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Don't fly what you can't afford?

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Jimsun Froegliech Republic University Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2015.11.09 15:50:39 - [1] - Quote My freighter dun got blown up. It was under contract, with a very high collateral. I saw an opportunity, similar to many I've successfuly run before, and gambled and lost against the house. The house being determined pirates. Altogether it was an absolutely awesome experience - freighters are so tanky it really is quite exciting, you get a good minute or so of desparate crawling hope before you realise you won't make it. Usual rules apply as well - I was in a rush, I didn't follow my usual precautions, and happened to run into some very capable bastards. Now I am in an interesting position, because whilst I could normally replace my losses without any real sweat I'm currently leveraged up to my eyeballs on some very attractive trades. And I need a freighter to make quite a lot of them work. If I lose another freighter I'm not going to be able to rebuy one without taking heavy losses - technically I can't really afford to fly my next one because I can't easily replace it. I've obviously gone out and straight away replaced it. And my enthusiasm for this game has tripled, all of a sudden slowboating across 18 gates has become an adrenaline fueled panic of D scan and local lookups. I'm running my covops as point, and I have a widow escort in anything less than .7. I've always extolled the basic tenants of 'don't trust anyone you can't physically punch in the face', 'if its too good to be true, it is', and 'don't fly what you can't afford'. But I'm starting to wonder what the value is in the third one (except for absolute first week rookies who may immediately quit if they lose everything), other than to make the game more boring. My losses in this event are the worst I've had, but obviously nothing really that out of the ordinary for the general populus. For those of you who've lost big - does it not restore your enthusiasm for the game, that you have to work your way back up or start doing things differently?
Jonah Gravenstein Machiavellian Space Bastards 25668	Posted - 2015.11.09 16:23:42 - [2] - Quote I treat it more as "don't fly anything you're not comfortable with losing". I certainly have ships that I couldn't afford to replace immediately if they exploded, but I have other ships that'll do the same job, albeit not as well, or other jobs and earn me enough to be able to do so in a short time. Good attitude to your loss btw. Civilized behaviour is knowing that violence is barbaric, but paying other people to do it is business. Nil mortifi sine lucre.
DaReaper Net 7 2649	Posted - 2015.11.09 17:03:31 - [3] - Quote its actually "Don;t fly what you can't afford to lose" and this doesn't mean just isk. Lots of people in your situation would be rage quitting, or whining up a storm, because they can;t emotionally afford to lose said ship. Thought you are levered and can't afford a new freighter, emotionally you seem to be able to rebound and move on. Thus in that regard you are able to move on form the loss. OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining! Yes i am optimistic about eve.. i'm giving it till dec 31st 2016 before i doom n gloom
Daerrol Death By Design Did he say Jump 253	Posted - 2015.11.09 17:31:12 - [4] - Quote I have two ships that are incursion-ready. One is a cheap T2 Scimitar, the other is an impressive fit Macharial which stays docked in Amarr. It's worth around 1bn isk. These ships NEVER see PVP, despite being around the same price as my normal PVP Pirate battleships and the logi is actually cheaper than most my PVP logis. However, these are my dedicated money making ships. The mach is there for redundancy. It can be cannabilized to make more scimitars or if Incursions ever stop being good ISK due to changes from CCP, I can use it to fly L4's or all sorts of other useful ISK making activities. The rest my ships are already spacedust before they undock.
