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SlightlyMad
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Posted - 2003.11.23 11:40:00 -
[1]
Seriously.. you are avoiding the issue.
It is not battleships mining in highsec space that ruins it.. Thats an amateur not seeing the whole picture.
Cause of problem:
----> 1, Not enough Ore! <----
Why?
Because the astroidrespawn logarithm was never mathematicly analyzed.
How fast is the respawnrate of an asteroidfield?
How fast can we expect people to mine?
If the possibility of anyone with 9 harvestors and 8 minerII's would fancy mining in highsec space wasn't thought of... I really don't know what to say.
*
-"You know, we play the "good guys" right? We kill pirates, griefers, retards and general subversive elements in the EVE-Community. To the rest, we are friendly and always prepared to help out. Peo |
Tassadar Beta
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Posted - 2003.11.23 12:04:00 -
[2]
While you have a good point...
 Quote:
-Stopped reading and writing in the forums 2003.10.01 - Happy ever since
really? then whats this :P
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BlackVenom
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Posted - 2003.11.23 12:08:00 -
[3]
I think its cause of the alliance making there * Cough there LOL * space secure and making it impossible to mine cause if u enter u get blown up. SO there actualy making the comunity worse then better offcourse this is my opinion. And offcourse pc pirates but thats normale i dont blame em.
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SlightlyMad
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Posted - 2003.11.23 12:17:00 -
[4]
Quote:
really? then whats this :P
Someoneelse is using my account to post bull****!
*
-"You know, we play the "good guys" right? We kill pirates, griefers, retards and general subversive elements in the EVE-Community. To the rest, we are friendly and always prepared to help out. Peo |
Ariell Lucinwind
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Posted - 2003.11.23 12:23:00 -
[5]
Quote:
Someoneelse is using my account to post bull****!
Snuh?? So you dont believe there is a BS mining problem, and that some one else is posting on your account?  Now I am confused
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Came back cause I love you guys :P |
Infinity Ziona
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Posted - 2003.11.23 12:32:00 -
[6]
Respawn rate in only one factor. Imo these are also important:
NPC's - give very little bonus per kill vs the amount lost to equipping against them.
NPC's - invariably attack your mining drones first, in what seems to be the equivalent of AI Kamikaze attacks, your in a battleship and popping them quickly but they don't care about you as long as your drones die.
Drones - losing 2 harvesters is equivilent to losing 1 miner II. 10 harvesters is 5 miner II's. Using combat drones costs you ore.
Eve Instability - Mining in unsecure space is dangerous due to CTD and CAP bug.
PC pirates - While mining, while in transit to empire space.
Industrials - extremely small cargo holds for the size of the ships. The size is too small to make multiple jump mid to low grade ore hauling very profitable.
JIP camping - it makes people angry and afraid to go into unsecure space
Asteroid Yield / Mineral Density - Good ores are spread out and don't yield a large supply of ore so using secure cans is not really an option as you have to search them out which most probably means moving outside of can range. You either have to use lots of SCC or jettisoned which explode after a limited period of time. Not good when you have to multiple jump to get a hauler.
Selling - selling minerals in 0.0 is hard as theres not many people willing to come pick it up and hauling it past blockades / multiple jumps is reducing your profits dramatically.
Theres probably a few other reasons which make it more profitable to stay in high level systems. These mostly apply to solo miners but imo they're the ones most likely to mine in Empire space anyhow.
Infinity
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IZON
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Posted - 2003.11.23 12:58:00 -
[7]
beta was more fun - sad but so true
"...master! there's a guy in the south village called IZON, he is a Ninja!" |
Lansfear
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Posted - 2003.11.23 16:23:00 -
[8]
Not enough ore.......?
Ever been out to the thousands of .5 and lower belts? Scod the size of moons yeilding 120+ units, omber rocks that yeild 20k units each, kern in the 4-5k's.
The only problem i see with the lack of ores statement are from Gniess, Hemo, Hedb and Jasp. Talk about pathetic yielding rocks.
Cant wait til they push people out of secure space. I'm gonna need lots of popcorn for the fireworks........
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SlightlyMad
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Posted - 2003.11.23 19:18:00 -
[9]
Lansfear. This seem to be the general concern.
