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StealthNet
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Posted - 2003.12.11 13:47:00 -
[1]
Hi,
If you are used to go to chaos to test fitting and for the occasional PvP, please, fit your ship and travel. Try traveling around a bit in a BS.
The didn't nerf MWDs and ABs. They destroyed it.
The patch is wonderful, but travel time swill at least double. Imagine that you are used to fit your quad lif and get a 890+ % speed bost with almost no cap.
Now you fit the best MWD available for a BS, and you get your 450% speed boost (huh ?)... in fact, your ship will travel at 550 m/s on avg, will accelerate slowly and what is the most important: it will destory your cap. Most of the time you will end up with 50%, even 30% of your cap left, because MWDs now suck 720 cap units.
I can't believe that from all options in the world that could be implemented this one was the chosen. Why drag them so low ? Why destroy the only means you have to get travel times shorter ? Is it the new strat to make BS worthless and boost cruisers and frigs ?
C'mon, can't you just find something in between those worlds ?
Please, please, pretty please, review these settings.
And before you hit the reply link, please, go to chaos and test it.
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Psy Corp
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Posted - 2003.12.11 13:53:00 -
[2]
one thing how will the prototype mwds that we have ingame be after patch.. anyone know?
I Have The Power Of The Mighty Lo.0lipop..
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PERCYDAMAN
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Posted - 2003.12.11 14:23:00 -
[3]
I also jumped on chaos last night for the first time and loved the new look and new features... Until I fitted a mwd on my mega and tried to travel. Man talk about overcompensation....
Those things are so different that calling them mwds or even comparing them to mwds is idiotic. Travel is quite the pain now and I suspect that pirates are having a field day with this... Soon, the only real viable profession outside of bunny space is pirate or pirate hunter... its all coming to a head 
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Eltigre
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Posted - 2003.12.11 14:46:00 -
[4]
 Quote:
I also jumped on chaos last night for the first time and loved the new look and new features... Until I fitted a mwd on my mega and tried to travel. Man talk about overcompensation....
Those things are so different that calling them mwds or even comparing them to mwds is idiotic. Travel is quite the pain now and I suspect that pirates are having a field day with this... Soon, the only real viable profession outside of bunny space is pirate or pirate hunter... its all coming to a head
Yeah, enough with minig ore already - get out and PvP even if ya didn't really want to ! - lol
SWEET routinely sells BPC's in Sing Laison and Essence Regions. |
Zyrla Bladestorm
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Posted - 2003.12.11 15:40:00 -
[5]
as I understand it LiF AB's and quad Lif MWD will become BS items.
Y-S8 AB's and Y-T8 MWD will become Cruiser items.
Monopropellant and Cold gas arcjet AB and MWD's will become frigate items
Afterburner I/MWD I will become Meganewton Afterburner (frigate)
new items(and BP's I'd assume but haven't seen yet) will be added for the 10 and 100 meganewton I's (cruiser and BS respectively)
Yep I agree speeds overall are about halved
They changed the acceleration control formula also .. so instead of making an 25% AB 50% at level 4 it makes it 30% (+6.25% becomes +1.25%)
Curiously considering the whole point was to stop people using twin MWD its pretty much going to force me to start using two of them on my mission ships (Tech II .. you gotta catch em all :P)
If it isn't changed again before its released I can see a lot of indy pilots giving up there indys for Probes :/ since the linking of mass to AB's has killed what little speed remains from them (plus indys even with an grid upgrade to 82-90 base cant fit anywhere near as many as before .. and with half the cap of cruisers cant run them for any length of time at all either) whereas the probe being a minnie frig will have about the same speed it has on TQ plus access to MWD's .. and an mobile refinery will fit in if they ever release it :P
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Apologys for any rambling that may have just occurred.
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Crimsonjade
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Posted - 2003.12.11 16:44:00 -
[6]
Quote:
Curiously considering the whole point was to stop people using twin MWD its pretty much going to force me to start using two of them on my mission ships (Tech II .. you gotta catch em all :P)
Go for it. The amount of cap the BS size MWD's take will leave you with hardly any cap after one or two cycles.
