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Mikhem
Taxisk Unlimited
328
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Posted - 2016.02.06 13:41:01 -
[1] - Quote
How big problem is alt infiltration for EVE corporations? I know that some corporations do not easily recruit people because risk of getting alt to corporation is very high. This is true especially if you are highly visible member of EVE community. I usually create ready ideas how to fix problems to EVE forums but for this problem I have no ready answers. That is why I created this open discussion thread about alt infiltration.
Topics for this thread are:
1. How big problem is alt infiltration for EVE corporations? Share your experiences and thoughts about this issue here.
2. What could be done to minimize damage from alt infiltration? Share your idea how recruitment of capsuleers could be more safe for corporations.
Discussion is open! Share your thoughts if you dare!
Mikhem
Link library to EVE music songs.
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Poddington Bare
Angur Therapy
165
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Posted - 2016.02.06 13:43:09 -
[2] - Quote
1. Constant and unrelenting.
2. Genital clamping of real life users. |
Thorian Baalnorn
Bad Influence
I N G L O R I O U S
62
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Posted - 2016.02.06 14:07:47 -
[3] - Quote
1) It happens mostly with big alliances and power blocks.
2) Nothing, there is no way to stop infiltration short of having a corp of only your alts. For example, just because someone has my full API key and my account is "clean" doesnt mean im not a spy, it just means im not a bad spy. I could have an alt in every major alliance in EVE, and you could never tell in game.
In fact i was thinking about this the other day. What if you had a corp or alliance in which your PVP main is in a corp or alliance with people's other pvp main. Then if you had your "isk making alt" on a different account and in a normal alliance.
So now you have this corp or alliance of pvpers and every one of them has an alt in another alliance. You just created an awesome intel network for your pvp alliance. Now you can PVP with impunity. Your not attached to any of the other alliances your just using them for a farm alt. Meanwhile your corp /alliance has intel on everyone, is in everyones TS, etc
And i got to thinking about how ingenious that would be... then i realized i just described PL.
Shooting Structures = PVP Mining
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Grauth Thorner
Vicious Trading Company
436
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Posted - 2016.02.06 15:04:53 -
[4] - Quote
Mikhem wrote:
1. How big problem is alt infiltration for EVE corporations? Share your experiences and thoughts about this issue here.
2. What could be done to minimize damage from alt infiltration? Share your idea how recruitment of capsuleers could be more safe for corporations.
1. Not big, just make a seperate corporation for alts - ah wait, you're talking about a different kind of alt infiltration 
2. Make sure new pilots can't get a hold on too much intel too soon and more importantly, fight intel-scavengers with intel.
Create your own in-game shiplabels:
>EVE Custom Ship Labeler application forum thread
>iciclesoft.com
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Cara Forelli
Meticulously Indifferent
1522
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Posted - 2016.02.06 15:11:01 -
[5] - Quote
Why is this a problem? Alts are people too you know!
I don't like your tone.
Adventures
New player with questions? Join my public channel in game: House Forelli
Titan's Lament
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Barnabus Jones III
Meticulously Indifferent
2
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Posted - 2016.02.06 15:17:51 -
[6] - Quote
Cara Forelli wrote:Alts are people too you know!
The best people. |
Mithandra
Catastrophic Operations
Get Off My Lawn
467
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Posted - 2016.02.06 15:45:16 -
[7] - Quote
Its unrelenting. spying is all pervasive, awoxing is happenning, and someone really is out to raid your corporation hangers and wallets. God I love this game.
Not my style of play, but it takes all sorts to make this game.
Yes its a worry for recruiters such as myself, but hey, whats life without some risk eh?
Eve is the dark haired, totally hot emo gothchild of the gaming community
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Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
10652
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Posted - 2016.02.06 16:07:51 -
[8] - Quote
OP, I think you should rename your corp (Taxisk Unlimited) to 'Bumbleisk Unlimited'
I think you know what I mean =^_^=
Got a HoleySheet1 corpse? I'll buy it for 200m!
Bumble's Space Log
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Memphis Baas
1051
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Posted - 2016.02.06 16:07:54 -
[9] - Quote
1. Agree with the above, it happens all the time, unrelenting.
2. What they've done with it is what you do with anything that simply exists / is a factor: you just assume it's happening even if you don't see it, and operate as if it's happening.
There's "op.sec" (operation security):
- fleets are formed just before the event, rather than long in advance
- there are many fleets, keeping the big ships separate from the small / newbie ones
- the destination isn't disclosed, just vague "we're gonna do something, assemble in system x"
- FC's take control and move the fleet towards its destination without revealing the destination till the last moment
There's counter-intelligence:
- you infiltrate every other alliance because you know they have spies in your membership
- you keep track of WHEN secrets are revealed (compared to when they were announced), and who had access to the information
- you announce false information and keep track of when/where it gets revealed
- you use what your spies hear, and correlate with API data / names of characters, to try to figure out who the enemy spies are
There's security:
- careful recruitment interviews (as much as possible), or "recruitment is closed" but use satellite corps to secretly recruit and check out the newbies
- API checks to find alts, linked money or item transaction, or discrepancies between what is claimed ("I'm a newbie!") and assets
- no access to sensitive stuff; separate forums and channels for the directors etc., separate hangars, separate wallets, etc.
