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Arthur Guinness
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Posted - 2003.11.26 14:02:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Arthur Guinness on 26/11/2003 14:15:30
DISCLAIMER
Changes might be made till the tech2 patch hits TQ.
You guys might have heard about the new Research Agents, which will be used to distribute the new Tech2 BPs. Now agent's will be the only way to get tech2 bp's for the first few months.
Research Agents will be located in the following Regions (number behind region is the number of agents): updated list from PS
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Correction: I ran the research agent query on the wrong DB. Here's the lists
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Aridia 5
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Derelik 2
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Devoid 1
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Domain 27
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Essence 15
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Everyshore 6
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Genesis 11
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Great Wildlands 3
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Heimatar 3
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Kador 14
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Khanid 2
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Kor-Azor 5
15:11 <@PapaSmurf> Lonetrek 21
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Metropolis 27
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Molden Heath 3
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Placid 10
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Sinq Laison 14
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Solitude 1
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Syndicate 1
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Tash-Murkon 21
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> The Bleak Lands 7
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> The Citadel 19
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> The Forge 17
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Verge Vendor 11
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> and faction wise:
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Amarr Empire 46
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Caldari State 73
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Gallente Federation 59
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Khanid Kingdom 2
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Minmatar Republic 58
15:12 <@PapaSmurf> Thukker Tribe 8
You might notice that none of the claimed 0.0 regions get's any research agents. This means that corporations and freelancer who live there will have to go back to empire space and do missions there to get Tech2.
According to PapaSmurf there are no plans for research agents in other regions.
I personaly think this screws game balance. Till now empire space vs non empire space was, imo, balanced. But with tech2 only being available in empire that balance really get's screwed.
What do other ppl think about that?
--
The worst thing you can do when suggesting a solution to a problem is to provide alternatives, people end up arguing the alternatives instead of implementing the fix. |
Omniwar
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Posted - 2003.11.26 14:13:00 -
[2]
It is logical that the pirate NPC corps in non empire space dont have the tecnoligy or skilled peaple to research to tech 2, then they would simply eliminate the empires.
Same as outlaws in the real world dont have the tecnoligy to build high tech items such a space crafts, underwater boats, high tech military airplanes and such, they have to get that from dirty peaple in civilized countries
Spawn of the Devil
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2003.11.26 14:14:00 -
[3]
Edited by: j0sephine on 26/11/2003 14:17:21
"What do other ppl think about that?"
... The 0.0 space is --as far as CCP is concerned-- controlled by the pirate factions. 'was said the pirate agents will be quite different e.g. they will provide access to black market goods like boosters which won't be available through empire space agents.
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Arthur Guinness
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Posted - 2003.11.26 14:19:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Arthur Guinness on 26/11/2003 14:19:34
 Quote:
Edited by: j0sephine on 26/11/2003 14:16:25
"What do other ppl think about that?"
... The 0.0 space is --as far as CCP is concerned-- controlled by the pirate factions. 'was said the pirate agents will be quite different e.g. they will provide access to black market goods like boosters which won't be available through empire space agents.
That stuff will come in the future.... (several months).
If pirates don't have research facilities, how did they get a Thorax with a missile launcher hardpoint?
How would pirates with tech1 equippment survive against the mighty empires with tech2?
Why don't pirates even offer stolen BPs?
Quote:
(btw, did you manually browse all corporation agents list to compile that info? =)
nah, Papasmurf supplied the info in irc.
--
The worst thing you can do when suggesting a solution to a problem is to provide alternatives, people end up arguing the alternatives instead of implementing the fix. |
Bad Harlequin
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Posted - 2003.11.26 14:20:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Bad Harlequin on 26/11/2003 14:22:37
excuse me. where did the angels, the sanshas, and the rest, all get their ships?
go read William Gibson especialy Neuromancer about 30 times followed by everything Neal Stephenson wrote.
Then go pick out 10 random books from your local library's SciFi section.
