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Star Fraction refutes Misleading Reports of SOE and Hedoubel System

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Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 16:00:00 - [1] http://myeve.eve-online.com/mb/news.asp?nid=1367 Inaccuracies abound in the recent news report detailing the Sisters of Eve intervention in Hedoubel System. While it is reported that Sister Rhayne of SOE was attacked by the Star Fraction pilots in system was not the case and the account presented is factually incorrect and deeply misleading. What actually happened is that a Star Fraction combat wing cleared the system of all hostiles including CYI alliance and Order of Medusa fleet assets and allowed the Sisters of Eve to take the readings they required from the affected station. Then there was stand-off with a particular member of the SOE hired escort force under MorduÆs Legion tags. Seargant Major Rakham of MorduÆs flying a Cerberus class Heavy Assault Ship was informed that he was a viable target to SF for his political allegiances and had two minutes to depart the scene before he was engaged by Star Fraction ships. Seargant Major Rakham ignored the warning and was subsequently destroyed in accordance with Star Fraction diplomatic customs and rules of engagement. Choosing to remain in system Rakham then hurled various impotent threats and imprecations and complaints towards the SF fleet from his pod and did all he could to inflame the situation further: Seargant Major Rakham > Cowards Seargant Major Rakham > Star fraction you are are just cowards. Seargant Major Rakham > So says Star Fraction... Friends of the Gurista.. you are nothing more then a joke.. and well pirates. Seargant Major Rakham > By attacking me.. you destroyed alot of data that was required by the SSoE.. and I'm flying uder the banner of the SSoE you damned fool. (This last was of course a lie since the data had already been transferred and verified by the SOE ships present.) Sister Rhayne herself chose then to inform us: ôYour attack against our escort is considered an attack on us.ö ôFrom now on you will be considered enemies of the Servant Sisters of EVE.ö And we wait formal confirmation from the SOE command whether this is indeed a declaration of -10 standings and free fire status or whether Sister Rhayne has the diplomatic seniority to make such decisions in the field. So, What conclusions can be drawn: Star Fraction choose to set MorduÆs Legion to -10 standings after their own cowardly behaviour in Pureblind as lickspittle hired help for RAZOR and the Northern Tyrants last year, this standing persists in the absence of MorduÆs Legion apologies for the deeds and words of their leadership. There are no circumstances where SF is obliged to ignore these standings û we may choose to do so but this occasion it was not our choice. The SF fleet present in Hedoubel System was easily capable of eliminating the hostiles from Order of Medusa and did so swiftly. The MorduÆs Legion pilot was warned to withdraw and chose not to. His vessel was eliminated in part payment for old hostilities which remain unaddressed. We give fair warning that Mercenaries will be treated as entities in their own right and we will not spare them the consequences of past actions regardless of who they are currently serving. Anyone thinking to hire MorduÆs Legion in the future would do well to remember that Star Fraction is hostile to this organisation and will engage their ships and personnel anywhere in space. It is not possible for a Mercenary to escape the record of their past actions simply by taking a contract with a neutral/friendly entity û if they are not prepared to make diplomatic effort to recover the good-esteem they have lost then they must be prepared to be targets. Hostilities begin between SF and Mordu's Legion So, official clarification from SOE is sought together with an apology for the misleading news report assembled from her inaccurate words. Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 16:05:00 - [2] And specifically to Sister Rhayne we say this: Be wary of telling lies that can be so easily revealed as such. There are combat logs and local conversation records that prove everything I have said on this matter. If you wish to provoke a confrontation with the Star Fraction in support of the MorduÆs Legion you are going in the right direction û but we suspect your superiors may look on the records you have provided with a more discerning eye now the truth is in the public forum. Star Fraction is recruiting
Khavi Vetali Team Americas Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.02.05 16:56:00 - [3] Edited by: Khavi Vetali on 05/02/2007 16:57:38 I was curious as to the proper account of things when I read the bulletin this morning, as I was sure SF had no hostilities, or any reasons to be hostile towards SSOE. I was reasonably certain it had to be a non-SSOE member of the task force that had negative standings for SF and was thus eliminated. It will be interesting to see the results of this debacle. More specifically, if clarification will be made of the erroneous reporting. Edit: It seems the report has already been removed from publication, perhaps for correction. Edit 2: Main News Center link has been removed, however, the article can still be found under the archives. Originally by: Itanis "Hello there mate, I'm dreadfully sorry, but I'm going to have to sodomize you with howitzers. Have a lovely day!"
Dust Angel Harvest System Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.02.05 17:14:00 - [4] Perhaps Star fraction should consider the ramifications of their actions. mirel yirrin > "DU HAST VERBROKEN DAS FORUMERN RULEN! DU SWINE!"
Devilish Ledoux Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 17:21:00 - [5] I am not bothered by the response of SoE's field commander, Sister Rhayne. She was obviously unprepared for sudden deviations from her mission plan and while that is likely to lead to the deaths of pilots under her command in the future, that did not happen on this occasion. What bothers me is the irresponsible reporting of Eris Discordia. The facts are as follows: 1) The Legion's Sergeant Major Rakham was given ample opportunity to quit the field. He chose to remain and was attacked and destroyed per Star Fraction Rules of Engagement. 2) The Order of Medusa ships were also attacked by Star Fraction Free Captains. 3) Star Fraction Free Captains offered to assist the Sisters of Eve in the completion of their mission. Sister Rhayne refused to accept the offer. 4) At no time did Star Fraction Free Captains engage the pilots of the Sisters of Eve. Nor did they attempt to hinder the mission of SoE. However, if you read Ms. Discordia's report, you would think that the Star Fraction fleet assisted the Order of Medusa in attacking the SoE escort fleet and preventing them from completing their mission. I find it particularly disturbing that Ms. Discordia's report makes absolutely no mention of the presence of the Legion pilot, especially considering the fact that his presence (and subsequent refusal to quit the field) that led to the destruction of his vessel. Perhaps if Ms. Discordia had attempted to contact Star Fraction diplomats for their side of the story, this botched attempt at journalism could have been prevented. _ Sig removed, lacks game related content. Please contact [email protected] for more info (including a copy of your picture!) -Pirlouit
Kovid Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 17:43:00 - [6] And oh how I like what Ly Sol said in the past [http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=247190&page=1#9] "As much as Jericho is hated by the northern allies, thier word is worth billions." And to this day The Star Fraction's word is still worth billions. For the stubborn there are the logs for this case. So Sister Rhayne, why do you choose to ask for help of mercernaries who have horrible standings with The Star Fraction who happen to be operating in the very area you were going? If anyone failed you it was them not telling you they could be a liability, IXDS could have told you we would be in the area. They know. We carefully selected and laid retribution to our targets as always. We are not indiscriminate like so many others. Even in a situation like this we were even gracious making sure no data or efforts were loss among the Sister of Eve by giving warning to the Mordu pilot. Once the timer expired, so did the blowhard Seargant Major Rakham's ship.
MrJordanIOI Minmatar The Lantern Mining Corporation	Posted - 2007.02.05 18:17:00 - [7] Seeing the news and then reading Jasmines clarification leaves me with a sense of shock. How Eris can so easily give up her well known credibility with such a lie is something I can not comprehend. Bad recherche perhaps ? Biased ? Quite a bit sad to see a reputation hurt on either side by lies spread by a third party I venture to believe. IOI
MrJordanIOI Minmatar The Lantern Mining Corporation	Posted - 2007.02.05 18:17:00 - [8] Seeing the news and then reading Jasmines clarification leaves me with a sense of shock. How Eris can so easily give up her well known credibility with such a lie is something I can not comprehend. Bad recherche perhaps ? Biased ? Quite a bit sad to see a reputation hurt on either side by lies spread by a third party I venture to believe. IOI
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 19:33:00 - [9] I was present at the events so inaccurately reported in the news and confirmed the Mordu's Legion pilot was a viable target to the Star Fraction wing commander, Jonny Damordred, while suggesting the two minutes grace period. Those who are designated hostiles are not normally given such a grace period, it was my view that the Legion pilot should be given the warning and an opportunity to withdraw given he was working with the SoE. He chose to ignore the warning and behave in an offensive manner. The pilot lost his temper in the aftermath and no doubt he gave a highly-coloured account to the news service resulting in the poor quality report. As has been said, SoE ships and personnel were specifically not targeted and in particular the SoE personnel who recovered data from the stricken research station were able to rejoin their ship, carrying the samples they had gathered, and depart the scene in good order. There were independent witnesses to all that transpired, notably Ashar Kor-Azor of the Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr, who will be able to confirm the Star Fraction account. The SoE are requested to confirm their stance with respect to the Star Fraction. Until they do so we will continue to regard SoE as a neutral entity not to be engaged by SF pilots. The Mordu's Legion, of course, remain viable targets. Personally, I would recommend that SoE engage a reputable capsuleer mercenary group for escort duties in future. Mordu's Legion is a spent force that has lost all clarity of vision. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Raivi Explosion Matrix	Posted - 2007.02.05 19:45:00 - [10] I am glad to hear the Star Fraction side of this story. I for one was shocked when I read the news report on the Hedoubel incident. Whatever one may think of the Star Fraction's goals, they are not the kind of capsuleers who would actively aid he Order of Medusa against The Sisters of EVE. I call for a full review this report by Interstellar Correspondents in order to protect the public reputation of their reporters. More now than ever, the EVE cluster needs a strong and unbiased news source which all capsuleers can trust. ----------------------------------------- Explosion Matrix: Our Name Makes No Sense
Ashar KorAzor Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.05 20:06:00 - [11] In the interest of actually contributing to this discussion in a way that forced any impulse-driven rabble-rousers to actually access another GalNet feed and thus have time to reconsider tossing stupid statements my way, or the way of any other pilot who chooses to risk InterGal, I have replied to the Doctor's implied request here. Anyone who would like to put money toward a good cause is directed to transfer it to my wallet so I can feed some starving people today, to make up for the spiritual breach caused by even accessing this sordid network. Yes, money from filthy outlanders will be accepted. No, you don't have to send me a thank-you letter. Good day.
Bruno Bonner Gallente Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.02.05 20:15:00 - [12] I'm intrigued. You had Mordu's Legion set to negative standing which is a fact, no arguing about it. Weren't you and your fleet informed by SoE and Mordu's Legion of their intentions in system?. They were not pursuing actions against your organization, but hired to provide minimal escort to the SoE fleet, firing on them under such contractual circumstances could almost be interpreted as an attack on SoE, unless.... You wish to replace Mordu's Legion as the main provider of security services to SoE. New business ventures? ------ aka BinderAJ
Tara Armitage Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 21:05:00 - [13] Edited by: Tara Armitage on 05/02/2007 21:02:23 The strict ROE of The Star Fraction prohibits us from shooting pilots in organizations that are not -10 KOS to us, Mr. Bonner. More importantly, we have our own cause and we are fully committed to furthering that. As always we reserve the right to move against any valid target according to our rules of engagement. Mordu's Legion is -10 KOS to The Star Fraction by their own actions. Seargant Major was a valid target. He chose to insult us instead of removing himself, but even so we were not ordered to engage before the time given for him to leave the area had ran out. Soon after that I fired the final blow to the fiery hull of his damned vessel myself.
Darina Rea	Posted - 2007.02.05 22:10:00 - [14] Originally by: Jade Constantine So, official clarification from SOE is sought together with an apology for the misleading news report assembled from her inaccurate words. Your rules of engagement are all nice and dandy, but you still shot an SoE escort that was under contract to aid the SoE under all circumstances, which frankly does not translate into abandoning them when Jack and Jill tell them to get lost. The Sergeant major could use a lesson in diplomacy, but his bravery is quite obvious. Your 'aid' was no more then a happy coincedence with your own agenda. You deserve no apology. _________ Time is on our side.
Khavi Vetali Team Americas Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.02.05 22:16:00 - [15] Originally by: Darina Rea Your 'aid' was no more then a happy coincedence with your own agenda. You deserve no apology. Even though you think they deserve no apology, the facts of the report still need to be corrected to represent what actually occurred. Originally by: Itanis "Hello there mate, I'm dreadfully sorry, but I'm going to have to sodomize you with howitzers. Have a lovely day!"
Sister Rhayne Food Relief	Posted - 2007.02.05 22:31:00 - [16] As much as it pains me to dwell upon that unprovoked act of violence and the other atrocities that took place that day, I have retrieved and reviewed my vessel's logs from the day in question. Your pilots were informed several times that the Seargant Major was a member of our relief convoy, and the Star Fraction pilots were politely asked to set aside their differences for the greater good. They chose to attack despite being informed of the nature of his involvement. When his ship was destroyed, we lost a great portion of our scanner data and the station's logs that had been transfered to his ship from our other vessels for safekeeping. It is not my intention to slander the name of your corporations or alliance, but I will reiterate what I stated in Hedoubel after your attack. The willful, unprovoked attack on a member of our convoy fleet during a relief effort within the Gallente Federation's borders and the subsequent hinderance to our efforts has left us with no option but to consider your alliance as a potential threat to our relief operations, and our pilots and members of our convoy must be warned of the possible danger that your ships represent. May God bless us with his light in these dark days.
Sister Rhayne Food Relief	Posted - 2007.02.05 22:31:00 - [17] As much as it pains me to dwell upon that unprovoked act of violence and the other atrocities that took place that day, I have retrieved and reviewed my vessel's logs from the day in question. Your pilots were informed several times that the Seargant Major was a member of our relief convoy, and the Star Fraction pilots were politely asked to set aside their differences for the greater good. They chose to attack despite being informed of the nature of his involvement. When his ship was destroyed, we lost a great portion of our scanner data and the station's logs that had been transfered to his ship from our other vessels for safekeeping. It is not my intention to slander the name of your corporations or alliance, but I will reiterate what I stated in Hedoubel after your attack. The willful, unprovoked attack on a member of our convoy fleet during a relief effort within the Gallente Federation's borders and the subsequent hinderance to our efforts has left us with no option but to consider your alliance as a potential threat to our relief operations, and our pilots and members of our convoy must be warned of the possible danger that your ships represent. May God bless us with his light in these dark days.
K'srah Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.05 22:33:00 - [18] ::scoffs::
K'srah Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.05 22:33:00 - [19] ::scoffs::
Darina Rea	Posted - 2007.02.05 22:46:00 - [20] Originally by: Khavi Vetali Originally by: Darina Rea Your 'aid' was no more then a happy coincedence with your own agenda. You deserve no apology. Even though you think they deserve no apology, the facts of the report still need to be corrected to represent what actually occurred. Ofcourse. _________ Time is on our side.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 23:02:00 - [21] Originally by: Sister Rhayne When his ship was destroyed, we lost a great portion of our scanner data and the station's logs that had been transfered to his ship from our other vessels for safekeeping. So it is your claim that digital data is lost at the origin point when it is transferred from one ship to another? That may be a common device in holoreel science-fiction romances but it is a patent nonsense. Let's examine the logs: Quote: [ 21:42:17 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Your Scanners should be working fine.. Send me the data. [ 21:42:35 ] Sister Rhayne > I am still getting no response, I will have to dock if their communications equipment is damaged. [ 21:42:40 ] Disciple Sibanna > Confirmed Sir, data transfer started. [ 21:42:56 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Is this all of the data? [ 21:43:17 ] Disciple Sibanna > Yes sir, no life signs...... my concern, [ 21:47:11 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Sibanna, send a priorty comms to CONCORD.. Send them the data you have.. Tell them that we have a code black situation.Sister, my scans are showing that the enviroment on that station is unsafe and I suggest we request a CONCORD HAZMAT team. [ 21:47:49 ] Seargant Major Rakham > I am sending you the results of my scan for you to confirm the readings. [ 21:47:56 ] Gaven Blands > Increased [ 21:48:03 ] Disciple Sibanna > Data sent Sir. [ 21:48:24 ] Disciple Sibanna > Receiving your logs now.... 50% transfer complete. [ 21:51:59 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sergant Major, CONCORD repsonce... [ 21:53:09 ] Disciple Sibanna > Transfer Complete Sergant Major im awaiting orders. [ 21:55:08 ] Seargant Major Rakham > We have orders from CONCORD Sister.. All ships are to move to at least 100km from the station. That includes you.. You are also to meet a HAZMAT team at the Cords I am sending you. [ 21:55:34 ] Sister Rhayne > Thank you Seargant Major, I will do that once we can confirm [ 21:56:23 ] Seargant Major Rakham > My scans are showing no life signs Sister, as no doub't yours are. [ 21:57:22 ] Sister Rhayne > My team is reporting in now... It seems... that they found many of the civilians... all dead. [ 21:58:13 ] Sister Rhayne > No signs of wounds or injuries... Not yet, Sibanna, it is a large outpost... [ 21:58:34 ] Sister Rhayne > There are many floors to investigate, but I fear that I must trust our scanners. Everyone aboard is dead. [ 21:59:08 ] Sister Rhayne > I've instructed my team to gather biomass samples for post-mortum study. [ 22:01:12 ] Sister Rhayne > My team has returned, I am prepared to enter quarantine as CONCORD has requested. [ 22:02:56 ] Sister Rhayne > [...] bodies are loaded into the cyro-refridgeration units for preservation. So, Disciple Sibanna of SoE is scanning the station, she transfers data to the Legion pilot, Rakham, but clearly retains a copy of that data as she later sends that data at his request to CONCORD. CONCORD eventually acknowledge receipt of the data. There are at this point at least three copies of that data extant so it cannot be said to be lost. Note that Disciple Sibanna also receives full copies of Rakham's logs. There is then the matter of data obtained while Sister Rhayne's team is on board scanning and collecting samples, including bodies. While a datastream may have been sent to the Legion pilot as a sensible backup measure it stretches credulity that a science vessel would need to transfer, without retaining its own copies, all data to a military ship such as the Cerberus piloted by Rakham. I am sorry, Sister Rhayne, but I simply do not believe you and there are not many who will. You are trying to accuse us of something that could only happen if you were the most incompetent scientists in the cluster. Is that really what you are saying? As for our attack, I repeat, our response to your entreaty was to give the pilot ample time to withdraw. This is not a courtesy we usually extend to hostile entities. He squandered it. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Jowen Datloran Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2007.02.05 23:15:00 - [22] Guess that is another marking in the "terrorist book" for Star Fraction. Reminds me of FON: naive ideals, brutal and indiscriminate methods. ---------------- Mr. Science & Trade Institute
Kovid Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 23:30:00 - [23] Originally by: Sister Rhayne Your pilots were informed several times that the Seargant Major was a member of our relief convoy, ... When his ship was destroyed, we lost a great portion of our scanner data and the station's logs that had been transfered to his ship from our other vessels for safekeeping. Disciple Sibanna > Receiving your logs now.... 50% transfer complete. ... Disciple Sibanna > Transfer Complete Sergant Major im awaiting orders. In fact Sibanna was sent data FROM the Sergent Major. Simply put, Disciple Sibanna was not shot. No data was lost. Originally by: Sister Rhayne It is not my intention to slander the name of your corporations or alliance, but I will reiterate what I stated in Hedoubel after your attack. The willful, unprovoked attack on a member of our convoy fleet during a relief effort within the Gallente Federation's borders and the subsequent hinderance to our efforts has left us with no option but to consider your alliance as a potential threat to our relief operations, and our pilots and members of our convoy must be warned of the possible danger that your ships represent. I would normally come to the assumption that something is happening behind the scenes and Sister Rayne is intentionally covering up something by decieving people at the situation and to Galnet reporters. The logs clearly show the transfer of data meaning there are copies on different ships. As for being unprovoked. We told you no SoE would be hurt, and none were. The provocation happened months before in the north when Mordu's made their bed. You just had to see the Sergent Major put to bed with your own eyes. Now take off the blinders or stop the lies. Never mind the blinders. You have been caught outright telling untruths. What is your real goal?
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 23:56:00 - [24] Sister Rhayne. The issue of the "lost data" having been totally refuted by the words of your own organisation let us move on to your own use of innept mercenaries of little skill, talent, or diplomatic ability. Originally by: Sister Rhayne It is not my intention to slander the name of your corporations or alliance, but I will reiterate what I stated in Hedoubel after your attack. The willful, unprovoked attack on a member of our convoy fleet during a relief effort within the Gallente Federation's borders and the subsequent hinderance to our efforts has left us with no option but to consider your alliance as a potential threat to our relief operations, and our pilots and members of our convoy must be warned of the possible danger that your ships represent. It is very simple Sister Rhayne. Take more care in selecting mercenary protection for your operations in future. If you select Mordu's Legion know they are Kill on Sight for the Star Fraction and we will eliminate their vessels if at all possible. We consider Mordu's Legion to be a bankrupt organisation of cowards and dogs unworthy of respect - you would do better to hire a more reputable organisation for your future operations. And still this does leave us with the entirely inaccurate news report that appears to allege we sided with the Order of the Medusa against SOE vessels. I trust you will be issuing an apology for this shameful misrepresentation of the facts now? Star Fraction is recruiting
Celia Azur Minmatar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.05 23:59:00 - [25] Originally by: Jowen Datloran Guess that is another marking in the "terrorist book" for Star Fraction. Reminds me of FON: naive ideals, brutal and indiscriminate methods. Read the thread. Read the thread. Read it again. Now try comprehending the silly things called words.
