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Exploit optimized attributes?

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Atomic Atty Tax Evasion Obviously 0	Posted - 2016.01.03 23:32:44 - [1] - Quote I'm sure I am just missing something about the mechanics, but it appears that when you begin training a skill, you get a bunch of free starting points, which I assume are to offset for you current attributes. Are those extra points saved to that skills training right then, or only truly applied at the end of the skill training? Obviously if it is at the beginning as it sort of appears to be, that would mean that you should tick one point on every skill that you have maximized attributes for before doing remaps. This could end up saving months of training time for long train time lvl 5 skills. Thanks for any clarifications.
Antihrist Pripravnik Aliastra Gallente Federation 951	Posted - 2016.01.03 23:45:34 - [2] - Quote Skill points are not assigned to offset anything, nor do you get a bunch of free starting points when you start training the skill. The behaviour which you are describing is most likely linked to how the Aura app was programmed (it's 3rd party software after all).
Sturmwolke 660	Posted - 2016.01.04 00:08:21 - [3] - Quote Skill level progression isn't linear. You still need to invest the SAME points, depending on the skill rank. If you have any free skill points, you can either notch up a number of low rank skills or spend it all on one skill - makes no difference, except in the former, you'd be spreading your training of skills all over the place. Depending on the situation, assuming one is a total newbie char, bringing up several core skills to a min Lv3 might be a good idea - especially if your current attribute mapping isn't ideally suited for the skill. tl;dr Spend free skill points for skills on opposite side of your attribute mapping. Other than that, the only char optimization possible is through a) careful skill selection & specialization area and b) attribute optimization + implants that boosts related attributes.
Atomic Atty Tax Evasion Obviously 0	Posted - 2016.01.04 00:34:59 - [4] - Quote Antihrist Pripravnik wrote: Skill points are not assigned to offset anything, nor do you get a bunch of free starting points when you start training the skill. The behaviour which you are describing is most likely linked to how the Aura app was programmed (it's 3rd party software after all). Wrong. Start a new skill and look at trained/total points in your skill window. It always starts with some significant number of points completed.
Atomic Atty Tax Evasion Obviously 0	Posted - 2016.01.04 00:40:20 - [5] - Quote Sturmwolke wrote: Skill level progression isn't linear. You still need to invest the SAME points, depending on the skill rank. If you have any free skill points, you can either notch up a number of low rank skills or spend it all on one skill - makes no difference, except in the former, you'd be spreading your training of skills all over the place. Depending on the situation, assuming one is a total newbie char, bringing up several core skills to a min Lv3 might be a good idea - especially if your current attribute mapping isn't ideally suited for the skill. tl;dr Spend free skill points for skills on opposite side of your attribute mapping. Other than that, the only char optimization possible is through a) careful skill selection & specialization area and b) attribute optimization + implants that boosts related attributes. I don't think any of this addresses my question. I'm not talking about free points from patches. I'm talking about the points you start with the second you begin to train a completely new skill level.
Scipio Artelius The Vendunari End of Life 42794	Posted - 2016.01.04 00:56:16 - [6] - Quote Atomic Atty wrote: Antihrist Pripravnik wrote: Skill points are not assigned to offset anything, nor do you get a bunch of free starting points when you start training the skill. The behaviour which you are describing is most likely linked to how the Aura app was programmed (it's 3rd party software after all). Wrong. Start a new skill and look at trained/total points in your skill window. It always starts with some significant number of points completed. Can you provide a screenshot of what you mean? I just double checked on one of my alts, as my understanding is the same and Antihrist and no lump of skillpoints when you start training a new skill from what I can see. Just starts counting up from 0. The screenshot comparison below contains both the character skeet and the skill queue; and both just start at 0 and then count up according to the speed of training: http://puu.sh/miHjD/0d581c9c27.jpg Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
Atomic Atty Tax Evasion Obviously 0	Posted - 2016.01.04 01:08:29 - [7] - Quote I think I just figured out what was throwing me off. the trained / total you can see in training queue must be the total points from level 0 to level 5 of that skill... True? I was under the impression that those points were per level, since it seems silly to have two separate measures of the same progression. If this is true then levels and points trained are just different precision of the same measurement.
Sturmwolke 660	Posted - 2016.01.04 01:28:44 - [8] - Quote Atomic Atty wrote: I don't think any of this addresses my question. I'm not talking about free points from patches. I'm talking about the points you start with the second you begin to train a completely new skill level. It was addressed, you're just confused. To start with, even your first post was a ball of knot, needing some unravelling for the reader. Expecting accurate answers over an improperly framed query = more ground for confusion.
Rowells ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans 2876	Posted - 2016.01.04 01:53:47 - [9] - Quote Atomic Atty wrote: I think I just figured out what was throwing me off. the trained / total you can see in training queue must be the total points from level 0 to level 5 of that skill... True? I was under the impression that those points were per level, since it seems silly to have two separate measures of the same progression. If this is true then levels and points trained are just different precision of the same measurement. Think of each level as a milestone on the same path. A skill partially trained to lvl IV will include all the points from the previous levels, and the progress to the next level.
