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Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1106
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 10:23:00 -
[1] - Quote
November wrapup: discussed some issues with Crucible and learned a little about what is upcoming. In brief, more crucibility.
Nullsec: discussed many tweaks to nullsec to promote conflict, including possibility of destructible stations and changes to drone loot and moons.
Little things: FW/Wormholes: presented lists of small changes to improve these areas of the game. Hopefully they will get some love.
Game balance: discussed ships, classes, the new ships, global issues, possible new role for EAS ships, continued evolution of supercaps.
Future highlevel discussion: very broad discussion of where the game is going in the longer term. Shorter term is fixing current systems.
Crimewatch: Greyscale presented a proposal for rewriting Crimewatch, the system that handles aggression, criminal flags, and so on. It's basically a big ball of tangled code, and CCP wants to streamline and move the various functions into independent units of code. We really liked the new concept. CSM - because I have not yet plumbed the depths of my inherent masochism! CSM 6 Activities Summary | My CSM blog |
Adhar Khorin
AK Sciences
2
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Posted - 2011.12.09 11:18:00 -
[2] - Quote
Thanks Trebor, really appreciate the quick summaries. Good to hear more Crucibility vs. Crucifixion is coming. |
Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
254
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Posted - 2011.12.09 11:23:00 -
[3] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Nullsec: discussed many tweaks to nullsec to promote conflict, including possibility of destructible stations and changes to drone loot and moons. No word on changing the way system "ownership" can change hands? So we're stuck with a light modification of the current SOV system? |
Geksz
The Fountain
3
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 12:48:00 -
[4] - Quote
Any news on how they gona handle expansions and bugfixes/iterations in the future? (for example: expansions get new features in, or rewritten old features, and between expansions and in expansions we get bugfixes, and balance changes) |
St Mio
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
164
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 13:14:00 -
[5] - Quote
Yay CSM |
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
126
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 14:35:00 -
[6] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:(...)
Nullsec: discussed many tweaks to nullsec to promote conflict, including possibility of destructible stations and changes to drone loot and moons.
(...)
Huh. Quoting myself, talking about POCOs:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:That's lowsec/nullsec business as usual, where novelties are split between any of these two cathegories:
- things that favor big corps - things that harm small corps
'nuff said. So... no affordable NEx store... no full-fledged Incarna... no new casual content... no new solo content... no new PvE content...-á
Why should I keep paying to play this game? |
ninjaholic
Aliastra Gallente Federation
19
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 14:49:00 -
[7] - Quote
Awesome. Thanks for the updates!
Support Eve's own built-in Battle-Recorder! |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1380
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 15:48:00 -
[8] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Trebor Daehdoow wrote:(...)
Nullsec: discussed many tweaks to nullsec to promote conflict, including possibility of destructible stations and changes to drone loot and moons.
(...) Huh. Quoting myself, talking about POCOs: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:That's lowsec/nullsec business as usual, where novelties are split between any of these two cathegories:
- things that favor big corps - things that harm small corps 'nuff said.
Malcanis' Law applies to small corps in 0.0 as much as it does to new players in EVE. I have never yet seen a change to sov 0.0 suggested "to help small corps/alliances" that would not in fact be hugely to the advantage of large strong alliances.
In fact I challenge you to produce a workable one. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
259
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 16:13:00 -
[9] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Malcanis' Law applies to small corps in 0.0 as much as it does to new players in EVE. I have never yet seen a change to sov 0.0 suggested "to help small corps/alliances" that would not in fact be hugely to the advantage of large strong alliances.
In fact I challenge you to produce a workable one. I caution you, don't hold your breath. |
Velicitia
Open Designs
181
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 17:40:00 -
[10] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Malcanis wrote:Malcanis' Law applies to small corps in 0.0 as much as it does to new players in EVE. I have never yet seen a change to sov 0.0 suggested "to help small corps/alliances" that would not in fact be hugely to the advantage of large strong alliances.
In fact I challenge you to produce a workable one. I caution you, don't hold your breath.
