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HAC's... worth it?

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Lady Kinla Dark Empire Fleet Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.13 15:20:00 - [1] I was looking at the Tech II ships and I have set my sights on getting a Deimos. But a few days ago there was a thread that said that HAC's weren't all that great. Is there any truth in this and if there is what Tech II ship would you suggest I train for if I want to pvp? --------------------------- Aimez- "oh ****, this is empire......." Thanks for the loot, and next time you go out to pirate, carry more tech 2 plz =)
Scourpius	Posted - 2006.12.13 15:34:00 - [2] My 2c.... HACs ARENT that great. They're like T1 cruisers with marginally better tank and buffed resists. Basically they're more survivable than T1 ships, but in EVE if you get ganked by a couple ships or caught in a large bubble with frig tacklers and BS snipers ain't nothing you can do to survive. Oh, and even speedtanks cry when a Munin shows up, my Curse dies about 20secs after they warp in to support a gang. Honestly the only reason to go with T2 Cruisers is when you have billions just sitting around waiting to be wasted or when you need a T2 ship that has no T1 equivalent, like the Stealth Recons (the ones that an warp cloaked). If you're looking to fly a Deimos just fly a T2 fitted Thorax until you can afford a stable of about 10 Deimos. Oh, and the upside to flying a Thorax is that people will actually engage you, where as in my Curse I can't get anyone to engage unless they have at least 4v1 superiority with at least 2 in T2 ships. Only place I can get a decent fight is the test server.
Waxau Liberty Rogues	Posted - 2006.12.13 15:36:00 - [3] Totally disagree with the previous poster - HACS are well worth it. Theyremot than just t2 cruisers. They ganking, tanking, pwnage ships. If you meet any ship cruiser or below roughly (with exception) 1v1, then a hac will beat them. I wont go into the ins and outs, but HACs are deffinately worth it, and if you specialise, theyre fantastic.
6Bagheera9 Shadows of the Dead Xelas Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.13 15:38:00 - [4] Some HACs are really good, but most that are also extremely expensive. The only good HAC I know of that that doesn't cost an arm and a leg is the eagle. The Munnin may also be a good buy since the patch.
Darknar Gallente Ascendant Strategies Inc. The Volition Cult	Posted - 2006.12.13 15:48:00 - [5] Edited by: Darknar on 13/12/2006 15:49:09 question are HAcs worth it? answer? what are you going to use it for. but seriosly. HAcs may be a dream, its even my dream, but when it come down to it they are ships for people with too much isk right at this moment. there not really even solopwn mobiles, they are a great addition to a fleet though. for solo work. go buy yourself a cruiser , its cheaper to lose and probably more fun for you and the other person you attack. HACs are specilised one trick ponie ships. as soon as you see one you know what its good at and try to counter it. T1 ships on the other hand a a little bit harder to predict, unless its a poorly fitted thorax ***ot to mention, i dont own a hac and i dont think 150 million for a cruiser is worth it
Pottsey Gallente Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2006.12.13 15:58:00 - [6] Hacs are not worth it as Command Ships are cheaper, tougher, do more DPS and more flexible. There just better all around. Passive shield tanking guide click here
Gridan	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:21:00 - [7] HACs are worth it, namely the ishtar. Ishtars make me want to gut myself for rolling caldari, and that really says something. Great manueverability, 375m3 drone bay with hac skill to 5, great innate shield/armor resists. It's like a ultra-hard shelled super fast mini-dominix with the same-sized drone bay. If you want to solo pvp there is nothing better than a good HAC, if you're into gang stuff you might as well go with something cheaper imo. Just flying a HAC screams "I have immense amounts of skillpoints" and is intimidating enough to send most people warping for cover only to cry underneath their sheets at night.