Tennotsukai Minmatar Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.02.06 00:25:00 - [26] Normally, I just enjoy reading the latest bouts of politcal banter and such while having a few jugs of Starkman black mead to catch up on the who did this, and to read about then antics of Ushra'Khan and how many Amarrian eyes have been poked and noses disjointed. But this has caught me eye. Now there is no love between the legion and the MC, they can all rot in a Zaimeth swamp for all I care. However as a professional merc meself I feel the need to point something out.. Star Fraction claims to have given the Mordu's Sgt. Maj. time to bug out, but from what I can gather he told them to shove it and remaind with the Sisters convoy. Well, that sounded quite diplomatic coming from a Sgt. Maj in my view.. And well, if i'm on contract the only people I answer to is the MC officers and the person who hired us if we are privvy to that information. I do not answer to some political bully boy, so on that I have to side with the Mordu's pilot.. I would have given the same answer, but attached to some spare ammo via the autocannon mail service. Also the whole business about this data.. no it must be me.. but reading theser logs somethings kinda sticks out.. Originally by: "Comms Logs" [ 21:42:17 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Your Scanners should be working fine.. Send me the data. [ 21:42:40 ] Disciple Sibanna > Confirmed Sir, data transfer started. [ 21:47:49 ] Seargant Major Rakham > I am sending you the results of my scan for you to confirm the readings. [ 21:48:03 ] Disciple Sibanna > Data sent Sir. [ 21:48:24 ] Disciple Sibanna > Receiving your logs now.... 50% transfer complete. [ 21:51:59 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sergant Major, CONCORD repsonce... [ 21:53:09 ] Disciple Sibanna > Transfer Complete Sergant Major im awaiting orders. Now Star Fraction you claim that the data was safe, but sorry i have to say this may not be the case.. The Sgt. Maj. Asks for data to be sent to him.. he does a scan and then sends the data from his scan after reciving data from Disciple Sibanna .. nothing else, as what would the reason for him to send back the data just sent to him by Disciple Sibanna? Thus this can be said that when his ship was destroyed he did indeed have data from the other pilots that was lost. No doub't the Star Fraction spin doctors will jump upon this and try to blindside folks with big words and such.. But I'm afraid it looks like Star Fraction may indeed screwed up and are now trying to cover their tracks. It's also a shame that Star Fraction have set their spin doctors upon the poor Sister, but unfortunatly by their own hand they have shown that data could indeed have been lost due to their trigger happy nature.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 00:34:00 - [27] Originally by: Tennotsukai nonsense really Perhaps you'd like a look at the longer conversation logs? [ 2007.01.27 21:53:09 ] Disciple Sibanna > Transfer Complete Sergant Major im awaiting orders. [ 2007.01.27 21:53:19 ] Caius Sivaris > /emote can lend some minmattar duct tape for fixing [ 2007.01.27 21:53:21 ] Ashar KorAzor > Not my people, Freecaptain. [ 2007.01.27 21:53:33 ] happymappy > im so confused wheres thes the station [ 2007.01.27 21:53:53 ] Ashar KorAzor > But if you'd like to send over a consultant, they'd welcome it, I'm sure. [ 2007.01.27 21:53:55 ] Jonny Damordred > /emote nods > I thought you had better taste than that [ 2007.01.27 21:54:03 ] Tareen Kashaar > Reconfigure your scanning equipment then, it's right next to Sister Rhayne [ 2007.01.27 21:54:13 ] Sister Rhayne > Okay, I am now docked and my relief team is entering the air locks. [ 2007.01.27 21:54:14 ] Ashar KorAzor > You need to stop trying to insult people subtly, Jonny, it isn't your thing. Just go for a big one. [ 2007.01.27 21:54:18 ] Caius Sivaris > large ciollidabl;e structure [ 2007.01.27 21:54:35 ] Jonny Damordred > That was a complement, love [ 2007.01.27 21:54:36 ] happymappy > ah [ 2007.01.27 21:54:43 ] Ashar KorAzor > Sure was, sure was. [ 2007.01.27 21:54:44 ] happymappy > gota play with my thingy then :p [ 2007.01.27 21:55:05 ] Tareen Kashaar > Way too much information, happymappy. [ 2007.01.27 21:55:08 ] Seargant Major Rakham > We have orders from CONCORD Sister.. All ships are to move to at least 100km from the station. That includes you.. You are also to meet a HAZMAT team at the Cords I am sending you. [ 2007.01.27 21:55:16 ] Ashar KorAzor > Ah, great. [ 2007.01.27 21:55:24 ] Caius Sivaris > /emote is 101km away [ 2007.01.27 21:55:29 ] Ashar KorAzor > Well, let's get the hell out of here before we choke and die for restricted reasons. [ 2007.01.27 21:55:34 ] Sister Rhayne > Thank you Seargant Major, I will do that once we can confirm the status of the civilians on this outpost. [ 2007.01.27 21:56:14 ] Ashar KorAzor > OBSA personell, either get out of the 100 km range or scatter to the four winds. [ 2007.01.27 21:56:23 ] Seargant Major Rakham > My scans are showing no life signs Sister, as no doub't yours are. [ 2007.01.27 21:57:01 ] happymappy > why u shooting the guy? he was just crying in avaux local =/ [ 2007.01.27 21:57:16 ] Tareen Kashaar > He is an enemy [ 2007.01.27 21:57:18 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Please sister.. move away from the station. [ 2007.01.27 21:57:22 ] Sister Rhayne > My team is reporting in now... It seems... that they found many of the civilians... all dead. [ 2007.01.27 21:57:46 ] Ashar KorAzor > I suggest your team leave. Environment suits have been known to fail, at times. [ 2007.01.27 21:57:50 ] Tia Organa > i dont think ive ever met ya [ 2007.01.27 21:57:58 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sister have they found... Any Survivors? [ 2007.01.27 21:58:05 ] Jonny Damordred > We've met your alliance, and that is good enough [ 2007.01.27 21:58:13 ] Sister Rhayne > No signs of wounds or injuries... Not yet, Sibanna, it is a large outpost... [ 2007.01.27 21:58:18 ] happymappy > they only joined to get away from an empire war [ 2007.01.27 21:58:19 ] Jonny Damordred > if you want to lose another ship today, come back [ 2007.01.27 21:58:31 ] happymappy > =/ [ 2007.01.27 21:58:34 ] Sister Rhayne > There are many floors to investigate, but I fear that I must trust our scanners. Everyone aboard is dead. [ 2007.01.27 21:58:58 ] Jonny Damordred > Ashar... I have a problem [ 2007.01.27 21:58:59 ] The Cosmopolite > Mordu's Legion are viable targets to The Star Fraction [ 2007.01.27 21:59:04 ] Ashar KorAzor > Yes, Jonny? [ 2007.01.27 21:59:06 ] happymappy > fair play [ 2007.01.27 21:59:08 ] Sister Rhayne > I've instructed my team to gather biomass samples for post-mortum study. Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 00:35:00 - [28] [ 2007.01.27 21:59:14 ] The Cosmopolite > Due to their support for RAZOR in the past. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:20 ] happymappy > just feel sorry for the guy that was his last ship -.- [ 2007.01.27 21:59:23 ] Ashar KorAzor > I suggest you make a command decision not to shoot them. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:24 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sister there is nothing more we can do... we should follow Sergant Major Rakhams orders and withdraw [ 2007.01.27 21:59:32 ] The Cosmopolite > We have had them set to -10 for many months. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:34 ] Seargant Major Rakham > I am here as escort for the SSoE. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:45 ] Ashar KorAzor > I also suggest you think of them as liasions to Soe and thus, temporarily, non-Mordu personell. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:46 ] Sister Rhayne > I will Sibanna, once my team returns with the bodies. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:58 ] Ashar KorAzor > After the escort is done, I suggest you shoot anyone you like. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:11 ] Jonny Damordred > Ashar, your tone is not helping you [ 2007.01.27 22:00:11 ] Admiral Eos > Sister, this is a bit much. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:13 ] happymappy > i get what u mean just poor lil nubbin =::Sad [ 2007.01.27 22:00:19 ] Admiral Eos > We have orders. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:24 ] Sister Rhayne > I would ask, on behalf of the sisters of Eve, that you set aside your differences with the Mordus Legion at least temporarily. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:27 ] The Cosmopolite > If they withdraw now, we will allow them to leave. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:43 ] Ashar KorAzor > This is why my tone was problematic. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:48 ] Disciple Sibanna > Im...sorry Sister, this is the first encounter where such a Atrocity has occured.... [ 2007.01.27 22:00:55 ] Ashar KorAzor > Come, Doctor, do you not have the authority to settle old scores peacefully? [ 2007.01.27 22:01:05 ] Ashar KorAzor > There has been enough death here. [ 2007.01.27 22:01:12 ] Sister Rhayne > My team has returned, I am prepared to enter quarantine as CONCORD has requested. [ 2007.01.27 22:01:18 ] Jonny Damordred > All bills come due Ashar [ 2007.01.27 22:01:20 ] The Cosmopolite > Two minutes [ 2007.01.27 22:01:27 ] Selim > What is a mercenary soldier doing on a humanitarian mission? [ 2007.01.27 22:01:28 ] happymappy > look ill ask emp to stay away [ 2007.01.27 22:01:30 ] Jonny Damordred > And Mordus wrang up a large one [ 2007.01.27 22:01:33 ] Ashar KorAzor > Well, I'm not here to fight Star Fraction personell. [ 2007.01.27 22:01:34 ] Seargant Major Rakham > How about I ignore you and carry on my duty along side the SSoE. [ 2007.01.27 22:01:38 ] happymappy > so no more popy of the miners [ 2007.01.27 22:01:48 ] deathbyangel > wuts goin on? [ 2007.01.27 22:01:53 ] Sister Rhayne > Mordus Legion regularly provides assistance to the Sisters of EVE in the form of escorts. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:00 ] The Cosmopolite > You die if you do not leave. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:02 ] happymappy > jerico are poping emp lol [ 2007.01.27 22:02:05 ] Dallan Arethi > Humanitarians can pay mercenaries too, Selin. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:06 ] deathbyangel > haha [ 2007.01.27 22:02:15 ] Ashar KorAzor > /emote sighs * I'm not stupid enough to challenge an experienced flight group, but I do wish that the Doctor would count time slowly. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:18 ] Gaven Blands > It's there sec status, they can pop who they like [ 2007.01.27 22:02:47 ] happymappy > bit of a gank though xD [ 2007.01.27 22:02:50 ] The Cosmopolite > Die [ 2007.01.27 22:02:56 ] Sister Rhayne > They bodies are loaded into the cyro-refridgeration units for preservation. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:57 ] Ashar KorAzor > And there it goes. [ 2007.01.27 22:03:03 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sister get out now [ 2007.01.27 22:03:05 ] Sister Rhayne > Please stop your attack [ 2007.01.27 22:03:05 ] Admiral Eos > Oh no... [ 2007.01.27 22:03:21 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Cowards [ 2007.01.27 22:03:29 ] Selim > dog. [ 2007.01.27 22:03:30 ] Nemesor > you were warned. Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 00:36:00 - [29] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 06/02/2007 00:32:52 [ 2007.01.27 22:03:35 ] The Cosmopolite > SoE remain safe from us. [ 2007.01.27 22:03:36 ] Sister Rhayne > I'm sorry Seargant-Major... [ 2007.01.27 22:03:47 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sister warp to my coords [ 2007.01.27 22:04:10 ] deathbyangel > /emote gets the popcorn [ 2007.01.27 22:04:11 ] Sister Rhayne > Your attack against our escort is considered an attack on us. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:18 ] Disciple Sibanna > They just engaged Rakham with no provocation, i dont feel safe here. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:19 ] Ashar KorAzor > Do NOT engage! [ 2007.01.27 22:04:19 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Star fraction you are are just cowards. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:19 ] Sister Rhayne > From now on you will be considered enemies of the Servant Sisters of EVE. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:25 ] Ashar KorAzor > You've plagued bodies in the hold. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:36 ] The Cosmopolite > No, Mordu's Legion are fools. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:37 ] Selim > Oh, really? [ 2007.01.27 22:04:46 ] Admiral Eos > Disgusting. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:47 ] The Cosmopolite > You have been hostiles to us for months. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:49 ] Jonny Damordred > He was warned, and stupid for not leaving [ 2007.01.27 22:04:49 ] Nemesor > You ignored warnings with blatant disrespect. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:59 ] Ashar KorAzor > Sad, but accurate. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:00 ] The Cosmopolite > You were given fair warning and ample time to withdraw. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:13 ] happymappy > im so confused still xD [ 2007.01.27 22:05:22 ] Seargant Major Rakham > So says Star Fraction... Friends of the Gurista.. you are nothing more then a joke.. and well pirates. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:28 ] The Cosmopolite > SoE personnel will not be hurt. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:28 ] Gaven Blands > So Seargant Major Rakham finally figured out who your enemy is huh? [ 2007.01.27 22:05:42 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sergant Major im returning to base with Rhayne my place is with her, [ 2007.01.27 22:05:44 ] Ashar KorAzor > Thank you, Doctor. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:56 ] The Cosmopolite > Mordu's are the joke. You pay the price for siding with the Northern Tyrants. [ 2007.01.27 22:06:24 ] Jonny Damordred > It is sad to see SoE siding with IRON and RAZOR dogs [ 2007.01.27 22:06:27 ] Dallan Arethi > The price is to be attacked while siding with someone completely different? [ 2007.01.27 22:06:34 ] Ashar KorAzor > SoE sides with those in need. [ 2007.01.27 22:06:38 ] Selim > I had some respect for SoE. [ 2007.01.27 22:06:42 ] Jonny Damordred > pfft [ 2007.01.27 22:06:44 ] Dallan Arethi > SoE aren';t siding with Mordu's, SoE are employing them. [ 2007.01.27 22:06:54 ] Jonny Damordred > And do you see us killing them Ashar [ 2007.01.27 22:06:55 ] The Cosmopolite > SoE have NOT been attacked. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:12 ] Ashar KorAzor > You attack a convoy escort who is negative to you, and they set you at negative standings...this is in line with their operatioal procedures, I expect, as your actions were with your own. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:21 ] The Cosmopolite > Our stance towards SoE has not changed. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:36 ] The Cosmopolite > If SoE personnel aggress us, that will change. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:43 ] deathbyangel > srry for the interrupt of a good show but wuts soe [ 2007.01.27 22:07:45 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Yes they have... By attecking me.. you destroyed alot of data that was required by the SSoE.. and I'm flying uder the banner of the SSoE you damned fool. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:52 ] Ashar KorAzor > Yes, and I am glad of it, Doctor. I am pointing out that they are not so much siding with people as they are hewing to protocol. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:08 ] The Cosmopolite > Your banner is Mordu's Legion. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:13 ] Admiral Eos > Sergeant, we have to go. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:16 ] The Cosmopolite > You were given time to get clear. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:26 ] Jonny Damordred > If he had left when warned, he would have not been destroyed Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 00:37:00 - [30] [ 2007.01.27 22:08:28 ] Ashar KorAzor > Hopefully your Pod's systems retained some of that data. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:38 ] Selim > We don't usually grant people that respect. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:41 ] Ashar KorAzor > I'm powering down. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:45 ] Ashar KorAzor > Fly well and fly safe. [ 2007.01.27 22:09:28 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Congratulations Star Fraction.. for destroying the data that was collected on the station. And no my orders come from the SSoE not some jumped up bully boy who pretends to be more then the pirates they really are. [ 2007.01.27 22:09:39 ] Jonny Damordred > Pfft [ 2007.01.27 22:09:49 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Well, I will leave you with the mess you have made Star Fraction. [ 2007.01.27 22:09:52 ] Jonny Damordred > If you want to do more than just whine in local [ 2007.01.27 22:09:54 ] Caius Sivaris > so any proof yet of any worngdoing in that station? [ 2007.01.27 22:09:59 ] Jonny Damordred > we are in stacmon, come and get us [ 2007.01.27 22:09:59 ] happymappy > Lmao woo claps [ 2007.01.27 22:10:06 ] The Cosmopolite > You were given time to get clear. [ 2007.01.27 22:10:15 ] deathbyangel > hehe jonny boy run to high sec [ 2007.01.27 22:10:16 ] The Cosmopolite > You are the fool for not taking the oportunity. [ 2007.01.27 22:10:35 ] Ashar KorAzor > If anyone wants a fight with SF, they're fools and will likely lose some ships soon. [ 2007.01.27 22:10:41 ] Selim > SoE, I suggest next time you operate around here that you do not hire the enemies of the Star Fraction. [ 2007.01.27 22:10:52 ] Azure Skyclad > The data coudl have been handed off in that time Sargeant Major. Perhaps pride clouded your judgement? [ 2007.01.27 22:11:27 ] happymappy > oh dam i remember that old vent chat with a jerico guy in Smiley [ 2007.01.27 22:11:40 ] happymappy > that was teh funny xD [ 2007.01.27 22:12:03 ] Dallan Arethi > Pride or faith in your better natures. I don't understand what kind of grudge demands that you attack someone for their employers when they have changed employers. [ 2007.01.27 22:12:26 ] Katrina Kirellii > Peace everyone - peace. [ 2007.01.27 22:12:32 ] deathbyangel > this reminds me of old english [ 2007.01.27 22:12:34 ] deathbyangel > like hamlin [ 2007.01.27 22:12:40 ] deathbyangel > tis so funnies [ 2007.01.27 22:12:50 ] happymappy > im getting bored o/ later on beutiful people [ 2007.01.27 22:13:33 ] happymappy > /emote chucks love at every1 in local Azn [ 2007.01.27 22:13:34 ] Dallan Arethi > Then again, I don't know all the details of your history with the Northern alliances, so I only have what passes for my sense to go on. [ 2007.01.27 22:14:31 ] Jonny Damordred > Dallan, it is long and bloody [ 2007.01.27 22:14:33 ] The Cosmopolite > Excuse me, Dallan, the standing is with Mordu. [ 2007.01.27 22:14:37 ] The Cosmopolite > For Mordu actions. [ 2007.01.27 22:14:45 ] The Cosmopolite > In Mordu interests. [ 2007.01.27 22:15:28 ] Kayne Darklight > so, does anyone actually know what happened on that outpost? or was it all lost in a hail of gunfire? [ 2007.01.27 22:16:02 ] Pilious > I don't evben se an outpost here [ 2007.01.27 22:16:08 ] Sanguineous Reaper > what you bunch of nurds roleplaying about? [ 2007.01.27 22:16:09 ] deathbyangel > i thought u couldn't put an outpost in empire [ 2007.01.27 22:16:09 ] Elesaar > its there, its puny [ 2007.01.27 22:16:18 ] Tareen Kashaar > reconfigure your scanner, Pillious [ 2007.01.27 22:16:23 ] Kayne Darklight > large collidable, rather than a station [ 2007.01.27 22:16:30 ] Elesaar > barely the size of a battleship [ 2007.01.27 22:16:32 ] Pilious > I tryed to add colidable objects [ 2007.01.27 22:16:44 ] Dallan Arethi > Fair enough, Cosmopolite. I don't think here is the place to explain them, but if I asked in a less hectic venue would you be averse to answering them? [ 2007.01.27 22:17:05 ] The Cosmopolite > No, not at all. Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 00:42:00 - [31] Suffice to say scan reports in and transmitted. Investigation concluded. Unless you are claiming that these electonic readings miraculously "erased themselves" when transitted ship to ship then there are many verifiable sources of data remaining. We believe the "lost data" accusation was made up on the spur of the moment by an angry and humiliated Mordu's Legionary Sergeant rightfully destroyed by SF forces in line with our entirely public Rules of Engagement. The fact we waited until the operation was complete before destroying this enemy of the Fraction bespeaks nothing other than our profound patience with the Sisters of Eve and should the Mordu's man have taken the hint and left the area with his task complete he'd have saved the lives of his Cerberus crewmen as well. This was an arrogant fool who lost his ship due to his arrogance. Not a great advert for the Mercenary Profession. Star Fraction is recruiting
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 00:46:00 - [32] Originally by: Tennotsukai The Sgt. Maj. Asks for data to be sent to him.. he does a scan and then sends the data from his scan after reciving data from Disciple Sibanna .. nothing else, as what would the reason for him to send back the data just sent to him by Disciple Sibanna? Thus this can be said that when his ship was destroyed he did indeed have data from the other pilots that was lost. No doub't the Star Fraction spin doctors will jump upon this and try to blindside folks with big words and such.. But I'm afraid it looks like Star Fraction may indeed screwed up and are now trying to cover their tracks. No 'big words' are needed. You're right, there was no reason for the Legion pilot to send the data he had received from SoE back: Disciple Sibanna retained it and moreover sent a copy to CONCORD. Quote: [ 21:47:11 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Sibanna, send a priorty comms to CONCORD.. Send them the data you have.. Tell them that we have a code black situation.Sister, my scans are showing that the enviroment on that station is unsafe and I suggest we request a CONCORD HAZMAT team. [ 21:47:49 ] Seargant Major Rakham > I am sending you the results of my scan for you to confirm the readings. [ 21:48:03 ] Disciple Sibanna > Data sent Sir. In fantasy land there may be a tradition of it being impossible for a particular item of data to be in two data storage systems at once but not in actuality. The SoE ships were science vessels and it's quite clear they had all the data they needed. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 00:51:00 - [33] Originally by: Tennotsukai And thank you for posting that, those logs indeed reinforce the fact that data may have been lost.. They do precisely the reverse. If you think otherwise, please show how they do so. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 00:59:00 - [34] Originally by: Tennotsukai You attacked a long Mordu's Pilot doing his job and indeed telling you to shove it in his own way and refusing to abandon his duty the same as any merc worth his salt would when on duty, and to top it off you may have indeed destroyed data that was being stored in his ships computers. We don't care if he was doing his job. He is a target and will die whenever we see him in space. Thats the price of association with an organisation that declared hostilities to the Star Fraction. The logs clearly show no data was lost and you are being foolish to insist otherwise. Star Fraction is recruiting
Tennotsukai Minmatar Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.02.06 01:41:00 - [35] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Originally by: Tennotsukai You attacked a long Mordu's Pilot doing his job and indeed telling you to shove it in his own way and refusing to abandon his duty the same as any merc worth his salt would when on duty, and to top it off you may have indeed destroyed data that was being stored in his ships computers. We don't care if he was doing his job. He is a target and will die whenever we see him in space. Thats the price of association with an organisation that declared hostilities to the Star Fraction. The logs clearly show no data was lost and you are being foolish to insist otherwise. Sorry but I'm afraid you are well quite wrong on this.. The logs that you have posted don't prove a thing about the data.. As i said they also show that the Data may have indeed been lost. And you say you don't care if he was doing his duty or not and your logs do however show that you ignored the pleas of the sister and as Disciple Sibanna says make an unprovoked attack on the Mordu's pilot and make the SSoE pilots feel very unsafe. As for calling the Mordu's pilot and arrogent fool for remaining at his post and doing his duty, and this arrogence.. or in me eyes his defiance to your orders as a bad advert for the Merc professional.. I hate to say it, but you are so very wrong, it really does hurt.. His devotion to his duty and his post by remaining at the side of the SSoE convoy even though it seems he was heavily outnumbered rather then running off with his tail between his legs is a damn fine advert for his profesionalism. If anything your own arrogance is starting to show through, and well.. Its seems that the Mordu's pilot didn't give two fedos about your bully boy threats.. Plus those logs do show that Star Fraction was indeed in the wrong, and their spin doctors are trying to cover up this fact. But in the same vein their own words are showing the full picture (even if some of the Logs have been edited.) One that I see the Star Fraction Spin doctors failing at covering up. Again, I expect them to have a go at me thoughts.. In their usual way of ganging up on someone and trying to intimedating them.. A broad grin appears across his face Good thing that, it won't work with me.. And with that I'm off to me pit and well I will have to wait until morning to see what spin and intimidation tactics are being stuck on me thoughts
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 02:19:00 - [36] The logs show what they show and are there for all to read and draw their own conclusions from. We have not edited out anything. Any excerpts are simply highlighting the actual events pertaining to the data for clarity and Jasmine has produced the full unedited version. The logs show that all data was in SoE hands and anyone who thinks differently has to show how that is not so. Simply saying that the logs show that data was lost does not make it so. We have made our case and we stand by it. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Khavi Vetali Team Americas Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.02.06 03:39:00 - [37] Edited by: Khavi Vetali on 06/02/2007 03:38:22 Originally by: Tennotsukai Again, I expect them to have a go at me thoughts.. In their usual way of ganging up on someone and trying to intimedating them.. Funny, I don't see any attempts at intimidation in any of the Star Fraction replies to your repeated babbling. Your repetition about it leads me to to believe you're trying to egg them on. I don't see any spin either. They've posted logs, given their side of the events, and left the burden of proof on others to try to show that the Fraction is in the wrong. I guess if you squint hard enough you can see shadows lurking in the brightest corners. Ugh. Use a little something called a logical conclusion. I'll spell it out for you, now read slowly, so you're sure to comprehend. Originally by: Sequence of Events The Sergeant requests a transfer of data, the Disciple does so. Then the Sergeant transfers his data to the Disciple, who in turn relays it to Concord. Both transfers are completed. The Sergeant's unique data has been copied and relayed. The Disciple's unique data now resides on her ship and the Sergeant's Cerberus. The Cerberus is now destroyed, losing the copied data from the Disciple, and the formerly unique scan data. The only way completely unique, non-replicated scan information was destroyed is if the Disciple had the incredible ineptitude, or should I say stupidity, to delete her information after it was relayed to the Cerberus. Also you can deduce that the scan data from the Disciple was relayed to Concord with the Sergeant's information, since that was obviously the procedure that SoE was following. Game, set, match. Originally by: Itanis "Hello there mate, I'm dreadfully sorry, but I'm going to have to sodomize you with howitzers. Have a lovely day!"
M'haratoh	Posted - 2007.02.06 03:54:00 - [38] Edited by: M''haratoh on 06/02/2007 03:51:05 edited
Ituralde Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 03:55:00 - [39] I swear, the galaxy is turning on its head. What is this? The Mercenary Coalition jumping up to lick the boots of the Mordus Legion? Ive seen stranger things happen, but not many... _____________________________ Fear is the mind-killer.
Karn Mithralia Minmatar Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2007.02.06 03:56:00 - [40] Never trust what you read in the news. ----------------------------------------- Now recruiting.
Lowanaera Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2007.02.06 08:30:00 - [41] How interesting, the broader actions of the Fractionists played out in micro. Attacking the support structure others depended on for their safety, and then denying that you put anyone at risk or had a responsibility to take up the duties of protection. Even on such a limited scale the hypocritical actions you perpetrate against residents of the empires are mirrored and transparent for what they truly are.