Nafensoriel KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation 178	Posted - 2015.11.09 17:54:47 - [5] - Quote A purchased ship in eve is a bomb. An undocked ship in eve is a bomb with an unpredictable timer that has been activated. Accept that the ship is scrap from the moment you undock it and your eve life will be so much more awesome. To the OP get another freighter or use a DST if you don't need the volume. I find i can recover liquid isk fairly fast and even if you lose the second freighter its only a brief setback in the long haul. Or use the excuse to do something new like pvping or hell even mining(though this is a form of insanity.. be careful with it)
Ima Wreckyou The Conference Elite CODE. 1851	Posted - 2015.11.09 18:06:55 - [6] - Quote It also helps to purchase a mining permit if you intend to operate your vessel in New Order territory (formerly known as Highsec). the Code ALWAYS wins Elite PvPer, #74 in 2014
Spruillo Spruillo Corp 57	Posted - 2015.11.09 18:15:22 - [7] - Quote tl:dr- your a dumbass how is dscan going to help your freighter in losec PLAYIN SPACE TRUCKS VROOM VROOM
Chainsaw Plankton Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave 2007	Posted - 2015.11.09 18:32:06 - [8] - Quote Jonah Gravenstein wrote: I treat it more as "don't fly anything you're not comfortable with losing". I certainly have ships that I couldn't afford to replace immediately if they exploded, but I have other ships that'll do the same job, albeit not as well, or other jobs and earn me enough to be able to do so in a short time. Good attitude to your loss btw. don't fly what you can't afford to replace is a very different statement from don't fly what you can't afford to lose. I have flown many ships I couldn't afford to immediately replace, but as you say I also have plenty of ships that can do a similar job, or do a different job and then I can eventually replace any ship I've flown. Hell most of the ships I fly I have at least 3 of. There are plenty of ways to interpret the rule and I can't say one is better than the other. As someone else said a lot of "affording" a loss is the emotional portion. @ChainsawPlankto
Nuu Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 1	Posted - 2015.11.09 18:34:27 - [9] - Quote Ima Wreckyou wrote: It also helps to purchase a mining permit if you intend to operate your vessel in New Order territory (formerly known as Highsec). What if I offer money for each ganked mining permit holder? Have you 'smart boys' realised that yet? How many will pay your litte mafia fee after that if they get ganked anyway?
Paranoid Loyd 7428	Posted - 2015.11.09 18:43:05 - [10] - Quote Spruillo wrote: your "Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata Fix the Prospect!

Dan Seavey Allier Seavy Acquisitions 68	Posted - 2015.11.09 18:45:54 - [11] - Quote Lost a Barghast this weekend running combat sites in Null. New the risk, had precautions set up, make a teeeeeeeny mistate, and got clowned for it. But not before I raked in about 40 million in a shade over an hour. Am I going to do that again? Oh hell yeah. Am I going to lose another Barg? Yup. But not the same way I lost the last one. And when I lose this one, it will be another unique learning experience. (And, it's fun as hell.) ((AND I took the T2 that scrammed me out before I blew up, so >:P )) Eventually, I will rule any null combat site I choose, just like I can now mine, P.I. , transport and Rat anywhere I like. This game is no fun at all if you aren't going to put it on the line from time to time. Dan Honey Never Sleeps.
Jimsun Froegliech Republic University Minmatar Republic 7	Posted - 2015.11.09 19:25:02 - [12] - Quote Spruillo wrote: tl:dr- your a dumbass how is dscan going to help your freighter in losec Oh bless you! I'm afraid I don't know, I've never been to 'losec', I've heard its really dangerous! Maybe if you ask in the new players forum someone might be able to help you? Anyway, thank you for your valuable contribution, I know that reading can be really difficult. Ima Wreckyou wrote: It also helps to purchase a mining permit if you intend to operate your vessel in New Order territory (formerly known as Highsec). No thanks, I'm good However I hope you realise that some of us appreciate your activities (from afar, preferably whilst aligned); time in Highsec would be -super- boring without the very slim chance of being hunted. I know I would leave this game if CCP ever introduced a truly safe area. Dan Seavey Allier wrote: Lost a Barghast.... (would do it again)... Eventually, I will rule any null combat site I choose, just like I can now mine, P.I. , transport and Rat anywhere I like. This game is no fun at all if you aren't going to put it on the line from time to time. Amen. I've played so unbelievably cautious for so long (this is my first half decent loss in years), I think if anything I'm thrilled to find out that not only am I not as good or as much of a smartass at this game as I thought, but that the occasional bit of risk and punishing misfortune is a real additive to the general enjoyment, not a detractor. Mulling over from when I made the OP, I've also realised that most of the stories I've heard about people losing really big, often involve being in a position of responsibility with regards to other peoples wealth/assets; I'm guessing that must be more difficult to come to terms with.