CCP is just fine tuning the system to make it coincide with other space genre games. who ever heard of a capital ship cruising at 1.5 km/s? you dont, BS are meant to be slow, powerful and somewhat suceptible to small fighter attack.
the only downside i see to the whole arrangement is that the amount of battleship deaths will decrease in pvp somewhat, which may cause some people to stop pvping. once you think about it in the long run, it is promising.
No pain, no palm; no thorns, no throne; no gall, no glory; no cross, no crown.
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StealthNet
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Posted - 2003.12.11 17:20:00 -
[7]
Quote:
Quote:
Curiously considering the whole point was to stop people using twin MWD its pretty much going to force me to start using two of them on my mission ships (Tech II .. you gotta catch em all :P)
Go for it. The amount of cap the BS size MWD's take will leave you with hardly any cap after one or two cycles.
CCP is just fine tuning the system to make it coincide with other space genre games. who ever heard of a capital ship cruising at 1.5 km/s? you dont, BS are meant to be slow, powerful and somewhat suceptible to small fighter attack.
the only downside i see to the whole arrangement is that the amount of battleship deaths will decrease in pvp somewhat, which may cause some people to stop pvping. once you think about it in the long run, it is promising.
I disagree. 1 Km/s in space is as slow as a turtle on earth. The famous Blackbird SR-71 was able to beat that... in atmosphere! (well, sort of)
The space shuttle travels, while in orbit, roughly 6 times that speed.
But let's stop rl comparison, because this is a game that has no "real" appeal. The fact is, travel will be a pain. Anyway, I was not saying that the previrous MWD model was right or wrong. But ppl at CCP must learn to do small moves instead.
Keep the speed boost I say. But be easier with the cap cost. We are talking about a BS not a frig.
If the whole goal was to make ppl from using 2 or more MWDs, then approach the problem accordinly, like was done with the weapon upgrades: if you fit 2 or more, there would be a steep penalty.
But as they are currently on chaos, the only thing they accomplish is: bigger travel times.
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StealthNet
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Posted - 2003.12.11 17:23:00 -
[8]
Quote:
Yeah, enough with minig ore already - get out and PvP even if ya didn't really want to ! - lol
Mining the Universe one roid at a time - lol
I don't PVP, and I don't mine too. But I enjoy playing EVE. Hows that ? 
I respect the players that chose the pirate path. I also respect the players that mine. But nerfing travel will be a penalty applied to us all.
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Zyrla Bladestorm
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Posted - 2003.12.11 17:28:00 -
[9]
Quote:
Go for it. The amount of cap the BS size MWD's take will leave you with hardly any cap after one or two cycles.
my mission ships actually a frig (vigil, though gonna get a probe and rifter too now) they can run 1 mwd indefinetely, 2 pretty easily ..
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Apologys for any rambling that may have just occurred.
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Ana Khouri
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Posted - 2003.12.11 17:44:00 -
[10]
Frigs are there pretty much the exeption, no chance of it for cruisers and BS. And since TomB said that he "doesn't want people being able to use MWDs 24/7 I'm sure it will be fixed once someone mentions it to him. Please transfer 10 mil to my account in the next 5 hours, my finger on the "hit reply" botton in the ship&module MWD thread is getting itchy 
As for the MWD changes - I already said so several times in several threads and am sure that we'll get the biggest flamefest ever once these changes are live and people realize what their unwelcome sideeffects are.
Perhaps TomB could see the light before it's too late if more than two people would say that the current changes are contraproductive in the appropriate thread.
free speech not allowed here |
JackDonkey
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Posted - 2003.12.11 17:48:00 -
[11]
Quote:
Is it the new strat to make BS worthless and boost cruisers and frigs ?
Battleships won't become worthless, they'll just become miners.
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Zyrla Bladestorm
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Posted - 2003.12.11 17:48:00 -
[12]
the bit that has me miffed is the big AB nerf really, rather than the MWD nerf
(imagine if frigate mwd got nerfed more .. you'd never hear the end of it from J0)
By pretty easily I mean pretty easily in the sence of getting to the gates in less than 1 cycle :P rather than run indefinitely easily :D
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Apologys for any rambling that may have just occurred.
