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Scanning by pirates in deadspace?

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Jai Gar Agents of the Veiled Dragon	Posted - 2006.12.05 13:27:00 - [1] Is this for real? I've never been attacked by another player while in a deadspace mission... I thought Deadspace was like an Instanced area only available to you or your ganged people. After all, everything in a deadspace mission area goes away if you complete or decline the mission with the agent. I was mining some Omber found in a corpmate's deadspace when she told the agent mission complete. The Omber went poof! If the Griefers can enter your mission area so easily and gank you, what is the point to playing this damned game anymore? I thought CCP was finally nerfing the pirate's power somewhat with Kali. Instead, I read that they just made it easier for them to ply their **** up * coward trade... How the hell can they do this? I mean, I can't get to the mission spot without using the deadspace gate even if I bookmark a spot IN the mission area! So how the can these damned pirates just pop in on someone? They should be required to use the gate, but the gate should have them locked out! If this is true, it's the last straw... I was really hoping Kali would be the upgrade that made this game more non-player-killer friendly, but it appears my hopes are dashed... I've been playing for nearly 9 months now and I can't afford any of the new ships because I've never been a pirate. In EVE, only the evil have any real chance of getting somewhere... Sorry for all the foul language, but I am madder than I've ever been with this... We've invested months of our lives and not a small amount of money (two accounts) with this game, only to have CCP say " ** you very much! " Our two accounts are officially outta here... If this is true, it's over!
Helison Gallente Times of Ancar THE R0NIN	Posted - 2006.12.05 13:39:00 - [2] Pirates were always able to scan you in deadspace missions and they always had to use the gates themself. Nothing changed for this. I lost a mega in a deadspace mission only one week before Kali. The only change was that it is generally easier now to scan ships.
FalconHawk Amarr Falcon Advanced Industries	Posted - 2006.12.05 13:48:00 - [3] easier and now with recon launchers it will be way faster than before. with good skills and a proper ship with bonus you can easily find the location of the deadspace within less than 2 mins ... and there is no chance to complete a lv4 mission in that time. kiss goodbye to low sec missions, as we wouldn¦t have enough to do with 40+ rats, now we even need to check local every min and scan the system (which won¦t help very much cause the new probes have a higher range than the scanner).
ian666 Minmatar Turbulent	Posted - 2006.12.05 14:33:00 - [4] If you don't want to take a risk go to empire where there is none !
Cosmic Flame	Posted - 2006.12.05 15:11:00 - [5] Edited by: Cosmic Flame on 05/12/2006 15:17:13 Edited by: Cosmic Flame on 05/12/2006 15:11:45 Originally by: ian666 If you don't want to take a risk go to empire where there is none ! Ian you're missing the point. Get out of the box and look at it from a different point of view man. I'm an "evil" bloke just as you are. What you're saying is precisely what people will do. They will go to hi sec empire, or just go to 0.0 claimed space as part of an alliance or something, but they won't do low sec missions. Which means it will become a useless part of the game as the vast majority of people won't do them as it's pointless. Pre Kali i was really in favor of all lvl4 agents being low sec. You'd get a decent reward (nothing compared to 0.0 missions/ratting ofc) with a decent risk to go along with it. Getting killed either during a mission or moving from system to system was part of the risk but it was worth it. And you know very well it was worth it or there wouldn't be people there doing the missions, pre Kali. Now it isn't worth it. The problem here isn't the fact that there are "ooh boohoo piewats kill us" in the game. Hell no that's fun as hell. But not being ever able to finish a mission so long as someone is living in that same area who do nothing else all day but probe the mission runners because it's easy is not exactly what i call a balance. If adaptation means having a game feature become useless then CCP is failing. That's the point you're missing.
Cosmic Flame	Posted - 2006.12.05 15:17:00 - [6] Edited by: Cosmic Flame on 05/12/2006 15:19:36 Also, Ian, another point is low sec becomes a void. Like you said, hi sec = no risk (not totally true but nearly). And 0.0 = risk + great reward. What's the point in living in low sec then? Or rather, what's the point in any sort of content existing there (at least mission related/belts/anything else you can think of)? Just 2 choices: 0.0 or hi sec. Low sec is nothing when it's really supposed to be a transition between 0.0 and hi sec empire (or so i thought).