(too bad it's not blue) |
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Pavel Bidermann
whips chains and ballgags Care Factor
32
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Posted - 2011.12.09 18:15:00 -
[11] - Quote
Thanks for the update. I can't say I feel good about that list though.
More stuff to be destroyed by the east/west block and drive out the small and even larger independant alliances from null. Actually, those types of alliances in null will be pretty much extinct next year, so I guess it really doesn't matter. Why is it you think people will go to null again?
Definately not looking forward to the changes in high sec. Not that it doesn't need work, but it seems to be tailored more and more to help null sec again.
I voted for you but I have to say that over the past year I have become very anti CSM. I don't have anything against you personnally and I know some of you are trying to make it work, but its broken. The idea was really good, but the results have been terrible. We'll see if there is another CSM or not. If it does go up for a vote again I think we can expect the same poor results. |
Feligast
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
460
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 18:56:00 -
[12] - Quote
Pavel Bidermann wrote:Thanks for the update. I can't say I feel good about that list though.
Since the changes your hard work have produced haven't directly and significantly improved everything I, and only I, want, the CSM is obviously a total failure.
Fixed those :words: of yours there. |
Pavel Bidermann
whips chains and ballgags Care Factor
33
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 19:17:00 -
[13] - Quote
Feligast wrote:Pavel Bidermann wrote:Thanks for the update. I can't say I feel good about that list though.
Since the changes your hard work have produced haven't directly and significantly improved everything I, and only I, want, the CSM is obviously a total failure. Fixed those :words: of yours there.
How does addressing 2 items on that list translate to "everything"? A little bored are we? Maybe you have poor skills in comparing statements? |
Pavel Bidermann
whips chains and ballgags Care Factor
33
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 19:18:00 -
[14] - Quote
OOPS! You're a Goon. That answers that. I should have read that first. Sorry. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1382
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 19:48:00 -
[15] - Quote
Pavel Bidermann wrote:Thanks for the update. I can't say I feel good about that list though.
More stuff to be destroyed by the east/west block and drive out the small and even larger independant alliances from null. Actually, those types of alliances in null will be pretty much extinct next year, so I guess it really doesn't matter. Why is it you think people will go to null again?
There aren't any independant alliances in sov 0.0 now, and I don't think there have been for at least a year (discounting the occasional temporary station-snatch) and perhaps more, depending on your exact definition of "independant".
Furthermore, unless CCP radically alter the way space works, there aren't ever likely to be any either. The place for small independent corps/alliances is W-space, where that radical alteration has already taken place and numerous small entities are quietly going about their business as you read this.
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Pavel Bidermann
whips chains and ballgags Care Factor
35
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 19:54:00 -
[16] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Pavel Bidermann wrote:Thanks for the update. I can't say I feel good about that list though.
More stuff to be destroyed by the east/west block and drive out the small and even larger independant alliances from null. Actually, those types of alliances in null will be pretty much extinct next year, so I guess it really doesn't matter. Why is it you think people will go to null again? There aren't any independant alliances in sov 0.0 now, and I don't think there have been for at least a year (discounting the occasional temporary station-snatch) and perhaps more, depending on your exact definition of "independant". Furthermore, unless CCP radically alter the way space works, there aren't ever likely to be any either. The place for small independent corps/alliances is W-space, where that radical alteration has already taken place and numerous small entities are quietly going about their business as you read this.
WH space has been sounding better and better these days. That's one thing I haven't done. Scanned down plenty of them but haven't gone in one.
I'm currently in an independant alliance so they do exist. We don't rent and we have a little bit of space. I helped get that space but after we got it I no longer cared. It turns out that the whole thing got boring fast, but that's just me. Low sec was a bit of hassle but not bad. There isn't any reason to be there though. Doesn't matter, since the big blocks will eventually push everybody out of the south. They seem to still be hurting from all the earlier sov grinding. |
Rex Glendower
Mordus Faction
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 20:07:00 -
[17] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Trebor Daehdoow wrote:(...)
Nullsec: discussed many tweaks to nullsec to promote conflict, including possibility of destructible stations and changes to drone loot and moons.
