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Hopfrogg
The Scope Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 01:35:16 -
[1] - Quote
Can't seem to find specific FPS EVE online performance for GTX970 and GTX960.
I'm torn between these two cards and wonder what the FPS performance is for them at 1080p and 1440p. Can current owners of these cards give me some figures?
Thanks.
Edit: All settings maxed. I know both cards would easily get 60fps at 1080p. My main concern is being able to take advantage of 144hz + 1440p/1080p. |

Black Panpher
Middle-aged pony tail
4734
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Posted - 2015.10.29 04:10:57 -
[2] - Quote
I wouldn't buy a lesser card than a 970. |

Nafensoriel
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
150
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Posted - 2015.10.29 04:19:50 -
[3] - Quote
Well first off... Don't think most games will run at max quality+145 fps. To many factors are involved in most games rendering to actually push performance to this level in actuality.
The main advantage to higher hz and higher pixel count, personally, is that you obsolete issues such as tearing to a degree and massively reduce the need for memory intensive AA so you can upscale the base textures for improved quality. Optically it takes a generally trained eye to notice normal usage differences between 60FPS and 120FPS or 144FPS. Many will dispute this saying they have magical eyes and they are both correct and incorrect. Your eye/brain combo can notice movement differences in excess of these timings but when other things are going on in your brain, such as playing a game, you habitually wont notice it unless you are viewing a specific screen intentionally for the purposes of noticing a difference. When people claim to notice major changes and they don't know exactly what to look for in the image(different movements are easier for our brain to notice) they actually are noticing variations in the rendering of the image... which frankly will happen in 99.9% of consumer video games. To much happens for the image to be absolutely 100% unaffected by all the other calculations going on and while we might not notice a 60hz difference we damn well notice a 1hz hitch when a frame gets slightly delayed due to a glitch in the games code.
Additionally higher pixel count does not equate to linear changes in performance.. IE going from 1080p to 4k is not a 4x increase in raw power needed. At higher pixel count other factors are involved and frame processing can become slightly more efficient under certain circumstances.. TLDR 4k doesnt need 4x the card.. but it does need more memory and pixel rate.
Back to your question the 970 typically is a 4gb card while the 960 is a 2gb card. The lower tiered card also has 65% less pixel fill rate. If you intend to use 1440p and any FPS above 60 you will want to seriously consider the extra memory. Using a 2gb card in will cripple its ability to reliably finish the frame without thrashing in many modern games. Directly to EVE online.. currently the engine isn't very demanding except for HDR and sound... the GFX team keeps adding stuff at an amazing rate though so I wouldn't exactly rely on current eve as a good benchmark.. especially with all the major behind the scenes code changes going on that we DON'T see. |

Velarra
454
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 04:36:29 -
[4] - Quote
Of very minor note, unfortunately, the 970 is a 3.5 gig card with a 512mb extra bonus chunk of non-contiguous memory which gravely impacts 970 performance IF the card needs to use more than 3.5 gig of ram. Not that splitting this hair matters too much at present unless you're playing with ineffecient "HD" mods / HD textures in other games that may not be the most VRAM efficient. |

Johan Civire
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
987
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 04:44:58 -
[5] - Quote
Nafensoriel wrote:Well first off... Don't think most games will run at max quality+145 fps. To many factors are involved in most games rendering to actually push performance to this level in actuality.
The main advantage to higher hz and higher pixel count, personally, is that you obsolete issues such as tearing to a degree and massively reduce the need for memory intensive AA so you can upscale the base textures for improved quality. Optically it takes a generally trained eye to notice normal usage differences between 60FPS and 120FPS or 144FPS. Many will dispute this saying they have magical eyes and they are both correct and incorrect. Your eye/brain combo can notice movement differences in excess of these timings but when other things are going on in your brain, such as playing a game, you habitually wont notice it unless you are viewing a specific screen intentionally for the purposes of noticing a difference. When people claim to notice major changes and they don't know exactly what to look for in the image(different movements are easier for our brain to notice) they actually are noticing variations in the rendering of the image... which frankly will happen in 99.9% of consumer video games. To much happens for the image to be absolutely 100% unaffected by all the other calculations going on and while we might not notice a 60hz difference we damn well notice a 1hz hitch when a frame gets slightly delayed due to a glitch in the games code.
Additionally higher pixel count does not equate to linear changes in performance.. IE going from 1080p to 4k is not a 4x increase in raw power needed. At higher pixel count other factors are involved and frame processing can become slightly more efficient under certain circumstances.. TLDR 4k doesnt need 4x the card.. but it does need more memory and pixel rate.
Back to your question the 970 typically is a 4gb card while the 960 is a 2gb card. The lower tiered card also has 65% less pixel fill rate. If you intend to use 1440p and any FPS above 60 you will want to seriously consider the extra memory. Using a 2gb card in will cripple its ability to reliably finish the frame without thrashing in many modern games. Directly to EVE online.. currently the engine isn't very demanding except for HDR and sound... the GFX team keeps adding stuff at an amazing rate though so I wouldn't exactly rely on current eve as a good benchmark.. especially with all the major behind the scenes code changes going on that we DON'T see.
I agree i told this so many times to other players you need to have more than 2gb video ram... Guess what people thinking you`re stupid or what. 2gb video cards are not for 4k gaming. End of all the debate that will come. |