FalconHawk Amarr Falcon Advanced Industries	Posted - 2006.12.05 15:22:00 - [7] Originally by: ian666 If you don't want to take a risk go to empire where there is none ! why you don¦t move into deep 0.0 and take the rest of the pirates with you? would make low sec safer for mission runners and miners, more players will populate low sec (like ccp wants to)and everyone is happy. But your kind always just spit out "If you don't want to take a risk go to empire" .... it¦s not about taking a risk, it¦s more about commiting suicide. as quoted in several other threads: scanning is way too quick and accurate (and way too easy) pirates can see which mission rats will be there, so they know min 80% of the fitting of the mission runner (especialy how they are tanked) pirates have the advantage that alot of mission rats will help them to kill (just waiting for pirates to whine that omgwtf many killmails went to npcs) mission runners cannot fully concentrate on scanning the system all the time and some probes even have higher range than scanner and last point (i know i missed alot) jumping to ss all the time when someone enters the system is not realy an option.
ian666 Minmatar Turbulent	Posted - 2006.12.05 15:28:00 - [8] ThatÆs the Point there is no point living in low sec its already dead at least this helps people find other people. Scanning down missions wasn't rocket science just took a long time, maybe a mid point would be better or why not make low sec worth bothering with IÆm all for making it more profitable just as long as there is still risk. P.s I do think out of the box if I didn't then I wouldn't be very good at my job now would I, maybe your a mission hoe who loves to pat his nice shiny ship on the wing and only use it for no risk mission running in deep space try watching local its already over powered its not hard to avoid capture only if your stupid.
Cosmic Flame	Posted - 2006.12.05 15:30:00 - [9] Originally by: FalconHawk Originally by: ian666 If you don't want to take a risk go to empire where there is none ! why you don¦t move into deep 0.0 and take the rest of the pirates with you? would make low sec safer for mission runners and miners, more players will populate low sec (like ccp wants to)and everyone is happy. But your kind always just spit out "If you don't want to take a risk go to empire" .... it¦s not about taking a risk, it¦s more about commiting suicide. as quoted in several other threads: scanning is way too quick and accurate (and way too easy) pirates can see which mission rats will be there, so they know min 80% of the fitting of the mission runner (especialy how they are tanked) pirates have the advantage that alot of mission rats will help them to kill (just waiting for pirates to whine that omgwtf many killmails went to npcs) mission runners cannot fully concentrate on scanning the system all the time and some probes even have higher range than scanner and last point (i know i missed alot) jumping to ss all the time when someone enters the system is not realy an option. And that type of comment is always pointless. The problem here isn't a "piewats vs omgwtfnoobcarebears" war. Has nothing to do with whether or not there are or aren't pirates in low sec. If there were none, it wouldn't be low sec, now would it? There problem here is as i stated... low sec missions are now undoable. It has nothing to do with the fact there are pirates there. Who cares? More free targets as they light my overview up like a christmas tree
Jaketh Ivanes Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard	Posted - 2006.12.05 15:46:00 - [10] I'll do low sec missions if I get unscannable mines. Then, after warp-in, i just deploy a few mines.. That would bring risk back to the pirates. As said allready, the risk is entirely on the mission runner, pirates take 0 risk. Where are their risk vs reward?

ian666 Minmatar Turbulent	Posted - 2006.12.05 15:58:00 - [11] Edited by: ian666 on 05/12/2006 16:00:26 Cosmic Flame do you even know what your going on about? ref "low sec missions are now undoable"? LMFAO, you could always scan them the risk was always there Noob. Mines are cool but all this isn't required a mission could always be scanned I do agree that the time it takes is a little to fast with a recon launcher but at the end of a day if a covert scans you down you don't know anyway do the time doesn't really matter now does it just make sure your vigilant and remember you can't just go afk becaue its a mission your in low sec anything goes or look out for probes using the scanner thats what its there for. The main problem is there are less and less targets in low sec people are either docked, POS, or on missions so guess what your now being probed and tbh there is certainly more profit in it then belt hunting, and well if we gate camp your just moan at that also, you can't have it all.
Seishomaru	Posted - 2006.12.05 16:01:00 - [12] Simply moves insidde the rats blob when pirate comes.. when he is close.. us ethat nasty ECM burst (that was NOT nerfed). Make all rats unlock and relock.. 50% should re lock him. now scramble him.. and since YOu have tanked for the NPC damage and he is probably ganking.. ...
ian666 Minmatar Turbulent	Posted - 2006.12.05 16:05:00 - [13] Edited by: ian666 on 05/12/2006 16:05:42 At last someone with half a brain and not omg nerf nerf nerf its like so unfair !! or how about use some intel and work out the covert? then you can inform everyone when they are in local scanning missions they will soon get bored if there are no targets.
Belhorn Battlebeard Turbulent	Posted - 2006.12.05 16:20:00 - [14] Jeez, these anti-pies want it all these days - fyi, piracy is not just some easy task, there's more involved than just scanning down mission runners. On the same subject however, I think there are a good few good ideas out there to continue CCP's trend of "balancing" - like making low-sec missions a lot more profitable and worth the risk. But to see people moaning about being probed down when they have ACCEPTED a mission with a "low sec warning" in bright red is ludicrious - what would be the point in thay warning if there was no risk of getting attacked? Also, one comment from the O/P "I can't afford any of the new ships because I've never been a pirate" - in case you weren't aware mate, piracy is more for fun than profit, I make next to nothing doing it, I have to rely on a carebear alt - the majority of people I know with large wallets are mission runners, like yourself. 'Bel
ian666 Minmatar Turbulent	Posted - 2006.12.05 16:34:00 - [15] :-) thats the thing we play both sides and also do lev 4 missions in low sec ! Maybe you should pirate for a bit it might teach you a thing or 2 boys like how not to get WTFPWN wine wine wine.
