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Lady Ganker
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Posted - 2007.01.07 20:10:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Lady Ganker on 07/01/2007 20:19:57 Drastic times call for drastic measures.
When you look at the popularity of jita you become pretty aware that its the prime trading hub in eve, but on top of that its an important traffic system. Everything comming from the north, 2 the forge constelations, that wants to go to amarr/gallente space has to pass through it. On top of that its close to a very popular newbie shool and has good lvl 4 agents.
The solution to this needs to be drastic, goal is to remove 100-200 people from system. The folks that aren't interested in trading then dont have to be there.
The solutions are:
1. Remove all mining belts from jita, this should can clear up to 20-40 away from system. What is mining in jita are mostly newbs running away from depleted belts in kisogo, so replacing those belts in kisogo would be a good idea.
2. Remove all agents to surrounding systems. Lots of newbies that run their first missions their, but also vets doing lvl 4's. This should free up another 30-50 people.
3. Make shortcuts, so people who dont have to be in jita can take a shortcut. Like shortcutting sobaseki with kisogo. This should would free up alot more people out of the system.
These are 3 drastic changes, bu I feel they are needed.
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Noriath
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Posted - 2007.01.07 21:14:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Noriath on 07/01/2007 21:12:58 I have a better idea, let's make the sales tax placed on goods a fluent number that goes up further and further depending on how many items are being sold and put on sale in a system. That way over time it becomes really really pricy to buy goods in Jita and other systems become good trade opportunities, and in general the economy will be more interesting, because items will acctually be cheaper in backwater systems where not a lot of people buy them, instead of being the cheapest where most people are, and thereby destroying any chance of sales ever spreading out over the Galaxy, or Manufacturers competing through any other means then undercutting.
Also on a side note, calling anything the "final solution" leaves a bad aftertaste, no matter what the idea is.
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Lady Ganker
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Posted - 2007.01.07 21:26:00 -
[3]
Your solution solves nothing about the traffic, and only makes people ****ed.
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Noriath
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Posted - 2007.01.07 22:28:00 -
[4]
Your solution doesn't adress the acctual problem, but instead is to just remove content from market systems.
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Lady Ganker
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Posted - 2007.01.08 00:14:00 -
[5]
The market is fine, and it needs to stay there. I dont want to move 10 jumps to get all my stuff. The point is to take casual traffic, miners, mission runners out and get them to surrounding systems. That would help the lagg by alot.
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Mai Shiranui
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Posted - 2007.01.08 00:53:00 -
[6]
Drop it's sec status down to 0.0 . That will clear up the problem quick.
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Reggie Stoneloader
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.08 03:35:00 -
[7]
I bet the population of Jita would triple for the first week it's 0.0.
I do like the idea of getting agents out of market hubs. THe agents can stick around, of course, but have them move to other systems. Anyone who has any LP with them gets a letter saying, "I can't stand all the traffic in Jita, I'm transferring to Aakari. If you want to continue working for me, look fo rme there."
And why do you need all those stations anyway? Obviously, you can't just take stations out, since people have hangars and offices in then, but is there a reason for a system to have 23 stations in it? Three is more than enough.
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Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari Worms Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.08 03:40:00 -
[8]
Jita should have all the stations merged into one Super Station that has multiple Undocking ramps. im talking a massive commerce station, call it the "The Mall of Caldaria" or something. since we will be able to enter stations at some point may as well put in a nice food court and of course a Roller Coaster in center court.
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Reggie Stoneloader
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.01.08 03:44:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker Jita should have all the stations merged into one Super Station that has multiple Undocking ramps. im talking a massive commerce station, call it the "The Mall of Caldaria" or something. since we will be able to enter stations at some point may as well put in a nice food court and of course a Roller Coaster in center court.
Best. Idea. Ever.
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Lygos
Amarr ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.01.08 04:33:00 -
[10]
Heh. Noriath, I'm billing you 1 isk for use of the market trade volume <=> market tax index idea. Patent ftw.
It would be interesting to see the security of a system fall as people pile into a system by 10base exponents. Actually pushing a system anywhere near 0.0 would crash the node, so most alliances would be right out, but Pirate Coalition et al might periodically go for a lark.
Another option might be bribing agents, but I don't think that would have any real effect on market hubs considering the savings and investments dilemma.