Daemun Khanid
Sanctus Imperialis
168
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 05:01:16 -
[6] - Quote
970 should easily do the job. I run 2 clients on 3 screens on a R9 390 (probably somewhere between the performance of a 970 and 980 depending on the resolution and how the games optimized) and run between 200-400 fps depending on what's going on.
Daemun of Khanid
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Kal'Han
Win or Die
20
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Posted - 2015.10.29 05:27:34 -
[7] - Quote
1080p interleave none = no vsync
my gtx970 goes up to 280 in space, 500+ in station enough for your 144GHz
You want data : here are my settings and here is a screen of fps count. http://i.imgur.com/Fx5OIRP.png (I realize I was in windowed mode, add more fps (not much) for fullscreen)
I'm playing in full high quality, except Anti Aliasing to none, my eyes can't really tell the difference when things move around sure on static screenshot it's clear as crystal, but in space when things move at 60 fps without ever a drop, you don't see it.
anyway, 240 is way over what you need for 144hz screen
Oh, I have a 1rst gen i7 960 from 4 years ago I think, about as powerful as a current i5 and I think that's what's limiting my reaching the 1000 fps bar...
and yes, 970 is better than 960, no there is no ram issue if your card was released after the manufacturing bug announcement (beware cheap 970) and I don't like ATI/AMD on simple gut feeling basis (and the most ****** drivers ever : catalol)
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Daemun Khanid
Sanctus Imperialis
168
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 05:58:44 -
[8] - Quote
Kal'Han wrote:1080p interleave none = no vsync my gtx970 goes up to 280 in space, 500+ in station enough for your 144GHz You want data : here are my settings and here is a screen of fps count. http://i.imgur.com/Fx5OIRP.png (I realize I was in windowed mode, add more fps (not much) for fullscreen) I'm playing in full high quality, except Anti Aliasing to none, my eyes can't really tell the difference when things move around sure on static screenshot it's clear as crystal, but in space when things move at 60 fps without ever a drop, you don't see it. anyway, 240 is way over what you need for 144hz screen Oh, I have a 1rst gen i7 960 from 4 years ago I think, about as powerful as a current i5 and I think that's what's limiting my reaching the 1000 fps bar... and yes, 970 is better than 960, no there is no ram issue if your card was released after the manufacturing bug announcement (beware cheap 970) and I don't like ATI/AMD on simple gut feeling basis (and the most ****** drivers ever : catalol)
Not sure what you're getting at about interleave, it has nothing to do with vsync,
Daemun of Khanid
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Amarant'h
Fistful of Finns Paisti Syndicate
32
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 06:52:35 -
[9] - Quote
Well I have GTX 970, and it's good. End of the story. |

Shallanna Yassavi
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
34
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 07:36:53 -
[10] - Quote
If you want to 4k for cheap, R9 390(X). The memory (8 GB!) and bandwidth make it good for that. You better have the power supply to feed it and the case fans to cool it, though, cause they're all vent-into-your-case cards. If energy efficiency is a serious issue (you live in Europe or California and power costs more than 10 cents/kW*h), go with the 970/980-or an i7 5775c, which delivers a serious amount of integrated graphics performance with 60W.
A signature :o
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Tiberius Heth
Say No to Features
333
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Posted - 2015.10.29 08:03:21 -
[11] - Quote
Nvidia driver settings have a HUGE impact on performance, not only can you change overall render quality which affects fps a lot (so you can't really compare people's stats because some of them might/will have toyed with that setting) but you can also activate DSR which will increase the quality (beyond normal realistic use) at quite a high cost. |