And, finally, there's "it's just a game":
- programs for free ships, ISK donations to new members, advice / mentoring
- ship reimbursement programs
- drunken / yolo fleets
- NPSI fleets (anyone not in your fleet is a valid target, even if they're from your alliance / all deeds are forgiven come Monday)
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Ibutho Inkosi
Irubo Kovu
103
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Posted - 2016.02.06 17:41:10 -
[10] - Quote
Alt infiltration...as a professional intel officer I have to say, when I'm trying to penetrate a system and my target is looking for "alts" I am much comforted. It means he's not looking for me. How that simple fact fits into your equation I know not. I will tell you this, it really doesn't matter what you do. If I want to infiltrate you, I will. You can't stop it.
What I "fear" most when I'm being paid to infiltrate someone is compartmentalized information. When I see this, I see a target that's not letting it all hang out. It's not a matter of controlling who you have working with you. It's a matter of controlling information. In organizations (such as those found in this game) run by people who aren't employing an intel technician, and aren't using intelligence protection management methods, I can not only get whatever I want in the way of info, I can sow seeds of mistrust among your most loyal people.
Compartmentalized information is what keeps me from having free reign over your system. Trying to divine who's a spy and who isn't as your main security method allows me to operate with impunity, and also take advantage of your paranoia. If the mission is to totally undermine your command structure, that's how it's done. Get you to not trust your own people.
If everyone and their cousin doesn't have access to everything (plus some) then you don't have to mistrust people 'cause they aren't in a position to hurt you. It is so hard to get this simple fact across to people, which is a good thing for me. So, please. Don't believe me. Keep using those APIs and that paranoid hiring method. I love buying new, very expensive ships.
As long as the tale of the hunt is told by the hunter, and not the lion, it will favor the hunter.
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Cien Banchiere
Extrinsic Arcadia Distribution
41
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Posted - 2016.02.06 18:12:24 -
[11] - Quote
It happens, and happens often. It's not as scary ad it seems when I you first start or it happens to you the first time. I've been through it a couple times.
Good recruitment practices and using common sense investigating potential hires are key. Don't be like my CEO and ignore everyone's warning flags and get your **** stolen out of the POS and blown up. |
Lulu Lunette
Savage Moon Society
276
|
Posted - 2016.02.06 18:23:47 -
[12] - Quote
When does an alt become a main?
@lunettelulu7
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
13998
|
Posted - 2016.02.06 18:43:20 -
[13] - Quote
Lulu Lunette wrote:When does an alt become a main?
when it has an alt of its own 
Better the Devil you know.
=]|[=
|
Epic Name
The Lost.
SpaceMonkey's Alliance
147
|
Posted - 2016.02.07 02:24:40 -
[14] - Quote
Poddington Bare wrote:1. Constant and unrelenting.
2. Genital clamping of real life users. I agree with this solution. /thread |
Droidster
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
158
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Posted - 2016.02.07 04:27:18 -
[15] - Quote
Corporate history and standings are generally sufficient to ferret out low-play-time alts. Also, if the player's SP does not match up with their age, then obviously they have been using training time on some other character.
Of course, there is always the possibility of a player that fully maintains two accounts and keeps them separate. Often such pairs are identifiable because they will appear in the same corporation together or otherwise do things that will lead to them being associated. If the owner keeps them fully separate, plays both regularly and religiously uses a VPN when connecting to voice servers, then a secret identity is possible, but this is quite a rare case.
If you accept young players into a corp, then there is always the possibility of a spy. |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
End of Life
44427
|
Posted - 2016.02.07 06:38:56 -
[16] - Quote
I thought it was friendly fire that prevented Corp recruitment.
CCP might need to ban alts now.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Borat Guereen
Chao3
Chao3 Alliance
47
|
Posted - 2016.02.07 07:52:51 -
[17] - Quote
Mikhem wrote:How big problem is alt infiltration for EVE corporations? I know that some corporations do not easily recruit people because risk of getting alt to corporation is very high. This is true especially if you are highly visible member of EVE community. I usually create ready ideas how to fix problems to EVE forums but for this problem I have no ready answers. That is why I created this open discussion thread about alt infiltration.
Topics for this thread are:
1. How big problem is alt infiltration for EVE corporations? Share your experiences and thoughts about this issue here.
2. What could be done to minimize damage from alt infiltration? Share your idea how recruitment of capsuleers could be more safe for corporations.