Really though, there are volumes of market mechanics which can be used to depress hubs. Most people seem to favor use of various skill schemes, though I usually don't. I prefer something along the lines of competing for vendor slots at stations ala the old system of labslots, but with competitive bidding along the lines of NPC-managed contracts. Too much of a market overhaul tbh though. The market is functional and stable even if it doesn't quite give us what we should really desire.
The latter would push some nice wars while the market started spreading out all over major routes in empire, and deep throughout lowsec. I personally love lowsec because in terms of cartography, it has the most intricate webs of all spacelanes. Far moreso than the frustrating spaghetti strings of 0.0 space.
We could also use a T1 overhaul. For example, make manufacturable parts middle of the road, while making npc-dropped mods specialized instead of just grades of +1,+2 EQ nonsense. T2 overhaul would force T2 production into lowsec and/or 0.0 space and force constant exposure and risk, even for bpcs. See "T2 RISK" below.
Also, having some economic npc competition would spice things up for traders. For example, the more you buy and sell (and pay taxes) at one npc corp station, the more annoyed other npc station owners could become. This can be between factions, within factions between rival npc corps, or even between individual npc station managers. Unfortunately, this can be metagamed by even a solo player to just avoid taxes in general, and provides mostly no immediate incentives to any secondary industry since EVE is so small.
On that note, making EVE bigger by increasing travel times is a favored idea of mine, but not too popular for some reason. Adding another layer of destinations (and content) to systems would go a long way to offsetting reasons to just be moving through them. Solar systems should be BIG. It should be possible for a reasonable trade route to exist within a single system. A trade route could involve a little more than undock, click, dock. By increasing the labor involved in both transporting goods from one system to another and the adventure of establishing an industrial beachhead there, you effectively create protectionist markets throughout constellations.
The latter is compounded by the subject of fuel. The greater the transport costs for moving goods, the more likely they are to originate close to home, especially in the less competitive areas away from traffic routes. The more convenient something is, the more it costs. Even if fuel is a nice idea for combat logistics, it is even more a practical idea as overhead for traders, general haulers, and industrial planners, and the military groups who seek to exploit them.
--- T2 Risk | Corp Divisions |
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PtolemaiosPlato Solomon
Gallente Brave New World OPUS Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.08 04:38:00 -
[11]
I like some of the ideas. However, isn't it the special flair of Jita to be a dense traffic hub?The way it is now - I like it. I think, it should be a hardware solution to spped up the things there.
Greetings, thanks for reading,
Sven Location: 18¦ 0'33.80"N - 76¦46'52.66"W - Elevation 344 ft
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Za Po
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.01.08 10:23:00 -
[12]
If Jita stops being a traffic hub, it also stops being a trade hub. Another traffic hub will take its place. This has been the case throughout human history, and it has happened in Eve as well (Yulai), so I have no doubt that if you rearranged the jumpgates so that Jita gets less traffic, its trading role would wither soon afterwards.
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Mira deVorsha
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Posted - 2007.01.08 16:04:00 -
[13]
I think the sun going nova in Jita would probably clear it out. Put a few warnings up beforehand and have it as a game event.
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Noriath
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Posted - 2007.01.08 16:19:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Noriath on 08/01/2007 16:19:09
Originally by: Lady Ganker The market is fine, and it needs to stay there. I dont want to move 10 jumps to get all my stuff.
Exactly, you're lazy and so are 500 of the other people in Jita, they are the problem, not people who want to mine and run missions.
Face the facts, the market is the problem, nothing else. Convenience should have its price, and fluid taxation is the only way to ensure that market hubs don't start black-holing sales in entire regions and destroying the economy.
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Sargeant HAmmer
Caldari Star Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.01.08 16:36:00 -
[15]
jitas a market right?
ok
well instead of jumping into a solar system why not remove the solar system alltogether and make it a station jump!
you just jump in and your at a station in the middle of space. This would mean that you can still fly around but all the gates are visible and it also means it keeps players in the system or out of the system as soon as they can. Make a story like The jita star exploded and the gravity field is strong enough to hold 1 exta large station. the station would be large than any other station ever built. also remove the School in jita!
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Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari Worms Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.08 16:59:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Noriath Edited by: Noriath on 08/01/2007 16:19:09
Originally by: Lady Ganker The market is fine, and it needs to stay there. I dont want to move 10 jumps to get all my stuff.