Samir Duran Xadi
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
39
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 09:35:43 -
[12] - Quote
The AMD 390 has rendered the GTX 970 completely obsolete so I would go for that. |

xttz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
712
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 09:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
My 4GB GTX960 happily runs EVE in 4K with all settings on high, except AA which isn't really necessary anymore. When I switched off V-sync it showed well in excess of 100fps, and had no trouble running multiple clients either.
EVE has pretty low graphical requirements compared to most modern games. The card you want will depend more on what else you play, and/or if you want to run lots of EVE clients at once. |

Kal'Han
Win or Die
20
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 11:01:19 -
[14] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:Not sure what you're getting at about interleave, it has nothing to do with vsync. The processor also has nothing to do with preventing you from hitting 1000 fps. Your processor probably isn't even hitting 50% utilization in EvE.
interleave "immediate" means no wait time between each frame, allowing the game to go faster that your screen refresh rate and allows you to see lots ot FPS with ctrl+F
Interleave "1" means you get as much FPS as your screen refresh rate, (60Hz, 100Hz, 144Hz) which means ctrl + F will give you only the number of FPS your screen can display.
ok it is not "vsync on/off", but it serves approximatively the same purpose.
for the test I made, I wanted to show that the 970 could go above the 144Hz asked by OP, hence interleave immediate. |

Yourmoney Mywallet
Jita Institute of Applied Monetary Manipulation
649
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 11:11:10 -
[15] - Quote
I think that setting is called "Interval." If you're talking about the one in the Esc-menu. |

Norian Lonark
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
175
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 11:15:24 -
[16] - Quote
I would go for the 970 because I think its probably the best value - performance out of the GTX range.
Having said that I am happily running 2 x clients on two monitors, 1 @ 3440x1440 and 1 @ 1920 x 1080 with a single GTX 680 all detail settings are high and I have no performance issues... with the exception when in areas with "clouds", so I think you will be good with either card for EVE :)
Start wide, expand further, and never look back
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Kal'Han
Win or Die
20
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 11:22:31 -
[17] - Quote
Yourmoney Mywallet wrote:I think that setting is called "Interval." If you're talking about the one in the Esc-menu.
whaaaat ? *remove shades* damn! I read that wrong a few years ago... and kept using that word (years!)
ahahah, my bad! |

Velarra
455
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 14:05:22 -
[18] - Quote
Kal'Han wrote:
no there is no ram issue if your card was released after the manufacturing bug announcement
Really? All documentation from nvidia following and surrounding the incident reported that the "4GB" value representation was due to a miscommunication between NVidia marketing department and their engineers. That it was not an issue that could be resolved by drivers and was an inherent -working as intended- trait associated with the 970 by design. Not, a hardware bug.
I'd like to see some formal documentation from NVidia clearly stating the engineering feature (3.5 + 512) was a bug.
However i would highlight that this issue is a lot of hair splitting over a small detail that really is unlikely to impact anyone playing modern, commercially developed games released today or in the recent past. The only real kinds of situations where it is bad, where performance suffers due to lack of texture memory as 'advertised' by NVidia on the box, are in mods developed by players for games that allow modding or at least make it possible. The fan made mods are often prone to having inefficient 'hd' textures and " [WIP]" levels of detail that do not always scale that well, that consume hysterically amusing quantities of VRAM. To the point where you can hit that 3.5g wall. Go beyond it? And performance drops off.
Otherwise, for today's commercially developed or near future games, the 970 is great and should be an absolutely fine card if used within its 3.5g limits. |