Lady Kinla Dark Empire Fleet Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:24:00 - [8] So basically exactly what I'm looking for. People get so nervous when they see a HAC that they start making mistakes that they normally wouldn't. --------------------------- Aimez- "oh ****, this is empire......." Thanks for the loot, and next time you go out to pirate, carry more tech 2 plz =)
Alowishus Shadow Company	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:32:00 - [9] Quote: in EVE if you get ganked by a couple ships or caught in a large bubble with frig tacklers and BS snipers ain't nothing you can do to survive. Hi. This is true of every ship in Eve.
Lady Kinla Dark Empire Fleet Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:34:00 - [10] Now just one more question. Ishtar or Deimos? --------------------------- Aimez- "oh ****, this is empire......." Thanks for the loot, and next time you go out to pirate, carry more tech 2 plz =)
Electric Cucumber Amarr coracao ardente Sani Khal'Vecna	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:37:00 - [11] Edited by: Electric Cucumber on 13/12/2006 16:40:20 Edited by: Electric Cucumber on 13/12/2006 16:39:34 Originally by: Alowishus Quote: in EVE if you get ganked by a couple ships or caught in a large bubble with frig tacklers and BS snipers ain't nothing you can do to survive. Hi. This is true of every ship in Eve. not interceptors and vagabonds Hac's are very powerful and have great resistances, but I wouldn't go solo in one unless your in a vagabond. They're just too easy to lose. imo battlecruisers,especially the tier 2 are more worth it isk wise, they are also more powerful.
weedmasta Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:42:00 - [12] HACs are worth it, it's just that some people don't know how to fly them, that's why they complain about them, simple as that.
Lady Kinla Dark Empire Fleet Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:45:00 - [13] Basically exactly what I was thinking. A friend of mine has a HAC and it is amazing. --------------------------- Aimez- "oh ****, this is empire......." Thanks for the loot, and next time you go out to pirate, carry more tech 2 plz =)
Lady Kinla Dark Empire Fleet Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:45:00 - [14] Basically exactly what I was thinking. A friend of mine has a HAC and it is amazing. --------------------------- Aimez- "oh ****, this is empire......." Thanks for the loot, and next time you go out to pirate, carry more tech 2 plz =)
zwerg Caldari mUfFiN fAcToRy Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:47:00 - [15] well hacs are acutally worth it, when you got your wallet fitted wiht a huge amount of isk, imo hacs are good solo ships, lets take a few examples: a muninn artillary or autocannon is just ownage in pvp aswell as piracy or in a small gang, even in fleet the honey is doing its job. vagabond, no question solo pwnmobile in 1v1 and smaller gangs but: big gang = vaga bad, youre getting called primary and you have to warp away all the time, and if your enemy got web drones, well :/. deimos: nothing more to say, ownage. ishtar, thats absolute rockzzpwnzor, you can do anything with it. YES ANYTHING: PVP, RATTING, PVE, and even mining xD well okay mining suXx hardcore but well if its a must, its a must. the only con in these ships ( hacs ) is that they are really expensive, but if you got gd skills then its cool having/flying one. imo recons are better for solo work. take the pilgrim or the rapier or even rook. /zwerg Save the whales!!! Harpoon some Amarrians!!!!
Alowishus Shadow Company	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:51:00 - [16] No ship in Eve is bad. They all have their uses and figuring out propper usage is a large part of separating good PvPers from great PvPers. However, some ships are a bit more expensive than they should be. A HAC should be slightly more (10-20% or so) expensive than a Tier 1 BS. But in reality rarity and demand add to the price. You can find an Arma BPC just about anywhere. But you will not find a HAC BPC at all. Period (unless your corp owns the BPO and gives members copies for personal use). The inability for all players in Eve to build these ships on their own decreases available supply. Certain ships are considered good, like the Vaga, increases demand. These factors lead to the Vaga being, in my opinion, more expensive than it's ability is worth. But it's still a good ship and value (whether it's worth it) is in the eye of the beholder.