Discussion is open! Share your thoughts if you dare!
Check my campaign.
Candidate for CSM XI
Speaker of Chao3
|
ArmyOfMe
BANISHED.
The WeHurt Initiative
580
|
Posted - 2016.02.07 13:05:13 -
[18] - Quote
Mikhem wrote:How big problem is alt infiltration for EVE corporations? I know that some corporations do not easily recruit people because risk of getting alt to corporation is very high. This is true especially if you are highly visible member of EVE community. I usually create ready ideas how to fix problems to EVE forums but for this problem I have no ready answers. That is why I created this open discussion thread about alt infiltration.
Topics for this thread are:
1. How big problem is alt infiltration for EVE corporations? Share your experiences and thoughts about this issue here.
2. What could be done to minimize damage from alt infiltration? Share your idea how recruitment of capsuleers could be more safe for corporations.
Discussion is open! Share your thoughts if you dare!
1) A lot bigger then you think.
2) Nothing really. The harder it is for a alt to get in, the better the spy is. So basicly there is not much you can do.
Live with it, learn to accept it, or just recruit ppl you already know (the last one is basicly the only way to avoid alt infilitration)
QUOTE CCP Dolan and the EVE Online development team:-áThe battle was relatively even for some time with CFC and Russian forces holding moderate lead at first and only have a slight lead in Titan kills. Then came a turning point in the battle. Manfred Sideous, the initial Fleet Commander for PL/N3, handed over command to the CEO of Northern Coalition., Vince Draken
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J'Poll
Perkone
Caldari State
6287
|
Posted - 2016.02.07 13:42:59 -
[19] - Quote
It's a big issue.
Everywhere I go my alts follow me.
And they aren't as nice as I am and always get me into trouble with corp leadership.
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded
Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
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Lugh Crow-Slave
1508
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Posted - 2016.02.07 14:30:27 -
[20] - Quote
There is nothing you can really do to keep alt infiltration from harping however there is plenty you can do to keep it from negatively affecting your corp or to make it extremely beneficial to your corp if your a medium size organization
Citadel worm hole tax
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Hal Morsh
Hmmzor.
Muffins of Mayhem
500
|
Posted - 2016.02.07 17:29:08 -
[21] - Quote
Ibutho Inkosi wrote:Alt infiltration...as a professional intel officer I have to say, when I'm trying to penetrate a system and my target is looking for "alts" I am much comforted. It means he's not looking for me. How that simple fact fits into your equation I know not. I will tell you this, it really doesn't matter what you do. If I want to infiltrate you, I will. You can't stop it. What I "fear" most when I'm being paid to infiltrate someone is compartmentalized information. When I see this, I see a target that's not letting it all hang out. It's not a matter of controlling who you have working with you. It's a matter of controlling information. In organizations (such as those found in this game) run by people who aren't employing an intel technician, and aren't using intelligence protection management methods, I can not only get whatever I want in the way of info, I can sow seeds of mistrust among your most loyal people. Compartmentalized information is what keeps me from having free reign over your system. Trying to divine who's a spy and who isn't as your main security method allows me to operate with impunity, and also take advantage of your paranoia. If the mission is to totally undermine your command structure, that's how it's done. Get you to not trust your own people. If everyone and their cousin doesn't have access to everything (plus some) then you don't have to mistrust people 'cause they aren't in a position to hurt you. It is so hard to get this simple fact across to people, which is a good thing for me. So, please. Don't believe me. Keep using those APIs and that paranoid hiring method. I love buying new, very expensive ships.
You're a rat.
My advice for everybody else. Put his post as a "note" in his in game profile. For future refrence.
Dun'Gal > Hal is simply an imperfect ai, though if drunkeness ever gets programmed into ai's I foresee both a hilarious and tragic end to humanity.
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Alea
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
201
|
Posted - 2016.02.08 18:57:58 -
[22] - Quote
Barnabus Jones III wrote:Cara Forelli wrote:Alts are people too you know! The best people.
I second that.
Fellow Eve players please take note: In case you haven't yet noticed HTFU is going to be replaced with P(ay)TFU, that is all..
|
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1103
|
Posted - 2016.02.08 19:53:58 -
[23] - Quote
1) dont recruit alts.
2) profit??
you see on killboard if someone is alt or not. Hardly anyone is going to be active and actively pvping on his alt, or at least there is some effort involved reducing the risk significantly.
If you recruit any noob from NPC corp channel, its entirely your fault. |
Remiel Pollard
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
7511
|
Posted - 2016.02.08 20:00:22 -
[24] - Quote
I wish someone would infiltrate me.
*so lonely* 
GÇ£Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'.
Jam those ones first, and kill them last.GÇ¥
- Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
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