Then go to do research on supercomputers and south america until you find the now-buried story about the drug lord who had a potential informants database on a supercomputer, which he used to quickly track and off anyone who turned on him....
(edit: meant to differntiate: this last one is a NEWS story. it's REAL. it HAPPENED. it probably STILL IS. If YOU had a few billion in disposable income...)
then tell me about how there is no technological underground.
If CCP thinks i'm gonna make 30-40 jumps one way to just 'commute' between 'work' and 'home,' as ******* BORING as travel is in this game, just so i can do more ******* BORING agent mission travelling 10 jumps to deliver garbage in 10 minutes -
if THIS is the Magical Tech 2 Patch that will Fix Everything Soon -
then they're out of they're goddamn minds. How can they POSSIBLY toss this out if they have the SLIGHTEST clue what's going on ingame and what it's like to play it?
Give me a fragging break.
You are in a maze of twisty little asteroids, all alike. |
Temerlyn
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Posted - 2003.11.26 14:27:00 -
[6]
What realy irks me is the notion this is the ONLY way to get tech 2.
This is seriously ......................
Agent missions do not promote group play. So 95% of my corp will be spending there days doing crappy boring anal retentive missions to get to a level 3 research agent. Then they ask for research in a certain area then log on a week later with a heap of reasearch points and get some tech 2 BPO's.
Or am i mistaken and you have to do agent missions to get research points? If so then my corp will turn into AFK agent hunters.
Go here, collect this, bring it back, 10 jump trip all done with auto pilot and thus afk.
Why the hell cant we research our tech 1 BPO's?
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Orestes
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Posted - 2003.11.26 14:30:00 -
[7]
I'll be watching this thread.
Please do your utmost best to keep it on-topic and free of flaming and trolling.
Thanks 
Join the IC! |
Arthur Guinness
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Posted - 2003.11.26 14:32:00 -
[8]
it depends on agent quality. You get better agent's with better faction standings.
I think there is nomore agent ladder as such.
With a good enough standing you can get lvl3 agents.
Agent missions are the best way to gain (and loose) standing tough.
--
The worst thing you can do when suggesting a solution to a problem is to provide alternatives, people end up arguing the alternatives instead of implementing the fix. |
Deneba Zaavi
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Posted - 2003.11.26 14:57:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Deneba Zaavi on 26/11/2003 15:04:22
If tech2=best stuff in game (till tech 3 comes)
and
If tech2=only agent missions
Than
EVE= single player game
I'm really suprised, but maybe i'm missing something here. I understand that CCP have to find a way to rightfully distribute the most awaited tech 2 stuff, and to do it they are doing it via a strictly controlled system (agent missions..). But this is only saying:
"If you want tech 2, close your connections with the rest of the EVE world and do these 250 missions untill you get this coveted tech 2 BP. Once you've done this you will become insanely rich."
I'm sorry but this is not promoting interaction, nor socializations between players. You're giving away the best stuff in the game to people who may play this game as it was a single player game.
And to add insult to the injury you say "If you play this way, with agent mission, you're getting the best stuff that this game can give you to make money". Uh? To me this sounds like someone is trying to shoot himself right into the feets. (If we do assume that CCP's goals is to promote EVE as a multiplayer online game... no sarchasm intended)
Dunno, maybe i'm really missing something (maybe the missions DO require some player interaction of some sort? Xcept buying overpriced NPC goods from speculating players?).
Please, somebody, tell me i'm wrong.
P.S: I fully concur and agree with Bad Arlequin on the "Underground" technology set. If only half of what told in the movie "Traffic" is true about the intelligence network of some drug cartels in south america (under a tachnological and monetary point of view...) the statements that claims "only civilized and rightfully organized societies can have this kind of technologies" is false. I think for a science breakthrough u need a brilliant mind, and a lot of money. And with a lot of money you can also buy a brilliant mind so.... you get the point.