(...) Huh. Quoting myself, talking about POCOs: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:That's lowsec/nullsec business as usual, where novelties are split between any of these two cathegories:
- things that favor big corps - things that harm small corps 'nuff said. Malcanis' Law applies to small corps in 0.0 as much as it does to new players in EVE. I have never yet seen a change to sov 0.0 suggested "to help small corps/alliances" that would not in fact be hugely to the advantage of large strong alliances. In fact I challenge you to produce a workable one.
ok ill propose that null systems have dead space pockets were corps can anchor and password protect warp gates in to the pocket. sizes on the pockets can restrict number of ships in pockets and dead space anomaly's could give anchored pos's a better resistance to attack. granted this does not give small corps or groups sovereignty but in effect allows squatters rights in system that are low traffic high yield systems and allowing a coded homing beacon could allow any ship loged off in said pocket to warp back to dead space pocket by passing any warp gate camps . pockets could have riods minable gase even ice for that matter . further allowing the anchoring of jump portals would alow said corp to move goods out of the pockets to a safer spot in low sec for transport to market. certain restrictions should be applied to make this none exploitable corps anchoring warp gates in dead space should not be allowed to be in alliances should not exceed a preset maximum number of members should receive the same invunerblity to attack on structures as the sovernty holder of the system that they are camping other restrictions may be needed to ensure the safety of squatters
short of turning wh space in to upgradable and claimable systems this would be one of the few things that could benefit the smaller corps and still give them access to null space |
Pavel Bidermann
whips chains and ballgags Care Factor
35
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 20:22:00 -
[18] - Quote
The problem isn't actually the mechanics. There are plenty of mechanics. I agree that they need work, but adding more mechanics wouldn't fix it. The problem is the alliances themselves and no mechanics change seems to fix bad leadership.
I'll address that last statement right here. It isn't bad leadership to use all the tools available to advance your group. It is bad leadership to use those tools to advance your personal agenda at the expense of your own members and the game as a whole. The later is the current problem in null and no mechanic can fix that. The players have to fix that. Sadly, the blocks are so large that nothing in the game will affect them other than one block getting greedier than the other. |
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
126
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 20:42:00 -
[19] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Trebor Daehdoow wrote:(...)
Nullsec: discussed many tweaks to nullsec to promote conflict, including possibility of destructible stations and changes to drone loot and moons.
(...) Huh. Quoting myself, talking about POCOs: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:That's lowsec/nullsec business as usual, where novelties are split between any of these two cathegories:
- things that favor big corps - things that harm small corps 'nuff said. Malcanis' Law applies to small corps in 0.0 as much as it does to new players in EVE. I have never yet seen a change to sov 0.0 suggested "to help small corps/alliances" that would not in fact be hugely to the advantage of large strong alliances. In fact I challenge you to produce a workable one.
I am working along the "cross section" concept: introduce something that hits harder to bigger targets; somehting that hits elephants but misses maggots.
FAI, NPC uber-fleets wreaking havoc on player-owned assets, depending on how big is the owner corporation/alliance as measured by sovereignty, member count, blued players, and so. And I mean wreak havoc, drop whatever it takes to annihilate a structure within minutes and do so without warning. Preferably when most of the alliance is asleep. Also, NPC won't drop anything but garbage when blown out. Let the universe predate on the bigger fishes for a change...
Or, FAI 2, something I already suggested in the past, a stacking penalty for fleets based on both raw and differential EHP & DPS, dynamically adapting, and fit with various safeguards to prevent cheating the system with partial drops, retreats and reinforcements.
Being big should have shortcomings and handicaps, being small shud allow escape, evasion and surgical capability. Being big is a win-win because CCP wanted to brag about thousands of ships in a battle, but they're killing the game to themselves and everyone... So... no affordable NEx store... no full-fledged Incarna... no new casual content... no new solo content... no new PvE content...-á
Why should I keep paying to play this game? |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
1382
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 20:47:00 -
[20] - Quote
Yeah pretty much what I expected. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
|
Krios Ahzek
Juvenis Iratus
273
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 20:54:00 -
[21] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
FAI, NPC uber-fleets wreaking havoc on player-owned assets, depending on how big is the owner corporation/alliance as measured by sovereignty, member count, blued players, and so. And I mean wreak havoc, drop whatever it takes to annihilate a structure within minutes and do so without warning. Preferably when most of the alliance is asleep. Also, NPC won't drop anything but garbage when blown out. Let the universe predate on the bigger fishes for a change...
