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Tobias Quinton
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
0
   |
Posted - 2011.12.14 15:39:00 -
[1] - Quote
I was wondering what total ISK value I should try to keep the modules and cargo of my ships below after the insurance changes in order to not get suicide ganked for what I'm carrying. I remember hearing that 1B used to be the upper limit for Freighters but what about the modules on a ship? Items such as Caldari Navy Invulnerability Field's look tempting to put on a mission fit but they're quite costly at over 500m each. I wouldn't want to buy one or two then get tanked because of it.
I haven't been ganked so far due to not running expensive setups but since I'm planning on tackling some harder missions it'd be nice to know if it's safe to fit some expensive mods. Any recommendations such as a ISK:EHP ratio would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Tobias |
Murtific
Snuff Box
0
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Posted - 2011.12.14 15:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
where do you mission at??
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Tobias Quinton
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2011.12.14 15:47:00 -
[3] - Quote
Murtific wrote:where do you mission at??
Any mission system with less than 20 or so people in it. Helps to prevent wreck stealers and whatnot. |
Kahz Niverrah
We Are So Troubled Everyone Runs Screaming
Moar Tears
81
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 15:54:00 -
[4] - Quote
It's safe to put up to 10b in mods on your ship.
I don't always post on the forums, but when I do, I post with my main. |
Tobias Quinton
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 15:58:00 -
[5] - Quote
Kahz Niverrah wrote:It's safe to put up to 10b in mods on your ship.
So long as I'm in low-sec running Level 5's in a Titan solo, right? |
Kahz Niverrah
We Are So Troubled Everyone Runs Screaming
Moar Tears
81
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 16:00:00 -
[6] - Quote
Tobias Quinton wrote:So long as I'm in low-sec running Level 5's in a Titan solo, right?
Now you're just being silly.
I don't always post on the forums, but when I do, I post with my main. |
Murtific
Snuff Box
0
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Posted - 2011.12.14 16:15:00 -
[7] - Quote
Done it. =/ |
Vachir Khan
TriSeq Defence Group
101
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Posted - 2011.12.14 16:22:00 -
[8] - Quote
Don't know the current numbers with insurance changes and new tier 3s but assume that losing a tier 3 BC costs about 60 mil, then realise they do about 12k volley damage and then know that drop chance is about 50%. So suiciding most mission runner BS will take some 4-6 (depending on tank and sec status of system) BCs, costing about 300 mil. So you need to have a module value of over 600 mil to make it, statistically, worth it to be ganked. As they also want to make a profit (and have to split 4-6 ways) it needs to be quite a bit more.
Now realise that a Tengu can be oneshotted by a Tornado just fine and if it's omni tanked it will take 2, yet people keep having this faction fetish and pour on the most ridiculous mods. Simply put; if you fly a BS for missions you're already a whole lot safer than in a T3 and if you just use some faction damage mods and perhaps a pimp shield booster (if not silly) you'll be fine. But morons with double CN invul, all faction launcher and pith-X type nonsense, those are prime target.
You can always get ganked for lulz ofcourse or because you annoyed someone. then all math is unimportant :)
Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
|
Dzajic
Level Up
0
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Posted - 2011.12.14 16:26:00 -
[9] - Quote
You have to consider your fit. Do you omnitank, or mission specific hardeners? AKA do you have resist holes. Check your EHP for artillery ammo best suited to exploit your resist hole. Consider in what sec system are you and how long CONCROD will take to spawn, aka will they get 1 salvo or 2. Be pessimistic and assume 60-70% of your modules will drop. Note the manufacturer price of a Tornado.
So:
IF Tornado_alpha * number_of_tornadoes_needed > your_EHP@biggest resist hole
AND
numbers_of_tornadoes_needed*price_of_a_tornado < 0.65*price_of_your_modules
You will get suicide ganked. If you are in 0.5 (and maybe 0.6, im not certain) they can get 2 salvos out so divide number of tornadoes by 2.
TLDR&IMHO
Unless you are gimping your tank and dps for a lot of buffers and omni resits, and sticking to a 0.7+ system anything over 1Bil is risky; 2Bil+ is certain eventual doom. |
RZGZ
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
0
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Posted - 2011.12.14 16:53:00 -
[10] - Quote
As high as possible please, thanks. |
shlakkk
Drama Llamas
Phobia.
