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FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
3592
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Posted - 2016.03.01 20:44:20 -
[1] - Quote
Scuttlebutt is there are upcoming changes to make the watch list consensual. This is a response to the current state of null affairs where supercap pilots are watched by basically all of null. I can see how that would be a problem in need of a fix, especially with the new CREST-based contact tools. It's a level of intel that has a stifling effect on gameplay, and CCP should definitely be looking to remedy the problem.
It's been pointed out before that these pilots will no longer be forced to live in their ships once Citadels come about. That would make the supercap watch list largely irrelevant, as those pilots would then be able to engage in non-cap activities and their online status would become much less useful information. Still, it's a major intel issue, and apparently enough people want to see a change that *something* is going to be done.
That said, the loss of the watch list makes bounty hunting and mercenary work nearly impossible. Tracking down targets when you can't even determine their online state effectively removes the entire line of work. The workarounds will involve infiltrating corps with alts to get online status or constantly pinging convo requests until everyone gets completely antisocial and blocks all inbound requests. I don't think the alternatives are good for the game.
I have two proposals:
1. Limit the watch list to only work when contacts are in high- or low security space. Nullsec and Wspace would be considered "off the grid" and online status would only be broadcast to mutual contacts. I think lowsec should be retained as it's still empire space, and also because I know the watch list is a crucial tool to my friends in FW. The alternative for them is more spy alts, which just adds tedium to the game.
2. Go with the "mutual only" watch list idea, with the exception of anything considered a valid target such as wartargets or people on either side of a killright.
Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
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Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1883
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Posted - 2016.03.02 02:41:15 -
[2] - Quote
So explain to me one more time why CCP is changing the game to allow certain players to avoid conflict. I hope it's not because of some fabricated or perceived morality or 'fairness' standard. Something like that is just so 'un-EVE' - I can't believe CCP would be doing that. |
Corvald Tyrska
Dha'Vargar
74
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Posted - 2016.03.02 04:04:26 -
[3] - Quote
Wouldn't it be better to add some actual, useful tools for Bounty Hunting/Mercenary work?
Just tossing out some ideas off the top of my head here.
How about hacking sites like data sites that after a successful hack let you search the gate logs for a specific player to find the last ten gates they jumped through? Maybe HiSec sites for a HiSec search, low for low and null for null?
Then maybe the hack gives you a transponder code (item) that you load into a probe scanner to let combat scanner probes locate a specific ship in space rather than every ship and anomaly.
Similarly, have a hacking style interface to hack stations to allow a search of the characters docked at that station.
The data site tells you the system they last jumped to and then you can search the stations and probe the system to find them. Unless they are cloaked or logged off in space or used wormholes but they become the counters to the hunting. |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
2227
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Posted - 2016.03.02 05:42:40 -
[4] - Quote
Perhaps just move that functionality into the observation array. Make it give free locates and online/offline status for all war targets. Limit it to empire space if need be, but I think the cost of running the structure and the wardec itself will limit blanket tracking of supers. Not to mention the fact the pilots can now leave their coffins already degrades this Intel.
As a side benefit, is would make mercenaries put something in space the defenders could go after. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3013
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Posted - 2016.03.02 07:22:33 -
[5] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Perhaps just move that functionality into the observation array. Make it give free locates and online/offline status for all war targets. Limit it to empire space if need be, but I think the cost of running the structure and the wardec itself will limit blanket tracking of supers. Not to mention the fact the pilots can now leave their coffins already degrades this Intel.
As a side benefit, is would make mercenaries put something in space the defenders could go after.
Free locates and online/offline status for all WT's would be excessively powerful, not to mention far to easy for a big alliance to maintain one in their safe corners (or several). Compared to the cost of fueling a few thousand POS to guard moons from suddenly POS, a few Wardecs and Observation Arrays are going to be negligible.
Tying this into existing locator agents in this manner and Observation arrays also giving you a standings free locator agent who still charges per locate however, could be a way forward. |
Wimzy Chent-Shi
Unkindness Incorporated
Who Dares Wins.
39
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Posted - 2016.03.02 07:40:25 -
[6] - Quote
If you wanna go hardcore, you can try to convo them to see whether they are online or not, seems like it changes nothing, kinda a step back.
Wimzy, the (ex)FC for WarpToMe Incursions, friend to many neutral to most.
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
2227
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Posted - 2016.03.02 08:04:25 -
[7] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Perhaps just move that functionality into the observation array. Make it give free locates and online/offline status for all war targets. Limit it to empire space if need be, but I think the cost of running the structure and the wardec itself will limit blanket tracking of supers. Not to mention the fact the pilots can now leave their coffins already degrades this Intel.