rofflesausage
State War Academy Caldari State
231
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 14:43:54 -
[19] - Quote
OP: I'm sorry you've had to listen to the drone of people not understanding what you're asking.
I have a 970 with a 1440p / 144Hz screen. I can not maintain 144fps with everything on highest. Knocking off AA helps a lot, and keeps it much closer to the 144FPS. Knocking all settings down to medium and I've never not been at full FPS.
I'm sure I could find a good balance of some being on highest / medium, but I tend to stick with medium on the off chance I get into large fleet battles and it drops slightly.
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Netan MalDoran
Last Garrison
127
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Posted - 2015.10.29 16:44:42 -
[20] - Quote
How can you measure FPS in game? I have the 960 and i run it on max everything with no lag at all, I can spout numbers if someone tells me how.
"Your security status has been lowered." - Hell yeah it was!
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Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
643
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 17:23:47 -
[21] - Quote
Netan MalDoran wrote:How can you measure FPS in game? I have the 960 and i run it on max everything with no lag at all, I can spout numbers if someone tells me how.
CTRL+F in game or use 3rd party OSD software such as RivaTuner. You can get that with MSIAfterburner or PercisionX.
"Tomahawks?"
"----in' A, right?"
"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."
"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."
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Netan MalDoran
Last Garrison
127
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Posted - 2015.10.29 18:55:26 -
[22] - Quote
Sobaan Tali wrote:Netan MalDoran wrote:How can you measure FPS in game? I have the 960 and i run it on max everything with no lag at all, I can spout numbers if someone tells me how. CTRL+F in game or use 3rd party OSD software such as RivaTuner. You can get that with MSIAfterburner or PercisionX.
Ok, after that with the GTX 960 FTW with max everything, I get: 275 FPS just warping around Brief dip to 80 FPS on system load after a jump 250 FPS on a gate with no players (Just NPC's) 110 FPS on the Jita undock (Changed depending on which direction you were looking at, lowest I got was looking back at the station for 100 FPS)
I'm running 2 monitors with 2 docs open and Mozilla along with EvE, so the others shouldn't affect it much.
"Your security status has been lowered." - Hell yeah it was!
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Daemun Khanid
Sanctus Imperialis
168
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 21:09:01 -
[23] - Quote
Netan MalDoran wrote:Sobaan Tali wrote:Netan MalDoran wrote:How can you measure FPS in game? I have the 960 and i run it on max everything with no lag at all, I can spout numbers if someone tells me how. CTRL+F in game or use 3rd party OSD software such as RivaTuner. You can get that with MSIAfterburner or PercisionX. Ok, after that with the GTX 960 FTW with max everything, I get: 275 FPS just warping around Brief dip to 80 FPS on system load after a jump 250 FPS on a gate with no players (Just NPC's) 110 FPS on the Jita undock (Changed depending on which direction you were looking at, lowest I got was looking back at the station for 100 FPS) I'm running 2 monitors with 2 docs open and Mozilla along with EvE, so the others shouldn't affect it much.
I assume youre running at 1920x1080as you didn't specify. That sounds about right for a 960 at 1080p, maybe a little suprisingly high for a 960 @ 2560x1440.
Daemun of Khanid
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Hopfrogg
The Scope Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 21:20:35 -
[24] - Quote
rofflesausage wrote:OP: I'm sorry you've had to listen to the drone of people not understanding what you're asking.
I have a 970 with a 1440p / 144Hz screen. I can not maintain 144fps with everything on highest. Knocking off AA helps a lot, and keeps it much closer to the 144FPS. Knocking all settings down to medium and I've never not been at full FPS.
I'm sure I could find a good balance of some being on highest / medium, but I tend to stick with medium on the off chance I get into large fleet battles and it drops slightly.
It's ok, lots of great information from everyone. So do you recommend spending the extra for the 144hz? EVE is too gorgeous not to get a 1440p monitor, but can't decide if it's worth the much higher price jump to get one that does both 1440p/144hz.
Is the jump from 60hz to 120hz/144hz very noticeable in EVE? Will my best experience be to run the game at max quality, 60hz, 1440p and full 60fps all the time... or medium settings getting full 144fps... or a compromise and run max quality with varying fps 60-144?
Thanks, your answer will probably be the decider  |

Hopfrogg
The Scope Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 21:24:00 -
[25] - Quote
Netan MalDoran wrote:Sobaan Tali wrote:Netan MalDoran wrote:How can you measure FPS in game? I have the 960 and i run it on max everything with no lag at all, I can spout numbers if someone tells me how. CTRL+F in game or use 3rd party OSD software such as RivaTuner. You can get that with MSIAfterburner or PercisionX. Ok, after that with the GTX 960 FTW with max everything, I get: 275 FPS just warping around Brief dip to 80 FPS on system load after a jump 250 FPS on a gate with no players (Just NPC's) 110 FPS on the Jita undock (Changed depending on which direction you were looking at, lowest I got was looking back at the station for 100 FPS) I'm running 2 monitors with 2 docs open and Mozilla along with EvE, so the others shouldn't affect it much.
Thanks... so if I don't spend extra for the 144hz, it seems the 960 will aptly handle the job. |