5
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 17:35:00 -
[11] - Quote
suicide ganking mission runners is hugely rare and usually because someone posts their multi billion isk tengu on battleclinic just for e-peen purposes.
been there, done it.
just dont fly a tengu for missions, a lot of ships are better IMHO
cnr is roughly equal,
mach, nightmare, vindicator, bhal, golem, varg, paladin. dont know about gallente navy bs's but prob them too.
besides, incursions are where the money is at and missiles suck for incs.
the point is, dont fly a low hp ship like a T3 if ur gonna pimp it, but even a tengu with 1bn worth of mods is not going to get ganked for 99% of missioners.
if u want to spend money on pimping it, get a crystal set of implants, that way the ship is not shinny but it gives you the equivalent of an extra shield boost amp or more
|
Smiling Menace
Star Nebulae Holdings Inc.
63
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 17:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
To be honest, some people will gank you just for lulz regardless of how much your transport/fit. |
Tobias Quinton
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 17:41:00 -
[13] - Quote
A Tornado with maximum skills using T1 AC's, Faction EMP + 4 stabs has just under 9.2K alpha. That setup costs around 60m. I was planning on running a passive tank CNR with faction specific resists, at any point the lowest amount of EHP it would have is 141K. That means in the worse case scenario it'd take 16 Tornados or 960m to kill my CNR. With dual CN Invul my modules are at the most 1.5B, that's a potential drop of 975m at a 65% chance.
Considering there's only a 15m difference betweeen the cost and the drop and the fact it's assuming a 65% drop chance I think I might be safe running dual CN Invul. This is besides the fact it would take 16 simultaneous Tornados to get the job done. |
Kariel Lateef
Space Meanies Inc.
10
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 17:51:00 -
[14] - Quote
If they are ganking for tears it doesn't matter what you fit, had a guy in a catalyst try to gank my catalyst, his fit was more expensive than mine (not better hence his failure to gank me). |
shlakkk
Drama Llamas
Phobia.
5
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 18:11:00 -
[15] - Quote
dont fly a passive cnr, just go on battleclinic or somewhere and check out the top fit on there, then tailor it to your budget or needs.
generally, 2 invuln fields and 2 boost amps (all TII) with a gist large booster will be enough, if you have to spend more isk buy a lowgrade crystal set. make sure u use explosion velociy/radius rigs and at least one target painter. also 4 caldari navy bcs is standard before you start spending money on stupidly overpriced cn invulns.
i ran a golem with 2 TII invulns, navy boost amp and a gist something large booster. with no other tanking or capacitor mods. and was fine for even angels extrav bonus room. use 2 boost amps to make up for not getting the tanking bonus of the marauder and you should be fine. |
Lunkwill Khashour
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 18:48:00 -
[16] - Quote
For mission ships wielding things like CN invuls, it's hugely important to activate them the second your session changes. Mission runners are vulnerable just after undock e.g. and die to ganks they shouldn't have if their mods were running. |
Julia Connor
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
9
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Posted - 2011.12.14 18:52:00 -
[17] - Quote
If you have max skills then go ahead and fit your ship optimally for whatever you are doing. It'll mostly consist of t2 and a few faction stuff. |
Opertone
Signal 7
The Jagged Alliance
50
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 19:02:00 -
[18] - Quote
Nobody gives a damm, unless you are fully faction fitted. Or carry at least 3 meta 14-16 items. I.e. officer mods and dedspace loot.
Having t2 guns and meta 6-9 tanks helps a lot. Things go crappy if you have officer damage mods, pith X-type hardeners and fly a Nightmare. |
1-Up Mushroom
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
307
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 19:45:00 -
[19] - Quote
You can put as much as you want on as long as you don't get scanned
5 Senses In A Person... 4 Seasons In A Year... 3 Colors In A Stoplight... 2 Poles On The Earth... ONLY 1-UP MUSHROOM!!!-á If You Like My Sig, Like Me! |
Lady Spank
GET OUT NASTY FACE
462
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 21:22:00 -
[20] - Quote
Smiling Menace wrote:To be honest, some people will gank you just for lulz regardless of how much your transport/fit.
(a¦á_a¦â) ~ http://getoutnastyface.blogspot.com/ ~ (a¦á_a¦â) |
1-Up Mushroom
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
308
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 21:28:00 -
[21] - Quote
Opertone wrote:Nobody gives a damm, unless you are fully faction fitted. Or carry at least 3 meta 14-16 items. I.e. officer mods and dedspace loot..