Or, FAI 2, something I already suggested in the past, a stacking penalty for fleets based on both raw and differential EHP & DPS, dynamically adapting, and fit with various safeguards to prevent cheating the system with partial drops, retreats and reinforcements.
Being big should have shortcomings and handicaps, being small shud allow escape, evasion and surgical capability. Being big is a win-win because CCP wanted to brag about thousands of ships in a battle, but they're killing the game to themselves and everyone...
1.Spend hours setting up a POS and shipping stuff. NPC supercap fleet hotdrops and alpha strikes it in a cycle. Get 2000 friends together, beat it back. No salvage or drops.
Yeah, perfect idea.
2. My fleet is big so our armor magically gros thinner and our guns shoot wet tissue instead of tungsten rounds. People just wouldn't form fleets.
This is beyond dumb, I hope you're trolling.
Do not take me for some conjurer of cheap tricks. |
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
126
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 20:56:00 -
[22] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Yeah pretty much what I expected.
Malcanis the clairvoyant. So... no affordable NEx store... no full-fledged Incarna... no new casual content... no new solo content... no new PvE content...-á
Why should I keep paying to play this game? |
Krios Ahzek
Juvenis Iratus
273
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 21:04:00 -
[23] - Quote
Came in expecting dumb ideas, left content Do not take me for some conjurer of cheap tricks. |
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
126
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 21:05:00 -
[24] - Quote
Krios Ahzek wrote:Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
FAI, NPC uber-fleets wreaking havoc on player-owned assets, depending on how big is the owner corporation/alliance as measured by sovereignty, member count, blued players, and so. And I mean wreak havoc, drop whatever it takes to annihilate a structure within minutes and do so without warning. Preferably when most of the alliance is asleep. Also, NPC won't drop anything but garbage when blown out. Let the universe predate on the bigger fishes for a change...
Or, FAI 2, something I already suggested in the past, a stacking penalty for fleets based on both raw and differential EHP & DPS, dynamically adapting, and fit with various safeguards to prevent cheating the system with partial drops, retreats and reinforcements.
Being big should have shortcomings and handicaps, being small shud allow escape, evasion and surgical capability. Being big is a win-win because CCP wanted to brag about thousands of ships in a battle, but they're killing the game to themselves and everyone...
1.Spend hours setting up a POS and shipping stuff. NPC supercap fleet hotdrops and alpha strikes it in a cycle. Get 2000 friends together, beat it back. No salvage or drops. Yeah, perfect idea.
Stay little. Let the Big Man look for a bigger one to crush.
Quote:2. My fleet is big so our armor magically gros thinner and our guns shoot wet tissue instead of tungsten rounds. People just wouldn't form fleets.
This is beyond dumb, I hope you're trolling.
No. Your LOS is blocked by your own ships, spreading your fleet opens gaps, wider formations take longer to assemble and maneuver, supply lines become critical, the more field you control the thinner are your resources in any certain point... those are Real World drawbacks to being big which EVE simply ignores by making ships that magically hit each other no matter what's in between nor where in 360-¦ it's located, that don't need refueling, that can instantly jump where they want, and so and so. So... no affordable NEx store... no full-fledged Incarna... no new casual content... no new solo content... no new PvE content...-á
Why should I keep paying to play this game? |
Pavel Bidermann
whips chains and ballgags Care Factor
37
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 21:20:00 -
[25] - Quote
I would love LOS issues in game. Frigate PVP in an asteroid belt would be awesome! Also, ship explosions as an area effect plus electronic interferance from large numbers or electronically intensive ships being bunched (slower targeting and such). |
Lord Zim
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
262
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 21:30:00 -
[26] - Quote
I've an idea: remove SOV mechanics. Let people own what they can actively defend on a day to day basis. |
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
126
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 21:45:00 -
[27] - Quote
Pavel Bidermann wrote:I would love LOS issues in game. Frigate PVP in an asteroid belt would be awesome! Also, ship explosions as an area effect plus electronic interferance from large numbers or electronically intensive ships being bunched (slower targeting and such).