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SUPER GROVER
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Posted - 2003.12.11 18:12:00 -
[13]
I think they did with mwd's the same thing they did with afterburners, you will need a medium or large mwd to propel your ship fast!
If i'm wrong then it should be implemented!
In "real" you don't fit your freighter with an outboard 10Pk engine, or do you?
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2003.12.11 18:27:00 -
[14]
"(imagine if frigate mwd got nerfed more .. you'd never hear the end of it from J0)"
*smirks* No worry, there will be no further word from me on the subject. And i fully expect to see the frigate MWD brought further to level of cruiser and battleship versions... i.e. into the ground -- TomB knows one can run them constantly, and he said already he doesn't want people to be able to do it.
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Mr nStuff
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Posted - 2003.12.11 18:50:00 -
[15]
Wow.. I thought I was the only one that realized the cost to travel time..
Most people are whining about PvP for some reason.
5 R&D Agents, 10months, Zero BPO Offers..
Onboard navigational [Planetary Avoidance] computer.
My account will be suspended at the end of the current play period.
Expires on 19. September 2004 |
Jael
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Posted - 2003.12.11 19:33:00 -
[16]
Quote:
Wow.. I thought I was the only one that realized the cost to travel time..
Most people are whining about PvP for some reason.
PvP is, to an extent, irrelevant. Travel time is the least fun part of EVE for the most subscribers, and it's increasing. Whooppeee. Colour me tickled. |
Adliger Krieger
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Posted - 2003.12.11 19:39:00 -
[17]
Just browse the market while traveling, keeps me busy looking for good trade routes :-)
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Ana Khouri
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Posted - 2003.12.11 19:44:00 -
[18]
I would *love* to know how you can acess the market while travelling, exept using a second account.
free speech not allowed here |
StealthNet
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Posted - 2003.12.11 19:54:00 -
[19]
Quote:
Frigs are there pretty much the exeption, no chance of it for cruisers and BS. And since TomB said that he "doesn't want people being able to use MWDs 24/7 I'm sure it will be fixed once someone mentions it to him. Please transfer 10 mil to my account in the next 5 hours, my finger on the "hit reply" botton in the ship&module MWD thread is getting itchy
As for the MWD changes - I already said so several times in several threads and am sure that we'll get the biggest flamefest ever once these changes are live and people realize what their unwelcome sideeffects are.
Perhaps TomB could see the light before it's too late if more than two people would say that the current changes are contraproductive in the appropriate thread.
Thanks for pointing me that out. I just posted there, but s I said, after 11 pages of replies, it will hardly get noticed.
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StealthNet
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Posted - 2003.12.11 19:56:00 -
[20]
Quote:
I would *love* to know how you can acess the market while travelling, exept using a second account.
Let's say we are able to browse it while traveling. Now, let's get some distance from this affirmative, and give it a thought or two: look what we are doing we are trying to find something else to do because it's so boring.
I think thats when the *game* starts to loose it's appeal.
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Ana Khouri
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Posted - 2003.12.11 20:02:00 -
[21]
Quote:
Now, let's get some distance from this affirmative, and give it a thought or two: look what we are doing we are trying to find something else to do because it's so boring.
I think thats when the *game* starts to loose it's appeal.
Yes, that gos without question. Some people spam the forum, for example
Which brings me to something else. What is one of the most boring things to do in eve and what involves a lot of travel?
I wouldn'T have thought agent missions could become even MORE boring...
free speech not allowed here |
pooti
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Posted - 2003.12.11 20:42:00 -
[22]
I think nerfing travel is great! Shuttles and frigates wills till be great for moving around, but this retarded move-a-fleet-of-30-battleships across the universe in 30 minutes thing will die.
I'm sick of battleships being the end-all of everything.
The best fighting ships. The best mining ships. The best travelling ships.
C'mon.
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pooti
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Posted - 2003.12.11 20:45:00 -
[23]
And re: travel time, yeah it sucks, but hey.