Deneba Zaavi
"The world is perfect as it is: a complete mess" - Joseph Campbell |
Maud Dib
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Posted - 2003.11.26 15:05:00 -
[10]
Agent mission in 0.0, We have notice that the gurista pirates forgot to oder my lunch. Go to UMI-KK and steal Viceroy's ham sandwich and bring it to me. You will be charged 25,000 isk for your effort and as a quick completion bonus you can give me 500 mega.
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Viceroy
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Posted - 2003.11.26 15:11:00 -
[11]
yea that sux
-
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Nostradamu5
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Posted - 2003.11.26 15:39:00 -
[12]
So you 0.0 folks can't come up with a way to get empire space "carebears" to acquire the technology you crave, not very creative are we?
Damn I guess there's nothing out in 0.0 that people in empire space would want...hmmm let me see.
Maybe I'm not getting this correctly ohhh you're "RP" stupidity..ahh I see now.
Stop griping about server instability and go buy an EVE mug!
Additionally with the purchase of each mug you will receive two(2) invisible Elves.
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Oosel
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Posted - 2003.11.26 15:42:00 -
[13]
am i right in thinking there will be corp based missions where its not just you on ure missions but you will need to get your corp involved to have a hope in hell of completing them
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Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.11.26 15:51:00 -
[14]
It looks like they're going for non-pirate corporation sovereignty. But I know more regions than Great Wildlands are claimed by non-pirate sovereignty.
Pure Blind: Mordu's Legion and the Servant Sisters of Eve.
Germinate: Society of Conscious Thought
Outer Ring: ORE (though I'm not sure what ORE's background is).
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Jexter
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Posted - 2003.11.26 15:54:00 -
[15]
Ah well Deneba my friend, we'll have to resort to other ways to acquire the new technology...
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Zarthan
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Posted - 2003.11.26 15:58:00 -
[16]
there has to be a better way to implement some items. Why not have it so some items can be researched thru a reasearch facility??? Or how about have a few things in loot containers or maybe just myabe even dropped by a npc. Having all thru agents is really really stupid as the majority of EVE does not waste time on the singleplayer agent missions. As much as i can understand some things ccp does it does appear ccp needs to understand their own playerbase better.
_______________________________________________________
Get custom sigs and graphics done here
Unforgivn Website
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Namarus
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:04:00 -
[17]
This has got to be one of the worst ideas I have come across.
Quite a lot of people that I know came to Eve because when playing Earth & Beyond; the only way to get anywhere was to do missions.
No in order to gain the advanced technology we have to do mission for agents. Can this game get anymore boring? Honestly. The boredom factor is increasing every patch.
What happened to reverse engineering? What happened to upgrading your Tech level 1 BPs?
Scientist characters have become agent characters.
The fact reading the histories of the various pirate corporates a lot of them were supposed to be responsible for a lot of advanced (illegal) work makes be think that they should be offering agents by the bucket load.
You are shifting players from 0.0 space back into Empire space.
Sounds like they will be rebooting the servers more often now. I can guess how many people will be stuck in Yulai, Pator Luminare and the other highway systems once this stuff comes online.
Nothing to see here .... move along. |
Kalar Vrask
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:06:00 -
[18]
Makes me laugh, on one hand they want to push miners out of Empire space, yet on the other they put all the uber-leet-lewt-drop agents inside empire space to draw everyone back from 0.0 
Like make your mind up
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AvApsi
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:16:00 -
[19]
im' just wondering, why not make some action? keeping all agents in one 0.0 system :o) that would make it fun..
btw.. AG ure insane :D
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Angry Sheep
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:24:00 -
[20]
I agree with the majority of people
CCP have a loony idea here, 0.0 space according to there own literature has some of the lagest private trillianaires who are hot on technology (serpentis etc) these are not just pirates, this is Bill gates empire!
this is sooooo going to hurt people who are paying to play and have fun, I come home from work, not to go to work in game - but to have fun.
It's a Dog eat Dog World out there and I'm wearing Milky Bone underwear
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Angry Sheep
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:27:00 -
[21]
They seem to be implementing this the wrong way which will cause a lot of distress:
I advise the following.