Scipio Artelius The Vendunari End of Life 42794	Posted - 2016.01.04 02:13:17 - [10] - Quote Atomic Atty wrote: I think I just figured out what was throwing me off. the trained / total you can see in training queue must be the total points from level 0 to level 5 of that skill... True? I was under the impression that those points were per level, since it seems silly to have two separate measures of the same progression. If this is true then levels and points trained are just different precision of the same measurement. No, the trained / total is: trained: how many SP you have trained up to now on that skill total: total to reach for the current level So in the screenshot above for frequency modulation, the 750 total is just to total to reach level 1. For each level for that skill, it is: 1: 1 - 750 2: 751 - 4243 3: 4244 - 24000 4: 24001 - 135764 5: 135765 - 768000 If you are part way through training a skill, then it shows all of the points you have trained on a skill so far. Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
Memphis Baas 890	Posted - 2016.01.04 03:54:21 - [11] - Quote Actually, skill points = how far you've trained. Trained to level 1 = 250 points accumulated. 2 = 1,414 3 = 8,000 4 = 45,255 5 = 256,000 At each level you get another (square) dot in the bar, and the skill gives more bonus. So if the skill gives 5% per level, when you have 3 dots it will give 15%. Note that each 5% (each level) takes exponentially longer to train - you can spend several days trying to get that last 5% (from 4 to 5). Skills also have RANK, and the rank is the difficulty of the skill. So a rank 8 battleship skill will actually require: 1 = 2,000 2 = 11,312 3 = 64,000 4 = 362,040 5 = 2,048,000 points. You could spend months to get a high rank skill from 4 to 5. Luckily, most prerequisites for T2 modules require the previous skills trained to level 3. For T2 weapons you need to train some lower rank prerequisites to 5, takes a bit longer. And for the specialized T2 and T3 ships, you need to also train several prerequisite skills to 4 and 5, also takes a bit. EDIT: Other games have "classes" (warrior, wizard, etc.) that limit what "skills" you have. Here, there are no limits; do whatever you want, but you have to look at the benefits and stop yourself at "good enough" (level 3 or 4 trained). Some skills are worth training to 5 (very few skills affect power grid and CPU for example, which are extremely limited on all your ships and prevent you from installing everything you'd want), and other skills must be trained to 5 because they are a prerequisite for some ship that you want. But otherwise, always stop at "good enough."
Atomic Atty Tax Evasion Obviously 0	Posted - 2016.01.04 04:27:51 - [12] - Quote Sturmwolke wrote: Atomic Atty wrote: I don't think any of this addresses my question. I'm not talking about free points from patches. I'm talking about the points you start with the second you begin to train a completely new skill level. It was addressed, you're just confused. To start with, even your first post was a ball of knot, needing some unravelling for the reader. Expecting accurate answers over an improperly framed query = more ground for confusion. No your answer had nothing to do with my question, but I can see the confusion.
Atomic Atty Tax Evasion Obviously 0	Posted - 2016.01.04 04:35:02 - [13] - Quote Thank you for the info. I did understand most of what was explained here. My issue was only with my interpretation of what the trained points started from. As mentioned, I see that they start from where they left off on the last level, and I understand now that the total points represents the total points to the next level. It all makes sense now.
Sgt Ocker Kenshin. DARKNESS. 793	Posted - 2016.01.04 06:11:05 - [14] - Quote Didn't look to hard at this, don't use the app but installed it to see if I could see what was happening. It looks to me as though the "time saved" SP in yellow is accounting for any time saved due to installed implants. If you have an empty jump clone, jump to it and look at Aura again once the API updates - You should see the yellow "bonus" SP has gone. NB; This may be entirely wrong, I only tested it with one character. My opinions are mine. If you don't like them or disagree with me that's OK.- - - - - - Just don't bother Hating - I don't care It really is getting harder and harder to justify $23 a month for each sub.
Tyberius Franklin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 1853	Posted - 2016.01.04 08:21:15 - [15] - Quote Atomic Atty wrote: I think I just figured out what was throwing me off. the trained / total you can see in training queue must be the total points from level 0 to level 5 of that skill... True? I was under the impression that those points were per level, since it seems silly to have two separate measures of the same progression. If this is true then levels and points trained are just different precision of the same measurement. Assuming you are looking at the in game queue: What you're seeing is SP trained in the skill for the level you have / SP needed for the next level of that skill. The first number starts from 0 SP and increases continually with the added SP from training time. The second is the total SP needed in that skill for whatever the next level is rather than level 5. Playing around with the queue it does look like it says you already have the SP for level 1 of a skill after adding it if you never put any training time in it when looking on the left pane, which is odd.
Nat Silverguard Aideron Robotics 231	Posted - 2016.01.04 09:22:54 - [16] - Quote dude, Marcel, my CEO and the creator of the Aura app haven't updated it for a looooong time now so there might be some discrepancy with SP accumulation and presentation. the app doesn't include the changing of the drone skills, T3 destroyers, T2 command destoryers, and T2 logi frigs. we have our own, corp-exclusive, internal web-based skill monitoring so we don't exactly bug him to upgrade it. Just Add Water

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