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Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2003.11.11 14:39:00 -
[1]
Eve needs to give people/corps the ability to take and hold territory/systems.
In my opinion, this in quite possibly the most crucial element that is missing from the EVE universe. Without any means of 'officially' claiming 'land', people are left with little to fight over, and a disembodied sensation of being without a 'home'.
It was suggested by the devs that such a system was in design stages, but its importance cannot be underestimated.
It needs to come soon. Just imagine the amazing territory skirmishes that would take place, with either side vying for the 'rights' to the systems (and their resources). A bit like planetside (sony).
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BatManolo
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Posted - 2003.11.11 14:41:00 -
[2]
And what would happen to the uncorporated people?
Forced to pay taxes everytime they go from region to region 'cause it's owned by a different corporation?
Getting killed just 'cause someone thought you're a corporation spy?
Sure it would be fun for some, but i believe that for the "common" crusader, the independent people out there it would become "Space Travel Hell".
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Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2003.11.11 14:44:00 -
[3]
I am of course referring only to 0.0 (non empire) systems.
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Carp Riddell
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Posted - 2003.11.11 14:51:00 -
[4]
Will make the whole thing worthwhile when it happens. In theory, it might even lead to PvP where something's actually at stake other than bragging rights.
- Carp Riddell
- CEO, Innsmouth Shipping
- Proud Member of Curse Alliance
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Fred0
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Posted - 2003.11.11 14:53:00 -
[5]
Indeed. look forward to having this when it will actually mean something.(Read pos and mr's) :)
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Dark Nyte
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Posted - 2003.11.11 16:58:00 -
[6]
although ppl may dissagree I would like some 0.0 space where players can't own it or claim it maybe have a PC owned corp claim it so that none allience/corps players can do mine/hunt in a small part of 0.0 space.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:06:00 -
[7]
You mean NPC owned? There already are, now for CCP to make them own up to their claims.
Convert Stations
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Drethen Nerevitas
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:06:00 -
[8]
Dark Nyte: Most of 0.0 is already claimed. Making it official won't hurt freelancers and small corps anymore than it already has done.
_______________________________________________________________________
IMPORTANT: Devs (and players) please take notice.
1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7. |
Amin
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:19:00 -
[9]
Your forgetting that most of the major alliances in 0.0 space are already in claimed territory, Angel, Sancha, Serpentisss etc.
When player stations are implemented then yes there will be a need for alliances to claim syssstems that are unclaimed.
Drink StarsiÖ Relation Co-ordinator
Caldari State Citizen
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Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:27:00 -
[10]
even ones that ARE already claimed by npcs should be capable of being taken.
I mean, if a player force sits a huge fleet in the serpentis systems for a couple of months, I kinda think the serpentis people have been beaten.
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:28:00 -
[11]
 Quote:
even ones that ARE already claimed by npcs should be capable of being taken.
I mean, if a player force sits a huge fleet in the serpentis systems for a couple of months, I kinda think the serpentis people have been beaten.
Excellent idea! \o/
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Amin
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:39:00 -
[12]
Quote:
even ones that ARE already claimed by npcs should be capable of being taken.
I mean, if a player force sits a huge fleet in the serpentis systems for a couple of months, I kinda think the serpentis people have been beaten.
The way 0.0 claimed systems work seem to be different from empire systems. Gor example, if i were to go around killing Gallante fleet ships and Gallante Corp convoys, they would hunt me everytime i entered thier space. This isnt how it works in 0.0.
You kill their ships, in belts, u mine thier ore then u go back and dock and use thier stations?? 
How does that work?
Drink StarsiÖ Relation Co-ordinator
Caldari State Citizen
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:40:00 -
[13]
"I mean, if a player force sits a huge fleet in the serpentis systems for a couple of months, I kinda think the serpentis people have been beaten."
... With the way the NPCs work currently you can a) have the huge fleet sit in the NPC system for months and not meet single NPC ship for all that time b) decimate the feeble NPC spawns with just single cruiser as you please, until you are bored out of your mind.
Since they are no challenge, pretty much anyone is able to 'beat the NPC people' in this sense, which is pretty ridiculous i'd say... o.O;
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Carp Riddell
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Posted - 2003.11.11 18:10:00 -
[14]
Quote:
You kill their ships, in belts, u mine thier ore then u go back and dock and use thier stations??
How does that work?
It works because...
For some reason I'm not aware of, CCP released Eve with a faction rating system that didn't have teeth. They now can't give it teeth because if they did they'd cause a sizeable number of players to leave - "Sorry, but SA have been evicted from Stain" would cause total mayhem.
