 18:01:59 - [57] - Quote Nevyn Auscent wrote: Milla Goodpussy wrote: nobody asked for this link crap, no one, not on the CSM its not their idea.. look who came up with it and did it and pushed it forward.. fozzie.. the entire idea is whacked out. Except for you know, the fact that it's the best idea so far anyone has managed to come up with that addresses Sov. The problem is it seems to be likely to be applied very poorly to non sov space, resulting in indefensible structures without any occupancy bonus for defenders to get there, and the lack of AI defenses that a current POS does have, meaning that a single frigate will easily swan by and RF your structure in 20 minutes while no-one is around, and once it's on a timer it's easy for people to just drop a Blob. But for a Sov solution it's great. You are correct IMO, and I think for an entosis link to work on a structure there really should be a need for sov to be in place (not to place a structure just to rf with an entosis link).
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative. 16578	Posted - 2015.06.27 19:05:11 - [58] - Quote Carrie-Anne Moss wrote: Kashadin wrote: They have already said several times that they are planning on making sure that a single ship with a entosis link WON'T be able to take down a Citadel structure as long as that structure has some kinda defenses, even if they aren't manned. That being said you will nee to defend against a dedicated force attacking you, but seeing as how the defenses of the things are going to be made to be able to defend against Caps, you should be ok unless they show up with a lot of stuff. Stop lying to the poor dude. He was asking SPECIFICALLY about a corp of him and his alts in hisec. That means the window time frame thing will be like 18hrs cuz only null can upgrade the system to get a smaller engagement window hour. Also the citadel will be able to repel a SINGLE ship. Not several with entosises while the dude is asleep. And if he gets wardecced for one week, im sure the attackers will show up to the timers and if dude misses one cuz of work or sleep or real life anything, goes to next timer. I.e. a corp in hisec filled with only alts CAN NOT STOP A CITADEL LOSS FROM WAR. Nor should it be able to. "It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!"
Hal Morsh Aliastra Gallente Federation 318	Posted - 2015.06.27 19:23:12 - [59] - Quote Cyborg Girl86 wrote: a fleet of 20+ Apocs Did you check if he was botting? Dun'Gal > Hal is simply an imperfect ai, though if drunkeness ever gets programmed into ai's I foresee both a hilarious and tragic end to humanity.
Vol Arm'OOO Bagel and Lox 630	Posted - 2015.06.27 19:31:55 - [60] - Quote Corraidhin Farsaidh wrote: My same response here as in other threads on this (I like to be consistent :) ): I hate the idea of the entosis link for structure combat. For flag capture ops in sov warfare? Fine. But for destroying massive heavily armed and armoured structures? Don't be daft...it makes no sense! The entosis link should maybe be used to disable repair modules/ECM or to reduce resists (my preferred option) to cut the EHP grind. However such structures should need to be beaten down with heavy firepower, likewise they should be able to deploy such firepower in defence. The entosis link thing is a bad idea in general - but if it was limited to sov warfare it wouldnt be that bad. What I had hoped to see was the hacking skill be allowed to be used on pos - if a player successfully hacks a pos (using the mini-game) they are able to disable some of the defenses or change rf timers - that would be cool and immersive - not like this entosis circle a button with a magic light thing that they are proposing. I don't play, I just fourm warrior.

Hal Morsh Aliastra Gallente Federation 320	Posted - 2015.06.28 00:54:41 - [61] - Quote How about a competitive hacking mini game. Dun'Gal > Hal is simply an imperfect ai, though if drunkeness ever gets programmed into ai's I foresee both a hilarious and tragic end to humanity.
Lil' Brudder Too Pistols for Pandas 223	Posted - 2015.06.29 20:57:21 - [62] - Quote CCP Darwin wrote: Lil' Brudder Too wrote: The most recent (over a week ago) response was the token "We're noting things, thanks for your feedback." Which is usually CCP speak for, "we don't believe you, we're doing it our way because we know best." Occasionally it doesn't mean that, but more often than not, that's what happens. Of course they can't answer your questions, they haven't finished their design yet. Note that if they'd held the dev blog until they had all the answers and the feature were about to be released, your (valid) complaint would likely be that they hadn't ever consulted players for input. This is what i mean, Here is what i just said...which you took out of context to fit inside the bubble that you wanted to read... Quote: They have deliberately avoided responding to many of the legitimate concerns that have been raised, like for instance, the absolute ease that a single ship will have at RF'ing these new structures if the owners don't spend their whole window POS-sitting. (just as an example) Not saying "they haven't ANSWERED all our questions"...they can easily address the concerns that were being raised, yet, they chose not to. We don't need "answers" right now, just assurances that they won't just bull through with what they (CCP) want and 'not believe" that the very valid concerns that we raise are indeed valid...up until the point where it will take you too much effort to undo/fix the things we warned you you were breaking. CCP has a history of this, and the lack of communication just reinforces our belief that you are going to continue that trend. New Icon SiSi feedback thread that got wholly ignored! An example of that a good ship icon set looks like.
Petre en Thielles Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 163	Posted - 2015.06.29 21:34:18 - [63] - Quote Oracle of Machina wrote: What happens to wormhole corps if POS's are removed? Are they forced to build citadels from now on? And to the best of my knowledge (someone correct me if I'm wrong), you don't have to anchor them to a moon. Which will make finding people in WH space....well, interesting. Curious if I will be able to AFK fly for 2 days, drop one of the new structures, and have a stupidly safe base of operations.
Anthar Thebess 1203	Posted - 2015.06.30 08:29:17 - [64] - Quote Petre en Thielles wrote: Oracle of Machina wrote: What happens to wormhole corps if POS's are removed? Are they forced to build citadels from now on? And to the best of my knowledge (someone correct me if I'm wrong), you don't have to anchor them to a moon. Which will make finding people in WH space....well, interesting. Curious if I will be able to AFK fly for 2 days, drop one of the new structures, and have a stupidly safe base of operations. It is called combat probes. Capital Remote AID Rebalance Way to solve important nullsec issue. CSM members do your work.
Petre en Thielles Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 163	Posted - 2015.06.30 14:00:16 - [65] - Quote Anthar Thebess wrote: It is called combat probes. How on earth does that have anything to do with the fact that you can find any POS without dropping probes now? That was literally my point. Do you even WH?
davet517 Caldari Provisions Caldari State 91	Posted - 2015.06.30 16:44:19 - [66] - Quote They're going to have module slots, and be anchorable anywhere in space, right? Just let people cloak the small and medium sized versions in non-sovereign space. That doesn't work with POS, since they take up a moon, but, since you can anchor them anywhere, it does. Of course, there should be a drawback to doing so. It should take up a slot, some grid, and CPU that reduces the amount of refining/building/researching you can do. Docking and undocking should also decloak it for a short span, so that it could be scanned down if the owner isn't careful. That should address the concerns of small-time high-sec and low-sec (and even NPC 0.0) players fairly well.


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