1. Research agents are available from stations with research labs. Not just in various areas (I noticed Fountain was not on the list - I take it people will be leaving in there droves1)
2. You do not need to do agent missions to get them, the agents are availble depending on you faction rating to their faction. The higher your rating, the higher level agent may be available. This means you dont just have to run agent missions, you can do other things and be rewarded for it (if it effects rating).
3. Research skills then generate research points, rather like your stats generate your learning rate - these points then operate as currently outlinned by Papa smurf.
Under the current system that is planned you are penalised by location, running agent missions (yawn - only because the limiterd scope, the fact that you do not have a choice is also a bone of contention).
players of Eve please read and review, if this is introduced incorrectly it will be a massive disappointment, and once introduced is always harder to correct.
It's a Dog eat Dog World out there and I'm wearing Milky Bone underwear
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Beringe
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:27:00 -
[22]
High level agent missions will allegedly be missions for the entire corporation, not just a single person.
I think pirate-sovreignity missions are a good idea, though.
-------------------------------------------
"My main griveance with the Caldari state was that once I had finished my work for them, they wanted me dead."
"No, it's none of your business." |
Nariko Tenrai
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:30:00 -
[23]
I rarely criticize CCP, because I've played MMPs for over four years now, and I know developing them is hard. Compared to some of the atrocities I've seen other dev teams inflict on their players, I honestly think they've done a creditable job. Any sins they have committed have been of omission, not commission.
That disclaimer said, the method of acquiring Tech II BPs is in my opinion a poor design decision.
When people ask for more PvE content they are not asking for new busywork hurdles to jump through - they are asking for fresh and original experiences. Very few people like agent missions. Most of them are anathema to the MMP genre - repetitive solo mini-quests with single-person loot. I realize the mission system is going to change soon, but the changes I've read about will do little rectify this fundamental flaw except at the highest levels.
On a more personal note:
Quote:
You tally up research points in specific fields depending on the agent level and your own research skills (these are all new skills, 17 in total). These new skills will not be on the market, but instead they are given out by agents as rewards for specific missions.
I've spent the last last four months building up my all my research skills to level 5 for nothing. Now I not only have to do missions to get an "in" with research agents, but I also have to do missions to acquire research skill packs, and in order to be competitive at learning these level 5 skills, I also have to do missions to get impants.
I guess researchers should expect to spend all their time running missions now. I chose at the outset to hoe the hard row of a research-oriented character to the exclusion of all else, because I was told I could be competitive with the combat and industrial oriented characters when reverse-engineering and higher tech levels were integrated. With the exception of Science, all that work has been rendered meaningless. There is no payoff on my investment. Of course I'm upset; I'd like to think I have some justification in that. In order to play the role I hoped to when I bought the game, I'm going to be forced to spend all my time running mail and cows back and forth between systems.
Yeah, I'm disappointed.
- - - -
I have measured and described the stars, their great and countless multitude. What man has seen their revolutions and entrances? Not even the angels see their number, yet I have recorded all their names.
- The Book of the Secrets of Enoch, Jewish Pseudepigrapha
We won't talk about how many cruisers I lost this weekend, nor how many nice railguns, or T2 enhancers. We're going to skip right over that. We're going to talk about my new Raven. It is like flying a small city, and the city's only export is missiles.
- Azeraphel |
Discorporation
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:32:00 -
[24]
2.
and
3.
Will happen, Angry Sheep.
D' uh ;p
[Heterocephalus glaber]
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Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:32:00 -
[25]
Did it ever occur to anyone that while the TL1 stuff allowed people to do everything, it's not meant for everyone to do everything themselves?
If you want your own TL2 bp, you'll have to do missions for it or buy it from someone who has. Otherwise, just buy the damn item from someone manufacturing whatever TL2 item you want.
There is no separation of profession in the game and when the first semi-decent step is taken to make a separation of professions, people complain. Send a n00b corp member to go run missions. Pay someone running missions for a blueprint. Hire a professional mission runner. Make it worth a manufacturer's time to ship products to you. Run the missions yourself.