Exactly, you're lazy and so are 500 of the other people in Jita, they are the problem, not people who want to mine and run missions.
Face the facts, the market is the problem, nothing else. Convenience should have its price, and fluid taxation is the only way to ensure that market hubs don't start black-holing sales in entire regions and destroying the economy.
the city of Danbury doesnt have a special Tax at our mall which generates lots of traffic on the surrounding roads to the point it has its own freeway ramp. the state also doesnt have a special mall tax.
the Market is benifits from a big central market in each empire, a dense market keeps prices competitive and stable. just removing mining and missions from Jita and it will still have its value as a market due to the ease of access.
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Noriath
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Posted - 2007.01.08 17:29:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Noriath on 08/01/2007 20:37:54 Edited by: Noriath on 08/01/2007 17:26:35
Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker the city of Danbury doesnt have a special Tax at our mall which generates lots of traffic on the surrounding roads to the point it has its own freeway ramp. the state also doesnt have a special mall tax.
the Market is benifits from a big central market in each empire, a dense market keeps prices competitive and stable. just removing mining and missions from Jita and it will still have its value as a market due to the ease of access.
The city of Danbury has certain living expenses that you have to come up for if you hire someone to run your shop. Because of that an Item that costs 10 cents to manufacture sells for 5 bucks in Dansbury. The same Item sells for 20 cents in a small town in China, since the costs of living are low, and the vendor doesn't need much money. This would be represented by the sales tax.
The market does not benefit from big central markets. They destroy the regional markets and severely restrict trade, because they remove all reason to go anywhere else but the market systems. Since undercutting is the only way to compete for sales theese market systems are usually cheaper then systems that are further away, which is not an accurate representation of economy. The more stuff people buy the more expensive selling becomes. The only reason to move stuff out from the market systems is if you are supplying a small group of players that us trying to live somewhere else, and then you can't make serious profit from it, because you don't want to screw over your group that needs supplies by hiking up the prices for goods you deliver to them.
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Lygos
Amarr ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.01.09 07:04:00 -
[18]
Trust me, the businesses in the city of Danbury make up the difference. So do the homeowners.
--- T2 Risk | Corp Divisions |
Doomed Predator
The Phoenix Rising Distant Star Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.09 17:18:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker Jita should have all the stations merged into one Super Station that has multiple Undocking ramps. im talking a massive commerce station, call it the "The Mall of Caldaria" or something. since we will be able to enter stations at some point may as well put in a nice food court and of course a Roller Coaster in center court.
That would be awsome,and a nice landmark
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Orrin Danestarr
Minmatar Merchants Trade Consortium New Eden Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.01.09 20:52:00 -
[20]
Turn it into a huge Dysn's Sphere....
Make it a system within a system. "Imagination is the key that unlocks the door." - ME |
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Alkirin
Gallente Die Hard Mining
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Posted - 2007.01.10 01:43:00 -
[21]
IF (very big if) there is to be a trade tax, then it needs to be low...something that will only see a marginal effect in the case of tradehubs becomming as great as Jita.
The heavy-handed solution some seem to be calling for will annihilate the economy, as prices across empire space are likely to stagnate.
Jita is one trade hub. One being the sum of it's parts, removing any one element of the traffic in Jita would likely threaten it's integrity as the trade hub it is now. For once, I agree with solomon about a hardware fix.
[Cogito Ergo Sum Atheios] - Alkirin of Scientia Obscura |
Mighty Baz
HUSARIA
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Posted - 2007.01.10 07:34:00 -
[22]
signed, last one trade hub - any1 remember Yulai? , h/w fix ______________________________________________ Husaria recruits based on legendary XVI century Polish winged cavalry |
Lost Ninja
Incessant-Logic's Friendly Society
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Posted - 2007.01.10 13:21:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Mira deVorsha I think the sun going nova in Jita would probably clear it out. Put a few warnings up beforehand and have it as a game event.
I was going to say Nuke it from orbit.... but sun going nova works too
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Lost Ninja
Incessant-Logic's Friendly Society
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Posted - 2007.01.10 13:23:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Orrin Danestarr Turn it into a huge Dysn's Sphere....
Make it a system within a system.
Love to see a Dyson's Sphere in game. Or any of the other orbital constructs that sci-fi has come up with over the years. Ringworld FTW!
Wikipedia Dyson's Sphere Linkage.
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