That can't be implemented in EVE, it would make the hamsters explode, same as implementing actual trajectory anlaysis to determine hit/miss. So... no affordable NEx store... no full-fledged Incarna... no new casual content... no new solo content... no new PvE content...-á
Why should I keep paying to play this game? |
Krios Ahzek
Juvenis Iratus
277
|
Posted - 2011.12.09 21:58:00 -
[28] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Krios Ahzek wrote:Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
FAI, NPC uber-fleets wreaking havoc on player-owned assets, depending on how big is the owner corporation/alliance as measured by sovereignty, member count, blued players, and so. And I mean wreak havoc, drop whatever it takes to annihilate a structure within minutes and do so without warning. Preferably when most of the alliance is asleep. Also, NPC won't drop anything but garbage when blown out. Let the universe predate on the bigger fishes for a change...
Or, FAI 2, something I already suggested in the past, a stacking penalty for fleets based on both raw and differential EHP & DPS, dynamically adapting, and fit with various safeguards to prevent cheating the system with partial drops, retreats and reinforcements.
Being big should have shortcomings and handicaps, being small shud allow escape, evasion and surgical capability. Being big is a win-win because CCP wanted to brag about thousands of ships in a battle, but they're killing the game to themselves and everyone...
1.Spend hours setting up a POS and shipping stuff. NPC supercap fleet hotdrops and alpha strikes it in a cycle. Get 2000 friends together, beat it back. No salvage or drops. Yeah, perfect idea. Stay little. Let the Big Man look for a bigger one to crush. Quote:2. My fleet is big so our armor magically gros thinner and our guns shoot wet tissue instead of tungsten rounds. People just wouldn't form fleets.
This is beyond dumb, I hope you're trolling.
No. Your LOS is blocked by your own ships, spreading your fleet opens gaps, wider formations take longer to assemble and maneuver, supply lines become critical, the more field you control the thinner are your resources in any certain point... those are Real World drawbacks to being big which EVE simply ignores by making ships that magically hit each other no matter what's in between nor where in 360-¦ it's located, that don't need refueling, that can instantly jump where they want, and so and so.
I joined EVE because of the possibility of having huge 500 vs 500 no holds barred PVP battles, something which little/none others MMO can do. Why do you want EVE to be full of 20 vs 20 fights again?
If you're going to nerf blogs, at least go for true line of sight. Random abstract stacking nerfs are just horrible. Do not take me for some conjurer of cheap tricks. |
Trelo Aumer
The Ironmongery
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.10 18:14:00 -
[29] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Crimewatch: Greyscale presented a proposal for rewriting Crimewatch, the system that handles aggression, criminal flags, and so on. It's basically a big ball of tangled code, and CCP wants to streamline and move the various functions into independent units of code. We really liked the new concept. Is this a purely technical proposal aimed at making the system easier to maintain/adjust and increasing its performance, or were there any proposed changes to the game mechanics this code handles? |
Trebor Daehdoow
Dirt Nap Squad Dirt Nap Squad.
1133
|
Posted - 2011.12.11 10:12:00 -
[30] - Quote
Trelo Aumer wrote:Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Crimewatch: Greyscale presented a proposal for rewriting Crimewatch, the system that handles aggression, criminal flags, and so on. It's basically a big ball of tangled code, and CCP wants to streamline and move the various functions into independent units of code. We really liked the new concept. Is this a purely technical proposal aimed at making the system easier to maintain/adjust and increasing its performance, or were there any proposed changes to the game mechanics this code handles? Mostly the former, but some of the latter. Nothing set in stone though. CSM - because I have not yet plumbed the depths of my inherent masochism! CSM 6 Activities Summary | My CSM blog |
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