And.. I can tell you. If this problem can be caused by a couple of maxed out battleships. Then what will happen if this game ever get more players?
n00bs can mine like crazy too
Thorax or Maller is not _that_ far from most battleships.
"restricting" or "punishing" battleships in secure space would be a highly artificial solution. And those are never ever good.
A specialised miningclass would lift the game a lot in my opinion. We already have an industry class. Build on that!
*
-"You know, we play the "good guys" right? We kill pirates, griefers, retards and general subversive elements in the EVE-Community. To the rest, we are friendly and always prepared to help out. Peo |
Tyrrax Thorrk
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Posted - 2003.11.24 03:08:00 -
[10]
Hehe actually last time I looked harvesters were sold at 400k, and miner IIs at 250-300k |
Skillz
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Posted - 2003.11.24 03:16:00 -
[11]
You're supposed to take the risk for the isk or not.
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Darketh Nightspawn
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Posted - 2003.11.24 03:35:00 -
[12]
Tough luck.... I think BS's mining in safe space should be made legitimate targets, and Concorde should not respond to them being shot.....
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The Reclaimer
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Posted - 2003.11.24 03:45:00 -
[13]
You carebears sicken me. You expect to do a few clicks and and be rich. Its no wonder you get bored. You havent even played Eve.
Personally, I cant see why ppl even bother with harvestors atm. They cost way too much to justify their out put even trained fully imo.
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Infinity Ziona
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Posted - 2003.11.24 05:04:00 -
[14]
"You carebears sicken me. You expect to do a few clicks and and be rich."
And the difference between mining an asteroid and mining a JIP is? Its not just carebears who expect to get rich with a few clicks, its a universal problem.
Infinity
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NGRU Rix
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Posted - 2003.11.24 06:21:00 -
[15]
Here's a thought, this won't fix a damn thing and it's Big fat waste of time and energy.
What is the actual problem anyway? I have read all about it and I still don't understand it. How does limiting BS mining make any difference in the long run other than a knee - jerk response to a bunch of people going wahhh on the forums? Seriously people, what will this possibly truly fix?
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The Reclaimer
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Posted - 2003.11.24 06:46:00 -
[16]
Its to stop ppl from macro mining in battleships. That is what the intent is. I dont believe that nobody can mine in empire space, rather you cant run macros. That is a good thing IMO.
Most pirates dont make money by camping JIP's. They just to blow **** up and make ppl amd.
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NGRU Rix
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Posted - 2003.11.24 06:54:00 -
[17]
Edited by: NGRU Rix on 24/11/2003 06:54:51
Macros? Jumpin jebus on a p0g0 stick...
This has nothing to do with battleships at all really. Macros are lame. The rest is just total bullsh**.
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Madcow
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Posted - 2003.11.24 08:00:00 -
[18]
miner II's are only 100k-140k isk
______________________
I am just a crazy cow |
Miri Tirzan
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Posted - 2003.11.24 08:55:00 -
[19]
This is just more of the whining from the carebear pirates. Why whine about mining in empire space, well, it is not because people get rich from it, as the rich people all live out in the 0.0 alliances. It is because the "pirates" cannot stand up to the PvP players in the alliances so they are trying to get back into Empire Space to kill noobies and anyone else that does not make combat their profession.
It is funny to watch people who's idea of mining is to set with containers and drones out in JIP camps lag killing everyone coming through telling the mining crowd what they are doing wrong.
svetlana - "whining gets you stuff. that is why humans got to the top of the food chain and all the other animals got nerfed."
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Lucre
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Posted - 2003.11.24 09:16:00 -
[20]
Quote:
Personally, I cant see why ppl even bother with harvestors atm. They cost way too much to justify their output even trained fully imo.
Even at 400k, a Harvester will pay for itself after less than 4 hours mining (mining drone 4).
And some of us bought ours when they were only 130k each... :-)
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The Reclaimer
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Posted - 2003.11.24 10:34:00 -
[21]
Edited by: The Reclaimer on 24/11/2003 10:36:14
OK, 4 hours great. What if you lose it in 10 min to npc's?
Add: Btw, I would like to thank the ppl that did buy them from me (ok an alt) for 450K. I stockpiled 100 of them in 9RQ when my corp was friends with Stain (immagine that). You may ask why I had 100, well I got 200 for 2 mil then and we wasted 100 mining bistot and crokite there. Thanks again suxxors.