Tau Cabalander Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs 5508	Posted - 2015.11.09 20:56:05 - [13] - Quote If I lost everything, and found myself back with only a rookie ship to my name, I'm confident I could recover quickly. "Don't fly what you can't afford to replace." "Don't fly what you can't afford to lose." No time-line is specified, nor whether "affordable" refers to ISK, and / or time, and / or emotional attachment. That's up to each pilot to weigh for themselves.
Ima Wreckyou The Conference Elite CODE. 1851	Posted - 2015.11.09 20:58:10 - [14] - Quote Nuu wrote: Ima Wreckyou wrote: It also helps to purchase a mining permit if you intend to operate your vessel in New Order territory (formerly known as Highsec). What if I offer money for each ganked mining permit holder? Have you 'smart boys' realised that yet? How many will pay your litte mafia fee after that if they get ganked anyway? How much money do you offer? the Code ALWAYS wins Elite PvPer, #74 in 2014
admiral root Red Galaxy 3526	Posted - 2015.11.09 22:33:15 - [15] - Quote Ima Wreckyou wrote: Nuu wrote: Ima Wreckyou wrote: It also helps to purchase a mining permit if you intend to operate your vessel in New Order territory (formerly known as Highsec). What if I offer money for each ganked mining permit holder? Have you 'smart boys' realised that yet? How many will pay your litte mafia fee after that if they get ganked anyway? How much money do you offer? Well, when I said "I" I mispoke a little, I meant "someone else" and when I said "money" I may have been a little unclear, I meant "someone else's money". No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff CODE. forum - everyone's welcome (no shiptoasters)
Ralph King-Griffin Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance 12778	Posted - 2015.11.09 22:41:16 - [16] - Quote Itt: op gets that loss is everything in eve and revels in it. Good job op. Better the Devil you know. =]\|[=
Benny Ohu Chaotic Tranquility Snuffed Out 4484	Posted - 2015.11.10 00:55:16 - [17] - Quote Jimsun Froegliech wrote: I've obviously gone out and straight away replaced it. And my enthusiasm for this game has tripled, all of a sudden slowboating across 18 gates has become an adrenaline fueled panic of D scan and local lookups. I'm running my covops as point, and I have a widow escort in anything less than .7. the widow will probably not be as useful as a dedicated webber? having an alt web your freighter gets it into warp really quickly
Demerius Xenocratus Rapid Withdrawal 732	Posted - 2015.11.10 02:20:21 - [18] - Quote Spruillo wrote: tl:dr- your a dumbass how is dscan going to help your freighter in losec DIS WILL BE DEALT WIF.
Tear Jar Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec 346	Posted - 2015.11.10 02:28:54 - [19] - Quote Nuu wrote: Ima Wreckyou wrote: It also helps to purchase a mining permit if you intend to operate your vessel in New Order territory (formerly known as Highsec). What if I offer money for each ganked mining permit holder? Have you 'smart boys' realised that yet? How many will pay your litte mafia fee after that if they get ganked anyway? CODE. agents aren't motivated by money. We are motivated by a desire to make highsec a better place. As such, we are far more dedicated than your typical mercenary group.
Sabriz Adoudel Black Hydra Consortium. 5471	Posted - 2015.11.10 03:08:32 - [20] - Quote OP - I like people like you, that take a loss well. Just this last weekend I got talking to a 3 day old trial account newbie that had been ganked and lost most of what they owned (which wasn't much). I gave him a fitted lowskill gank Atron and five million ISK, and told him to go and shoot some other people. He did, and now he's much more interested in the game. I gave him 50 million after his 10th gank attempt, as promised, and I expect EVE will keep him. You obviously have more resources and more SP than that guy did - which means taking up a life of ganking should be even easier. You can still trade on the side (I trade a lot, I just use courier contracts to move stuff) I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com Sabriz's Rule: "Any time someone argues for a game change claiming it is a quality of life change, the change is actually a game balance change".