As a side benefit, is would make mercenaries put something in space the defenders could go after. Free locates and online/offline status for all WT's would be excessively powerful, not to mention far to easy for a big alliance to maintain one in their safe corners (or several). Compared to the cost of fueling a few thousand POS to guard moons from suddenly POS, a few Wardecs and Observation Arrays are going to be negligible. Tying this into existing locator agents in this manner and Observation arrays also giving you a standings free locator agent who still charges per locate however, could be a way forward.
Well, we already have free online/offline status so I am not sure that is excessively powerful, but sure, the locator can have a cost or be limited by time or some other way as it is now.
Tuning and improving the cost/accuracy/time of the locator would be a good thing for rigs to determine. |
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
3597
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Posted - 2016.03.02 17:27:53 -
[8] - Quote
Wimzy Chent-Shi wrote:If you wanna go hardcore, you can try to convo them to see whether they are online or not, seems like it changes nothing, kinda a step back.
Yeah, convo request spam will immediately become a real thing, forcing many players to block all incoming requests. That will result in a drop in social interaction, which is a terrible thing for an MMO.
If CCP is indeed planning mutual-only watchlisting, I hope they've put a lot more thought into it than they have some other things recently.
Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
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Terrah Chain
Space Isolation
0
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Posted - 2016.03.02 20:56:48 -
[9] - Quote
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:Wimzy Chent-Shi wrote:If you wanna go hardcore, you can try to convo them to see whether they are online or not, seems like it changes nothing, kinda a step back. Yeah, convo request spam will immediately become a real thing, forcing many players to block all incoming requests. That will result in a drop in social interaction, which is a terrible thing for an MMO. If CCP is indeed planning mutual-only watchlisting, I hope they've put a lot more thought into it than they have some other things recently.
What they need to do is have the conversation fail messages have the same text for offline as for a rejected or timed out messages. If they aren't getting any intel out of the mechanic then it is not likely to get spammed, thus people won't need to turn on auto-reject.
If it always returned something like "Your attempts to contact *player name* failed at this time." then we would be in good shape. |
Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE
Fidelas Constans
2987
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Posted - 2016.03.02 23:21:59 -
[10] - Quote
Serendipity Lost wrote:So explain to me one more time why CCP is changing the game to allow certain players to avoid conflict. I hope it's not because of some fabricated or perceived morality or 'fairness' standard. Something like that is just so 'un-EVE' - I can't believe CCP would be doing that.
Maybe because it's also used to avoid conflict as much as it was used to generate it? |
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Corvald Tyrska
Dha'Vargar
75
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Posted - 2016.03.02 23:27:07 -
[11] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Perhaps just move that functionality into the observation array. Make it give free locates and online/offline status for all war targets. Limit it to empire space if need be, but I think the cost of running the structure and the wardec itself will limit blanket tracking of supers. Not to mention the fact the pilots can now leave their coffins already degrades this Intel.
As a side benefit, is would make mercenaries put something in space the defenders could go after. Free locates and online/offline status for all WT's would be excessively powerful, not to mention far to easy for a big alliance to maintain one in their safe corners (or several). Compared to the cost of fueling a few thousand POS to guard moons from suddenly POS, a few Wardecs and Observation Arrays are going to be negligible. Tying this into existing locator agents in this manner and Observation arrays also giving you a standings free locator agent who still charges per locate however, could be a way forward. Well, we already have free online/offline status so I am not sure that is excessively powerful, but sure, the locator can have a cost or be limited by time or some other way as it is now. Tuning and improving the cost/accuracy/time of the locator would be a good thing for rigs to determine.
I still prefer the idea of a mechanism involving actively gathering intel rather than logging in to access the passivly gathered intel. It expands the Bounty Hunting/Mercenary roles and potentially adds a new career of information broker - a player who actively seeks out intel on target locations and sells them to their clients. That's why I suggested a hacking minigame style activity for it. I'm not suggesting that a player needs to fly into every single system and search for their target but maybe passive intel gives you a region for the player and then you need to actively narrow it down to constellation and system via actively seeking the intel. |
perseus skye
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
4
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Posted - 2016.03.03 00:41:13 -
[12] - Quote
Corvald Tyrska wrote:Wouldn't it be better to add some actual, useful tools for Bounty Hunting/Mercenary work? Just tossing out some ideas off the top of my head here. How about hacking sites like data sites that after a successful hack let you search the gate logs for a specific player to find the last ten gates they jumped through? Maybe HiSec sites for a HiSec search, low for low and null for null? Then maybe the hack gives you a transponder code (item) that you load into a probe scanner to let combat scanner probes locate a specific ship in space rather than every ship and anomaly. Similarly, have a hacking style interface to hack stations to allow a search of the characters docked at that station. The data site tells you the system they last jumped to and then you can search the stations and probe the system to find them. Unless they are cloaked or logged off in space or used wormholes but they become the counters to the hunting. Edit: or there is also the Observatory Arrays from the https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=414191&find=unread thread which mentions "player tracking capabilities".
U mean in game tools like actually putting in effort/located agents and spies ?
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