There's 5 options. It's hardly like anyone except yourselves will be forcing you to choose the option to do it yourself.
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:34:00 -
[26]
Quote:
On a more personal note:
Quote:
You tally up research points in specific fields depending on the agent level and your own research skills (these are all new skills, 17 in total). These new skills will not be on the market, but instead they are given out by agents as rewards for specific missions.
I've spent the last last four months building up my all my research skills to level 5 for nothing. Now I not only have to do missions to get an "in" with research agents, but I also have to do missions to acquire research skill packs, and in order to be competitive at learning these level 5 skills, I also have to do missions to get impants.
Accumulating research points doesn't require running a mission. All it requires is having access to a research agent. If you have that, you visit the agent and choose to start a research project. Then you can leave.
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Jubeli
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:36:00 -
[27]
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=reply&threadID=44932
sorry for not posting here, didn't see it
short:
bascially i'm very disappointed also.. not being able to choose what to feild of tech II to aim for..
ok small corporations get a chance here.. is that really good?? look in RL, larger corporations DOES have bigger chances to achive greater things.. but here by random..
no thank you for this solution.. PLEASE think harder CCP (or jusr hire me) |
Jash Illian
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:38:00 -
[28]
Quote:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=reply&threadID=44932
sorry for not posting here, didn't see it
short:
bascially i'm very disappointed also.. not being able to choose what to feild of tech II to aim for..
ok small corporations get a chance here.. is that really good?? look in RL, larger corporations DOES have bigger chances to achive greater things.. but here by random..
no thank you for this solution.. PLEASE think harder CCP (or jusr hire me)
Larger corporations have the advantage of numbers. 1 person in a 5 man corp versus 10 people in a 50 man corp doing missions. Equal proportion of corporate manpower working to aquire new technology. But the 50 man corporation has higher chances due to numbers.
I mean its like you want corporations to oblige each other like its sex or something. Pffft I would rather **** my enemy.- Rohann
Be careful out there. That other guy waiting in the queue for the gate MIGHT be a baby-munching frock-burner, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!- Lallante |
Blueblooded
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:40:00 -
[29]
I think that it balance things up since the outer regions get wealthy on high end ore.
But realy, there is nothing that keeps the corps located in way out in 0.0 space from making missions inside the impire...so I guess everyone could get tech2 bps, just that it will be somewhat different for those 50 jmp away...
I agree to the points made by the logic of higher technology probebly first occure in high populated areasm, that make sense to me...
----------------------------------------
"The royal blood is blue, hence my name"
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Nariko Tenrai
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Posted - 2003.11.26 16:48:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Nariko Tenrai on 26/11/2003 16:52:44
[Edit: typos]
Quote:
Accumulating research points doesn't require running a mission. All it requires is having access to a research agent. If you have that, you visit the agent and choose to start a research project. Then you can leave.
As I read the statement, the implication was that your level in the new research skills determines the rate at which you accrue Tech II research points. The implication is that you need to run missions for:
1) Getting the faction rep required for research agents.
2) Getting the skill packs.
3) Indirectly, getting implants to more effectively learn the new research skills.
Quote:
There is no separation of profession in the game and when the first semi-decent step is taken to make a separation of professions, people complain.
I have no issue with using new methods to attain the goal of separation of profession. What I object to is forcing me - as someone who has spent months building a research character - to spend all my time focused on an aspect of the game that is almost unanimously considered a tedious, unfun treadmill.
- - - -
I have measured and described the stars, their great and countless multitude. What man has seen their revolutions and entrances? Not even the angels see their number, yet I have recorded all their names.
- The Book of the Secrets of Enoch, Jewish Pseudepigrapha
We won't talk about how many cruisers I lost this weekend, nor how many nice railguns, or T2 enhancers. We're going to skip right over that. We're going to talk about my new Raven. It is like flying a small city, and the city's only export is missiles.
- Azeraphel |
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