Ly'sol	Posted - 2007.02.06 10:59:00 - [42] Edited by: Ly''sol on 06/02/2007 11:00:33 ((scripted event...meet the ruthless world of political ramifications of past actions.)) My god! <smiles> Despite my feelings towards Mordu's crawling to RAZOR in the past. I have to say...such devotion to duty and staying true to his cause in face of a hostile threat. I have to applaud that, most members of the capsule community don't have the gumption for certain death. Makes my heart swell that the non-egger community is still producing some fine captains. Reminds me of my roots in space. This one might not have been the most competent of pilots but balls of brass. He didn't even beg for his life. Man, this act restored some of the respect I had for Mordu's ship captains. If only their high command would pull their heads out of their collective ass's and stop associating with every pod pilot alliance that drifts on through Pure Blind. I might again hold them in the regard as a neutral military force. Unfortunate that SF still had its bad standings to Mordu's and blindly followed orders to murder this chap. But hey price you pay for associating your identity with a banner and not as your own. Man...<takes a breath> maybe he was to stupid to know better...either way, his kids are gonna have a story about this one. Click here for Lysol's Linky Library-last updated 30NOV06
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 11:27:00 - [43] Originally by: Ly'sol Despite my feelings towards Mordu's crawling to RAZOR in the past. I have to say...such devotion to duty and staying true to his cause in face of a hostile threat. I have to applaud that, most members of the capsule community don't have the gumption for certain death. Makes my heart swell that the non-egger community is still producing some fine captains. Reminds me of my roots in space. This one might not have been the most competent of pilots but balls of brass. He didn't even beg for his life. Man, this act restored some of the respect I had for Mordu's ship captains. If only their high command would pull their heads out of their collective ass's and stop associating with every pod pilot alliance that drifts on through Pure Blind. I might again hold them in the regard as a neutral military force. He was a capsule pilot. He escaped the death of his ship. Many of his crew did not. He was shot down as a consequence of Mordu's Legion command associations with RAZOR alliance a year ago in Pureblind where they committed to helping RAZOR close and patrol space with Mordu's assets. The Servant Sisters should have known better than to hire a dog like this. Quote: Unfortunate that SF still had its bad standings to Mordu's and blindly followed orders to murder this chap. But hey price you pay for associating your identity with a banner and not as your own. Your insults are growing tiresome Ly'sol. There is nothing "blind" about SF standings and you know this well (or a least you once did) and however much I am irritated and annoyed by your constant galnet harping you are going to remain neutral to me until such time as you engage a SF vessel or join an organisation that has previously engaged a SF vessel. Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 11:30:00 - [44] Originally by: Lowanaera How interesting, the broader actions of the Fractionists played out in micro. Attacking the support structure others depended on for their safety, and then denying that you put anyone at risk or had a responsibility to take up the duties of protection. Even on such a limited scale the hypocritical actions you perpetrate against residents of the empires are mirrored and transparent for what they truly are. Star Fraction engaged a force that has previously declared itself hostile to our vessels and denied our neutrality. Hiding their own reputation behind the standings of the Sisters of Eve on the premise of a mercenary contract. There is no great revelation and you are adopting a position of profound hypocrisy to claim your own organisaton would respect the "protection" by hostiles of third-parties in the presence of your fleets. Star Fraction is recruiting
Merdaneth Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.02.06 11:51:00 - [45] It seems that once again Star Fraction has everybody confused. Nothing that we haven't seen before. Nothing they haven't tried to and failed to explain before. Maybe Star Fraction should use one of their own favorite lines instead of trying to confuse the issue further: SF, if you have a problem with how the Sisters of Eve or Mercenary Coalition interpret your actions, then wardec them or stfu.
Tennotsukai Minmatar Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.02.06 11:56:00 - [46] Well, I'm just saying what things look like to me.. The log show that data may have been lost, the the same way it may not have been lost. Please notice the word may that i keep using.. the word that the spin doctors keep missing out... Also its worth noting that, the spin doctors keep by passing the fact that they was asked to put their hostilies to one side, yet they ignored that and attacked the Mordu's pilot reguardless. This in itself is an attack upon the convoy no matter how much they keep saying otherwise. Also we are lead to belive that the logs are to be taken as accurate and complete... except The Cosmopolite's have clearly been altered, and those posted by Jasmine Constantine start 11 minutes after The Cosmopolite's. As for the comment from Ituralde... Sorry, but you little dig won't work my bald little Ammarian.. Its not a case of me or the MC licking the boots of the mordu's.. Its a simple matter that Star Fraction are trying to justify an attack on the SSoE convoy using incomplete and edited logs...And what if the SSoE do set Star Fraction to -10? Is Star Fraction going to activly hunt them? Start attacking their aid convoys because they dared to stand up to your bully boy actions? Or even for the fact they may indeed be telling the truth and Star Fraction are looking for a way out and by twisting the truth and hiding information in the way they are so well known for isn't working this time and that maybe the threat of violence towards the SSoE may work instead.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 11:57:00 - [47] Originally by: Merdaneth It seems that once again Star Fraction has everybody confused. Nothing that we haven't seen before. Nothing they haven't tried to and failed to explain before. Oh I think we've gotten our point across pretty well. I appreciate this is frustrating for our enemies but you are going to have to learn to live with disappointment. Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:09:00 - [48] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 06/02/2007 12:14:06 Originally by: Tennotsukai Well, I'm just saying what things look like to me.. The log show that data may have been lost, the the same way it may not have been lost. Please notice the word may that i keep using.. the word that the spin doctors keep missing out... For a man who has a problem with "spin-doctors" you seem remarkably keen to indulge in such vices yourself. The log shows the data was not lost - its entirely clear. Quote: As for the comment from Ituralde... Sorry, but you little dig won't work my bald little Ammarian.. Its not a case of me or the MC licking the boots of the mordu's.. Its a simple matter that Star Fraction are trying to justify an attack on the SSoE convoy using incomplete and edited logs... Let me just get this straight? Are you accusing Cosmopolite of factually editting the local log results to show a different situation to the one we are telling you occured? Quote: And what if the SSoE do set Star Fraction to -10? Is Star Fraction going to activly hunt them? Start attacking their aid convoys because they dared to stand up to your bully boy actions? Last night a Star Fraction vessel was attacked by a member of a Sister of Eve convoy. Does this action represent aggression from the Sisters of Eve organisation against Star Fraction? Would we be be correct in returning aggression to the Sisters of Eve organisation as a whole or should we turn the other cheek since the attack orginated from an independent pilot corporation on short term escort duty for Sister Rhayne's convoy and not from an officially flagged SOE vessel. What do you think Tennotsukai? Quote: Or even for the fact they may indeed be telling the truth and Star Fraction are looking for a way out and by twisting the truth and hiding information in the way they are so well known. You don't sound like a neutral third party to me. You sound like somebody with a grudge using your current position inside Mercenary Coalition to protect you from the consequences of your slander. Star Fraction is recruiting
Tennotsukai Minmatar Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:39:00 - [49] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine For a man who has a problem with "spin-doctors" you seem remarkably keen to indulge in such vices yourself. The log shows the data was not lost - its entirely clear. Spin... Not at all, just pointing out what is visible to everyone.. The Logs do give an element of doub't... You keep saying its clear but it isn't. It seems you are slowly losing your composure Ms Constantine and well you are sounding like a damaged holo-reel saying the same thing over and over again even though you may be wrong on the matter and ignoring other areas and questions. Also the good Sister states that data was lost, the logs show that there is an element of doub't to Star Fractions claims. Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Let me just get this straight? Are you accusing Cosmopolite of factually editting the local log results to show a different situation to the one we are telling you occured? Just pointing out that Cosmopolite have been edited, sothing that can not be denied as forst its a very bad job.. plus there are huge differeance between your logs and his with several minutes missing from his. So you tell me? After all Star Fraction are very well known for bending the truth and making things look in favour of themselves. Something you can not deny now can you? Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Last night a Star Fraction vessel was attacked by a member of a Sister of Eve convoy. Does this action represent aggression from the Sisters of Eve organisation against Star Fraction? Would we be be correct in returning aggression or should we turn the other cheek since the attack orginated from an independent pilot corporation on short term escort duty for Sister Rhayne and not from an officially flagged SOE vessel. What do you think Tennotsukai? The question could be asked, what did Star fraction do to warrent them being attacked by SSoE. After all you recently attacked their convoy and you are calling them liers... With all thats going on, wouldn't it have been more sensible to avoid the SSoE until this was sorted out, but with the typical Star Fraction arrogence I guess you went looking for the convoy to throw your weight around. But I guess you want us all to belive that SSoE launched an unprovoked attack on Star Fraction.. A orginisation dedicated to helping others with aid and supplies went out of their way to attack Star Fraction... Sure they did.. Well it looks like you have your excuse to go attack them now, something I'm starting to belive was your whole intention from the start. Originally by: Jasmine Constantine You don't sound like a neutral third party to me. You sound like somebody with a grudge using your current position inside Mercenary Coalition to protect you from the consequences of your slander. So I'm not allowed to have me own thought am i? Why would I have me a grudge against Star Fraction after all Until now I don't think I have had any dealing with you? As for using my current position... Sorry, but I have been in the service of the MC for a long time now, But i guess this is some kind of Star Fraction Intimidation threat.. "Oh if you wasn't in MC, we would hunt you down and kill you.." is that it... Because I don't agree with you, you feel the need to try and bully me.. Ahhh your true colours are starting to shine through. As for slander, not at all.. If any slander has been thrown about.. Its come from the Star Fraction. Sorry, but if you don't like me thoughts... tough, if i want to express them i shall.
Kunte Kinte	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:43:00 - [50] Quote: You don't sound like a neutral third party to me. You sound like somebody with a grudge using your current position inside Mercenary Coalition to protect you from the consequences of your slander. Sounds like star fraction want's to take on the mercenary coalition to show them the consequences of this free pod pilots words because they should know better then to hire a dog like Tennotsukai who would slander the star fraction except maybe it is not slander at all but the truth and that is clear when you read Jasmine's other words. Quote: He was a capsule pilot. He escaped the death of his ship. Many of his crew did not. He was shot down as a consequence of Mordu's Legion command associations with RAZOR alliance a year ago in Pureblind where they committed to helping RAZOR close and patrol space with Mordu's assets. The Servant Sisters should have known better than to hire a dog like this. Your insults are growing tiresome Ly'sol. There is nothing "blind" about SF standings and you know this well (or a least you once did) and however much I am irritated and annoyed by your constant galnet harping you are going to remain neutral to me until such time as you engage a SF vessel or join an organisation that has previously engaged a SF vessel. Jasmine can you explain why in the star fraction you advocate the individual being responsible for his actions but you only would attack an organization that an individual joins and not an organization that allows this kind of individual in or maybe you do attack the organzation; they seem the same to me but you only assign blame in one direction and not the other; after all you attacked the SSoE convoy escort and said they should have known better then hire someone like this, so in the same way you are criticizing the mercenary coalition using the same logic because they hire Tennotsukai to be a mercenary soldier; is this right? Sergeant Major Rakham was under the mordus tag but employed by SSoE to escort these relief supplies but it sounds like that does not matter as past grudges are all that matter to the star fraction; if he was under the SSoE tag I think the star fraction would have attacked them anyway because like Jasmine said they should have known better. To be consistent the star fraction now needs to issue a war declaration against the mercenary coalition because they should have known better then to hire Tennotsukai as a member of the guild when he has an old grudge and slanders the star fraction a war that will certainly be entertaining to watch I can not wait. KK
Kunte Kinte	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:50:00 - [51] Quote: So I'm not allowed to have me own thought am i? Why would I have me a grudge against Star Fraction after all Until now I don't think I have had any dealing with you? As for using my current position... Sorry, but I have been in the service of the MC for a long time now, But i guess this is some kind of Star Fraction Intimidation threat.. "Oh if you wasn't in MC, we would hunt you down and kill you.." is that it... Because I don't agree with you, you feel the need to try and bully me.. Ahhh your true colours are starting to shine through. They want everyone to be free pod pilots and to evolve but only free if you agree with them Tennotsukai; but Jasmine says ssoe should know better to hire someone like Rakham so the mercenary coalition should know better then to keep you so you will probably get fired from the guild today; that way the mercenary coalition would not have to live in fear of the star fraction. KK (Sorry if my words are not clear english is not my main language)
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:55:00 - [52] Originally by: Tennotsukai Spin... Not at all, just pointing out what is visible to everyone.. Yet not everyone agrees with you. Aren't you using rhetoric and assumption there and claiming to speak for a "public majority opinion" that doesn't really exist. Sounds like spin to me Tennotsukai. Quote: The Logs do give an element of doub't... You keep saying its clear but it isn't. It seems you are slowly losing your composure Ms Constantine and well you are sounding like a damaged holo-reel saying the same thing over and over again even though you may be wrong on the matter and ignoring other areas and questions. I'm simply repeating what the logs show. If you want to quote something from them that supports your incorrect assessment you are completely at liberty to do so. But as of yet, you're done nothing but repeat your own flawed assessment. Quote: Also the good Sister states that data was lost, the logs show that there is an element of doub't to Star Fractions claims. The "good sister" is a proven liar by the testimony of others present. That means her witness account is deeply suspect. Quote: After all Star Fraction are very well known for bending the truth and making things look in favour of themselves. Something you can not deny now can you? The Star Fraction is always truthful in our public writing. I certainly deny your accusation. Quote: The question could be asked, what did Star fraction do to warrent them being attacked by SSoE. No surprise you skipped my question or the implications - want to try to give it another shot? Quote: ...typical Star Fraction arrogence I guess you went looking for the convoy to throw your weight around. You are sounding like a man with a grudge you know. Did we blow up an NBSI business partner sometime? Quote: But I guess you want us all to belive that SSoE launched an unprovoked attack on Star Fraction.. A orginisation dedicated to helping others with aid and supplies went out of their way to attack Star Fraction... Sure they did.. Define provocation? - Because I'd like to see you justify the Sister's Convoy attack on us that will not justify our attack on the Mordu's Legionaire. You are becoming entangled in your own doubletalk spin here Tennotsukuai. Quote: So I'm not allowed to have me own thought am i? Why would I have me a grudge against Star Fraction after all Until now I don't think I have had any dealing with you? Yet suddenly you arrive on this thread with mention of how we are "masters of spin" "deceitful" "arrogant" and have a history of bullying. Such sentiments to not come from the blue and are typical of people with connections to other personalities who have been hostile to us in other parts of the cluster. I have seen many things in three and half years of active combat in the Fraction Tennotsuki and one thing I am always sure of is that opinions such as yours do not spring fully-formed from a void of personal experience. Quote: As for using my current position... Sorry, but I have been in the service of the MC for a long time now, But i guess this is some kind of Star Fraction Intimidation threat.. "Oh if you wasn't in MC, we would hunt you down and kill you.." is that it... Because I don't agree with you, you feel the need to try and bully me.. Ahhh your true colours are starting to shine through. Not at all, you are doing nothing that followers in other alliances do not likewise do - using the protection of your position to avoid the consequences of your words. In this case I'm sure you do not speak for the Mercenary Coalition and that your nonsense is below the notice of your leaders. You are perfectly safe - don't panic! Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:58:00 - [53] Originally by: Kunte Kinte various stuff Ask a friend from a recognised organisation to post for you and I'll be glad to answer questions. Star Fraction is recruiting
Kunte Kinte	Posted - 2007.02.06 12:59:00 - [54] Quote: Yet not everyone agrees with you. Aren't you using rhetoric and assumption there and claiming to speak for a "public majority opinion" that doesn't really exist. Sounds like spin to me Tennotsukai. To me it seems the only people who do not agree with Tennotsukai are the people in the star fraction guild; everyone else seems to agree with him who agrees with the star fraction? I can not find anyone who does because none of us can understand what you post; does your guild have a list of canned confusion generating responses you pick from when you post or do you make it up as you go? If you make isk the way you make spin you are the richest people in eve I am sure; if I was in the mercenary coalition I would be careful because you should know better then to hire someone like Tennotsukai or let him hide in your guild; the star fraction will get you. KK
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 13:06:00 - [55] Originally by: Kunte Kinte If you make isk the way you make spin Are you sure you aren't related to Tennotsukai? You both seem to share a vocabulary and common set of opinions. Maybe you can ask him to post your questions? Star Fraction is recruiting
Kunte Kinte	Posted - 2007.02.06 13:16:00 - [56] Quote: Ask a friend from a recognised organisation (that has existed for more than a day) to post for you and I'll be glad to answer questions. I am afraid to post with main character because my guild is just one for mining and exploring we do not have a big navy; you said Tennotsukai is hiding behind the mercenary coalition but we do not have the guns they have to fight you; you say you want freedom for pod pilots but you threaten anyone who does not agree with you this is why I will not tell you who I am; it is a valid concern with the history of the star fraction making war declarations on guilds they can beat but not fighting other ones; I have read the other threads here so I know about you because you said that. You said Tennotsukai is hiding from the consequences of his slander so anyone who disagrees with you could have the guild they are in issued a war declaration; I am thinking this is the right answer. KK
Tennotsukai Minmatar Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.02.06 13:39:00 - [57] Edited by: Tennotsukai on 06/02/2007 13:39:30 Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Yet not everyone agrees with you. Aren't you using rhetoric and assumption there and claiming to speak for a "public majority opinion" that doesn't really exist. Sounds like spin to me Tennotsukai. And not everyone agrees with you now do they? And I don't speak for the Majority and i have never claimed to, their your words not mine. I just using me own thought and me own opinion as well as me own eyes.. Interesting how one of the greatest spin doctors now tries to turn the tables and say me thoughts are now spin. Originally by: Jasmine Constantine I'm simply repeating what the logs show. If you want to quote something from them that supports your incorrect assessment you are completely at liberty to do so. But as of yet, you're done nothing but repeat your own flawed assessment. No, you are quoting your interpritation of the logs, as I am putting forward my interpritation of the logs. Now we are allowed our own thoughts and interpritations because you so? Originally by: Jasmine Constantine The "good sister" is a proven liar by the testimony of others present. That means her witness account is deeply suspect. Is she? Nothing has been show that proves she is a liar, unless we take your interpritation of things to make her out a liar. But then again, if we take into account that Star Fraction may be mistaken.. then.. oh look she is telling the truth. Originally by: Jasmine Constantine The Star Fraction is always truthful in our public writing. I certainly deny your accusation. Yet the proof is there for all to see. Cosmopolite's logs have been altered and yours start 11 minuets after his.. So you can deny that fact all you like but it is there for all to see. Originally by: Jasmine Constantine No surprise you skipped my question or the implications - want to try to give it another shot? No I didn't, I asked you a question that you seem to have ignored.. So I ask you again.. What did the Star Fraction do last night to warrent being fired upon by the SSoE? Also you avoided addressing the point of why did Star Fraction activly go looking for the SSoE rather then waiting until this situation has been sorted. Originally by: Jasmine Constantine You are sounding like a man with a grudge you know. Did we blow up an NBSI business partner sometime? Agian, you avoid addressing the statment and fall back on to me holding a grudge.. I will say it again.. I hold no grudge against the Star Fraction. I'm just putting down me thoughts. Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Define provocation? - Because I'd like to see you justify the Sister's Convoy attack on us that will not justify our attack on the Mordu's Legionaire. You are becoming entangled in your own doubletalk spin here Tennotsukuai. Well Something must have happend for them to attack you last night.. Are you saying its because of your attack on their convoy the other night.. Interesting.. As for me becoming entangled in doubletalk spin.. Again, I'm not using any spin, just me thoughts and me eyes. TBC
Khavi Vetali Team Americas Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.02.06 13:42:00 - [58] Edited by: Khavi Vetali on 06/02/2007 13:42:14 Originally by: Kunte Kinte To me it seems the only people who do not agree with Tennotsukai are the people in the star fraction guild; everyone else seems to agree with him who agrees with the star fraction? I can not find anyone who does because none of us can understand what you post; does your guild have a list of canned confusion generating responses you pick from when you post or do you make it up as you go? I think you want to reread the thread, and make note that the majority are either in favor of the situation being corrected, or neutral, and the few detractors are known to possess diametrically-opposed political views and have their reasons for engaging in slanderous diatribe. I find it hard to believe the continuing line that people cannot understand the Star Fraction's points. If you have trouble with the vocabulary, wording, or ideas and choose to disregard their arguments because of that, you have no ground to stand on for your own. Look up their ideology and philosophies, educate yourself, and you may find yourself better equipped to engage them. As it is, all you have here is gutless, meaningless drivel from someone so inconsequential they feel the need to comment by proxy. Originally by: Itanis "Hello there mate, I'm dreadfully sorry, but I'm going to have to sodomize you with howitzers. Have a lovely day!"
Natasha Donnan Caldari Silent-Running Surveillance	Posted - 2007.02.06 13:48:00 - [59] Originally by: Kunte Kinte To me it seems the only people who do not agree with Tennotsukai are the people in the star fraction guild; everyone else seems to agree with him who agrees with the star fraction? I can not find anyone who does because none of us can understand what you post; does your guild have a list of canned confusion generating responses you pick from when you post or do you make it up as you go? If you make isk the way you make spin you are the richest people in eve I am sure; if I was in the mercenary coalition I would be careful because you should know better then to hire someone like Tennotsukai or let him hide in your guild; the star fraction will get you. KK Does anyone know what a guild is? I think you along with everyone else would be better letting SSoE, Star Fraction and Mordus sort it out amongst themselves. I wasn't there and therefore I cannot comment on events but it seems to me to make emminent sense to let the concerned parties discuss this without outside interference. The member of the Merc Coalition had a point in so far as he remarked on the behaviour of a Mercenary. In so far as he should be best placed to evaluate that mercenary's stance in the situation he found himself in. Since then however as far as I can see he has gone beyond what could possibly be his own experience. It looks like conjecture. He risks making this look like it is a malicious attempt at character assassination. Even though I don't believe he wishes to sound like that. I am speaking as an interested neutral. No more. Like I said before let the concerned parties be and lets stay out of something that does not concern us. _________________________________________ The Girl with the really Starey eyes.
Tennotsukai Minmatar Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:01:00 - [60] Originally by: "Jasmine Constantine" Yet suddenly you arrive on this thread with mention of how we are "masters of spin" "deceitful" "arrogant" and have a history of bullying. Such sentiments to not come from the blue and are typical of people with connections to other personalities who have been hostile to us in other parts of the cluster. I have seen many things in three and half years of active combat in the Fraction Tennotsuki and one thing I am always sure of is that opinions such as yours do not spring fully-formed from a void of personal experience. Well, your the one saying that I using the MC as protection. Why what would happen if i wasn't in the MC? would you make threats against me life.. Would you put me on you KOS list? As for me opinion... their fromed from me thoughts and me eyes.. nothign more, as for your 3 years of active combat.. well, join the club.. I can at least say that I'm not innocent of crime.. Hell I started my life fighting pirates in the outer rings, then for a while became a pirate before being given a chance to make a life for myself In the MC. And for what.. speaking me thoughts and so the little dictator shines through. Originally by: "Jasmine Constantine" Not at all, you are doing nothing that followers in other alliances do not likewise do - using the protection of your position to avoid the consequences of your words. In this case I'm sure you do not speak for the Mercenary Coalition and that your nonsense is below the notice of your leaders. You are perfectly safe - don't panic! Og course I don't speak for the MC... I have said otehrwise? Ohhh your trying to imply that I might do.. ahhhh.. as for me being safe, of course I am, its not like your bully boy behavour makes me feel threatend.. Far from it. But it is interesting how you make a big deal about me being all nice and protected in the MC.. and well, then come out with me being perfectly safe. Again, what if i wasn't in the MC? Would you try to throw your weight around then? Would you try to scare poor little old me? Grins Well, I've had me say .. and no doub't you will jump up and down with your holo-banner.. But I'm afraid you have started to show yourself in a new light.
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:10:00 - [61] Originally by: Tennotsukai Originally by: "Jasmine Constantine" Yet suddenly you arrive on this thread with mention of how we are "masters of spin" "deceitful" "arrogant" and have a history of bullying. Such sentiments to not come from the blue and are typical of people with connections to other personalities who have been hostile to us in other parts of the cluster. I have seen many things in three and half years of active combat in the Fraction Tennotsuki and one thing I am always sure of is that opinions such as yours do not spring fully-formed from a void of personal experience. Well, your the one saying that I using the MC as protection. Why what would happen if i wasn't in the MC? would you make threats against me life.. Would you put me on you KOS list? As for me opinion... their fromed from me thoughts and me eyes.. nothign more, as for your 3 years of active combat.. well, join the club.. I can at least say that I'm not innocent of crime.. Hell I started my life fighting pirates in the outer rings, then for a while became a pirate before being given a chance to make a life for myself In the MC. And for what.. speaking me thoughts and so the little dictator shines through. Originally by: "Jasmine Constantine" Not at all, you are doing nothing that followers in other alliances do not likewise do - using the protection of your position to avoid the consequences of your words. In this case I'm sure you do not speak for the Mercenary Coalition and that your nonsense is below the notice of your leaders. You are perfectly safe - don't panic! Og course I don't speak for the MC... I have said otehrwise? Ohhh your trying to imply that I might do.. ahhhh.. as for me being safe, of course I am, its not like your bully boy behavour makes me feel threatend.. Far from it. But it is interesting how you make a big deal about me being all nice and protected in the MC.. and well, then come out with me being perfectly safe. Again, what if i wasn't in the MC? Would you try to throw your weight around then? Would you try to scare poor little old me? Grins Well, I've had me say .. and no doub't you will jump up and down with your holo-banner.. But I'm afraid you have started to show yourself in a new light. So you've moved on from pretend arguments to who has the bigger equipment. Typical trashtalk from someone with no stake in the consequences in what he says. You say Jas has been in shown in a new light, I say you've never taken the light off yourself. Go away you worthless little troll.