Queen Hades	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:51:00 - [17] Edited by: Queen Hades on 13/12/2006 16:55:10 Yes and no. Yes: I have a Deimos and she is a very good ship, dashing out more than 400 (raw) dps while still having a decent tank (Queen Hades fitting skill and skills 4tw). No: Try to find a role for it. Too expensive for serious pvp and 0.0 operations, too little range for being quicker in level 4 mission than with the usual Megathron 425s / antimatter setup, too uber for level 3s, low sec ratting and usual low sec system security duty. If I was a pirate I would use it to intimidate my prey, but since I'm not I'm still looking for a role.
Audemed Evisceration. Storm Armada	Posted - 2006.12.13 17:04:00 - [18] HACs have many purposes, depending on what they are... For some of them, their entire existence is designed around ganking (zealot, deimos, vaga, munnin in some cases), where others have supporting roles (ishtar, munnin, eagle). Cerb is only suitable for missioning/ratting, and the sacrelige is great for solo PVP (if you can somehow get your damage up to an acceptable level, 85% resists ftw). Personally, I love the zealot for lowsec piracy, but I've (through hard experience) learned that taking it around solo in 0.0 is an excersice in your wallet, as you're very likely to run into a blob SOMEWHERE....
Pottsey Gallente Enheduanni Foundation	Posted - 2006.12.13 17:13:00 - [19] ôIf you want to solo pvp there is nothing better than a good HAC, if you're into gang stuff you might as well go with something cheaper imo. Just flying a HAC screams "I have immense amounts of skillpoints"ö A good Command ships is way better then a HAC and it screams "I have I have immense amounts of skillpoints" more then a HAC as well. Passive shield tanking guide click here
Verizana Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2006.12.13 17:22:00 - [20] OK hacs are worth it pal. It depends on what you can do best with each one though. Cerberus - LVL 4 missions as well as pvp. Eagle - PVP only, sniping. Deimos - PVP only, blasting Ishtar - Missions, PVP. Ishtar can do both very well but you need t2 heavy drones. Zealot - Missions as well as PVP. Can do great tanking as well as firepower. Sacrilege - PVP as well as Missions. Does alot of tanking and not so great firepower. Muninn - Only PVP, Does sniping very well. Vagabond - Only PVP, speedy, small, nice firepower. keep it to the pvp here. My choice atm is the gallente race but I've thought of training for a Cerberus in the coming future.
The Hanz Caldari Waverly Industries	Posted - 2006.12.13 17:37:00 - [21] Originally by: Waxau Totally disagree with the previous poster - HACS are well worth it. Theyremot than just t2 cruisers. They ganking, tanking, pwnage ships. If you meet any ship cruiser or below roughly (with exception) 1v1, then a hac will beat them. I wont go into the ins and outs, but HACs are deffinately worth it, and if you specialise, theyre fantastic. They can kill things smaller than them? EUREKA!
The Hanz Caldari Waverly Industries	Posted - 2006.12.13 17:40:00 - [22] Originally by: Lady Kinla Now just one more question. Ishtar or Deimos? Ishtar. If you really can't decide then try both of them on the test server.
Neon Genesis Gallente Developmental Neogenics Amalgamated	Posted - 2006.12.13 18:29:00 - [23] Nos are so common atm that some hac's just become dead weight when they meet a bs. The ones that arnt totally cap reliant are good though.
Derrios Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.13 18:35:00 - [24] Edited by: Derrios on 13/12/2006 18:36:41 Originally by: Lady Kinla I was looking at the Tech II ships and I have set my sights on getting a Deimos. But a few days ago there was a thread that said that HAC's weren't all that great. Is there any truth in this and if there is what Tech II ship would you suggest I train for if I want to pvp? Talk to me in game when I log in next time Lady. I have posted some quite extensive data on Ishtars on our forums. I get them blown up myself, so I'd be glad to share how to die to a nyx with one as well. edit: also it makes a good platform to go for command ships. That however is a different beast altogether. (ffs this training takes so long). However CBC are sexily powerful. ----------------------------------------------- I got something to put in you. at the *** bar.