Spruillo Spruillo Corp 59	Posted - 2015.11.10 03:13:16 - [21] - Quote admiral root wrote: Ima Wreckyou wrote: Nuu wrote: Ima Wreckyou wrote: It also helps to purchase a mining permit if you intend to operate your vessel in New Order territory (formerly known as Highsec). What if I offer money for each ganked mining permit holder? Have you 'smart boys' realised that yet? How many will pay your litte mafia fee after that if they get ganked anyway? How much money do you offer? Well, when I said "I" I mispoke a little, I meant "someone else" and when I said "money" I may have been a little unclear, I meant "someone else's money". Eve forum winner 4 the day PLAYIN SPACE TRUCKS VROOM VROOM
Memphis Baas 744	Posted - 2015.11.10 03:21:37 - [22] - Quote High-collateral courier contract may be scam, too (specifically set up to gank you en-route), especially if it has the shortest time for delivery. I'm sure you know, but keep that in mind too.
Raine Marelwe Republic University Minmatar Republic 16	Posted - 2015.11.10 03:38:43 - [23] - Quote I may not have the right mindset for this game. I thought I did, because love overcoming a tenacious long-term challenge. Something like I imagine climbing tall cliffs would be like, if I were the outdoorsy type. But I can't STAND having to make up ground I feel like I already covered. My last loss was a set of 10x +5 implants. I could afford to lose them. I could even afford to replace them immediately. Instead, I logged off and played Skillqueue-Online for months because I would think about the time and effort it would take me to cover those losses, and it made me exhausted before I'd even start. Worse still is that low-risk recovery requires more work than high-risk progress does. I got whacked because I was being lazy and was taking a shortcut I had been using for a long time (AP shuttle through Hi-Sec with a decent bounty on my head. No problems for over a year.), and it was just time to pay the piper. So now I have to climb a different, safer, more methodical part of the metaphorical rock-face - one that does not include autopilot or the benefit of fancy implants - just to get back to where I was before my most recent enrollment in the school of hard-knocks. After years of playing, loss and the prospect of having to start from zero or near-enough is not reinvigorating for me; it accelerates the burnout. I'm beginning to wonder if I don't belong, but for as long as I can stick it out, I will continue to fly far less than that which I can afford to lose.
Sabriz Adoudel Black Hydra Consortium. 5475	Posted - 2015.11.10 04:31:37 - [24] - Quote Raine Marelwe wrote: I may not have the right mindset for this game. I thought I did, because love overcoming a tenacious long-term challenge. Something like I imagine climbing tall cliffs would be like, if I were the outdoorsy type. But I can't STAND having to make up ground I feel like I already covered. My last loss was a set of 10x +5 implants. I could afford to lose them. I could even afford to replace them immediately. Instead, I logged off and played Skillqueue-Online for months because I would think about the time and effort it would take me to cover those losses, and it made me exhausted before I'd even start. Worse still is that low-risk recovery requires more work than high-risk progress does. I got whacked because I was being lazy and was taking a shortcut I had been using for a long time (AP shuttle through Hi-Sec with a decent bounty on my head. No problems for over a year.), and it was just time to pay the piper. So now I have to climb a different, safer, more methodical part of the metaphorical rock-face - one that does not include autopilot or the benefit of fancy implants - just to get back to where I was before my most recent enrollment in the school of hard-knocks. After years of playing, loss and the prospect of having to start from zero or near-enough is not reinvigorating for me; it accelerates the burnout. I'm beginning to wonder if I don't belong, but for as long as I can stick it out, I will continue to fly far less than that which I can afford to lose. Change your mindset. Think of in-game assets as consumables. All of them. (Your skillpoints are your 'permanent' assets). Try to avoid doing actively un-fun things to obtain your consumables. I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com Sabriz's Rule: "Any time someone argues for a game change claiming it is a quality of life change, the change is actually a game balance change".