Khavi Vetali Team Americas Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:22:00 - [62] Originally by: Natasha Donnan I think you along with everyone else would be better letting SSoE, Star Fraction and Mordus sort it out amongst themselves. I wasn't there and therefore I cannot comment on events but it seems to me to make emminent sense to let the concerned parties discuss this without outside interference. The member of the Merc Coalition had a point in so far as he remarked on the behaviour of a Mercenary. In so far as he should be best placed to evaluate that mercenary's stance in the situation he found himself in. Since then however as far as I can see he has gone beyond what could possibly be his own experience. It looks like conjecture. He risks making this look like it is a malicious attempt at character assassination. Even though I don't believe he wishes to sound like that. Quoted for emphasis. I think it's best to let the detractors wind themselves down with their own ineptitude and let this matter be settled between the immediately involved parties. The press release by Jasmine has brought a different, more complete sequence of events to public light than was originally covered in the biased news report. I'm curious to see if the official stance will be changed, and what will result from the actions that took place in the Hedoubel System. Originally by: Itanis "Hello there mate, I'm dreadfully sorry, but I'm going to have to sodomize you with howitzers. Have a lovely day!"
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:39:00 - [63] Originally by: Tennotsukai Just pointing out that Cosmopolite have been edited, sothing that can not be denied as forst its a very bad job.. plus there are huge differeance between your logs and his with several minutes missing from his. For clarity. For no other reason. So I will now produce them in their entirety so you can see they are unexpurgated and that the flow of events is as we have said. We do not tell lies. --------------------------------------------------------------- Channel ID: (('solarsystemid2', 30003794),) Channel Name: Local Listener: The Cosmopolite Session started: 2007.01.27 21:33:49 --------------------------------------------------------------- [ 2007.01.27 21:38:54 ] EVE System > Channel changed to Slays Local Channel [ 2007.01.27 21:39:56 ] EVE System > Channel changed to Amoen Local Channel [ 2007.01.27 21:40:51 ] EVE System > Channel changed to Ruerrotta Local Channel [ 2007.01.27 21:41:31 ] EVE System > Channel changed to Hedoubel Local Channel [ 2007.01.27 21:42:17 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Your Scanners should be working fine.. Send me the data. [ 2007.01.27 21:42:35 ] Sister Rhayne > I am still getting no response, I will have to dock if their communications equipment is damaged. [ 2007.01.27 21:42:40 ] Disciple Sibanna > Confirmed Sir, data transfer started. [ 2007.01.27 21:42:56 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Is this all of the data? [ 2007.01.27 21:43:14 ] happymappy > wasup hommies [ 2007.01.27 21:43:17 ] Disciple Sibanna > Yes sir, no life signs...... my concern, [ 2007.01.27 21:43:20 ] happymappy > whats going on ere then? [ 2007.01.27 21:43:27 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Sister, hold your position.. DO NOT MOVE. [ 2007.01.27 21:43:49 ] Saira Anttulen > I think this is my cue. [ 2007.01.27 21:43:56 ] Sister Rhayne > I am cutting my engines, I am just about in docking range. [ 2007.01.27 21:44:02 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Sister, back away from the station.. [ 2007.01.27 21:44:12 ] happymappy > theres no station here im so confued [ 2007.01.27 21:44:21 ] Admiral Eos > Sister.. [ 2007.01.27 21:44:23 ] Saira Anttulen > Time for me to leave the area. Goodday fools.. [ 2007.01.27 21:44:28 ] Saira Anttulen > /emote laughs loud [ 2007.01.27 21:44:30 ] Admiral Eos > ... [ 2007.01.27 21:44:45 ] Caius Sivaris > come at planety 3 happymappy ;-) [ 2007.01.27 21:44:59 ] happymappy > im scared Sad [ 2007.01.27 21:45:03 ] Ashar KorAzor > Don't. [ 2007.01.27 21:45:07 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sister report in.... [ 2007.01.27 21:45:09 ] Sister Rhayne > I have aborted my docking attempt, Seargant Major. [ 2007.01.27 21:45:13 ] Ashar KorAzor > Sudden Death Squad pilots are probably not welcome. [ 2007.01.27 21:45:17 ] happymappy > lol [ 2007.01.27 21:45:33 ] happymappy > my corp is leaving in a day or 2 can i come now? Cheesy [ 2007.01.27 21:45:58 ] Ashar KorAzor > You can go where you please, but start trouble and someone will likely kill you. There's a lot of pilots in the area who like SOE. [ 2007.01.27 21:46:27 ] happymappy > ah well ill go get a shuttle or something so u know i wont do anything Smiley bbs [ 2007.01.27 21:47:11 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Sibanna, send a priorty comms to CONCORD.. Send them the data you have.. Tell them that we have a code black situation.Sister, my scans are showing that the enviroment on that station is unsafe and I suggest we request a CONCORD HAZMAT team. [ 2007.01.27 21:47:29 ] Sister Rhayne > Gaven, your ship is interfering with my attempts to dock, could you please increase your distance? [ 2007.01.27 21:47:49 ] Seargant Major Rakham > I am sending you the results of my scan for you to confirm the readings. [ 2007.01.27 21:47:56 ] Gaven Blands > Increased [ 2007.01.27 21:48:03 ] Disciple Sibanna > Data sent Sir. [ 2007.01.27 21:48:24 ] Disciple Sibanna > Receiving your logs now.... 50% transfer complete.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:39:00 - [64] [ 2007.01.27 21:48:29 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Negative sister.. You are not to dock at that station. I repeate do not dock at the station. [ 2007.01.27 21:48:42 ] Sister Rhayne > I just reached the docking port, Seargant Major. [ 2007.01.27 21:48:50 ] Disciple Sibanna > No responce from CONCORD as of yet. Must be a relay station out somewhere.... [ 2007.01.27 21:49:08 ] Ashar KorAzor > Great, we're probably standing here watching the next Kyokoke plague breakout or something. [ 2007.01.27 21:49:11 ] Caius Sivaris > those do goodes may unlseah some epidemics with their careless behavior.... [ 2007.01.27 21:49:26 ] Ashar KorAzor > Sister, I suggest you not dock. [ 2007.01.27 21:49:33 ] Seargant Major Rakham > All pilots please move to at least 100km from the station please... [ 2007.01.27 21:49:40 ] Sister Rhayne > It is too late, I was already docked when you warned me not to... [ 2007.01.27 21:49:40 ] Kayne Darklight > can anyone web her? [ 2007.01.27 21:49:43 ] Gaven Blands > Well, the guys who asked us to make sure you don't dock have left [ 2007.01.27 21:49:46 ] happymappy > im back lads [ 2007.01.27 21:49:48 ] Gaven Blands > Web it? [ 2007.01.27 21:49:52 ] happymappy > and ladys Smiley [ 2007.01.27 21:49:53 ] Gaven Blands > I can blow it to the middle of next week [ 2007.01.27 21:50:12 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Negative. [ 2007.01.27 21:50:15 ] Ashar KorAzor > Bad idea. [ 2007.01.27 21:50:22 ] Caius Sivaris > should we.... sterilize teh sister? [ 2007.01.27 21:50:32 ] Gaven Blands > Sister, you're infected [ 2007.01.27 21:50:33 ] Ashar KorAzor > Wrechage could drift to the planets in-system, to any convoys that pass through... [ 2007.01.27 21:50:34 ] Kayne Darklight > no [ 2007.01.27 21:50:38 ] Gaven Blands > You NEED sterilizing [ 2007.01.27 21:50:51 ] Ashar KorAzor > Gaven, stand the hell down before someone shoots at you again. [ 2007.01.27 21:50:53 ] Sister Rhayne > Please do not. My ship and pod are all sealed, there is no chance of infection. [ 2007.01.27 21:51:06 ] happymappy > so whats going on dudes? [ 2007.01.27 21:51:08 ] Caius Sivaris > famous last words [ 2007.01.27 21:51:09 ] Disciple Sibanna > Gaven hold your tongue, Sister Rhayne is a good pilot she knows what shes doing... [ 2007.01.27 21:51:34 ] Gaven Blands > A good pilot who couldn't dock because I was "too close". Sounds like a poor pilot to me. [ 2007.01.27 21:51:37 ] Sister Rhayne > I will be sending members of my relief team into the outpost to assess the nature of the emergancy, They will all be in environmental suits. [ 2007.01.27 21:51:48 ] Sister Rhayne > Your ship was ramming mine, Gaven. [ 2007.01.27 21:51:53 ] Ashar KorAzor > Alright. [ 2007.01.27 21:51:59 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sergant Major, CONCORD repsonce... [ 2007.01.27 21:52:00 ] Sister Rhayne > And... you just did it again. [ 2007.01.27 21:52:03 ] Jonny Damordred > /emote rolls his eyes [ 2007.01.27 21:52:13 ] Caius Sivaris > it goes with the title [ 2007.01.27 21:52:14 ] Jonny Damordred > Professional people you have there Ashar [ 2007.01.27 21:52:17 ] Disciple Sibanna > Forwarding info onto you now. Please await transfer. [ 2007.01.27 21:52:23 ] Sister Rhayne > Please desist Gaven, or your actions will have to be interpreted as hostile... [ 2007.01.27 21:52:43 ] Disciple Sibanna > I cannot open the logs with my access rights, its encoded.... this... this isnt a good sign is it Sir? [ 2007.01.27 21:52:50 ] Sister Rhayne > I am attempting to dock again, my starboard docking port was damaged when Gaven ramed me away from the station. [ 2007.01.27 21:53:09 ] Disciple Sibanna > Transfer Complete Sergant Major im awaiting orders. [ 2007.01.27 21:53:19 ] Caius Sivaris > /emote can lend some minmattar duct tape for fixing [ 2007.01.27 21:53:21 ] Ashar KorAzor > Not my people, Freecaptain. [ 2007.01.27 21:53:33 ] happymappy > im so confused wheres thes the station
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:40:00 - [65] [ 2007.01.27 21:53:53 ] Ashar KorAzor > But if you'd like to send over a consultant, they'd welcome it, I'm sure. [ 2007.01.27 21:53:55 ] Jonny Damordred > /emote nods > I thought you had better taste than that [ 2007.01.27 21:54:03 ] Tareen Kashaar > Reconfigure your scanning equipment then, it's right next to Sister Rhayne [ 2007.01.27 21:54:13 ] Sister Rhayne > Okay, I am now docked and my relief team is entering the air locks. [ 2007.01.27 21:54:14 ] Ashar KorAzor > You need to stop trying to insult people subtly, Jonny, it isn't your thing. Just go for a big one. [ 2007.01.27 21:54:18 ] Caius Sivaris > large ciollidabl;e structure [ 2007.01.27 21:54:35 ] Jonny Damordred > That was a complement, love [ 2007.01.27 21:54:36 ] happymappy > ah [ 2007.01.27 21:54:43 ] Ashar KorAzor > Sure was, sure was. [ 2007.01.27 21:54:44 ] happymappy > gota play with my thingy then :p [ 2007.01.27 21:55:05 ] Tareen Kashaar > Way too much information, happymappy. [ 2007.01.27 21:55:08 ] Seargant Major Rakham > We have orders from CONCORD Sister.. All ships are to move to at least 100km from the station. That includes you.. You are also to meet a HAZMAT team at the Cords I am sending you. [ 2007.01.27 21:55:16 ] Ashar KorAzor > Ah, great. [ 2007.01.27 21:55:24 ] Caius Sivaris > /emote is 101km away [ 2007.01.27 21:55:29 ] Ashar KorAzor > Well, let's get the hell out of here before we choke and die for restricted reasons. [ 2007.01.27 21:55:34 ] Sister Rhayne > Thank you Seargant Major, I will do that once we can confirm the status of the civilians on this outpost. [ 2007.01.27 21:56:14 ] Ashar KorAzor > OBSA personell, either get out of the 100 km range or scatter to the four winds. [ 2007.01.27 21:56:23 ] Seargant Major Rakham > My scans are showing no life signs Sister, as no doub't yours are. [ 2007.01.27 21:57:01 ] happymappy > why u shooting the guy? he was just crying in avaux local =/ [ 2007.01.27 21:57:16 ] Tareen Kashaar > He is an enemy [ 2007.01.27 21:57:18 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Please sister.. move away from the station. [ 2007.01.27 21:57:22 ] Sister Rhayne > My team is reporting in now... It seems... that they found many of the civilians... all dead. [ 2007.01.27 21:57:46 ] Ashar KorAzor > I suggest your team leave. Environment suits have been known to fail, at times. [ 2007.01.27 21:57:50 ] Tia Organa > i dont think ive ever met ya [ 2007.01.27 21:57:58 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sister have they found... Any Survivors? [ 2007.01.27 21:58:05 ] Jonny Damordred > We've met your alliance, and that is good enough [ 2007.01.27 21:58:13 ] Sister Rhayne > No signs of wounds or injuries... Not yet, Sibanna, it is a large outpost... [ 2007.01.27 21:58:18 ] happymappy > they only joined to get away from an empire war [ 2007.01.27 21:58:19 ] Jonny Damordred > if you want to lose another ship today, come back [ 2007.01.27 21:58:31 ] happymappy > =/ [ 2007.01.27 21:58:34 ] Sister Rhayne > There are many floors to investigate, but I fear that I must trust our scanners. Everyone aboard is dead. [ 2007.01.27 21:58:58 ] Jonny Damordred > Ashar... I have a problem [ 2007.01.27 21:58:59 ] The Cosmopolite > Mordu's Legion are viable targets to The Star Fraction [ 2007.01.27 21:59:04 ] Ashar KorAzor > Yes, Jonny? [ 2007.01.27 21:59:06 ] happymappy > fair play [ 2007.01.27 21:59:08 ] Sister Rhayne > I've instructed my team to gather biomass samples for post-mortum study. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:14 ] The Cosmopolite > Due to their support for RAZOR in the past. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:20 ] happymappy > just feel sorry for the guy that was his last ship -.- [ 2007.01.27 21:59:23 ] Ashar KorAzor > I suggest you make a command decision not to shoot them. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:24 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sister there is nothing more we can do... we should follow Sergant Major Rakhams orders and withdraw [ 2007.01.27 21:59:32 ] The Cosmopolite > We have had them set to -10 for many months.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:41:00 - [66] [ 2007.01.27 21:59:34 ] Seargant Major Rakham > I am here as escort for the SSoE. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:45 ] Ashar KorAzor > I also suggest you think of them as liasions to Soe and thus, temporarily, non-Mordu personell. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:46 ] Sister Rhayne > I will Sibanna, once my team returns with the bodies. [ 2007.01.27 21:59:58 ] Ashar KorAzor > After the escort is done, I suggest you shoot anyone you like. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:11 ] Jonny Damordred > Ashar, your tone is not helping you [ 2007.01.27 22:00:11 ] Admiral Eos > Sister, this is a bit much. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:13 ] happymappy > i get what u mean just poor lil nubbin =::Sad [ 2007.01.27 22:00:19 ] Admiral Eos > We have orders. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:24 ] Sister Rhayne > I would ask, on behalf of the sisters of Eve, that you set aside your differences with the Mordus Legion at least temporarily. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:27 ] The Cosmopolite > If they withdraw now, we will allow them to leave. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:43 ] Ashar KorAzor > This is why my tone was problematic. [ 2007.01.27 22:00:48 ] Disciple Sibanna > Im...sorry Sister, this is the first encounter where such a Atrocity has occured.... [ 2007.01.27 22:00:55 ] Ashar KorAzor > Come, Doctor, do you not have the authority to settle old scores peacefully? [ 2007.01.27 22:01:05 ] Ashar KorAzor > There has been enough death here. [ 2007.01.27 22:01:12 ] Sister Rhayne > My team has returned, I am prepared to enter quarantine as CONCORD has requested. [ 2007.01.27 22:01:18 ] Jonny Damordred > All bills come due Ashar [ 2007.01.27 22:01:20 ] The Cosmopolite > Two minutes [ 2007.01.27 22:01:27 ] Selim > What is a mercenary soldier doing on a humanitarian mission? [ 2007.01.27 22:01:28 ] happymappy > look ill ask emp to stay away [ 2007.01.27 22:01:30 ] Jonny Damordred > And Mordus wrang up a large one [ 2007.01.27 22:01:33 ] Ashar KorAzor > Well, I'm not here to fight Star Fraction personell. [ 2007.01.27 22:01:34 ] Seargant Major Rakham > How about I ignore you and carry on my duty along side the SSoE. [ 2007.01.27 22:01:38 ] happymappy > so no more popy of the miners [ 2007.01.27 22:01:48 ] deathbyangel > wuts goin on? [ 2007.01.27 22:01:53 ] Sister Rhayne > Mordus Legion regularly provides assistance to the Sisters of EVE in the form of escorts. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:00 ] The Cosmopolite > You die if you do not leave. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:02 ] happymappy > jerico are poping emp lol [ 2007.01.27 22:02:05 ] Dallan Arethi > Humanitarians can pay mercenaries too, Selin. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:06 ] deathbyangel > haha [ 2007.01.27 22:02:15 ] Ashar KorAzor > /emote sighs * I'm not stupid enough to challenge an experienced flight group, but I do wish that the Doctor would count time slowly. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:18 ] Gaven Blands > It's there sec status, they can pop who they like [ 2007.01.27 22:02:47 ] happymappy > bit of a gank though xD [ 2007.01.27 22:02:50 ] The Cosmopolite > Die [ 2007.01.27 22:02:56 ] Sister Rhayne > They bodies are loaded into the cyro-refridgeration units for preservation. [ 2007.01.27 22:02:57 ] Ashar KorAzor > And there it goes. [ 2007.01.27 22:03:03 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sister get out now [ 2007.01.27 22:03:05 ] Sister Rhayne > Please stop your attack [ 2007.01.27 22:03:05 ] Admiral Eos > Oh no... [ 2007.01.27 22:03:21 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Cowards [ 2007.01.27 22:03:29 ] Selim > dog. [ 2007.01.27 22:03:30 ] Nemesor > you were warned. [ 2007.01.27 22:03:35 ] The Cosmopolite > SoE remain safe from us. [ 2007.01.27 22:03:36 ] Sister Rhayne > I'm sorry Seargant-Major... [ 2007.01.27 22:03:47 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sister warp to my coords [ 2007.01.27 22:04:10 ] deathbyangel > /emote gets the popcorn [ 2007.01.27 22:04:11 ] Sister Rhayne > Your attack against our escort is considered an attack on us. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:18 ] Disciple Sibanna > They just engaged Rakham with no provocation, i dont feel safe here. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:19 ] Ashar KorAzor > Do NOT engage!
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:42:00 - [67] [ 2007.01.27 22:04:19 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Star fraction you are are just cowards. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:19 ] Sister Rhayne > From now on you will be considered enemies of the Servant Sisters of EVE. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:25 ] Ashar KorAzor > You've plagued bodies in the hold. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:36 ] The Cosmopolite > No, Mordu's Legion are fools. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:37 ] Selim > Oh, really? [ 2007.01.27 22:04:46 ] Admiral Eos > Disgusting. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:47 ] The Cosmopolite > You have been hostiles to us for months. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:49 ] Jonny Damordred > He was warned, and stupid for not leaving [ 2007.01.27 22:04:49 ] Nemesor > You ignored warnings with blatant disrespect. [ 2007.01.27 22:04:59 ] Ashar KorAzor > Sad, but accurate. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:00 ] The Cosmopolite > You were given fair warning and ample time to withdraw. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:13 ] happymappy > im so confused still xD [ 2007.01.27 22:05:22 ] Seargant Major Rakham > So says Star Fraction... Friends of the Gurista.. you are nothing more then a joke.. and well pirates. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:28 ] The Cosmopolite > SoE personnel will not be hurt. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:28 ] Gaven Blands > So Seargant Major Rakham finally figured out who your enemy is huh? [ 2007.01.27 22:05:42 ] Disciple Sibanna > Sergant Major im returning to base with Rhayne my place is with her, [ 2007.01.27 22:05:44 ] Ashar KorAzor > Thank you, Doctor. [ 2007.01.27 22:05:56 ] The Cosmopolite > Mordu's are the joke. You pay the price for siding with the Northern Tyrants. [ 2007.01.27 22:06:24 ] Jonny Damordred > It is sad to see SoE siding with IRON and RAZOR dogs [ 2007.01.27 22:06:27 ] Dallan Arethi > The price is to be attacked while siding with someone completely different? [ 2007.01.27 22:06:34 ] Ashar KorAzor > SoE sides with those in need. [ 2007.01.27 22:06:38 ] Selim > I had some respect for SoE. [ 2007.01.27 22:06:42 ] Jonny Damordred > pfft [ 2007.01.27 22:06:44 ] Dallan Arethi > SoE aren';t siding with Mordu's, SoE are employing them. [ 2007.01.27 22:06:54 ] Jonny Damordred > And do you see us killing them Ashar [ 2007.01.27 22:06:55 ] The Cosmopolite > SoE have NOT been attacked. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:12 ] Ashar KorAzor > You attack a convoy escort who is negative to you, and they set you at negative standings...this is in line with their operatioal procedures, I expect, as your actions were with your own. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:21 ] The Cosmopolite > Our stance towards SoE has not changed. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:36 ] The Cosmopolite > If SoE personnel aggress us, that will change. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:43 ] deathbyangel > srry for the interrupt of a good show but wuts soe [ 2007.01.27 22:07:45 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Yes they have... By attecking me.. you destroyed alot of data that was required by the SSoE.. and I'm flying uder the banner of the SSoE you damned fool. [ 2007.01.27 22:07:52 ] Ashar KorAzor > Yes, and I am glad of it, Doctor. I am pointing out that they are not so much siding with people as they are hewing to protocol. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:08 ] The Cosmopolite > Your banner is Mordu's Legion. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:13 ] Admiral Eos > Sergeant, we have to go. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:16 ] The Cosmopolite > You were given time to get clear. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:26 ] Jonny Damordred > If he had left when warned, he would have not been destroyed [ 2007.01.27 22:08:28 ] Ashar KorAzor > Hopefully your Pod's systems retained some of that data. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:38 ] Selim > We don't usually grant people that respect. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:41 ] Ashar KorAzor > I'm powering down. [ 2007.01.27 22:08:45 ] Ashar KorAzor > Fly well and fly safe. [ 2007.01.27 22:09:28 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Congratulations Star Fraction.. for destroying the data that was collected on the station. And no my orders come from the SSoE not some jumped up bully boy who pretends to be more then the pirates they really are.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:44:00 - [68] [ 2007.01.27 22:09:39 ] Jonny Damordred > Pfft [ 2007.01.27 22:09:49 ] Seargant Major Rakham > Well, I will leave you with the mess you have made Star Fraction. [ 2007.01.27 22:09:52 ] Jonny Damordred > If you want to do more than just whine in local [ 2007.01.27 22:09:54 ] Caius Sivaris > so any proof yet of any worngdoing in that station? [ 2007.01.27 22:09:59 ] Jonny Damordred > we are in stacmon, come and get us [ 2007.01.27 22:09:59 ] happymappy > Lmao woo claps [ 2007.01.27 22:10:06 ] The Cosmopolite > You were given time to get clear. [ 2007.01.27 22:10:15 ] deathbyangel > hehe jonny boy run to high sec [ 2007.01.27 22:10:16 ] The Cosmopolite > You are the fool for not taking the oportunity. [ 2007.01.27 22:10:35 ] Ashar KorAzor > If anyone wants a fight with SF, they're fools and will likely lose some ships soon. [ 2007.01.27 22:10:41 ] Selim > SoE, I suggest next time you operate around here that you do not hire the enemies of the Star Fraction. [ 2007.01.27 22:10:52 ] Azure Skyclad > The data coudl have been handed off in that time Sargeant Major. Perhaps pride clouded your judgement? [ 2007.01.27 22:11:27 ] happymappy > oh dam i remember that old vent chat with a jerico guy in Smiley [ 2007.01.27 22:11:40 ] happymappy > that was teh funny xD [ 2007.01.27 22:12:03 ] Dallan Arethi > Pride or faith in your better natures. I don't understand what kind of grudge demands that you attack someone for their employers when they have changed employers. [ 2007.01.27 22:12:26 ] Katrina Kirellii > Peace everyone - peace. [ 2007.01.27 22:12:32 ] deathbyangel > this reminds me of old english [ 2007.01.27 22:12:34 ] deathbyangel > like hamlin [ 2007.01.27 22:12:40 ] deathbyangel > tis so funnies [ 2007.01.27 22:12:50 ] happymappy > im getting bored o/ later on beutiful people [ 2007.01.27 22:13:33 ] happymappy > /emote chucks love at every1 in local Azn [ 2007.01.27 22:13:34 ] Dallan Arethi > Then again, I don't know all the details of your history with the Northern alliances, so I only have what passes for my sense to go on. [ 2007.01.27 22:14:31 ] Jonny Damordred > Dallan, it is long and bloody [ 2007.01.27 22:14:33 ] The Cosmopolite > Excuse me, Dallan, the standing is with Mordu. [ 2007.01.27 22:14:37 ] The Cosmopolite > For Mordu actions. [ 2007.01.27 22:14:45 ] The Cosmopolite > In Mordu interests. [ 2007.01.27 22:15:28 ] Kayne Darklight > so, does anyone actually know what happened on that outpost? or was it all lost in a hail of gunfire? [ 2007.01.27 22:16:02 ] Pilious > I don't evben se an outpost here [ 2007.01.27 22:16:08 ] Sanguineous Reaper > what you bunch of nurds roleplaying about? [ 2007.01.27 22:16:09 ] deathbyangel > i thought u couldn't put an outpost in empire [ 2007.01.27 22:16:09 ] Elesaar > its there, its puny [ 2007.01.27 22:16:18 ] Tareen Kashaar > reconfigure your scanner, Pillious [ 2007.01.27 22:16:23 ] Kayne Darklight > large collidable, rather than a station [ 2007.01.27 22:16:30 ] Elesaar > barely the size of a battleship [ 2007.01.27 22:16:32 ] Pilious > I tryed to add colidable objects [ 2007.01.27 22:16:44 ] Dallan Arethi > Fair enough, Cosmopolite. I don't think here is the place to explain them, but if I asked in a less hectic venue would you be averse to answering them? [ 2007.01.27 22:17:05 ] The Cosmopolite > No, not at all. ---------------------------------------------------------- The full log, from my record, and unedited. It will be noted that every excerpt I have produced in posts where I edited for clarity has exactly the same words as in the full log and the same timestamp. None of my edits distorted the true facts in any way. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Kovid Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 14:55:00 - [69] Edited by: Kovid on 06/02/2007 15:03:00 Originally by: Tennotsukai Also we are lead to belive that the logs are to be taken as accurate and complete... except The Cosmopolite's have clearly been altered, and those posted by Jasmine Constantine start 11 minutes after The Cosmopolite's. Yes you are to believe, they are complete and accurate. And oh how I like what Ly Sol said in the past [http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=247190&page=1#9] "As much as Jericho is hated by the northern allies, thier word is worth billions." And to this day The Star Fraction's word is still worth billions. ---------------------------------- An informal Star Fraction FAQ \| ----------------------------------
GoGo Yubari Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.02.06 15:19:00 - [70] Originally by: Nekumi So you've moved on from pretend arguments to who has the bigger equipment. Typical trashtalk from someone with no stake in the consequences in what he says. You say Jas has been in shown in a new light, I say you've never taken the light off yourself. Go away you worthless little troll. I'm sorry but it was one of your's that first insinuated that if Tenno wasn't in the organization he might be the target of your punitive action. Tenno was sporting opinions. You brought the organization into this. Now I'm interested, too. The stakes are as high as you decide to make them and I know the Fraction is very fond of threatening war decs on those who dare confront them on the forums.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 15:42:00 - [71] Originally by: GoGo Yubari I'm sorry but it was one of your's that first insinuated that if Tenno wasn't in the organization he might be the target of your punitive action. Tenno was sporting opinions. You brought the organization into this. Now I'm interested, too. The stakes are as high as you decide to make them and I know the Fraction is very fond of threatening war decs on those who dare confront them on the forums. What was stated was that if your member wasn't in Mercenary Coalition and might actually have had to consider the personal consequence for his obvious grudge and slander then he'd be more likely to moderate his language and tone and bring a little more respect and little less in the line of random insults to the discussion. Now while we in the Fraction fear precisely nothing and nobody ms Yubari, you must know that we have precisely nothing to gain from wardeccing a mercenary corporation with a deep 0.0 holding in the belly of Band of Brothers alliances. Hence nothing however vile spewed up from your corpmate is going to yield consequence. He knows it, we know it, you know it. And that is the point that was made. Star Fraction is recruiting
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 15:49:00 - [72] Originally by: GoGo Yubari Originally by: Nekumi So you've moved on from pretend arguments to who has the bigger equipment. Typical trashtalk from someone with no stake in the consequences in what he says. You say Jas has been in shown in a new light, I say you've never taken the light off yourself. Go away you worthless little troll. I'm sorry but it was one of your's that first insinuated that if Tenno wasn't in the organization he might be the target of your punitive action. Tenno was sporting opinions. You brought the organization into this. Now I'm interested, too. The stakes are as high as you decide to make them and I know the Fraction is very fond of threatening war decs on those who dare confront them on the forums. We live and die by our actions GoGo. I have no stomach for anyone who just mouths off without the will, fortitude or cajones to back up what they say. Star Fraction do not threaten war decs, we invite them or we make them and I don't think it has ever been because some random ****ant trolls us on the forums.