Gaogan Gallente Solar Storm Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.05 16:36:00 - [16] What part of "Low sec is dangerous" don't you get? Want me to call you a Waambulance?
Allen Deckard Gallente LFC Lotka Volterra	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:05:00 - [17] I think some of you are missing the point. Personally I find missions boring so I dont do them anymore. BUT 1. To run missions takes a certain setup typically. This setup isn't intune with pvp typically. 2. People *** all the time about not enough people in low sec. (usually people ***in are pirates go figure) 3. Scan probes have always found dead space correct. BUT scan probes used to be found on the scanner now they are not. Thus you have no idea your being scanned anylonger. 4. Some say watch local. Yes you can watch local. Fine and dandy now what ur gonna jump out of the mission every time someone passes threw the system? not all pirates are neg not all neg are pirates. So you take a 2 hour mission and turn it into 8 yah thats alot of fun. 5. Hmm maybe counter with "bring a bunch of friends to do the mission" yah that makes sence It simply boils down to the simple fact that while few did the low sec missions before less are going to do them now. This simply means even less people for low sec. Personally the only counter I can think of myself is to take the mission sit at the entrance gate with a short range gank setup and wait for the pirate to warp in on you as he'll be right next to you. But then again your not getting anything done are ya. This is all just my opinion personally I gave up on low sec a long time ago it's not a place to make any isk so I leave it to the pirates and the noobs that go there to get killed.
Tribunal FIRMA Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:24:00 - [18] For the record, Turbulent is a pirate corp that lives off of mission runners in Placid, so I would take what they say with a grain of salt. "We can't all be heroes, because somebody has to sit on the curb and applaud when they go by." - Will Rogers
ian666 Minmatar Turbulent	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:31:00 - [19] Edited by: ian666 on 05/12/2006 17:34:05 LOL, We live off whatever is for the take in plaicd were PIRATES, but we don't just hunt mission runners don't forget we also gate camp !! OMG the camp gates nerf nerf nerf I also want Intsa warping BS I take it you have emmm been owned :-) MMUUHHAAAAAA. Tell me what is wrong with killing mission runners? o wait its pirating it doesn't matter what we do the point is there is nothing wrong with it nore probing, we just use it and well you wine about it LOL keep to your insta docks and instant local, funny thing is you have it all and yet your still stupid and get killed LMFAO Noobs.
Thundernova	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:35:00 - [20] "The problem here isn't the fact that there are "ooh boohoo piewats kill us" in the game. Hell no that's fun as hell. But not being ever able to finish a mission so long as someone is living in that same area who do nothing else all day but probe the mission runners because it's easy is not exactly what i call a balance. If adaptation means having a game feature become useless then CCP is failing."

ian666 Minmatar Turbulent	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:39:00 - [21] \Agreed its all about the hunt no one wants a simple gank where is the fun !! but I don't expect that you can do a mission in Low sec and not have any risk of being probed either, the old way was very long and a hard task, the new way is a little to easy i agreed so like I said before CCP need to find the middle.
R0ze Hounds of Basgerin	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:40:00 - [22] Originally by: ian666 Edited by: ian666 on 05/12/2006 17:34:05 I also want Intsa warping BS Come on.. You have now an instant warp (okay ready after few secs) to whatever you want in whatever ship you want (not restricted to gang) :)
Tribunal FIRMA Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.12.05 17:51:00 - [23] Originally by: ian666 Edited by: ian666 on 05/12/2006 17:34:05 LOL, We live off whatever is for the take in plaicd were PIRATES, but we don't just hunt mission runners don't forget we also gate camp !! OMG the camp gates nerf nerf nerf I also want Intsa warping BS I take it you have emmm been owned :-) MMUUHHAAAAAA. Tell me what is wrong with killing mission runners? o wait its pirating it doesn't matter what we do the point is there is nothing wrong with it nore probing, we just use it and well you wine about it LOL keep to your insta docks and instant local, funny thing is you have it all and yet your still stupid and get killed LMFAO Noobs. I haven't see a Turbulent gate camp yet. All I've seen are probes all over the place while 2-4 of you guys are hiding in local. As far as getting "owned", please. You should check your killboard before spouting out nonsense as you will not see my name on it. I'm more worried about the NPCs in my mission deadspace then one of you guys warping in. "We can't all be heroes, because somebody has to sit on the curb and applaud when they go by." - Will Rogers
Mad Rage Amarr Doom Guard	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:16:00 - [24] lol this is crazy where the fun when there no pirates people that cry read this i am a mission runner in safe space i got killed a few times in a safe space and low sec piracy is part of the game its pvp fun the soul reason i hate wow i hate carebares (well am kidda one my self but the fact is) lineage 2 and eve and so on they are massive pvp and games you play how you wanna play its freedom of choice heres an old say "tired of getting killed lvl up and have your revange" i got poped by a guy when i had a destoryer i wanted my revange i killed him in a cruiser (ashimmu) yes sound imposible god gave you a brain use it all the items can make omne ship withstand mission and player assuilt i used that kind of set up on my ship pvp and mission ablity (less fitting lol needs) if you do not like the game you can leave and spare the lag lol and for all the carebares out there if you don;t like it go play on the test server or wow coz am a mission runner also (kidda of a carebare) but i do not whine everything i lose a ship coz i know i will get my cold blooded revange
Shayla Etherodyne	Posted - 2006.12.05 18:43:00 - [25] To put it simple: mision running in low sec don't pay enough to repay the lost ships, so we aren't interested.