Raine Marelwe Republic University Minmatar Republic 16	Posted - 2015.11.10 05:30:03 - [25] - Quote Sabriz Adoudel wrote: Change your mindset. Think of in-game assets as consumables. All of them. (Your skillpoints are your 'permanent' assets). Try to avoid doing actively un-fun things to obtain your consumables. I appreciate the advice. Though I'm not sure how capable of selectively modifying my mindset I really am, I'm willing to give it a try. My concern is this; I enjoyed earning the assets - or consumables - the first time. It's novel and exciting to overcome barriers and succeed at something I have not yet mastered or do not fully understand. Having to replace them, however, feels awfully similar to a 9-to-5 grind. I went out, I worked, but then I ate my paycheck (consumables), so I have to go back to work now. I've earned ISK in many different ways in this game, and while I ditched the dullest and least effective (mining, hi-sec exploration), they ALL seem to wear thin when when I'm laboring to recoup losses. (As opposed to expanding my personal empire of Hangar Queens and Exotic Dancers to new extremes, which I am willing to put up with considerable tedium to accomplish) Further, I can see how one might consider implants which I had been using for some time before losing them consumable; I received some benefit and then they were (unexpectedly) used up. This perspective appears less applicable to perhaps even more frustrating scenarios - say, losing a load of resources I had extracted and was moving to market, 'consumables' from which I had yet to benefit, yet which I had already invested considerable effort and time into procuring. I've also made some alterations to my cost/performance analysis of fittings following a suicide gank attempt I survived mere days before the bounty hunter cracked my egg. Having adjusted my play style and chosen a new path up the mountain, I am edging back toward being active in New Eden once more. I shall have to see if I am capable of expecting the exhaustion of my consumables while still working to prevent it/replace them.
Isajah RENTER REBELS UNCHAINED League of Unaligned Master Pilots 5	Posted - 2015.11.10 06:54:52 - [26] - Quote op, can you post the killmail. the char you are writing with is obiously not the freighter pilot. Me wants Comet mining
Luca Lure Obertura 51	Posted - 2015.11.10 06:59:55 - [27] - Quote Yesterday I lost a blockade runner in 0 with my alt. I was angry. Very angry. Because I screwed up. Just plain stupid. I flew into a bubble, cause I didn't fly to a bookmark, but to a gate. Worse was that I knew the gate was camped. So I logged off and went to bed. Will fly again tomorrow and do it right this time. I hope. No gains without losses. GÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇòGÇò The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.
Otso Bakarti Filial Pariahs 458	Posted - 2015.11.10 10:29:51 - [28] - Quote You know in intelligent social constructs (such as sovereign domains, i.e. Minmatar, Amarr, Gallente, Caldari) those sovereigns see your activities as the reason and purpose said intelligent social constructs exist. For, without your endeavors, no society would exist at all. Therefore, neither the technology you use to pursue your endeavors, nor the technical means with which these sovereign powers enforce their sovereignty (against foreign intervention or criminal elements) would exist. This is why piracy is so outlawed no sovereign power flinches from using, and even increasing, its own navy (and often times in alliance with other sovereign powers should the need arise) in order to stamp out all vestiges of piracy anywhere it may appear. This includes summary execution without trial of any pirate caught on the open transportation lanes, and especially caught in the act of piracy. Were the logical mechanics of sovereignty in effect your losses would be seen as the state's losses, and help would be on the way. Not another of your shipments would be in peril. Too bad this is New Eden, no? Let's hear it for Jaeger Logic! Huzzah! Huzzah! Huzzah! Please, you criminals, finish this thread by telling everyone how useful you are. Fear of death follows from fear of life. A man who lives fully is prepared to die at any time. -Mark Twain -
Benny Ohu Chaotic Tranquility Snuffed Out 4485	Posted - 2015.11.10 12:31:24 - [29] - Quote Otso Bakarti wrote: Please, you criminals, finish this thread by telling everyone how useful you are. if they didn't fall asleep reading your post
Lan Wang V I R I I Ineluctable. 1808	Posted - 2015.11.10 12:57:14 - [30] - Quote we we decided to drop a carrier with blops got the carrier into deep structure and bum twitching moment when a ceptor landed on grid we were overheating all the things on the carrier, and then the ceptor started yellowboxing me, i was already aligned and managed to mjd. But that didnt stop the fine ceptor pilot who managed to get a point on me soo fast, just at that moment of being pointed after the mjd...local spike, had a fleet of whatever pointing neuting, and all the other wonderful things you would do to a 2bil isk black ops battleship. It wasnt very nice tbh, sitting watching vultures feed off your dying panther and knowing this is the end but i guess it was well played by that ceptor pilot for catching a couple of nice kills. it doesnt matter if you can afford it or not its still a hurtful loss losing anything over 100mil Recruiting V I R I I Small Gang Nullsec PVP Drinking rum before 10am makes you a pirate, not an alcoholic \| Angel Cartel \| Serpentis \|



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