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 16:01:00 - [73] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine What was stated was that if your member wasn't in Mercenary Coalition and might actually have had to consider the personal consequence for his obvious grudge and slander then he'd be more likely to moderate his language and tone and bring a little more respect and little less in the line of random insults to the discussion. Now while we in the Fraction fear precisely nothing and nobody ms Yubari, you must know that we have precisely nothing to gain from wardeccing a mercenary corporation with a deep 0.0 holding in the belly of Band of Brothers alliances. Hence nothing however vile spewed up from your corpmate is going to yield consequence. He knows it, we know it, you know it. And that is the point that was made. How does it feel to be on the other side of the "wardec or stfu" fence? Must be mighty uncomfortable after bullying unorganised alliances who can't even suffer light T2 attrition? Forgive me if I gloat, I just can't help myself due to the sheer irony. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Rowan Mayfair	Posted - 2007.02.06 16:02:00 - [74] I'm sure Star Fraction's treatment of Sisters of Eve delegates was positively cordial compared to the atrocities commited against SoE by members of BoB last night.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 16:22:00 - [75] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 06/02/2007 16:19:28 Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel How does it feel to be on the other side of the "wardec or stfu" fence? Must be mighty uncomfortable after bullying unorganised alliances who can't even suffer light T2 attrition? Forgive me if I gloat, I just can't help myself due to the sheer irony. Other side? Seems like we're still on the side that says "come and do something about it if you don't approve" - anyone is in their perfect right to do that if they feel they should. Point is this guy is a tiny drone in a bigger organisation and his words are consequence-free - thats why this sort of pathetic grudge-stalking wins no respect from us. And please stop trying to deflect us from the coming war against PIE Nomakai - I know you are scared but try at least to pretend you've got a backbone! Star Fraction is recruiting
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 16:41:00 - [76] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Other side? Seems like we're still on the side that says "come and do something about it if you don't approve" - anyone is in their perfect right to do that if they feel they should. Point is this guy is a tiny drone in a bigger organisation and his words are consequence-free - thats why this sort of pathetic grudge-stalking wins no respect from us. And please stop trying to deflect us from the coming war against PIE Nomakai - I know you are scared but try at least to pretend you've got a backbone! 1. Why do you assume that I belong to PIE? Not all Amarr belong to PIE and in a few days you'll be free to wardec my little one-man corperation (to be) if you wish. I'm sure it will be a grand step for you to fight my "regressive memes" in a more physical manner since your ideology seems to be completely harmless against those who have some sense in their heads. This considering that your allies are all terrorists, drugrunners or blood-drinking elitist cultists. Or a combination of the three. And that you're attacking humanitarian aid-convoys. Oh you just removed their only protection, but I guess you can rely on your pirate friends to do the final dirtywork once you've destroyed the escort. 2. I doubt that the PIE are afraid of you. Unlike the CYI and the Kimotoro directive they're battle-hardened after years of fighting against the Minmatar. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 17:05:00 - [77] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel 1. Why do you assume that I belong to PIE? Because every comment of note you've ever made on the intergalactic summit is pro their position? Because you hide your allegiance ticker? Because you are fairly transparent and sound just like Merdeneth of PIE? Because I guess you have no individuality and just act as a mouthpiece for the nationalist meme we fight. All those reasons really. Quote: Not all Amarr belong to PIE and in a few days you'll be free to wardec my little one-man corperation (to be) if you wish. I'm sure it will be a grand step for you to fight my "regressive memes" in a more physical manner since your ideology seems to be completely harmless against those who have some sense in their heads. This considering that your allies are all terrorists, drugrunners or blood-drinking elitist cultists. Or a combination of the three. And that you're attacking humanitarian aid-convoys. Oh you just removed their only protection, but I guess you can rely on your pirate friends to do the final dirtywork once you've destroyed the escort. If we attacked every 1 man corporation in Eve for talking claptrap on the intergalactic summit (as above) our warbill would be billions a week. While creative this "plan" for eliminating Star Fraction fiscally is fatally flawed by dint of our strategic planners knowing how to go for throat in our own wardecs and pick the targets that do the most harm to the nationalist movements selected. Quote: 2. I doubt that the PIE are afraid of you. Unlike the CYI and the Kimotoro directive they're battle-hardened after years of fighting against the Minmatar. We'll see. Time will tell how well they do. But until then I guess we'll keep on hearing from PIE-fans in the peanut gallery. Maybe when the war begins you'll join them? That would be nice. Star Fraction is recruiting
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 17:22:00 - [78] Edited by: Nomakai Delateriel on 06/02/2007 17:20:23 Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel 1. Why do you assume that I belong to PIE? Because every comment of note you've ever made on the intergalactic summit is pro their position? Because you hide your allegiance ticker? Because you are fairly transparent and sound just like Merdeneth of PIE? Because I guess you have no individuality and just act as a mouthpiece for the nationalist meme we fight. All those reasons really. Quote: Not all Amarr belong to PIE and in a few days you'll be free to wardec my little one-man corperation (to be) if you wish. I'm sure it will be a grand step for you to fight my "regressive memes" in a more physical manner since your ideology seems to be completely harmless against those who have some sense in their heads. This considering that your allies are all terrorists, drugrunners or blood-drinking elitist cultists. Or a combination of the three. And that you're attacking humanitarian aid-convoys. Oh you just removed their only protection, but I guess you can rely on your pirate friends to do the final dirtywork once you've destroyed the escort. If we attacked every 1 man corporation in Eve for talking claptrap on the intergalactic summit (as above) our warbill would be billions a week. While creative this "plan" for eliminating Star Fraction fiscally is fatally flawed by dint of our strategic planners knowing how to go for throat in our own wardecs and pick the targets that do the most harm to the nationalist movements selected. 1. No. I'm quite against PIE on some policies. Those policies however do not include deluded (or twisted depending on how devious you are) pirate-supporting anarchists. For example I'm quite at odds with PIE on some policies concerning minmatar or the use of foreign technology. 2. I do not display my alliance/corp ticker at the moment because it says nothing. I am still, and have been for quite a while, a member of the Imperial Academy although in a few days I will no longer remain there. 3. While Merdaneth is a decent speaker he is quite separate from me. As for "transparancy" that is called "honesty" where I come from. I do not wear a mask like a second face. When I speak I speak from the heart. When I fight my heart is with me. 4. I am Amarr. The only reason why you do not believe that I have an individuality is because your prejudices cloud your vision. The only reason why you do not see Nomakai Delateriel, the true Nomakai Delateriel, is because you cannot see any longer than the "Amarr" and "loyal to the empire". As for "claptrap". It is the truth. A decidedly Amarran truth (few people view the universe as we do) but still it fulfills all the coherency requirements that is demanded from truth. Still, you will be free to wardec me. If you do not, for financial reasons or what ever, fine. However your "wardec or stfu" hypocrisy as well as your double standards concerning your actions and the actions of others is getting old. And that will be true regardless if you declare war on me or not. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 18:03:00 - [79] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 06/02/2007 18:04:07 Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel 4. I am Amarr. The only reason why you do not believe that I have an individuality is because your prejudices cloud your vision. The only reason why you do not see Nomakai Delateriel, the true Nomakai Delateriel, is because you cannot see any longer than the "Amarr" and "loyal to the empire". No, the reason I believe you lack all individuality is that you bark for the drooling amusement of a pack of dogs and do not think for yourself. A product of that lack of thinking is your poorly-constructed and ill-supported attacks on SF ideology which you believe will bring you acclaim from the peanut gallery. That is why I do not credit you with individuality - you do not exist beyond the quest for mere-forum accomplishment. Quote: As for "claptrap". It is the truth. A decidedly Amarran truth (few people view the universe as we do) but still it fulfills all the coherency requirements that is demanded from truth. Utter nonsense unworthy of the time to refute it. Quote: Still, you will be free to wardec me. If you do not, for financial reasons or what ever, fine. However your "wardec or stfu" hypocrisy as well as your double standards concerning your actions and the actions of others is getting old. And that will be true regardless if you declare war on me or not. Yet you have completely failed in multiple threads to produce a single coherent argument to that effect. Must be frustrating to mirror your physical impotence so completely in your lack of public wit. I would sympathise but I suspect it would do no good. Simply using the word "hypocrisy" does not make it so, especially where your own lack of intellect prevents you from reading and understanding the idealogy of others. I do not expect you to agree with us neccessarily - but while you continue to erect and demolish straw-man arguments of your own intervention in preference to engaging the things we actually say you are not going to win the merest respect or recognition from my lips. Star Fraction is recruiting
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 18:21:00 - [80] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine [snip] Yet you have completely failed in multiple threads to produce a single coherent argument to that effect. [snip]Simply using the word "hypocrisy" does not make it so, especially where your own lack of intellect prevents you from reading and understanding the idealogy of others. Hypocrisy? Is it not Hypocrisy to continally tell minor corperations to "wardec or stfu" if people complain or critique your actions yet you complain when a pilot from a more powerful alliance criticise you? Is it not hypocrisy to condemn the Republic head of state for the Muritor affair when her actions were virtually analogous with you buying off pirates to save your dreadnought and its crew so they can come back and do the same thing another day? Other than of course that a dreadnought is merely a ship and unlike pirates we Amarr have honour. Those are acts of hypocrisy of the highest degree and only the most recent ones. As for my own words. They're not plays for the "peanut" gallery. They're the truth (granted, as I see it) Miss Constantine. But why do I even bother, all I will get is more insults and other forms of ad hominem. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Ashar KorAzor Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 18:55:00 - [81] Edited by: Ashar KorAzor on 06/02/2007 18:54:30 Edited by: Ashar KorAzor on 06/02/2007 18:52:04 You know what? This is getting tedious. A lot of people have wasted their time replying to this feed. Those of you who weren't there can stop now, your points were already made elsewhere and made better. To the Fractionists: You lot need to stop acting as if your actions need to be defended in this manner. You run about like naughty boys who've made off with a pastry, letting yourselves forget what actually happenned. Even the relatively eloquent Doctor can regularly be seen having to stick a finger in the dykes because of this torrent of badly framed thoughts is pouring through it. Let me clarify something. Your enemies want a squabble and a fuss, and that they can have if you explain, and they can't if you don't. What you did in the system in question was not particularly memorable. You were, in fact, a mostly mechanical extension of your own RoE. There were viable targets, they **ed you off, you shot them. Does this somehow change the fact that a few thousand crewmen died? No. People die all the time, really - on a galactic scale, it wasn't enough of a loss to make CONCORD care very much. As to the data loss - yes, you likely did no permanent damage, and whatnot; however, unless you're prepared to say that you know all data information and retrieval mechanisms utilized by CONCORD and Mordu's Legion, you really should cease dictating what is and is not happening in their data storage equipment. And if you ARE prepared to say you've somehow mastered all CONCORD cyphers, encryptions, and information transfer protocols, &c, well, that'll be interesting, won't it? Furthermore, the pilots in question never said you destroyed permanently irretrievable data. You might, however, have interfered with CONCORD's investigation and the response to it, which is the real issue. As I doubt making soverign entities or police forces unable to effectively respond to epidemics is the primary goal of your branch of posthumanism and its applications to strategic and tactical planning, I don't think you should be making major efforts to defend this. It is enough to say you did not cripple any SoE craft. It is enough to say you did not assist MEDUS in testing a virus that likely killed hundreds. To the Servant Sisters of EVE, Food Relief division, as well as to the pilots of Mordu's Legion: Despite various disagreements one will always be prone to have with any fractionist, it is readily evident that their RoE and general operational philosophy have room for reconciliation. They are also largely very good combat pilots.** Consider that they do not currently want to work against you - they are somewhat more focused on nationalist capsuleers, and they are, as always, willing to get more viable targets, but I doubt that destroying vessels flying the banner of a humanitarian organization is the average Fractionist's wet dream. Consider that a relief fleet with too many holes in it is not likely to get where it's supposed to be going. Consider the merit of neutralizing a potential or past enemy. Most of all, consider the lives of your crewmen, and quit screwing around with said lives. Also, consider persuing a course that will not have them ambush convoys in the future. They are said to be amongst the most forgiving grab-bag of self-proclaimed terrorists in known space.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 19:00:00 - [82] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Hypocrisy? Is it not Hypocrisy to continally tell minor corperations to "wardec or stfu" if people complain or critique your actions yet you complain when a pilot from a more powerful alliance criticise you? We're happy to tell Mercenary Coalition to "wardec or stfu" too of course. So where exactly is this "hypocrisy"? We're current -10 KOS to the majority of entities in 0.0 space for refusing to bend our knee or obey their commands. Where is the "hypocrisy?" You have seen no example of Star Fraction pilots ever treating the pilots from the more powerful alliances differently from the weaker ones. The Mercenary Coalition pilot I took issue with earlier was simply a fool with a grudge and the knowledge that we are targetting nationalists not mercenaries and fully able to let his mouth run. The fact you try to paint this is "hypocrisy" reveals your own limited intellect and proves no kind of hypocrisy whatsoever. Quote: Is it not hypocrisy to condemn the Republic head of state for the Muritor affair when her actions were virtually analogous with you buying off pirates to save your dreadnought and its crew so they can come back and do the same thing another day? Other than of course that a dreadnought is merely a ship and unlike pirates we Amarr have honour. You really are reaching and its almost pathetic to see. No it is not hypocrisy for a Star Fraction captain to save the lives of her crew when all else is lost. Yes it is entirely reasonable for Star Fraction pilots to condemn the head of the republic state for her weakness and lack of vision. And now you talk of the Amarr having "honour" - don't talk of what you cannot understand loyalist dog. No slaver has honour, no tool of memetic imperialism is deserving of respect. Quote: Those are acts of hypocrisy of the highest degree and only the most recent ones.As for my own words. They're not plays for the "peanut" gallery. They're the truth (granted, as I see it) Miss Constantine. But why do I even bother, all I will get is more insults and other forms of ad hominem. There is a fallacy with the ad hominen fallacy Nomakai Delateriel and let me explain it to you. You see, if the comment on the debating opponent is accurate and just then it is hardly a fallacy to hold up that persons credibility as a witness to public inspection. When you speak of Ad hominem attacks as a logical fallacy you are attempting to say that I attack you rather than the argument and are thus afraid of your logic - yet your arguments are not based on logic they are based on your credibility as a witness and partial and flawed judgement of our actions. The Fallacy is that if you are not a credible witness (and I most certainly allege you are not) then the basis of your argument is critically flawed and the Ad hominem attack is much certainly justified. Case in point. You cite the "honour" of the Amarr as if that is universally accepted. It of course is not. You seek to link the actions of the Republic head with the paying of randsom to save a Dreadnaught - your conjecture and accusation yet you present it as fact. Again it is incorrect. And you seek to present evidence of Star Fraction treating individuals of different sized alliances differently? Again you are incorrect yet you present it as truth. So I think in this case it is entirely justified in engaging in Ad hominem attacks against your credibility. One cannot grapple with your logic since it is inconsistent and ephemeral at best. You are a man of mist and smoke - with no true substance. How else to contend your competance beyond pointing that out ? Ultimately we are left with the question of your purpose then and since your arguments are clearly flawed and unsustainable we have to concern ourselves for your reasons for making them. And from what I have seen you seek the acclamation of peanut-gallery dogs and various rabble and rejoice in such. Therefore I conclude this is your motivation. Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 19:20:00 - [83] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 06/02/2007 19:22:33 Originally by: Ashar KorAzor Consider that they do not currently want to work against you - they are somewhat more focused on nationalist capsuleers, and they are, as always, willing to get more viable targets, but I doubt that destroying vessels flying the banner of a humanitarian organization is the average Fractionist's wet dream. Consider that a relief fleet with too many holes in it is not likely to get where it's supposed to be going. Consider the merit of neutralizing a potential or past enemy. Most of all, consider the lives of your crewmen, and quit screwing around with said lives. Those men signed on to run aid efforts, not get caught up in an entangling mass of past bad relations. Let them do their jobs. And while you're at it, consider persuing a course that will not have them ambush convoys in the future. They are said to be amongst the most forgiving grab-bag of self-proclaimed terrorists in known space. Last night Sister Rhaynes of the Servant Sisters of Eve recruited a rag-tag band of capsule pilots and through portraying Star Fraction members as likely hostiles, precipitated a confrontation in Pureblind that led to one of her escort vessels firing weapons at a Star Fraction vessel. As a result an interdictor bubble was deployed that led to the destruction of convoy elements at the hands of Band of Brothers alliance. Sister Rhaynes was repeatedly asked to confirm if SOE was considering SF at -10 Standings to confirm the diplomatic situation and failed to provide any kind of clarification whatsoever. The attack on the SF ship by the convoy was registered in conflict logs, and by intelligence feeds from within the communication channel Sister Rhayne's was using to organise the fleet operation. All Sister Rhaynes needed to do was confirm to Star Fraction diplomatic staff one of two standings: either SF from SOE is neutral, or SF is considered Hostile/targets by SOE. This she was utterly incapable of doing and so an attack was made by escort pilot Isean of Radd1ck Explorations on a Star Fraction ship and this earned the a -10 KOS status for his corp. [ 2007.02.06 03:42:33 ] Sister Rhayne > I was forced to tell them that an attack on a ship of our convoy was considered an attack on us, they failed to understand the reasoning. [ 2007.02.06 03:44:18 ] Sister Rhayne > And now they have been attempting to maenuver me into saying things which would only result in all out war upon the Sisters of EVE and Star Fraction. I refuse to be manipulated into giving them the answers that they are attempting to force from me. And 30 jumps later (After the Sister's Convoy attacked an SF ship) [ 2007.02.06 04:26:18 ] Isean > I must depart, fly safe sister. RDEX, Im sorry that my particular actions have gotten us marked KOS by SF. I will remain here for a while longer. I will be meeting with old BoB contacts. Fly safe all At the moment we still haven't set SOE as a whole to -10 KOS even though an SOE convoy led by Sister Rhaynes most definately fired on our shipping. (And by the sister's own logic based on the involvement of mordus legion previously we definately would be within our right) But it is becoming clear that if this matter is to have a successful diplomatic resolution then Sister Rhaynes is not the person we should be speaking with. We'll accept any help you can provide in locating a senior-ranked Servant Sister with which to resolve this standings confusion and continuing stand-off ms KorAzor. You are right to frustrated. But your frustration would be better directed at the object of the problem here and that is Sister Rhaynes and her arrogance and hostility to Star Fraction. And lets face it, in her own words: [ 2007.02.06 04:43:54 ] Sister Rhayne > I had best go before I lose what little control over my rising emotions that I still have. Hardly a rational personality. Star Fraction is recruiting
Ashar KorAzor Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 20:00:00 - [84] Edited by: Ashar KorAzor on 06/02/2007 19:57:34 While I will be looking to unearth an elusive SoE spokesperson who has the necessary rank and wherewithal to say something useful, I think I will stand by my statement, freecaptain. As for frustrations - I'm not particularly interested in siding with anyone. Both sides are set to lose - if not in terms of a loss incurred by a conflict decided through the arithmetics of a force of arms, then in ideology, and in how ideology is compromised. You lot want to extend the actions of one individual to an entire organization of humanitarians, fine. You don't, fine. You're met with somewhat unreasonable replies because your RoE makes you appear to be a bit like pirayes to a certain type of organization, hey, not your fault - no one can control the perceptions of others. You can, however, control who you shoot. The fact that you're looking to resolve this is commendable. The fact that the consequence of a resolution that is not to your express liking will have you target the organization an unreasonable individual is doing a bad job of hiding behind, however, is not. Not everyone needs to become a viable target.