Belhorn Battlebeard Turbulent	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:06:00 - [26] Originally by: Tribunal For the record, Turbulent is a pirate corp that lives off of mission runners in Placid, so I would take what they say with a grain of salt. Thanks for the pointless post talking us down mate, I'm sure everyone realy really appreciated those pearls of wisdom. You're like those people on Jerry Springer than just say things for a cheer (crowd-pleasers). I take what YOU say with a pinch of salt.
Ironnight Caldari Bloody Needles	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:20:00 - [27] Might as well give pirates a option to warp to a mission, when a missionrunner pulls a mission from an agent, this way a pirate could be waiting at the gate as the missionrunner warps in, it would save us all a lot of time, well not a lot of time, but still. Guess my alt is now an retired low sec missionrunner
Cosmic Flame	Posted - 2006.12.05 20:05:00 - [28] Originally by: ian666 \Agreed its all about the hunt no one wants a simple gank where is the fun !! but I don't expect that you can do a mission in Low sec and not have any risk of being probed either, the old way was very long and a hard task, the new way is a little to easy i agreed so like I said before CCP need to find the middle. Took you awhile but you finally got there.. sort of. Yeah, the risk was always there, but people still had a chance. Now, there is no chance. I'm not referring to combat, i'm referring to being able to finish the mission. If i want a fight i won't go doing missions now will i? Like i said, and like you said as well, people will adapt. But the problem is adaptation is going to mean not do any low sec agents because it won't be worth it. I'm sorry to see your atitude by calling me a noob. I don't recall offending you or your corp in any way. You clearly don't know how "profitable" those missions really are compared to the increased risk now involved. Another curious thing is how one of your corp mates mentioned how "hard" it was to scan down mission runners pre kali. I never thought it was hard. I did it on multiple occasions. However i did agree the probing system needed an overhaul, but this is overkill. I still remember a time when there were NO probes in game at all. Finding a person at their safe spot was really challenging and took real skill. Now, my grandmother can do it. No skill.
Cosmic Flame	Posted - 2006.12.05 20:18:00 - [29] Originally by: Belhorn Battlebeard the majority of people I know with large wallets are mission runners, like yourself. I suppose the mission runners who do nothing else but run missions every day (that's gotta be boring) might have a decent sized wallet. But i can think of much richer people: T2 producers.
GTSI	Posted - 2006.12.05 20:26:00 - [30] Having had personal experience of low sec mission running and Turbys, i feel i should chuck my hat in the ring for this post. Firstly, pirates are generally some of the poorer players in eve due to the fact that the pickings are so small. Secondly if you pirate in low sec you invariably lose your sec status making it difficult to replenish your ships and mods due to restricted access to hisec hubs. Scanning for ships used to be a nightmare and only the best skilled players were able to pinpoint a player and warp on top of him within jamming range, in my mind it makes this a talent that if correctly used will reap rewards and rightly so due to the difficulty. For a few months i ran missions in low sec space around the Turbulent lads, they caught me once during a 3 month mission running period and they landed right on top of me. I was jammed and scrammed then very efficiently popped. Damien Smith was even kind enough to take a screenie of it and give me a link! The point of this is that I made some good lp and isk doing the missions and only got popped once (Risk Vs Reward) they were polite and didnt smack at all. If you want easy money go run lvl4 in hi sec, can make good money with no risk whatsoever. If you want more rewards you will have to take the rough with the smooth and go low sec. If you want loads of isk get your ass into a 0.0 alliance and go do missions or plex's to make the big bucks. The bottom line is this, whatever you choose to do STOP WHINING LIKE A BABY AND GO DO IT!!!!!! Its just a game.



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