So, until player stations are available, and until the technology to create them has been rushed into the hands of the alliances, the faction system cannot be properly implemented.
Whose fault is it?
Well, you can't blame the alliances for taking advantage of the lack of a proper faction system, so it's not them. The worst you can say about the alliances is "it's not in the spirit of the game", and frankly that cuts very little msutard.
In my opinion, it comes down to a combination of CCPs failure to implement the faction system before release, and CCPs failure to anticipate the need for player stations at this* stage in the game.
(* 'this' meaning about three months after release)
- Carp Riddell
- CEO, Innsmouth Shipping
- Proud Member of Curse Alliance
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Onubis
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Posted - 2003.11.11 23:31:00 -
[15]
Will this change when the new faction thingy comes out? Like serpentis stations not letting FA dock, sentyss shooting them..LOL that would be sooooo funny. All the allinces would be foooked 
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
"It is better to die on our feet than live on our knees"
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Cruise
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Posted - 2003.11.11 23:49:00 -
[16]
I can't see an alliance like SA getting the boot once they get the factions working correctly, just pushed out of particular stations, like those owned by the NPC pirates.
It'll be inconvenient for many, particularly if they based a good deal of their production and research in a particular station, but ultimately it shouldn't shove them out of the area entirely, just force them to change particular locations and adapt.
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Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis ad capul tuum saxum immane mittam.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2003.11.12 00:23:00 -
[17]
What if Serpentis fields a fleet of 3000 battleships and actually use drones, when will the challenging alliance be considered beaten?
Convert Stations
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Veruna Caseti
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Posted - 2003.11.12 00:26:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Veruna Caseti on 12/11/2003 00:31:33
Quote:
Just imagine the amazing territory skirmishes that would take place, with either side vying for the 'rights' to the systems (and their resources).
Hmm, if 0.0 was any more "claimable" than it already is, what makes you think fighting would become more frequent. Each alliance or megacorporation would have a home, rich with plenty of resources to provide them with anything they need.
Meanwhile, new players and corporations that don't belong to one of these alliances would have no access to the necessary resources to build a fleet capable of even beginning to challenge the might of an alliance/corporation with the all the resources of a 0.0 region at their disposal.
You would have a case of "can't beat them, join them." People would simply sign on with an existing alliance as opposed to spending resources staging a futile battle against one of them.
If you want claims on 0.0 regions to be more solid, there also needs to be more "free space" with decent resources so people actually have a chance to challenge the power of an alliance sitting on a batch of virtually endless ISK and ships.
Veruna Caseti
Ishukone |
Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2003.11.12 00:29:00 -
[19]
Veruna, it pretty much already is at that stage, with alliances choking the rest to death.
Convert Stations
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MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2003.11.12 01:06:00 -
[20]
I¦ve said it often and I¦ll continue to say till CCP put all the stuff in:
This game needs deployables. It needs players to able able to claim their territory.
Without this, EvE will NEVER be really outstanding.
Mai's Idealog |
Veruna Caseti
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Posted - 2003.11.12 01:23:00 -
[21]
Quote:
It needs players to able able to claim their territory.
Why is this so urgent? What is it about the current system that is falling short? Are any of the major alliances hurting for resources or space because they can't "claim" their area of space? I don't think so.
Deployables will be a major addition, especially by improving the ability of corporations to move into non-empire space, but right now I don't think the inability to "claim space" is hurting EVE in any way. There are higher priorities.
Veruna Caseti
Ishukone |
agrizla
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Posted - 2003.11.12 01:32:00 -
[22]
Edited by: agrizla on 12/11/2003 01:33:42
Quote:
Veruna, it pretty much already is at that stage, with alliances choking the rest to death.
Even though I now find myself in an alliance I agree 100% with you.
Apart from the last couple of weeks I was a freelancer and alliances were the bane of my life. Not so much stable ones, but new ones springing up/splitting/reforming/etc.
The game needs something that ties the PCs trying to claim an npc region to the npcs. Eg - Angels want you to smuggle weapons. Just something that makes Empire forces dislike you (in general - agents could help) if you are in an alliance in an npc faction area.
The game right now makes no sense and TBH the npc factions are just viewed as npc pirates - which they are not.
More pipe dreams eh?
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Slithereen
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Posted - 2003.11.12 01:46:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Slithereen on 12/11/2003 01:55:18
Instead of deployables, let's make it this way.
Let's have CCP add all the stations in space. Every 0.0 non empire space will have station and stations. They start as NPC stations.
Make the stations >> CONQUERABLE <<. But not destroyable.
If a station is bombarded until its HP is all depleted out, it surrenders to the attacker, and the station cedes its loyalty to the attacker's corp.