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 20:09:00 - [85] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine You really are reaching and its almost pathetic to see. No it is not hypocrisy for a Star Fraction captain to save the lives of her crew when all else is lost. Yes it is entirely reasonable for Star Fraction pilots to condemn the head of the republic state for her weakness and lack of vision. And now you talk of the Amarr having "honour" - don't talk of what you cannot understand loyalist dog. No slaver has honour, no tool of memetic imperialism is deserving of respect. If you openly support a Star Fraction saving her(or was it his?) ship from certain defeat then you cannot condemn a head of state from saving her nation from certain defeat, because make no mistake the Republic fleet (as is) could never stand against the rebuilt and modernized Amarr navy. Yet taking no action against Muritor (and thus showing disrespect for the Yulai accord) would invite an Amarr offensive (and there are warhawks on my side that are all too eager for an all out war). By attempting to arrest (which turned into a killing) Muritor she did what was necessary to save the republic. Or to be truthful, to buy the republic more time (the republic and the Amarr empire will most likely clash one day). Just like you cannot know that the very same dreadnought won't be captured again another time. Basic military stratagem. Your pilot did it to save her crew, the republic did what was necessary to protect its people, and for that you will cheer one of them but condemn the other. If you call it weakness to avoid a war that would have cost the matari people billions in casualties then so be it. If you call it lack of vision to delay the war to another day when you will most likely have a much better chance for each day that passes(the republic navy has only been building ships for a mere two centuries, even less actually), then so be it. But then I'll call your dreadnought pilot weak and lacking foresight and vision. For she lacked foresight when she left the station despite knowing that there were superior forces waiting for her, and by your own reasoning she was weak when she ransomed her ship and took a risk that a small sacrifice would save a greater whole. As for Amarr honour, it was irrelevant to the argument (other than that I stated my opinion) but we have honour even if you are the one that does not understand. We fight fair, we speak truth as we see it, we are men (and women) of our word, we are merciful in victory and dignified in defeat. That is just a fraction of what Amarr honour means and if you cannot see that then that is your loss. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Kovid Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 20:23:00 - [86] Ashar, you are much more sensible then Sister Rhayne. I am not sure what to think of her. First I thought her to be indecisive, then scared, then incompetent, and even at one point manipulative with other motives. At least with you I see a more constant effort in neutrality and level head. I do not agree with your ways but at least you can speak without fumbling over yourself. I am curious what exactly your relations are with the Sisters of Eve. Maybe I will meet you sometime in La Maison to ask you. I believe I we can have a somewhat civil conversation as long as we never broach the subject of religion or slaves. On the subject of viable targets. They choose us. But it seems you know how our RoE works Ashar. ---------------------------------- An informal Star Fraction FAQ \| ----------------------------------
Ashar KorAzor Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 20:42:00 - [87] You flatter yourself, frecaptain. Take a look at my corporation's name and title and reconsider having a conversation with me that does not touch on those subjects. However, such intercourse may not be as negative as you think - unlike some of my associates in the Empire, I think the first is being stifled and betrayed and the second was wronged a few hundred years ago. But this isn't germaine. The SF RoE is rather easy to understand when one sees it in action and asks the odd question. I know what I need to of it; your corporation's public profile screams NRDS to any that have eyes in their heads. The details are simple enough to work out. As for level-headedness, you have me confused with someone else.
Sakura Nihil Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 21:00:00 - [88] I have not seen such attempts to dodge a subject in such a long time, kudos to Ms. Rhayne for being an excellent politician and refusing to answer such a simple question.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 21:21:00 - [89] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel If you openly support a Star Fraction saving her(or was it his?) ship from certain defeat then you cannot condemn a head of state from saving her nation from certain defeat, because make no mistake the Republic fleet (as is) could never stand against the rebuilt and modernized Amarr navy. Your argument is critically flawed and built on false logic. You are offering tired statist rhetoric as fact and it simply won't wash Amarrian. You laud the defeatest Republic stateswoman as hero because you want the Matari Submission. Do not try to contaminate the argument with such rhetorical dross - you insult me and you demean yourself further. Quote: Yet taking no action against Muritor (and thus showing disrespect for the Yulai accord) would invite an Amarr offensive (and there are warhawks on my side that are all too eager for an all out war). By attempting to arrest (which turned into a killing) Muritor she did what was necessary to save the republic. Or to be truthful, to buy the republic more time (the republic and the Amarr empire will most likely clash one day). Just like you cannot know that the very same dreadnought won't be captured again another time. Basic military stratagem. It is "basic" since it depends entirely on your partial interpretation of facts and circumstances you are no position to prove. Quote: As for Amarr honour, it was irrelevant to the argument (other than that I stated my opinion) but we have honour even if you are the one that does not understand. We fight fair, we speak truth as we see it, we are men (and women) of our word, we are merciful in victory and dignified in defeat. That is just a fraction of what Amarr honour means and if you cannot see that then that is your loss. Simple propaganda rubbish for children. Go home and tell it Amarri infants Nomakai Delateriel. They'll appreciate this rot more than we do. Star Fraction is recruiting
Kovid Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 21:23:00 - [90] Originally by: Ashar KorAzor You flatter yourself, frecaptain. Take a look at my corporation's name and title and reconsider having a conversation with me that does not touch on those subjects. However, such intercourse may not be as negative as you think - unlike some of my associates in the Empire, I think the first is being stifled and betrayed and the second was wronged a few hundred years ago. But this isn't germaine. The SF RoE is rather easy to understand when one sees it in action and asks the odd question. I know what I need to of it; your corporation's public profile screams NRDS to any that have eyes in their heads. The details are simple enough to work out. As for level-headedness, you have me confused with someone else. Oh well, I tried. ---------------------------------- An informal Star Fraction FAQ \| ----------------------------------
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 21:55:00 - [91] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Your argument is critically flawed and built on false logic. You are offering tired statist rhetoric as fact and it simply won't wash Amarrian. You laud the defeatest Republic stateswoman as hero because you want the Matari Submission. Do not try to contaminate the argument with such rhetorical dross - you insult me and you demean yourself further. Ad hominem circumstantial. I make an argument based on pure military facts. The Amarr navy is the largest and most powerful navy in the galaxy (barring the Jove navy). If the republic navy would have had any chance it would have been forced to adopt guerilla tactics and the Amarr navy would have commenced orbital bombardments in order to crush ground resistance and draw the republic fleet out of hiding (basic Amarr tactics that have been used in pretty much every interstellar war so far. Quite successfully). Orbital bombardment is an ugly business. If the loss was the death of a former warhero turned rabid, internal conflict (which will die down. The matari militias are in spirit too loyal to truly defect over this, even if they will yell and wave their spears) and the loss of my position (or even my life) I would have done it myself if I had been in her shoes (with a matari mindset and the best interest of the matari people in mind). True leaders see beyond their own need and to the needs of the people they lead. Especially since, by common estimates, the republic fleet is growing quite fast. Quote: It is "basic" since it depends entirely on your partial interpretation of facts and circumstances you are no position to prove. No. It's basic because it's the truth, or at least a very good hypothesis. The Amarr navy was already sniffing around (you can't have missed the "dear" Admirals statements) and the conflict was escalating out of control. What would you have wanted her to do? The two other options in this case were "Sit and do nothing" or "throw her people into a war they cannot win". It's fine and dandy for the UK to sit and yell "war" when they have no soft targets to defend (planets that is) and a navy that could not hope to defend them even IF they could win in the long run. Overall you have given no alternate solutions, no alternate scenarios. Just ad hominem. It's getting old Jasmine Constantine. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 22:11:00 - [92] Nomakai, why are you objecting to people using arguments that may or may not be ad hominem when you use them yourself? Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel If you openly support a Star Fraction saving her(or was it his?) ship from certain defeat then you cannot condemn a head of state from saving her nation from certain defeat, because make no mistake the Republic fleet (as is) could never stand against the rebuilt and modernized Amarr navy. The above is a specimen example of ad hominem tu toque. You cannot have it both ways. If it is wrong for ad hominem arguments to be used against you, then it is wrong for you to rely on ad hominem arguments with respect to our positions. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 22:58:00 - [93] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 06/02/2007 22:55:31 Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel I make an argument based on pure military facts. The Amarr navy is the largest and most powerful navy in the galaxy (barring the Jove navy). The Amarr navy is an antiquated joke that will be annhiliated in contact with a modern military force many times smaller. (this is an opinion) ((just like yours)) - referring to your opinion as "fact" simply makes it pointless debating with you. Quote: No. It's basic because it's the truth, or at least a very good hypothesis. Blow your own trumpet much? (I suppose you have to, nobody else is going to) Quote: Overall you have given no alternate solutions, no alternate scenarios. Just ad hominem. It's getting old Jasmine Constantine. I thought we'd already discussed your critical misunderstanding of the ad hominen fallacy? If you are getting tired of getting whipped in debate you have my permission to withdraw. Star Fraction is recruiting
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 22:59:00 - [94] Edited by: Nomakai Delateriel on 06/02/2007 22:58:30 Originally by: The Cosmopolite The above is a specimen example of ad hominem tu toque. You cannot have it both ways. If it is wrong for ad hominem arguments to be used against you, then it is wrong for you to rely on ad hominem arguments with respect to our positions. The Cosmopolite Perhaps you are refering to "Ad Hominem tu quoque" (roughly translated as "argument against the man: You too") which is an irrelevant accusation of hypocrisy? To call it a Ad Hominem tu quoque (as in it's inconsistency version, not it's "two wrongs make a right") would maybe have been a valid complaint if it had been a debate over if it is right or wrong to sacrifice something small to save a greater value, but in this case it's a case where the Star fraction holds it to be right if a star fraction pilot does it and wether a "pro-imperialist" does a logicly and morally equivalent act. ...well my bad. I accused you of being hypocrits when you are instead holding double standards. We have two options. 1. It's wrong to sacrifice something smaller to save something larger, even if it's just to gain a short respite (in which case you're hypocrits). 2. It's right to sacrifice something smaller to save something larger, even if it's just to gain a short respite (in which case your critique is null and void). Star fraction makes a third (In my humble opinion, non-valid) choice. "It's wrong to sacrifice something smaller to save something larger, even if it's just to gain a short respite. Except if you're a star fraction pilot" So far me and Jasmine Constantine have been arguing over the validness of comparing paying a ransom to save a few thousand lives to sacrificing a life and your own career (and possibly your own life) in order to save a billion or more lives. Your problem with this comparison can't possibly be that it's always wrong to sacrifice a life to achieve a greater good, because then your whole ideological program of armed struggle becomes pretty much void. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 23:02:00 - [95] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel So far me and Jasmine Constantine Please, I think you mean Jasmine Constantine and I. (while we are being pedantic) Star Fraction is recruiting
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 23:07:00 - [96] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel So far me and Jasmine Constantine Please, I think you mean Jasmine Constantine and I. (while we are being pedantic) Ah, objective and nominative. I never seem to get it right since my native tongue uses the same word for both forms. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 23:11:00 - [97] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel So far me and Jasmine Constantine Please, I think you mean Jasmine Constantine and I. (while we are being pedantic) Ah, objective and nominative. I never seem to get it right since my native tongue uses the same word for both forms. Its an easy mistake to make, rather like passing off opinion as "fact". Star Fraction is recruiting
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.06 23:18:00 - [98] Edited by: The Cosmopolite on 06/02/2007 23:15:38 Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel To call it a Ad Hominem tu quoque (as in it's inconsistency version, not it's "two wrongs make a right") would maybe have been a valid complaint if it had been a debate over if it is right or wrong to sacrifice something small to save a greater value, but in this case it's a case where the Star fraction holds it to be right if a star fraction pilot does it and wether a "pro-imperialist" does a logicly and morally equivalent act. ...well my bad. I accused you of being hypocrits when you are instead holding double standards. No, you're wrong and you illustrate you're wrong by basing your argument on the fact that it is a Star Fraction pilot that holds a position. It is a case of ad hominem tu quoque because you are saying that our comments on the actions of the Republic's politicians are invalidated by your view that we have acted in a manner inconsistent with our position in a similar case that you have drawn attention to. Your argument is ad hominem. So are you right to use such an argument or not? If you are right to use ad hominem, why then are we wrong to use arguments that you say are ad hominem? Quote: So far me and Jasmine Constantine have been arguing over the validness of comparing paying a ransom to save a few thousand lives to sacrificing a life and your own career (and possibly your own life) in order to save a billion or more lives. Your problem with this comparison can't possibly be that it's always wrong to sacrifice a life to achieve a greater good, because then your whole ideological program of armed struggle becomes pretty much void. Oh... not at all! My problem with the argument you are using is that it is ad hominem. Your claim that we cannot criticise the Republic politicians rests entirely on an ad hominem argument using the comparison you have just admitted you are making very clearly. Yet, my only difficulty with that is that when our pilots reply in a manner you regard as ad hominem is when you start squealing that we are using invalid arguments. Double standards? Hypocrisy? Oh yes, plenty and from you. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.06 23:46:00 - [99] Originally by: The Cosmopolite No, you're wrong and you illustrate you're wrong by basing your argument on the fact that it is a Star Fraction pilot that holds a position. It is a case of ad hominem tu quoque because you are saying that our comments on the actions of the Republic's politicians are invalidated by your view that we have acted in a manner inconsistent with our position in a similar case that you have drawn attention to. To clarify my position. I am not saying that your arguments against the republic are invalid because you did an equivalent act. They're invalid because you made an (according to me) equivalent act and praised it as a morally laudable act! You didn't go "Our dreadnought was about to be destroyed and in a moment of weakness we ransomed it to save our precious crew. It was wrong, but we did it anyway". You said it was RIGHT to save your crew even if it meant giving a billion ISK to pirates, which was merely a temporary solution. That means that it's not ad hominem tu quoque and that makes your argument against the republic invalid. Even if you percieve the act of attempting to apprehend Muritor as kow-towing to the Amarr empire it's but a small sacrifice (one man, one renegade infact) to save a greater whole. And to Jasmine. I may remind you that many Amarr pod pilot corperations use only amarr equipment, yet they do well against the opposing minmatar militias, despite battles with numerically even odds. I would not say that the Amarr navy is an antiquated joke. They've introduced a large number of new ship classes since Vak'atioth (practicly only capital shipclasses and the ol' Augoror remain of the old fleet). ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 00:16:00 - [100] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel To clarify my position. I am not saying that your arguments against the republic are invalid because you did an equivalent act. They're invalid because you made an (according to me) equivalent act and praised it as a morally laudable act! You didn't go "Our dreadnought was about to be destroyed and in a moment of weakness we ransomed it to save our precious crew. It was wrong, but we did it anyway". You said it was RIGHT to save your crew even if it meant giving a billion ISK to pirates, which was merely a temporary solution. That means that it's not ad hominem tu quoque and that makes your argument against the republic invalid. Even if you percieve the act of attempting to apprehend Muritor as kow-towing to the Amarr empire it's but a small sacrifice (one man, one renegade infact) to save a greater whole. I'm afraid you are very confused. What you have just described is ad hominem tu quoque. Let me break it down for you as I think you are being misled by cutting and pasting too much from GalNet encylopedias. Ad hominem tu quoque is an argument that says that the position held by a given party is invalid because they have previously acted in a manner inconsistent with that position or they have made claims that are inconsistent with that position. Now, you say that our view that Tatsue Nuko was right to act as she did with respect to her ship and crew invalidates our argument that the Republic's politicians were wrong to sanction the assassination of Muritor. To be precise, you claim the following: The Star Fraction have carried out acts of the form X and have claimed they were right to carry out acts of the form X. The Star Fraction have criticised another party Y for carrying out acts of the form X. The Star Fraction's criticism of party Y is invalid because they have previously said it is right to carry out acts of the form X. In even simpler language you are saying: SF say X SF have previously made claims inconsistent with X SF's claim X is invalid That is ad hominem tu quoque. Indisputably. It is your argument and your claims, mind you. I do not agree with your argument at all. So, once again, are you right to use the ad hominem argument that you have and if so, why are we wrong to use arguments that you claim are ad hominem? The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.07 00:50:00 - [101] Edited by: Nomakai Delateriel on 07/02/2007 00:51:13 Originally by: The Cosmopolite SF say X SF have previously made claims inconsistent with X SF's claim X is invalid You misunderstand the argument Cosmopolite, either knowingly or otherwise. The argument is: X is "It's right to sacrifice something small to save something greater, even if it's just temporary given if my options improve so that perhaps I do not have to make a small sacrifice the next time" SF says Not X SF previously claimed X thus SF says X and Not X SF are logically inconsistent. Because SF are inconsistent in their statements of X and not-X I criticise SF for being inconsistent and I do not dismiss the validness of holding the opinion Not X. The argument is not about X but your double standards concerning X. What is it, X or not X? It's not Ad hominem tu quoque because I'm not claiming the validness or invalidness of X (actually I am claiming the validness of X according to my morals, but my argument for the validness of X do not involve SF or SFs stance pro or con X). In the case of UK they've constantly held the Not X opinion and I respect them for that even if I think that they're wrong. Or to translate it to regular speech. Were you wrong to ransom the dread or was Midular correct to attempt to arrest Muritor? Or if you wish to bug out you could always claim that the two situations are not equivalent like Jasmine was (between her insults against my wit, my prowess and my race). Now the success of that bug out would of course be up to the audience, because I don't view it as a viable alternative. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 00:54:00 - [102] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Originally by: The Cosmopolite SF say X SF have previously made claims inconsistent with X SF's claim X is invalid You misunderstand the argument Cosmopolite, either knowingly or otherwise. The argument is: SF says X SF previously claimed Not X thus SF says X and Not X SF are logically inconsistent. Because SF are inconsistent in their statements of X and not-X I criticise SF for being inconsistent and I do not dismiss the validness of holding the opinion Not X. The argument is not about X but your double standards concerning X. What is it, X or not X? It's not Ad hominem tu quoque because I'm not claiming the validness or invalidness of X (actually I am claiming the validness of X according to my morals, but my argument for the validness of X do not involve SF or SFs stance pro or con X). Or to translate it to regular speech. Were you wrong to ransom the dread or was Midular correct to attempt to arrest Muritor? Or if you wish to bug out you could always claim that the two situations are not equivalent like Jasmine was (between her insults against my wit, my prowess and my race). Now the success of that bug out would of course be up to the audience, because I don't view it as a viable alternative. Explain to me how paying off pirates to save a ship and crew is equivalent to executing a freedom fighter please.
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.07 00:57:00 - [103] Originally by: Nekumi Explain to me how paying off pirates to save a ship and crew is equivalent to executing a freedom fighter please. Because executing that "freedomfighter" (which just happens to be a republic navy defector and renegade. I wouldn't say terrorist since as far as I know he hasn't hit civilian targets, or has he?) possibly prevented a war that could have caused the death of billions of matari citizens? ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 01:02:00 - [104] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Originally by: Nekumi Explain to me how paying off pirates to save a ship and crew is equivalent to executing a freedom fighter please. Because executing that "freedomfighter" (which just happens to be a republic navy defector and renegade. I wouldn't say terrorist since as far as I know he hasn't hit civilian targets, or has he?) possibly prevented a war that could have caused the death of billions of matari citizens? Tatsue saved her crew, Midular doomed the Republic. One of these things is not like the other.
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.07 01:07:00 - [105] Originally by: Nekumi Tatsue saved her crew, Midular doomed the Republic. One of these things is not like the other. I have more faith in the republic than that. They may be the enemies of the empire, but you learn some respect when you fight them. They won't scatter over Muritor (unless I have hideously over-estimated them). They'll muck around for a while, depose Midular and go on. The other alternative was a ravaging Amarr warfleet putting one or more planets under orbital bombardment. Unless of course you hold the opinion that the Minmatar state is more powerful than the Amarr empire in open fleet combat? ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 01:08:00 - [106] Edited by: Nekumi on 07/02/2007 01:06:46 Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Originally by: Nekumi Tatsue saved her crew, Midular doomed the Republic. One of these things is not like the other. I have more faith in the republic than that. They may be the enemies of the empire, but you learn some respect when you fight them. They won't scatter over Muritor (unless I have hideously over-estimated them). They'll muck around for a while, depose Midular and go on. The other alternative was a ravaging Amarr warfleet putting one or more planets under orbital bombardment. Unless of course you hold the opinion that the Minmatar state is more powerful than the Amarr empire in open fleet combat? Hmm I fear I may have been too subtle. Fact: Tatsue did in fact save her crew. Opinion: The Republic is doomed. You think otherwise but that doesn't change the fact that fact does not equal opinion. Oh and on the subject of fleet power. If the Amarr are so overwhelmingly powerful, why is there a Minmatar Republic at all?
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.07 01:14:00 - [107] Originally by: Nekumi Opinion: The Republic is doomed. Oh and on the subject of fleet power. If the Amarr are so overwhelmingly powerful, why is there a Minmatar Republic at all? A. But didn't you think that the Republic was doomed BEFORE Midular came into power? B. Heiderans Pax Amarr still stands as the guiding directive for the empire and we're patient, we Amarr are very patient. Now if the new Emperor is Sarum or Ardishipaur then maybe things will work out differently but I wouldn't bet on it. Hah, the Pax Amarr might even become scripture. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 01:19:00 - [108] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Originally by: Nekumi Opinion: The Republic is doomed. Oh and on the subject of fleet power. If the Amarr are so overwhelmingly powerful, why is there a Minmatar Republic at all? A. But didn't you think that the Republic was doomed BEFORE Midular came into power? B. Heiderans Pax Amarr still stands as the guiding directive for the empire and we're patient, we Amarr are very patient. Now if the new Emperor is Sarum or Ardishipaur then maybe things will work out differently but I wouldn't bet on it. Hah, the Pax Amarr might even become scripture. A. Yes, but this event is a catalyst for this destruction and a good thing in my opinion. The Matari need to wake up before they fall into the same traps your people did. B. So the Amarr let them break away and are content for now with the seperation and in the meantime they'll add more words to their magic scrolls from God. Pardon me while I laugh for a while.
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.07 01:35:00 - [109] Originally by: Nekumi B. So the Amarr let them break away and are content for now with the seperation and in the meantime they'll add more words to their magic scrolls from God. Pardon me while I laugh for a while. Only a fool grabs onto more territory than he can hold. We lost it once and we'll make sure that if we necessarily have to conquer it again it will remain ours, even if we would happen to have a rebellion and our fleet decimated at the same time and closely following a defection by a large portion of our Empires military forces. Second, the scrolls are not magic. Only fools believe in magic. The scrolls are holy, with little special power except for their words which are just like all other words except that they are directives from God. And as for your final "point". I'm sure the Udorians laughed as well back in the days. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 01:51:00 - [110] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel If you openly support a Star Fraction saving her(or was it his?) ship from certain defeat then you cannot condemn a head of state from saving her nation from certain defeat, because make no mistake the Republic fleet (as is) could never stand against the rebuilt and modernized Amarr navy. Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel You misunderstand the argument Cosmopolite, either knowingly or otherwise. No I don't. Unless you are changing your argument. Above you say: SF cannot say X because SF have previously made claims inconsistent with X. So have you changed that view? If you haven't then you are holding a position that is based on ad hominem tu quoque. If you have, looks like you keep needing to shift your ground. Quote: The argument is: X is "It's right to sacrifice something small to save something greater, even if it's just temporary given if my options improve so that perhaps I do not have to make a small sacrifice the next time" SF says Not X SF previously claimed X thus SF says X and Not X SF are logically inconsistent. So, to be clear, you are not saying: Star Fraction cannot condemn a head of state from saving her nation from certain defeat if Star Fraction openly support a freecaptain saving her ship from certain defeat. That's not what you are saying? Is that right? Quote: Because SF are inconsistent in their statements of X and not-X I criticise SF for being inconsistent and I do not dismiss the validness of holding the opinion Not X. The argument is not about X but your double standards concerning X. So it has changed? Your argument, I mean? You do acknowledge that our view that our freecaptain was right to act as she did does not in any way preclude us from criticising the Republic? Quote: It's not Ad hominem tu quoque because I'm not claiming the validness or invalidness of X (actually I am claiming the validness of X according to my morals, but my argument for the validness of X do not involve SF or SFs stance pro or con X). Oh, I see. So, you don't regard the fact that it is an SF pilot that is criticising the Republic as relevant to the validity of the criticism? That's fine. So you are simply saying that Star Fraction are being logically inconsistent. I see. What relevance, may I ask, does your view that we are being logically inconsistent have to our criticisms of the Republic? Does the logical inconsistency you claim mean we cannot criticise the Republic? Does the logical inconsistency you claim mean our criticisms are invalid? No? Why then are you raising it? What purpose is served by it? You wish to claim that SF are logically inconsistent as an end in itself? Fine. We will simply disagree and argue otherwise. Quote: Or to translate it to regular speech. Were you wrong to ransom the dread or was Midular correct to attempt to arrest Muritor? I say 'no' to both. The two are not equivalent. Quote: Or if you wish to bug out you could always claim that the two situations are not equivalent like Jasmine was (between her insults against my wit, my prowess and my race). Now the success of that bug out would of course be up to the audience, because I don't view it as a viable alternative. Bug out? Bug out from what? You've just explained at length that your main argument is that we are logically inconsistent. So how is addressing your main argument 'bugging out'? You surely understand that as your new argument rests on your claim of equivalence it is precisely to the point to refute that equivalence as we do. Your original claim, above, was however that we could not make certain criticisms of Republic politicians because of a position we held earlier. You actually say this in clear, bald terms. That is ad hominem tu quoque. You are doing a fine job of wriggling on that hook, because you don't want to admit you are using ad hominem arguments, but it isn't very convincing overall. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 01:54:00 - [111] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Originally by: Nekumi B. So the Amarr let them break away and are content for now with the seperation and in the meantime they'll add more words to their magic scrolls from God. Pardon me while I laugh for a while. Only a fool grabs onto more territory than he can hold. We lost it once and we'll make sure that if we necessarily have to conquer it again it will remain ours, even if we would happen to have a rebellion and our fleet decimated at the same time and closely following a defection by a large portion of our Empires military forces. Second, the scrolls are not magic. Only fools believe in magic. The scrolls are holy, with little special power except for their words which are just like all other words except that they are directives from God. And as for your final "point". I'm sure the Udorians laughed as well back in the days. So the Amarr where fools for grabbing onto more territory than they could hold? Has anything changed in the Empire that make their goals for universal domination different, apart of course from their relative impotence now compared to the your golden age when all you had to contend with where the fledging cultures you formally subjugated. If your magic holy scrolls are directives from God, why are you considering it okay that they be added to with the writings of men? Isn't that heretical? You're not a very good Amarrian in the classical sense are you? Better watch out or you'll find yourself in a re-education centre soon.