Daemun Khanid
Sanctus Imperialis
168
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 22:00:12 -
[26] - Quote
Added some further details to my last post, but as to whether or not there's a noticable difference between 60hz and 144hz I'd say probably not. 60 FPS is the generally accepted norm for butter smooth video. The resolution of 1440p over 1080p though I'd think would certainly be worth it. 1440p at 60 hz and you should be loving it.
Daemun of Khanid
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Jenshae Chiroptera
2346
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 22:24:17 -
[27] - Quote
Modern graphics cards the bottle neck is in the memory bus. The 970 has 256 bits vs 960's 128 bits. Ideally for gaming you want the 384 bit or higher but 256 suffices.
(Which is why some older generation cards can actually be superior). The "Radeon R7 370" is roughly equivalent to the GTX 970 and is half the price. The only real reason to stick with Nvidia is if you are running Linux or something that might have compatibility issues. Valve converted many games to run natively on Linux and in the process discovered that Direct X was covering for a fault in Nvidia and hampered AMD's performance (caused some tearing and such (much of that has been corrected)). As games and programs adjust more as time goes by; it may well be that AMD will become far superior.
CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids
There are other ways to fix Null Sec stagnation and Fozzie SOV is the wrong approach.
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Leeluvv
Polarized
49
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 22:30:46 -
[28] - Quote
A 2560 x 1440 monitor has 3.7 million Pixels. At 32 bit colour, it uses 118 Million bits of memory. This equates to 14 MBytes of memory.
i.e You only need a 14MB card to display 2560 x 1440 at 32 bit colour.
The large amounts of RAM modern graphics cards have is for processing and handling the textures, etc, but Eve does not require much memory (graphics or CPU) to run. If you think otherwise, use Task Manager and see how much RAM Eve is actually using, mine is currently using 700MB. Second hint, the installed game is only 300MB and texture compression won't be huge.
Using GPU-Z on my PC (i5 4670K, 16GB RAM and a 3GB R9 280X), Windows is using 600MB of Video memory and each Eve client running at 1920 x 1200 and full details uses an additional 400MB. |

Hopfrogg
The Scope Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 22:34:31 -
[29] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:1440p at 60 hz and you should be loving it.
Pretty much my thoughts. I can achieve this for a reasonable price. The temptation to kick it up a notch and do it all at 120-140fps is a costly one... Willing to pay the price if those framerates can remain stable at max settings and if people who have experienced this can testify that it is worth the big bump in price... if not, 1440p at 60fps is nothing to complain about. Game already looks gorgeous on my TN 21in 1080p. Can't wait to see it in 1440p, 27in, IPS. The 144hz factor is the sticking point right now. The price difference is almost double to do 1440p, IPS, and 144hz all in one panel compared to just 1440p/IPS. |

Daemun Khanid
Sanctus Imperialis
168
|
Posted - 2015.10.29 23:02:59 -
[30] - Quote
Hopfrogg wrote:Daemun Khanid wrote:1440p at 60 hz and you should be loving it. Pretty much my thoughts. I can achieve this for a reasonable price. The temptation to kick it up a notch and do it all at 120-140fps is a costly one... Willing to pay the price if those framerates can remain stable at max settings and if people who have experienced this can testify that it is worth the big bump in price... if not, 1440p at 60fps is nothing to complain about. Game already looks gorgeous on my TN 21in 1080p. Can't wait to see it in 1440p, 27in, IPS. The 144hz factor is the sticking point right now. The price difference is almost double to do 1440p, IPS, and 144hz all in one panel compared to just 1440p/IPS.
Both the 970 and the 390's are very reasonably priced as far as high end graphics cards go. The 980's and Fury are in a totally different league, costing almost as much as a crossfire/SLi setup of their junior cards. Personally having just recently upgraded to a new PC I went with the 390 due to it's improved performance at higher resolutions. An important point when running multi-screens and next spring when oculus rift is released. Just be sure if you go with AMD you have enough power supply as they are pretty hungry. Next summer I hope to pick up an Oculus Rift and upgrade to a second 390 to run in crossfire for FPS heaven at an affordable price.
Daemun of Khanid
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