John Leitch Gallente Elite Storm Enterprises Storm Armada	Posted - 2006.12.13 18:39:00 - [25] I enjoy using my eagle for gate camps, tends too kill those inties who think they are getting away at 3/4km/sec = no chance :) Dont use the Eagle for anything else though, which is a shame
Derrios Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.13 18:40:00 - [26] Originally by: Audemed HACs have many purposes, depending on what they are... For some of them, their entire existence is designed around ganking (zealot, deimos, vaga, munnin in some cases), where others have supporting roles (ishtar, munnin, eagle). Cerb is only suitable for missioning/ratting, and the sacrelige is great for solo PVP (if you can somehow get your damage up to an acceptable level, 85% resists ftw). Personally, I love the zealot for lowsec piracy, but I've (through hard experience) learned that taking it around solo in 0.0 is an excersice in your wallet, as you're very likely to run into a blob SOMEWHERE.... funny I thought Wraith didnt allow piracy. Or at least that was the line of ** he fed me when I got booted for "insighting" piracy. (telling someone on TS they should pod someone) ;p ----------------------------------------------- I got something to put in you. at the * bar.
Soros 0utbreak	Posted - 2006.12.13 18:44:00 - [27] Edited by: Soros on 13/12/2006 18:43:47 yes. ther fast, ther sleek, and they're sexy. sure other ships do it better. but why bother when ur slow ass hell and look stupid...
Shinjuro Solidline Enterprise Kith of Venal	Posted - 2006.12.13 18:44:00 - [28] Flown 3 races of them (sry amarr I just hate you) and this is what I had determined: With the exception of the vagabond and maybe the eagle depending on how you use it.. they are not worth the price. Command ships and Recon ships are so cheap compared to hac's and they are just as effective if not way more effective.
Derrios Dirty Deeds Corp. Axiom Empire	Posted - 2006.12.13 18:50:00 - [29] command ships take a GRIP of training though. Like months extra just to fly one well. I agree, just its something that should be brought to their attention as well :) ----------------------------------------------- I got something to put in you. at the *** bar.
EPSILON DELTA	Posted - 2006.12.13 18:52:00 - [30] Edited by: EPSILON DELTA on 13/12/2006 18:53:20 get a tier 2 bc, 1/5 the price of hac, 80% the resist of hac, 10% more gank than hac, 50% more tank volume. though that's speaking for the drake compared to cerb, for galentee might not be the case.
Kay Rissa The Priory Shroud Of Darkness	Posted - 2006.12.13 19:06:00 - [31] hac r good, to kill frigs, cruiser, noobs in BC, mining BS and barges... but when i fly my astarte and I see a hac on the scaner, I already know that its a dead hac...(if it's not a vagabond) put it this way, command ships r much better compare to hacs
Audemed Evisceration. Storm Armada	Posted - 2006.12.13 19:24:00 - [32] Originally by: Derrios Originally by: Audemed HACs have many purposes, depending on what they are... For some of them, their entire existence is designed around ganking (zealot, deimos, vaga, munnin in some cases), where others have supporting roles (ishtar, munnin, eagle). Cerb is only suitable for missioning/ratting, and the sacrelige is great for solo PVP (if you can somehow get your damage up to an acceptable level, 85% resists ftw). Personally, I love the zealot for lowsec piracy, but I've (through hard experience) learned that taking it around solo in 0.0 is an excersice in your wallet, as you're very likely to run into a blob SOMEWHERE.... funny I thought Wraith didnt allow piracy. Or at least that was the line of **** he fed me when I got booted for "insighting" piracy. (telling someone on TS they should pod someone) ;p My corp joined storm armada just a few days ago (and I haven't been able to log in for more than two weeks, yay iraq), so my position on the matter still stands
Cold Gorilla Perkone	Posted - 2006.12.13 19:43:00 - [33] hacs are not one trick pony ships dude. Take cerberus for example. can do close and long range well.

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