Ashar KorAzor Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.07 04:50:00 - [112] Four pages of transmissions, pedantry, and petty argument over useless semantics. Is this how you're going to provide clone access to every man, woman, and child in the cluster? Come on, we've got better things to do than argue all day.
Azure Skyclad Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 07:33:00 - [113] Edited by: Azure Skyclad on 07/02/2007 07:32:44 Originally by: Ashar KorAzor Four pages of transmissions, pedantry, and petty argument over useless semantics. Is this how you're going to provide clone access to every man, woman, and child in the cluster? Come on, we've got better things to do than argue all day. Apparently not. Dear oh dear. Edit: I was present at the events in question. I'm not going to put my point of view across so it can be treated to the same microscopic analysis that has taken place here. Lets just say i know what happened. SSoE didn't get shot at. Mordu's chappie did. http://www.voodoorockers.co.uk/
Vaslav Tchitcherine Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 08:00:00 - [114] Originally by: Azure Skyclad Lets just say i know what happened. SSoE didn't get shot at. Mordu's chappie did. Enough of your calm reason and concise summation, terrorist scum! Begone from this summit! Besides, you made a spelling mistake somewhere. I assume. Otherwise why would be posting? Star Fraction recruitment: come join the Yarrletariat!
Masri Minoti Sisters of EVE	Posted - 2007.02.07 14:39:00 - [115] Now I am getting rather tired of Star Fractions harassment and lies. Yes lies. I have reviewed all the logs from the other night, both comms, both ship and gate sensor logs as well as combat logs. First lets address this issue of standings. I am in a position to give you an answer, but I won't, the reason is that the fact is Star Fraction are looking for a reason to justify their attacks upon the servant sisters of Eve. Sister Rhayne was right not to give Jade and the others who constantly badgered her in to give an answer as she was not and is not in a position to make that decision plus if she did the great star Fraction Spin machine would go into action slinging out half truths and lies hidden within confusing statements along with the normal amount of arrogance and selectivememory that they use to skip over issues and holes in their statements. Now for the other night and the the more important lie.. What Jasmine fails to tell you is the actions taken by star fraction.. This started off with them harassing poor Sister Rhayne in our public channel, this was followed by Star Fraction pilots ramming the SOE ships, as well as constantly locking their ships and making aggressive manoeuvres towards them. A number of jumps later, Star fraction made an unprovoked attack on the SSoE convoy by using a interdictor to prevent Sister Rhayne from warping and force the escort ships to engage them so they could claim to be the victims, Sister Rhayne's ship cloaked before she could be locked and got herself out of the interdiction bubble while her escort engaged the Star Fractions ships. Its also worth pointing out that Star fraction planned this as they had their ships in position ahead of the convoy while Cosmopolite shadowed it. So as you can see they indeed started the conflict, and it seems their so called rules of engagement are nothing but a farce as they attacked the neutral escort. And now we see they are still wanting the SSoE to set them at -10. Its getting to the point they are begging for us to set them to -10, so that they will be able to declare that they are simply responding to our standings change and have justification in their twisted minds to seek out and destroy our ships with impunity. I'm sorry but we will not be intimidated by the threats from Star Fraction, and we will not sit back and listen to blatant lies that they are spewing forth.
Tareen Kashaar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 15:18:00 - [116] I'm sorry Masri, but you are mistaken about our intentions. A simple "No, we do not regard the Star Fraction as enemies" from Sister Rhayne would have resolved the matter. Instead, she chose to act as if we had hostile intentions, which naturally led us to believe that the Sisters of EVE indeed regard us as hostiles. Our goal is not war, and certainly not indiscriminate violence and destruction of innocents. We do however defend our interests against anyone who in words and actions seeks to oppress them. Sister Rhayne should have known as much, and acted less provoking. --- WTS: Forum Signatures, 30mil a piece. Evemail me!
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 15:51:00 - [117] Where do I start? Originally by: Masri Minoti Now I am getting rather tired of Star Fractions harassment and lies. Yes lies. I have reviewed all the logs from the other night, both comms, both ship and gate sensor logs as well as combat logs. I have also reviewed the comms and logs from that evening including combat logs - SSOE channel logs, Secret SSOE channel logs, and the gang logs from SF fleet personnel posted on our internal forums. And I do conclude that you are lying too Masri Minoti - alongside Sister Rhaynes you have also come here to tell lies about the Star Fraction. I wonder if we can tell why? Quote: First lets address this issue of standings. I am in a position to give you an answer, but I won't, the reason is that the fact is Star Fraction are looking for a reason to justify their attacks upon the servant sisters of Eve. Why not? Why won't you tell us if you have set us to -10 and are encouraging people who join your escort gangs to shoot us? Why won't you publicly make that statement? I think the reason is that you (rightly) fear we'll set you hostile immediately and engage your shipping. So you clearly prefer to set capsule-pilot levies against us as proxies for your own hostility. This is not the behaviour of a creditable humanitarian aid operation and neither do the lies you have given us here bring respect to your name. Quote: Sister Rhayne was right not to give Jade and the others who constantly badgered her in to give an answer as she was not and is not in a position to make that decision plus if she did the great star Fraction Spin machine would go into action slinging out half truths and lies hidden within confusing statements along with the normal amount of arrogance and selectivememory that they use to skip over issues and holes in their statements. So behind all those slurred accusations that sound (may I say) almost precisely like our usual forum critics in a Sisters of Eve gloss. What you are saying is that if Sister Rhayne actually told an organisation you have set to -10 that it was set to -10 you might risk being shot at? Is that what you telling me? Because if you haven't set us to -10 then why not just tell us and the whole problem goes away? Why keep up this charade and keep hiring uninvolved capsule pilots for "convoys" and setting them up to fight us? Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 16:05:00 - [118] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 07/02/2007 16:02:03 Originally by: Masri Minoti Now for the other night and the the more important lie.. Yes it was an important lie. And the important lie was yours Masri Minoti. Quote: What Jasmine fails to tell you is the actions taken by star fraction.. This started off with them harassing poor Sister Rhayne in our public channel I am going to post the logs of this alleged "harrassment" and you will see it is nothing other than SF diplomats asking for an answer on the diplomatic issue and SOE personnel avoiding answering. Quote: this was followed by Star Fraction pilots ramming the SOE ships, as well as constantly locking their ships and making aggressive manoeuvres towards them. Aggressive Manoeuvres? In hi-sec? With concord intervention the result of any action? Ridiculous allegation of the sort that combat logs cannot show. Thus an ideal and fertile ground for unsupported slander. Ironic indeed that the one solid article of proof for this behaviour comes from the side of Sister Rhayne's own convoy member: [ 2007.02.06 02:26:41 ] DJ Obsidian > lets go bump star faction out of the way [ 2007.02.06 02:27:21 ] Chekin > suicide smartbomber would do Tongue [ 2007.02.06 02:27:37 ] DJ Obsidian > EVERYONE [ 2007.02.06 02:27:43 ] DJ Obsidian > BUMP STarfaction [ 2007.02.06 02:29:34 ] DJ Obsidian > got them [ 2007.02.06 02:29:39 ] DJ Obsidian > sister [ 2007.02.06 02:29:52 ] DJ Obsidian > if you can run do it now my fighter is disrupting their formation Inconvenient how solid communication logs contradict your testimony isn't it Masri Minoti? Quote: number of jumps later, Star fraction made an unprovoked attack on the SSoE convoy by using a interdictor to prevent Sister Rhayne from warping and force the escort ships to engage them so they could claim to be the victims, Sister Rhayne's ship cloaked before she could be locked and got herself out of the interdiction bubble while her escort engaged the Star Fractions ships. This entire incident is fiction. There was no fight between the Star Fraction combat wing and Sister Rhayne's convoy escort. What happened is that the SF had deployed an interdictor bubble in Pureblind against -10 war enemies and when the Sister and her escort jumped into the bubble none of them were harmed in any way. No weapons exchanged - no hostility either. Sister Rhaynes and her party were allowed to exit the bubble without incident. I challenge you to provide combat logs of SF vessels attacking SOE escort ships. I know you cannot do this. Hence you are a proven liar Masri Minoti. What happened next however is supported by combat logs and we can certainly prove it. A Star Fraction Interdictor class vessel jumped ahead of our fleet into X-7O system and found a large hostile fleet from Band of Brothers in system. Warning the SF fleet of this presence our vessel noted one of the SOE convoy escorts arriving in a thorax class ship and ignored it since it was currently tagged "neutral". The Thorax Cruiser locked our interdictor and opened fire. We have weapon impact logs of this event and can publish them. This is unilaternal aggression from the SOE convoy and it was answered by the deployment of an emergency indictor bubble and withdrawl of the SF craft. Quote: So as you can see they indeed started the conflict, and it seems their so called rules of engagement are nothing but a farce as they attacked the neutral escort. You are lying and we can prove it. You have nothing but slander and falsehood to support your lie. Show us combat logs of SF vessels engaging your escort fleet prior to your fleet attacking our ship or admit you are a liar. Quote: so that they will be able to declare that they are simply responding to our standings change and have justification in their twisted minds to seek out and destroy our ships with impunity. While at the moment you prefer to sponsor univolved 3rd parties to attack our shipping while hiding a secret hostile standing? Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 16:22:00 - [119] And now to the alleged "harrassment" in the SOE public channel. (this from SF diplomatic logs from our forum) [ 2007.02.06 01:43:52 ] DJ Obsidian > Sister Rhayne im am calling out for forces to help us [ 2007.02.06 01:44:12 ] Seeker Lillandra > Sister, there is a blokade in EC-P8R [ 2007.02.06 01:44:31 ] El Filibustero > a warp bubble-type of a blockade? [ 2007.02.06 01:44:40 ] Sister Rhayne > /emote pouts with a slight frown. [ 2007.02.06 01:44:40 ] Seeker Lillandra > They almost got me in my Helios. [ 2007.02.06 01:44:58 ] Sister Rhayne > They cannot be reasoned with, then? [ 2007.02.06 01:45:20 ] Jade Constantine > might I ask the corp/alliance affilitation of the blockade ? [ 2007.02.06 01:45:26 ] Seeker Lillandra > I will speak to them, and see if they can help. [ 2007.02.06 01:46:46 ] Sister Rhayne > Miss Constantine, I'm afraid that I am going to have to ask you to leave after your actions with our last convoy. [ 2007.02.06 01:46:49 ] Poslen > surely they will see reason and understand the gravity of this mission? [ 2007.02.06 01:47:15 ] Sister Rhayne > The same goes for all members of the Star Fraction alliance. [ 2007.02.06 01:47:19 ] Jade Constantine > Can you clarify something for us ? [ 2007.02.06 01:47:25 ] Chekin > Can someone give me an up date here? [ 2007.02.06 01:47:28 ] Selim > You'll have to forcibly remove me, Sister. [ 2007.02.06 01:47:36 ] Jade Constantine > have SOE actually set Star Fraction alliance to -10 at this moment? [ 2007.02.06 01:48:35 ] Sister Rhayne > That can be arranged, Selim, althought it pains me to have to do so. [ 2007.02.06 01:48:54 ] Jade Constantine > can you answer my question explicitly please? [ 2007.02.06 01:48:59 ] Sakura Nihil > Are we or are we not -10? [ 2007.02.06 01:49:02 ] Troye > I wouldnt blame anyone for wanting to attack SOE and destroy the corpse for fear of further contamination [ 2007.02.06 01:49:27 ] Poslen > This corpse may be the key to a anti-virus [ 2007.02.06 01:49:32 ] Poslen > it must be studied [ 2007.02.06 01:49:47 ] Killiana Lett > I agree with Poslen here. [ 2007.02.06 01:49:58 ] Daran Hudson > Yup [ 2007.02.06 01:50:09 ] Poslen > and a vaccine discovered to prevent any sort of future outbreaks [ 2007.02.06 01:50:29 ] Daran Hudson > And besides, the virus ain't gonna spread in space [ 2007.02.06 01:50:46 ] Jade Constantine > it is a very straightforward question Sister Rhayne [ 2007.02.06 01:50:51 ] El Filibustero > you've never seen micropbacteria in asteroids? [ 2007.02.06 01:50:52 ] Killiana Lett > especially considering that symtoms of the virus can be easily detected as stated in the news. [ 2007.02.06 01:51:10 ] Poslen > there is no telling how many people could have been exposed before quarantine was established [ 2007.02.06 01:51:24 ] Daran Hudson > Well, of course, if someone shoots the body and vaporize it... then maybe we're in trouble [ 2007.02.06 01:52:08 ] Draegar Bane > as long as your shields are up the virus should not be able to penetrate your ship [ 2007.02.06 01:52:32 ] Poslen > unless u dock and then become exposed [ 2007.02.06 01:52:40 ] Nalya Nephilim > Well I guess the SSoE have choosen their allies between the Star Fraction and the Mordu legion, I can't say saddend to see it turned out this way but I just hope you have deep pocket to keep those mercenary dogs on your side [ 2007.02.06 01:54:23 ] Jade Constantine > The sister hasn't yet answered the question - perhaps she is checking with her superiors? [ 2007.02.06 01:55:17 ] Sister Rhayne > Yes, I have been. [ 2007.02.06 01:55:21 ] Troye > perhaps she has better things to attend to right now than your corps standings? [ 2007.02.06 01:55:46 ] Jade Constantine > well then Sister, perhaps you can now answer my question ? [ 2007.02.06 01:55:57 ] Sister Rhayne > Jade, it sounds to me that you are looking for an excuse to attack the Servant Sisters of Eve and I won't allow myself to fall victim to your spin tactics. Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 16:23:00 - [120] [ 2007.02.06 01:56:13 ] Jade Constantine > its a simple question [ 2007.02.06 01:56:22 ] Jade Constantine > and one triggered by your own statements [ 2007.02.06 01:56:25 ] Sister Rhayne > Our standings are an internal matter, and since we do not mantain an active combat fleet it should not concern you. [ 2007.02.06 01:56:33 ] Jade Constantine > yet it does [ 2007.02.06 01:56:41 ] Daran Hudson > Er... Sorry to interrupt you two cuties, but where do we go ? [ 2007.02.06 01:56:49 ] Jade Constantine > and its my job to decide what concerns us and what does not sister Rhayne [ 2007.02.06 01:56:58 ] Sister Rhayne > Stacmon V - Impro Factory please. [ 2007.02.06 01:57:24 ] Daran Hudson > 'Xcellent [ 2007.02.06 01:57:30 ] Killiana Lett > Is that station safe to dock at, as in, has the virus been contained? [ 2007.02.06 01:57:43 ] El Filibustero > event going on now [ 2007.02.06 01:58:20 ] Jade Constantine > perhaps it might be an idea if I spoke to your superior directly Sister Rhayne since it appears you are unused to matters of diplomacy ? [ 2007.02.06 01:59:10 ] Killiana Lett > Perhaps the Sister has already spoken. [ 2007.02.06 01:59:17 ] Sister Rhayne > You have our answer, Miss Constantine. I suggest you accept that, we do not deal with terrorists and pirates. [ 2007.02.06 01:59:32 ] Jade Constantine > we have no answer - you have failed to provide one [ 2007.02.06 01:59:50 ] Jade Constantine > I asked you an explicit question Sister Rhaynes and you have replied with misdirection and evasion [ 2007.02.06 02:00:01 ] Jade Constantine > makes me wonder if you have your own agenda here [ 2007.02.06 02:00:10 ] Killiana Lett > Sounds like she is well versed in diplomacy then. [ 2007.02.06 02:00:18 ] Isean > Sister, it may be best not to accept help from a person of such antagonistic attitude. [ 2007.02.06 02:01:11 ] Jade Constantine > I think Isean, you mistake our intent - whether or not we help or hinder this operation will depend entirely on the SOE diplomatic representations to the Star Fraction from this point [ 2007.02.06 02:01:13 ] Sister Rhayne > I had no intention of accepting their help, as they fired upon my last convoy. [ 2007.02.06 02:01:31 ] Troye > I am somewhat out of the way from empire right now, do we have a definate departure time? [ 2007.02.06 02:01:35 ] Jade Constantine > your mercenaries you mean ? [ 2007.02.06 02:01:51 ] Jade Constantine > Mordu's Legionaires whom have expressed hostility to us for the past year [ 2007.02.06 02:02:02 ] Jade Constantine > your lies are a little transparent Sister Rhayne [ 2007.02.06 02:02:26 ] Jade Constantine > it might be a good idea for your to request replacement before you damage the SOE interests further [ 2007.02.06 02:03:12 ] Draegar Bane > why jade would you fire on her convoy? [ 2007.02.06 02:03:26 ] Jade Constantine > we fired on a Mordu's Legionaire vessel [ 2007.02.06 02:03:31 ] Isoc Krell > Hi! [ 2007.02.06 02:03:34 ] Jade Constantine > after he refused to withdraw [ 2007.02.06 02:03:41 ] Jade Constantine > Mordu Legion are enemies of the SF [ 2007.02.06 02:03:42 ] Isoc Krell > I'm ready to lose another ship! [ 2007.02.06 02:03:56 ] Jade Constantine > the science vessels were entirely untouched [ 2007.02.06 02:04:04 ] Killiana Lett > Yet they were on a mission of mercy? [ 2007.02.06 02:04:37 ] DJ Obsidian > isoc be warned i think we are going to 0.0 you may lose it all out there this time [ 2007.02.06 02:04:49 ] Jade Constantine > the sisters may have been Killana [ 2007.02.06 02:04:54 ] El Filibustero > /emote has been to 0.0 before... just more space, shrugs. [ 2007.02.06 02:04:57 ] Jade Constantine > yet Mordus Legion are a malign organisation [ 2007.02.06 02:04:58 ] Sakura Nihil > The sisters were untouched. [ 2007.02.06 02:05:02 ] Draegar Bane > so you destory the escort sparing the science vessels so your guilt is free... yet leaving a science vessel unprotected is in itself a death sentence Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 16:24:00 - [121] [ 2007.02.06 02:05:13 ] Jade Constantine > /emote laughs [ 2007.02.06 02:05:15 ] Sister Rhayne > I find it disturbing that instead of attempting to rectify this situation or to express mourning for the many lives lost, you instead come to demand informatino from me. [ 2007.02.06 02:05:36 ] Isean > Even if it was a convoy dispatched by Mordu's Legion, it was intended as a relief escort, anything attached to that detail would then be a ship related to the relief effort. That would means hands off in most cases. [ 2007.02.06 02:05:36 ] Jade Constantine > we had already slain the hostiles threatening the science convoy Draegar [ 2007.02.06 02:05:48 ] Sakura Nihil > You hired them, they knew the risks of the job. [ 2007.02.06 02:06:20 ] Jade Constantine > And sister ... since you have slandered us in the galactic news it very much falls upon yourself to rectify this situation with a full and formal apology [ 2007.02.06 02:06:56 ] Isean > An apology for your attack? That sounds a bit unhinged. [ 2007.02.06 02:07:07 ] Sakura Nihil > We did not fire on the SOE. Period. [ 2007.02.06 02:07:08 ] Daran Hudson > What do you expect from anarchists anyway ? [ 2007.02.06 02:07:27 ] Sister Rhayne > I have only spoken truthfully of your actions. If you find such words slanderous, you should seek to change your actions, not change the perception of the universe around you. [ 2007.02.06 02:07:28 ] Jade Constantine > an apology for the lies told about the past enagement Isean [ 2007.02.06 02:07:30 ] Isoc Krell > Sorry about the outburst just now. Somebody mind filling me in on what's going on? [ 2007.02.06 02:08:03 ] Jade Constantine > You have lied outrageously Sister Rhayne and been revealed as a liar by my alliance mates publicly [ 2007.02.06 02:08:08 ] DJ Obsidian > chick fight [ 2007.02.06 02:08:11 ] Jade Constantine > the question now [ 2007.02.06 02:08:24 ] Jade Constantine > is if your own interests and motives are going to endanger the Sisters of Eve [ 2007.02.06 02:08:31 ] The Cosmopolite > Sister Rhayne > "itÆs even harder to imagine capsuleers preventing help from arriving" [ 2007.02.06 02:08:33 ] Jade Constantine > is your poisonous pride worth so much? [ 2007.02.06 02:08:43 ] The Cosmopolite > That is a lie. Straighforwardly, a lie. [ 2007.02.06 02:09:51 ] Daran Hudson > We weren't trying to delay anything, we were just trying to destroy the escort of a 0.0 convoy... sure [ 2007.02.06 02:09:56 ] Seeker Lillandra > /emote scoffs [ 2007.02.06 02:10:10 ] Sister Rhayne > /emote sighs despondantly. [ 2007.02.06 02:10:16 ] Jade Constantine > rather than scoffing you might try answering our questions [ 2007.02.06 02:10:29 ] Seeker Lillandra > These people try to help a humanitarian mission, and you block it? [ 2007.02.06 02:10:31 ] Jade Constantine > at the moment your arrogance is damaging your orders reputation [ 2007.02.06 02:10:37 ] DJ Obsidian > Rhayne my incursus is at yoru disposal... [ 2007.02.06 02:10:45 ] Seeker Lillandra > /emote shakes her head. [ 2007.02.06 02:10:49 ] Sister Rhayne > Thank you Obsidian, I am still in Stacmon. [ 2007.02.06 02:10:59 ] The Cosmopolite > We blocked nothing. [ 2007.02.06 02:11:05 ] Sakura Nihil > We killed no Sisters. [ 2007.02.06 02:11:07 ] El Filibustero > stacmon in 6 hops for me [ 2007.02.06 02:11:08 ] The Cosmopolite > We in fact destroyed a MEDUS Rokh. [ 2007.02.06 02:11:18 ] Jade Constantine > and yet we were lied about [ 2007.02.06 02:11:21 ] Sister Rhayne > My ship and crew has been cleared from quarantine, and we have been permited to leave with one fo the bodies we recovered from the outpost for our own study. [ 2007.02.06 02:11:35 ] DJ Obsidian > (( sorry guys this is an alt...... my main has no jump clone yet)) [ 2007.02.06 02:11:41 ] The Cosmopolite > A fact conveniently left out of Rhayne's account to the news reporter. [ 2007.02.06 02:12:19 ] Jade Constantine > now Star Fraction is recruiting
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 16:25:00 - [122] [ 2007.02.06 02:12:31 ] Jade Constantine > these were your words Sister Rhayne: [ 2007.02.06 02:12:34 ] Jade Constantine > "ôFrom now on you will be considered enemies of the Servant Sisters of EVE.ö [ 2007.02.06 02:12:41 ] Jade Constantine > do you stand by them? [ 2007.02.06 02:12:47 ] DJ Obsidian > jade dont be a *****........ [ 2007.02.06 02:12:48 ] Isoc Krell > Hoboy. Now we get to carry the mysterious disease to the entire galaxy. [ 2007.02.06 02:13:07 ] Draegar Bane > well thats just rude obsidian [ 2007.02.06 02:13:07 ] Sakura Nihil > Smooth DJ. [ 2007.02.06 02:13:22 ] Isoc Krell > Not only am I going to get podded, or worse, this time, I'm also going to help spread an intergalactic plague. [ 2007.02.06 02:13:24 ] Sister Rhayne > Isoc, the pathogens are dead, they have been dead since before we even recovered them from the site. [ 2007.02.06 02:13:36 ] Isoc Krell > Oh. Good to know. [ 2007.02.06 02:13:37 ] Isean > Even an arrogant humanitarian assosciation is still humanitarian [ 2007.02.06 02:13:45 ] DJ Obsidian > pfft dont really care....... i am reporting this to the alliances as we speak [ 2007.02.06 02:13:51 ] Jade Constantine > its a simple question - yet it seems impossible for her to answer [ 2007.02.06 02:13:54 ] Sister Rhayne > We have determined that there is no danger of contamination, we are only going to do further study. [ 2007.02.06 02:13:55 ] DJ Obsidian > im a reporter long before im a fighter [ 2007.02.06 02:14:16 ] Sakura Nihil > An impartial reporter you are. [ 2007.02.06 02:14:32 ] Isoc Krell > So, as a latecomer, I feel the urge to ask what in God's name is going on here. [ 2007.02.06 02:14:48 ] DJ Obsidian > jade is attacking SOE pretty much [ 2007.02.06 02:14:54 ] Jade Constantine > Sister Rhayne is proving herself incapable of answering questions [ 2007.02.06 02:15:03 ] Sakura Nihil > For crying out loud, do some research before you throw allegations out. [ 2007.02.06 02:15:05 ] Jade Constantine > and DJ Obsidian is showing his lack of class [ 2007.02.06 02:15:16 ] Isean > You must be another capsuleer who ignores the billboards and news Isoc. [ 2007.02.06 02:15:18 ] Celedris > and objectivity [ 2007.02.06 02:15:22 ] Draegar Bane > the sister answered your questions... she just didnt tell you what you wanted to hear [ 2007.02.06 02:15:32 ] Jade Constantine > she answered no question I asked [ 2007.02.06 02:15:39 ] Isoc Krell > Oh! New news! [ 2007.02.06 02:15:43 ] Draegar Bane > so now your badgering her until she tells you what you want to hear.. which i would venture to say ... wont happen [ 2007.02.06 02:15:51 ] DJ Obsidian > ha! class is overrated you know this. theres no time for class when it comes to survival... and i will see that disease reseachered because i dont want to die from it [ 2007.02.06 02:15:55 ] Sakura Nihil > They did a convoy a while back, and used Mordus as escort. We encountered hostiles and killed them, and then turned on the Mordus who are set -10. The sisters were left unharmed. [ 2007.02.06 02:16:07 ] Sakura Nihil > Get your facts straight, we don't attack neutrals. [ 2007.02.06 02:16:10 ] Jade Constantine > and yet [ 2007.02.06 02:16:13 ] Isoc Krell > I didn't notice. I thought the latest news was still the Minmatar politicians calling the Amarr a bunch of blubbering vaginas. [ 2007.02.06 02:16:19 ] Jade Constantine > Sister Rhatne saw fit to state: [ 2007.02.06 02:16:21 ] Sakura Nihil > The question is, are SOE going to fire on us in their arrogance? [ 2007.02.06 02:16:21 ] Jade Constantine > ôFrom now on you will be considered enemies of the Servant Sisters of EVE.ö [ 2007.02.06 02:16:28 ] Jade Constantine > and so I ask : [ 2007.02.06 02:16:34 ] Isoc Krell > DJ Obsidian and I hang out a lot. I'll bet you couldn't tell. [ 2007.02.06 02:16:34 ] Jade Constantine > have the SOE set SF to -10 [ 2007.02.06 02:16:40 ] Jade Constantine > because if the answer is "yes" Star Fraction is recruiting
Sakura Nihil Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 16:53:00 - [123] I've said this before and I'll say it again - when you hire mercs, don't expect them to get off scot-free for their past actions because they are under the so-called umbrella of a humanitarian mission. We had the option to shoot the Mordus pilot at first sight, but we gave him significant leeway by warning him to leave the area, knowing our rules of engagement prohibited us from shooting any neutrals including SOE - he refused and was destroyed. You then claimed he was part of an SOE convoy and that we had directly attacked you, despite the fact that no Sisters or their ships were harmed. Then, when we try to clarify our diplomatic standings after the incident, and even consider escorting you to your destination if indeed that was just an tense moment that wouldn't influence the our relationship. Instead, we are blocked and evaded at every turn by your representative, who painted us as a hostile force that would destroy them, one that was "unable to be reasoned with". In the encounters we had with you and your escort in low security space and nullsec, we had multiple opportunities to engage and destroy you, but note how we didn't? A bit odd for an unreasonable organization wouldn't you say?