So if I'm all T2 fit except for 1 Estamel's Invul nobody will bother with me?
5 Senses In A Person... 4 Seasons In A Year... 3 Colors In A Stoplight... 2 Poles On The Earth... ONLY 1-UP MUSHROOM!!!-á If You Like My Sig, Like Me! |
Percival Gates
State War Academy
Caldari State
6
|
Posted - 2011.12.14 22:32:00 -
[22] - Quote
Ugh, I wrote a bunch of stuff only to realize that I didn't read very well.
Anyway, the gist of what I was saying is this: don't underestimate the entertainment factor. Many will gladly gank mission ships for lulz. Loot drops are simply a bonus. For this reason, it's not really valid to come up with an "ISK value to keep below to not get ganked." When you spend isk, you spend it to have fun. For many, the "fun" is laughing at some poor scrub that got blown up when he thought he was safe. |
Opertone
Signal 7
The Jagged Alliance
50
|
Posted - 2011.12.15 08:18:00 -
[23] - Quote
1-Up Mushroom wrote:Opertone wrote:Nobody gives a damm, unless you are fully faction fitted. Or carry at least 3 meta 14-16 items. I.e. officer mods and dedspace loot.. So if I'm all T2 fit except for 1 Estamel's Invul nobody will bother with me?
More likely noone will bother you than not, since the chance of invulnerability not dropping is quite unsporting (shooting sitting duck sport). Add another 1-2 officer modules and you'll get yourself personal attention. I studied probability theory, according to it their chance to cover losses is 62% or greater, chances of them making profit (2 modules dropped) 38%, chances to hit jackpot 13%.
Assuming that officer mods are anywhere between 1.5 bill - 5 bill, cost of gank with may be near 70 mill per ship, in high sec they may need 10 for a tanked BS. If you have more than one expensive mod they'll give it a try.
Killing for lulz - uhmm, don't fly capsules and shuttles in hi density public areas. Don't hibernate in tengu near undock point. |
Vachir Khan
TriSeq Defence Group
104
|
Posted - 2011.12.15 09:23:00 -
[24] - Quote
Opertone wrote:I studied probability theory
You obviously chose the wrong study because any sane person would RUSH to that chance to get an Estamel invul drop (and even if it didn't drop it's still a funky killmail). Just because it's one item doesn't mean it's not a target, if that item is worth eleventy billion (as is the case) it's a good bet to pop him.
Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.
|
Federigo Mondial
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2011.12.15 09:57:00 -
[25] - Quote
People WILL still gank you for teh lulz. T3 pilots have to accept it as the Tengu is fragile. Fin. |
Spookyjay
Animosity.
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.15 12:01:00 -
[26] - Quote
Simple fix, fly a rattlesnake. 150k ehp. Profit |
Dbars Grinding
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
75
|
Posted - 2011.12.15 13:10:00 -
[27] - Quote
you are either.
a.) flying in a system with a fk ton of people.
b.) making it known u have a expensive fit.
c.) wont shut the fuk up in local
d.) sitting around drooling at the stars for too long.
e.) really bad at this game and dont realize 500m is pocket change. |
Bibosikus
Elite United Hard Moose
Moose Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.15 14:49:00 -
[28] - Quote
Train or buy a fleet boosting alt.
Put alt in Tengu/Legion/CS with T2 gang links for stupid 85% increase in active tank.
Sell pimp mods, buy T2, and have the same tank you had before.
EG:
Solo pimped Nightmare:
Pith A-Type LSB
Gist A EM hardener
2 x Cal Navy Invuls
omnitank = 444, 3m45s cap
Alt with mindlink in Tengu boosting T2 Nightmare :
T2 LSB
T2 EM hardener
2 x T2 invuls
omnitank = 444, 2m49s cap
Edit: and 10,000 more EHP than the pimp version
The T3's give better dedicated active tanking boosts than the Command Ships, and my t3 alt also tags along behind the main boat cherry-picking wrecks with long tractors, plus it's cov-ops cloaky fitted. So it's the boat of choice for boosting mission dps ships.
@OP - if you can use the above, then the only pimping you need to consider is damage mods. On a typical Nighmare, I fit 2 IN heatsinks and 2 T2's because the stacking penalties make using more faction gear a waste of time. It gives me 19dps (about 2.5%) less than 4 x faction mods, and keeps the boat cheap.
The box said "Requires Windows-á2000 or better", so I installed Linux. |
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