The station will be defended by player made sentry guns (destroyable) and player created NPCs.
The player sentry guns are a new class of NPC ships and deployed by jettisoning them off from indys.
The problem of destroyable player stations is that one day, a player can wake up one morning to find out his station is destroyed, and all this assets inside it destroyed as well. He will most likely quit the game, and probably his entire corp as well.
If you allow deployable stations you might have too many in space. There would be no balance.
Conquerable stations do not allow for players to put more than two ships in the hanger; no research and manufacturing facilities, and no shuttles either. Repair, market, insurance, and refining will be available, so is medical and clone upgrades.
Valuable stuff and ships should be placed in an unconquerable station.
Sentries of conquered stations will not fire upon existing inhabitants of the station even if they belonged to the enemy corps fighting the conqueror. They will be allowed to leave with their assets (basically your ship and what you can put in your hold), and not ganked as soon as they leave the station.
Conquerors are allowed to impose taxes upon inhabitants of the station. Repairs done in the station goes to the pocket of the corp who owns it. Station owners do not have the ability to confiscate player assets or ships, or allow to poke into player's hangers.
_______________________________________________
"Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies,
"Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy.
"Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
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Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.11.12 02:16:00 -
[24]
Quote:
"I mean, if a player force sits a huge fleet in the serpentis systems for a couple of months, I kinda think the serpentis people have been beaten."
... With the way the NPCs work currently you can a) have the huge fleet sit in the NPC system for months and not meet single NPC ship for all that time b) decimate the feeble NPC spawns with just single cruiser as you please, until you are bored out of your mind.
Since they are no challenge, pretty much anyone is able to 'beat the NPC people' in this sense, which is pretty ridiculous i'd say... o.O;
I'd have thought you would have pointed out the rather obvious hole in what was proposed:
What happens if a band of pirates take over Amarr?
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Zezman
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Posted - 2003.11.12 05:01:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Zezman on 12/11/2003 05:04:55
No one will ever be able to claim and hold land in Eve because there IS NO LAND IN EVE!!!!!
If you could land on, fly around in, and build upon, a planet - then you could hold territory; especially if that planet had all the major resources. You would then take the focus away from the asteroids, and give it to a sim-planet control system with orbiting gun platforms....
Oh, I'm sorry, I'm talking about an entirely different game there!
(»)(»)
À\Oo/
À=\/=
This is Rat. It is a vermin. It has eaten all of Bunny's lettuce. |
Crimsonjade
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Posted - 2003.11.12 08:57:00 -
[26]
The issue is that major alliances HAVE taken over the 0.0 regions. Now, they have set up shop there, basically control the region and yet are forced to remain under the faction of some phantom pirate corporation.
CCP gives us nothing to show for our efforts, except a ship to cruise around in space in. Offices are a joke and headquarters mean basically nothing.
I can fight someone in a system, dock at a station and he can dock at the same station! WTF is that? He can use the station I have invested billions of isk into as his home just by clicking dock.
The coolest thing I remember about everquest (on pvp servers) is that there were defined boundries. If you wanted to raid it was fairly simple, but you could not just set up shop on their doorstep and play grab a-s-s all day with no risk.
Ownership of space will go a long way in this game.
No pain, no palm; no thorns, no throne; no gall, no glory; no cross, no crown.
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Kaytlin
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Posted - 2003.11.12 09:03:00 -
[27]
Content of such magnitude like taking/holding territories cannot be rushed, theres so many problems that can occur.
When the DEVs get a firm idea of how it will work they will discuss it with us.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2003.11.12 09:40:00 -
[28]
Edited by: j0sephine on 12/11/2003 09:42:46
"I'd have thought you would have pointed out the rather obvious hole in what was proposed:
What happens if a band of pirates take over Amarr? "
Teehee.
"Current Location
Tank CEO Prime (formerly known as Sarum Prime)
Sovereignty: Forsaken Empire
Security Level: 0.0"
:s
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Dark Nyte
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Posted - 2003.11.12 09:45:00 -
[29]
Just to clarify my post I did mean NPc and not PC.
I actually meant PC as in computer but I was too thick to think that if NPC means none player character then PC means
Sorry for the stupidity
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var'ulfur
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Posted - 2003.11.12 14:17:00 -
[30]
people it will be as real as it gets when player stations come into play and with talk of ship yards even more so. if you can only build ships in player owned ship yards the need to keep them safe will be paramount, and with stations also. so gate camping and warp in point gangs will be things of the passed. the best way to defeat your enemy is to take his ability to replace ships away.so if you want to take a place you have to have a fleet to destroy the enemies ability first then control it after. about as real as it gets . |
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