Khavi Vetali Team Americas Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.02.07 17:02:00 - [124] Edited by: Khavi Vetali on 07/02/2007 17:03:32 With the SoE "Official" reply and the actual sequence of events during the second SoE incident, their organization is becoming less and less reputable in my eyes. Deliberately giving misleading accounts about Fraction behavior and well, blatantly lying about the events that transpired is pretty damning. How can SoE claim that SF engaged SoE escorts and SoE a second time, when it was quite obviously Band of Brothers. It's common knowledge that the SoE convoy was attacked by that gate camp, not the Fraction. Admittedly, Star Fraction aggression during the first encounter could be seen as callous and stubborn, even if it was following their strict RoE, but now? SoE has repeatedly attempted to convince the capsuleer community that they are in the right, while being unable to provide any evidence for their accusations against SF. Spreading known falsehoods doesn't help either. If you are going to claim someone is lying, at least make an attempt to back up those claims, with evidence, testimony....something. The actions of the Sisters of Eve during these recent events has me questioning their competence, motivations, and character. Originally by: Itanis "Hello there mate, I'm dreadfully sorry, but I'm going to have to sodomize you with howitzers. Have a lovely day!"
Svenjabi Xiang Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 17:05:00 - [125] Perhaps this is jumping into this after the fact, but as a participant in the initial situation, I think a fact has been lost that needs be brought out. Following the engagement of the Mordus pilot, we did escort the sister's mission to safety in a nearby station. We did not have to do this but we did in the attempt, be it whatever it has become, to ensure that the sister's mission was escorted in safety after our removal of the Mordus pilot. There was certainly no one in the system capable of withstanding us had our decision been to eliminate the sister's mission. That alone should have demonstrated that our intent was not to harm SSoE but instead to engage a particular pilot in terms of our RoE. It was not SF's intent to hamper SSoE, no matter what spin may being put on it now.
Kovid Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 17:39:00 - [126] Edited by: Kovid on 07/02/2007 17:35:52 I am merely curious. Might I request records of SSoE convoy destiantions in the past year? I also would like to find records of Amarr slave raids in the past year. ---------------------------------- An informal Star Fraction FAQ \| ----------------------------------
Devilish Ledoux Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 17:42:00 - [127] Personally, I have always admired the work of the Servant Sisters of Eve. I have even worked with them in the past, hunting minor pirates and freeing slaves, even going so far as to attack and destroy a flotilla of Caldari Navy vessels who were defending an Amarrian slave collection site. It is this incident that led me to sever many of my ties with the State. However, it is obvious that individual members of the SSoE do not hold my comrades in high regard. That is fine by me. I don't go through life seeking approval. The Star Fraction Free Captains have requested the answer to a question: "Excluding actions taken in self-defense, do the current Rules of Engagement of the Servant Sisters of Eve authorize their combat pilots to attack pilots of the Star Fraction?" We are not asking them to state that they are either our friends OR our enemies, with no middle ground. We are simply asking if they are our enemies. It is also important to note that we are willing to assume that any answer they give us will be truthful. If the answer to this question is no (and I truly hope that it is), then this is a non-issue. In short we would continue to list the Sisters as a neutral organization and will refrain from attacking thier pilots, except in self-defense. Masri Minoti, whom I can only assume speaks for the SSoE in an official capacity (since she neglected to state her position, it is entirely possible that she is merely an employee of the SoE with no authority to respond) has refused to answer the question. I wish I knew what was in her agenda that has led her to a point where she will not confirm or deny that her comrades are willing to attack mine. Whatever it is, it can't be good. In short, all the SSoE has to say is, "We will not attack you, unless you attack us." Considering their mission, I see no reason why this is such a difficult statement to make. _
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 19:00:00 - [128] Originally by: Khavi Vetali The actions of the Sisters of Eve during these recent events has me questioning their competence, motivations, and character. This is my abiding thought too. I cannot see the traditional reputation of the Sisters of Eve reflected in the words of their representatives here. Humanitarian relief workers do not smear and spin lies in this manner. I think there is something rotten in the heart of the Sisterhood coming to light. Star Fraction is recruiting
Darina Rea	Posted - 2007.02.07 19:36:00 - [129] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Humanitarian relief workers do not smear and spin lies in this manner. They remind you of yourself? _________ Time is on our side.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 20:09:00 - [130] Originally by: Darina Rea Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Humanitarian relief workers do not smear and spin lies in this manner. They remind you of yourself? Hardly. We make no secret of the people we set to -10. Your attempted slur is as impotent as your in-space ability. Star Fraction is recruiting
Kunte Kinte	Posted - 2007.02.07 21:45:00 - [131] Quote: [ 2007.02.06 02:10:31 ] Jade Constantine > at the moment your arrogance is damaging your orders reputation. Compared to the reputation of the star fraction guild I do not think the sisters have anything to worry about; maybe you should just tell sister to wardec or stfu. KK
Kunte Kinte	Posted - 2007.02.07 21:55:00 - [132] Quote: [ 2007.02.06 01:55:57 ] Sister Rhayne > Jade, it sounds to me that you are looking for an excuse to attack the Servant Sisters of Eve and I won't allow myself to fall victim to your spin tactics. The star fraction guild wants sister to be the bad one so they have excuse to attack them they just like war with weaker enemy so they can get big victory; the star fraction guild are pirates they fly with them and fight with them; you said mercenary can not be forgiven after a year but star fraction fighting with pirates do you expect to be forgived; Do not even talk to star fraction guild pilots they will try to trick you then use what you say as excuse to attack you sister is right they are spin tactic experts. KK
Heero Yuy Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 22:03:00 - [133] While it is tempting to simply give in to the sheer eloquence of your post, how about providing some examples and evidence to back up your allegations? _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Bacchanalian Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 22:19:00 - [134] Edited by: Bacchanalian on 07/02/2007 22:15:57 Originally by: Kunte Kinte The star fraction guild wants sister to be the bad one so they have excuse to attack them they just like war with weaker enemy so they can get big victory Speaking for myself, I would personally like nothing more than for the Sister to give a clear, simple answer, indicating that the SSoE do not in fact consider us enemies and that Star Fraction maintains a neutral standing with them. That would, in my view, put this mess mostly to bed. Instead, I see a worrisome tendency from the SSoE representatives to say anything but those words, and it makes me sad to ponder the possible reasons for not uttering them. What possible motivations can SSoE have to continue to drag this dispute out if ending it is so simple? Star Fraction is recruiting, join the revolution!
K'srah Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.07 22:23:00 - [135] Originally by: Bacchanalian Speaking for myself, I would personally like nothing more than for the Sister to give a clear, simple answer, indicating that the SSoE do not in fact consider us enemies and that Star Fraction maintains a neutral standing with them. That would, in my view, put this mess mostly to bed. Step into my parlor, said the spider to the fly.
Atandros Gallente Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 22:40:00 - [136] Originally by: K'srah Originally by: Bacchanalian Speaking for myself, I would personally like nothing more than for the Sister to give a clear, simple answer, indicating that the SSoE do not in fact consider us enemies and that Star Fraction maintains a neutral standing with them. That would, in my view, put this mess mostly to bed. Step into my parlor, said the spider to the fly. Well, this is quite fascinating indeed. So, what exactly do you believe we would do to SOE if they confirmed they don't have us KOS (not to mention why)? -------
K'srah Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.07 22:56:00 - [137] Originally by: Atandros Originally by: K'srah Step into my parlor, said the spider to the fly. Well, this is quite fascinating indeed. So, what exactly do you believe we would do to SOE if they confirmed they don't have us KOS (not to mention why)? This is of no matter, as I am sure you are well aware ::smirks::. But I am sure many would like to know the same of Star Fraction.
PYROPHIS INTAKI UNION	Posted - 2007.02.07 22:58:00 - [138] Originally by: Kunte Kinte Quote: I am afraid to post with main character..... hiding from the consequences of his slander ..... KK Kind of like how you are hiding so either step up as who you really are and say what you stand for or skulk in the shadows and let those willing to put forward their own views step forward and stay out of the discussion. As for the rest of this conversation I would still like to hear the SSoE step forward and say somthing coherent. I was there during the second half of this event scouting in my helios the entire 31 jump trip out to 0.0. I shared voice comms with the sisters escort who utilized our comms channel. I warned the escort in advance of the gate camp and watched them proceed thru without incident. I also warned them of the Band of Brothers camp that had earlier killed the ship of another sister and brag about it in their bio. I then observed as the escort opened fire on a SF vessel who had proceeded thru the gate ahead of them and after being fired on he dropped a inderdiction sphere and fled. The remainder of the escort exchanged fire with BoB forces and I left the scene at that time. I personally have my own logs and have failed to find any contridictory evidence to what SF has publically stated. SF may be arrogant and overly blunt but the bluntness is refreshing considering the level of BS around here and Im not talking about battleships. Everyone is talking about spin but the only people I see spinning things are SSoE and other uninvolved parties who were not there and have no place in this forum. You can read spin into whatever you want but the facts remain in the logs. So lets try somthing new. 1. Unless you can support your suppositions with "FACTS" and without innuendo please drop out and let this thread come to a logical conclusion. 2. Use your primary identity dont hide behind an alt created solely for the purpose of trolling this thread. 3. How about the SSoE answer the questions posed in a clear thoughtful manner without the outright lies we have seen here. You know I grew up hearing about the compassionate acts of kindness the SSoE did but now I wonder how much was your own spin doctoring. You forget sisters some of us were there and observed what happened. I helped out without any form of compensation and risked a ship worth millions just to help what I thought to be a worthy cause. Our corp even volunteered its voice comms to help the effort. So lets drop the slander and just tell the truth it is below your dignity to tell such lies and only slanders your own organization in such a way that leaves many wondering if you are worthy of trust in the future. Pyrophis Emissary of Intaki Union
Atandros Gallente Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 23:09:00 - [139] Originally by: K'srah Originally by: Atandros Originally by: K'srah Step into my parlor, said the spider to the fly. Well, this is quite fascinating indeed. So, what exactly do you believe we would do to SOE if they confirmed they don't have us KOS (not to mention why)? This is of no matter, as I am sure you are well aware ::smirks::. But I am sure many would like to know the same of Star Fraction. I am sure you are, evidently, a waste of biomass. -------
Lexiana Del'Amore Gallente Equilibrium Society	Posted - 2007.02.07 23:10:00 - [140] The Sisters don't need to justify their stance towards any entity, let alone some attention seeking terrorist faction.
K'srah Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.07 23:42:00 - [141] Originally by: Atandros I am sure you are, evidently, a waste of biomass. ::smirks smugly:: Thats fine, I did not anticipate an answer.
Jidaru Tamos Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.07 23:44:00 - [142] Originally by: Lexiana Del'Amore The Sisters don't need to justify their stance towards any entity, let alone some attention seeking terrorist faction. We didn't ask them to justify it, sweetheart. We asked them to just state it.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.08 00:03:00 - [143] Originally by: PYROPHIS As for the rest of this conversation I would still like to hear the SSoE step forward and say somthing coherent. I was there during the second half of this event scouting in my helios the entire 31 jump trip out to 0.0. I shared voice comms with the sisters escort who utilized our comms channel. I warned the escort in advance of the gate camp and watched them proceed thru without incident. I also warned them of the Band of Brothers camp that had earlier killed the ship of another sister and brag about it in their bio. I then observed as the escort opened fire on a SF vessel who had proceeded thru the gate ahead of them and after being fired on he dropped a inderdiction sphere and fled. The remainder of the escort exchanged fire with BoB forces and I left the scene at that time. I personally have my own logs and have failed to find any contridictory evidence to what SF has publically stated. SF may be arrogant and overly blunt but the bluntness is refreshing considering the level of BS around here and Im not talking about battleships. Everyone is talking about spin but the only people I see spinning things are SSoE and other uninvolved parties who were not there and have no place in this forum. You can read spin into whatever you want but the facts remain in the logs. So lets try somthing new. 1. Unless you can support your suppositions with "FACTS" and without innuendo please drop out and let this thread come to a logical conclusion. 2. Use your primary identity dont hide behind an alt created solely for the purpose of trolling this thread. 3. How about the SSoE answer the questions posed in a clear thoughtful manner without the outright lies we have seen here. You know I grew up hearing about the compassionate acts of kindness the SSoE did but now I wonder how much was your own spin doctoring. You forget sisters some of us were there and observed what happened. I helped out without any form of compensation and risked a ship worth millions just to help what I thought to be a worthy cause. Our corp even volunteered its voice comms to help the effort. So lets drop the slander and just tell the truth it is below your dignity to tell such lies and only slanders your own organization in such a way that leaves many wondering if you are worthy of trust in the future. Pyrophis Emissary of Intaki Union Thank you Pyrophis. As a pilot within the escort group on the evening in question your testimony is valuable and pertinent. So the question remains why did the Sisters of Eve representative lie about what happened here on this public discussion summit? It makes no sense for her to lie when the lie can so easily be discovered and refuted. So why did she think she could get away with this? Thats the deeper mystery for me in all this. Star Fraction is recruiting
Ryoma Sakamoto	Posted - 2007.02.08 03:23:00 - [144] Having read through the whole thread, one Gallentean phrase came to my mind : "Agent Provocateur" I have serious reservations about the true allegiance of this "Sister Rhayne", as her behaviour matches that of someone deliberately setting up a conflict between SSoE and SF, and make SF look the Heavy of the part. Did she choose her "Escorts" all by herself? Did she then call for SF assistance knowing that ML capsuleer was among her escorts, with all its ramifications? Why make the accusation and then hide? Where is she now??
Ashar KorAzor Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.08 16:53:00 - [145] Edited by: Ashar KorAzor on 08/02/2007 16:50:53 I have been contacted by SoE representatives and asked to mediate the dispute between the Fraction and themselves. In the interest of allowing SoE to continue their humanitarian efforts and not have any more politicking and so forth take place here, I have accepted. I offer my services as mediator to the Star Fraction leadership.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.08 17:05:00 - [146] Originally by: Ashar KorAzor I have been contacted by SoE representatives and asked to mediate the dispute between the Fraction and themselves. In the interest of allowing SoE to continue their humanitarian efforts and not have any more politicking and so forth take place here, I have accepted. I offer my services as mediator to the Star Fraction leadership. I'm sure a meeting can be arranged with Star Fraction diplomatic directors this evening Ashar KorAzor. What we expect from the Sisters of Eve is going to be pretty straightforward though. A clear and unambigious statement of their standings towards us, and an apology and retraction for the lies that have been told in the news, on the summit and in this thread by SOE personnel. It would also be very useful for the SOE organisation to acknowledge they are aware why we are hostile to Mordu's Legion and why using an organistion like the Legion for hired convoy escort is inevitably going to lead to problems with third party organisations. Anyway, lets hope the contact you have received heralds the end of this ridiculous business before more damage is done. Star Fraction is recruiting
Van Cleef Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve	Posted - 2007.02.08 17:40:00 - [147] It is damning that it takes 10 or so of your members to fill this thread with their posts to try and spin what is obviously an unprovoked and unwarranted attack against a SoE convoy. For well educated group such as Star Fraction, the definition of transfered seems to have escaped. Transfered means to have moved something from one area to another, ie if I transfer 100,000 isk, I do not keep a copy of it, I give it away. In any case, it truely is a shame that a for all the well worded goals, aspirations and intents that has been Jericho, and later Star Fraction, you will simply be remembered as common pirates and terrorists. ------------------------------------------------ CEO and Admiral of the Fleet Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Serve the State Join Channel CAINCOM
Nekumi Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.08 17:44:00 - [148] Originally by: Van Cleef It is damning that it takes 10 or so of your members to fill this thread with their posts to try and spin what is obviously an unprovoked and unwarranted attack against a SoE convoy. For well educated group such as Star Fraction, the definition of transfered seems to have escaped. Transfered means to have moved something from one area to another, ie if I transfer 100,000 isk, I do not keep a copy of it, I give it away. In any case, it truely is a shame that a for all the well worded goals, aspirations and intents that has been Jericho, and later Star Fraction, you will simply be remembered as common pirates and terrorists. The proof of what happened is for everyone to see in this thread, that's the opposite of spin by the way. If you're too much of an idiot to see that, it's your problem. The reaction and outright lies has incensed almost every member of Star Fraction. We're used to it when dealing with people of your ilk but we honestly didn't expect it from someone representing the SoE. That's the only reason so many of us have been vocal in this thread.
Van Cleef Caldari Caldari Independent Navy Reserve	Posted - 2007.02.08 17:56:00 - [149] If you choose to make this thread about my intelligence, or supposide lack thereof, that is your choice. By using the typical personal attacks rather than facts to dispute valid points you have already justified my post. Since I have no desire to engage in mud slinging, name calling or the inevitable STFU or war dec post, I will take my leave. ------------------------------------------------ CEO and Admiral of the Fleet Caldari Independent Navy Reserve Serve the State Join Channel CAINCOM
Sakura Nihil Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.08 18:11:00 - [150] Ashar, thank you again for agreeing to do this. I look forward to productive talks tonight to smooth over the diplomatic issues we've had over the past two weeks. Originally by: Van Cleef For well educated group such as Star Fraction, the definition of transfered seems to have escaped. Transfered means to have moved something from one area to another, ie if I transfer 100,000 isk, I do not keep a copy of it, I give it away. There's a difference between hard assets like missiles, weapons, ships, and its kind, and data that can be transmitted to another ship and yet stored as a copy on your own ship's databanks. Surely a well-educated individual such as yourself can recognize the difference between these two things?
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.08 18:14:00 - [151] Originally by: Van Cleef For well educated group such as Star Fraction, the definition of transfered seems to have escaped. Transfered means to have moved something from one area to another, ie if I transfer 100,000 isk, I do not keep a copy of it, I give it away. If that is the case please explain how Disciple Sibanna was able to send the data to CONCORD after having transferred that data to the Legion pilot. Data is not ISK. We have been given notice of a desire for talk facilitated by a mediator trusted by all parties. The Star Fraction will now await the outcome of any talks. The Cosmopolite The Star Fraction Recruitment
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.08 18:54:00 - [152] Originally by: Van Cleef By using the typical personal attacks rather than facts to dispute valid points you have already justified my post. When your opponents wouldn't recognise a "fact" if it introduced itself formally, left a calling card, arranged a coming out party and then authored an article in Yulai evening times celebrating its existence - all that remains is to heave a sigh at the pig-ignorance of nationalist delusion. Anybody with more than two brain-cells can see what has happened in this affair. Star Fraction is recruiting
Jalmari Vaara Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:15:00 - [153] Quote: I have also reviewed the comms and logs from that evening including combat logs - SSOE channel logs, Secret SSOE channel logs, Secret SSOE channel logs? So, you have hacked/infiltrated SSOE?
Malthros Zenobia Caldari Independent Navy Reserve	Posted - 2007.02.08 22:45:00 - [154] Edited by: Malthros Zenobia on 08/02/2007 22:44:41 You are demanding the 'lies' about you attacking the convoy be cleared up. The fact of the matter is that Mordu's Legion was part of that convoy. You attacked the Sister's fleet, at no point did it say you fired on a SSOE ship specifically, accept that you do not control the thoughts of the universe, even though you are trying so very hard. Originally by: kieron The Carrier was never intended to be a solo OMGWTF mission-farming PWNmobile.
Bacchanalian Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.02.08 23:06:00 - [155] Originally by: Malthros Zenobia Edited by: Malthros Zenobia on 08/02/2007 22:44:41 You are demanding the 'lies' about you attacking the convoy be cleared up. The fact of the matter is that Mordu's Legion was part of that convoy. You attacked the Sister's fleet, at no point did it say you fired on a SSOE ship specifically, accept that you do not control the thoughts of the universe, even though you are trying so very hard. As it seems there is currently diplomacy under way, how about we cease the idle speculation and pot-shots back and forth and allow the two sides to work out their differences through the diplomatic channels? Star Fraction is recruiting, join the revolution!
Ashar KorAzor Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2007.02.09 01:01:00 - [156] Originally by: Van Cleef It is damning that it takes 10 or so of your members to fill this thread with their posts to try and spin what is obviously an unprovoked and unwarranted attack against a SoE convoy. This comes from me as mediator and witness: You weren't there. Quit making statements you cannot back up with primary evidence before the Star Fraction spin machine targets you and you have to deal with it. I'm sorry. I mean deal with it again.

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