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EvilEric
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Posted - 2003.11.24 10:51:00 -
[22]
Edited by: EvilEric on 24/11/2003 10:53:06
Edited by: EvilEric on 24/11/2003 10:52:13
Quote:
You carebears sicken me. You expect to do a few clicks and and be rich. Its no wonder you get bored. You havent even played Eve.
Ok the ONLY real offence the BS miners (not talking about the marco ones, as this breaks EULA anyway and should be BANNED) is that they mine in the n00b starting systems, taking away from players who are starting out... and how many of those are there... 12-15 systems?
I agree that BS mining is a no-no in these 1.0-0.8 areas... but that still leaves hundreds of .7, .6, .5. The Mid-Sec space... will that get nerfed too. Will ALL BS mining be lumped in? And most ppl won't go .4 and below because of PC rats like Tank.
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The Reclaimer
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Posted - 2003.11.24 11:00:00 -
[23]
I agree, .7 and below should be fine with maybe a few limitations such as having to buy a mining pass (req. good standing) stuff like that.
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2600
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Posted - 2003.11.24 11:04:00 -
[24]
None of u play the chaos server do u.... There are already mobile refineries in the fight club hangers to play with... industry level 4 etc.
now u can park a mobile in deep 0.0 and just return with the condensed minerals.
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SlightlyMad
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Posted - 2003.11.24 11:05:00 -
[25]
You are avoiding the issue or refuse to see the problem
If a battleship can clean out belts. So can cruisers. We did that with ~10 ppl. Before the time of harvestors and miner II's and astrogeology
*
-"You know, we play the "good guys" right? We kill pirates, griefers, retards and general subversive elements in the EVE-Community. To the rest, we are friendly and always prepared to help out. Peo |
Discorporation
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Posted - 2003.11.24 11:08:00 -
[26]
Yeh, but yer not supposed to do it in 1.0 space, completely risk-free.
Take a look in 1.0 space, at the belts. Then travel 2-6 jps out and check the belts out there.
Lots of ore there, very little in 1.0. Time the Empires start charging you for mining their belts.
[Heterocephalus glaber]
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SlightlyMad
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Posted - 2003.11.24 12:55:00 -
[27]
"yer not supposed to do it in 1.0 space"
Who says that?
Its all driven by risk vs reward.
*Battleships stripmine in 1.0-0.8
If battleships are outlawed or limited in anyway. People will stripmine in cruisers. You just bring an extra thorax for every two battleships you use now. Same result.
The whole point in this game is freedom. Any artificial limitations will bring the game down. You have to make the gameplay equal to all players, n00b or not
*
-"You know, we play the "good guys" right? We kill pirates, griefers, retards and general subversive elements in the EVE-Community. To the rest, we are friendly and always prepared to help out. Peo |
NGRU Rix
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Posted - 2003.11.24 13:43:00 -
[28]
Edited by: NGRU Rix on 24/11/2003 13:46:12
Quote:
"yer not supposed to do it in 1.0 space"
Who says that?
No one says that, it's just ghey to do it. Take your BS (battlship) and go mine in .4 or lower. You'll find better rocks there anyway.
Leave the 1.0, .9 and .8 system to the new players. Give them a chance to get into it.
EDIT: Dude,you must be one miserable basta** by now. 
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Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.11.24 13:51:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Jash Illian on 24/11/2003 13:52:46
For the last time...
It's not an issue of propriety.
It's not an issue over a name.
It's simple math. With enough high capacity mining lasers a person can make more isk mining low end ores in Empire space than they can mining high end ores outside empire space, given the time investment. Toss in the lack of risk and you have people sucking down Scordite with the devs clueless on how to get them to mine Bistot.
That's why I said remove the NPC demand for minerals. The surplus of low end minerals will cause the value of those minerals to drop and make the minerals refined higher end ores more profitable to mine.
If the nerf goes against battleships only, the same issue will lurk with Thoraxes and other cruisers as the ores outside empire space are consumed.
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Ezra Vouland
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Posted - 2003.11.24 13:59:00 -
[30]
booooooo award
They call me trash... TrashGUY |
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