I travel between syndicate and curse fairly often and have to go around the edge of about 2/3 of the universe because I can't go through empire systems.
95 jumps instead of 30.
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StealthNet
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Posted - 2003.12.11 20:51:00 -
[24]
Edited by: StealthNet on 11/12/2003 20:53:29
Oh no, agent missions! I forgot those for a brief moment, but you had to remind me... damn 
I just did a small test. Travelled 11 jumps from amarr space to nonni.
My findings: with 5 cap relays, and 1 quad lif and 2 lif boosters, it took me 5 more minutes to do the same trip that with 1 quad lif in TQ.
Did the same test with only 1 quad lif on chaos: ran out of cap twice, and it took me 12 more minutes. Tried to do it without cap relays, gave up. Ran out of cap so many times that I logged off.
BTW ya, it should tae some time to travel long distances. I usually take around 1:30h to do 53 jumps, and thats fitted exclusively for travel (nanos, MWD and ABs). But couldn't it be something in between ?
I already said that the current speed boost idea on chaos is a good thing. But 720 cap cost ? That's a bit too much don't you think ?
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Adliger Krieger
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Posted - 2003.12.11 21:03:00 -
[25]
I hate nerfing. I travel an aweful lot, and this nerfing of the MWD simply will not do. Either decrease the speed, or increase the cap use, but not both. What is the matter with you CCP?
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Loraine Riesel
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Posted - 2003.12.13 09:40:00 -
[26]
Just one line:
CCP can prepare for a huge drop in players (ie: loose much income in $$ ÇÇ), when implementing the non-empire-BS-mining, JIP feature, change in mwd's and afterburners with the implementation of the patch this Monday! |
Qandor
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Posted - 2003.12.13 12:18:00 -
[27]
The devs always surprise me. Just when I thought the game couldn't possibly get any more boring and that something would have to be done to provide a bit of a spark - bam - they decide to nerf travel time. What an excellent move. I suppose this ties in with their desire for a "slow start". Guess we still haven't gotten slow enough yet.
Don't worry devs, I have faith. You can get those player population numbers down to your target level yet. Just one question though. What number were you shooting for? Maybe 2000 peak population? This could do it. It will fit your plans nicely. Free up that needed bandwith for the new big advertising push. Great strategy. Kudos.
This will be fun to watch. Folks are going to just love chugging around to do those new agent missions - lol.
PS - Just a reminder for the devs. We still have that nasty highway system in place. Removing the highways right now would fit nicely with the travel speed nerf. Think about it.
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Xtra Bitter
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Posted - 2003.12.13 14:45:00 -
[28]
As i dont have the time or inclination to set up chaos i was just wondering if anyone had investigated the effects of inertia stabilisers under the new system ?
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Chade Malloy
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Posted - 2003.12.13 16:37:00 -
[29]
Argh...
With this new changes, travelling in an indy as a trader will be a real pain...c¦m on, they are slow enough already, please, dear devs, don¦t nerf our only chance to get where we want in under two hours...
Indys have low cap, so they can only fit the samlles MWD, if any.
They have low powergrid, so they can¦t fit any extra modules to support the cap.
They are condemmed to be easy pray for every want-to-be-pirate out there.
With that, freelance trading MUST die.
(And stop that escorting-crap, i can¦t think of anything more boring than guarding a turtle-indy over 45 jumps through the Universe...and if you are alone, you would have to hire mercenaries, and this would kill your income as a trader)
Patience wins. |
JP Beauregard
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Posted - 2003.12.13 17:19:00 -
[30]
Makes you kind of wonder what the heck happened to the idea of a game where you actually travelled through space.
I think I'll spend a lot more time sitting in station copying blueprints (15 run Probes are cheap right now and you know you need that ship, if only to pick up the copy I just made ya...)
"Sorry, no deliveries, pick up your crap yourself."
I second Quandor's move to abolish all highway gates. People were actually moving from one system to another. Can't have that. Too much stress on crashing nodes.
Muppets...
JP Beauregard
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