EVE Search - Why is the Dev/BOB/Kugutsumen incident handled this way?

All Channels

EVE General Discussion

Why is the Dev/BOB/Kugutsumen incident handled this way?

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: [1] 2 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Guth Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.02.15 20:55:00 - [1] I just wanna know? It seems to me (from reading some of the facts on the other sites that dont delete them.. looks at CCP) that the openness they usually have with their playerbase would be ESPECIALLY important in this case. Telling us about what happened would be alot better than this generic response from the CCP CEO and then total deletion of anything and anyone mentioning it. It seems to me there is more harm in CCP sticking their heads in the sand about this than actually facing the music. Have I done something wrong in asking now? For those who dont know how to use google.com, alot more info about can be found at eve-search.com and kugutsumen.com Devs/Moderators/Gms: If this thread gets deleted and locked down, can I get a reason? Oh and to the flamers: don't bother, I will ignore replies without substance :) Factoid: Something fictitious that is presented as fact, devised especially to gain publicity and accepted because of constant repetition
Kylania Gallente Phoenix Industries	Posted - 2007.02.15 20:58:00 - [2] Edited by: Kylania on 15/02/2007 20:56:00 Originally by: Guth Devs/Moderators/Gms: If this thread gets deleted and locked down, can I get a reason? Because we already had a chance to comment. Go here: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=channel&channelID=3512 There's already hundreds of pages of information about all of this, answers and questions from both side, even a mongoose! Please lets just move on from this. -- Lil Miner Newbie Skills Roadmap \| How to Build from a BPO
Liu Kaskakka PAK	Posted - 2007.02.15 20:59:00 - [3] Originally by: Guth Devs/Moderators/Gms: If this thread gets deleted and locked down, can I get a reason? How about this = There's a dedicated thread for this discussion. King Liu is RIGHT!!
FuQue	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:00:00 - [4] ...and it was locked. of course. CCP u suck. tell us what you're going to do about the situation already.
Pacala Gallente AirHawk Alliance Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:00:00 - [5] Thing is, that thread has already been edited from its original content. I believe CCP has taken a position and you have to reach out to them through other means. I haven't needed a signature for 4 years.
Popsikle Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:00:00 - [6] Um, they told us what happened, they told us which alliances was affected, they told us why K was banned, and they told us about thier Internal Affairs department... What more do you want? __________________________________________ -= We Fly for our people =- -= I fly for Blood =-
Guth Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:04:00 - [7] Originally by: Liu Kaskakka Originally by: Guth Devs/Moderators/Gms: If this thread gets deleted and locked down, can I get a reason? How about this = There's a dedicated thread for this discussion. The locked one linked to above you? Factoid: Something fictitious that is presented as fact, devised especially to gain publicity and accepted because of constant repetition
Evil Vixen Minmatar	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:06:00 - [8] Originally by: Kylania Edited by: Kylania on 15/02/2007 20:56:00 Originally by: Guth Devs/Moderators/Gms: If this thread gets deleted and locked down, can I get a reason? Because we already had a chance to comment. Go here: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=channel&channelID=3512 There's already hundreds of pages of information about all of this, answers and questions from both side, even a mongoose! Please lets just move on from this. There is alot of info there yes but: - its LOCKED. - its not all there. Eve search and kugutsumen.com (among other sites) have alot more info. Info that doesnt seem to be asked about. For instance. The blueprints mentioned are two short of the blueprints that seem to be given to BOB. I can go on, but Im guessing nobody who havent found these "tidbits" of information really want to know the truth.
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:07:00 - [9] Incidentally, the Mods have pointed out that we are free and welcome to discuss whatever we like on 3rd party forums. To that end, Dark Shikari was good enough to create this textboard. Feel free to drop in and have a chat there. -------- Originally by: Constantine Arcanum most problems can be solved with chloroform.
Evil Vixen Minmatar	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:08:00 - [10] Originally by: Popsikle Um, they told us what happened, they told us which alliances was affected, they told us why K was banned, and they told us about thier Internal Affairs department... What more do you want? Their "facts" dont coincide with the information presented other places?
FuQue	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:08:00 - [11] Originally by: Popsikle Um, they told us what happened, they told us which alliances was affected, they told us why K was banned, and they told us about thier Internal Affairs department... What more do you want? We want some better answers other than "we're looking into it". We want more assurances that this won't happen again, and step CCP will take to assure that it won't. We want all items BOB has acquired to be investigated to see if there are more BPO's that came into their hands through devs (seriously doubt those are the only ones). The game is ruined because BOB rules eve. We want retribution.
Popsikle Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:10:00 - [12] Originally by: Evil Vixen Originally by: Kylania Edited by: Kylania on 15/02/2007 20:56:00 Originally by: Guth Devs/Moderators/Gms: If this thread gets deleted and locked down, can I get a reason? Because we already had a chance to comment. Go here: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=channel&channelID=3512 There's already hundreds of pages of information about all of this, answers and questions from both side, even a mongoose! Please lets just move on from this. There is alot of info there yes but: - its LOCKED. - its not all there. Eve search and kugutsumen.com (among other sites) have alot more info. Info that doesnt seem to be asked about. For instance. The blueprints mentioned are two short of the blueprints that seem to be given to BOB. I can go on, but Im guessing nobody who havent found these "tidbits" of information really want to know the truth. Maybe because those BPO's were obtained in a legal way? If people could focus less on BoB and more on what happened, and how it affects everyone, I imagine CCP would have allowed for more discussion on the topic. The problem is people already hated BoB and instead of blaming t20 for his mistake, they automaticly blame the whole sky is falling on BoB and fail to actually discuss the issue versus constantly flaming a portion of the users. If the community in general was a bit more mature, and did not use the whole affair as an excuse to flame BoB, maybe we actually could have had some PROPER discussion about it, but it was getting to the point of harassment against BoB pilots. __________________________________________ -= We Fly for our people =- -= I fly for Blood =-
Argenton Sayvers	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:11:00 - [13] Originally by: Patch86 Incidentally, the Mods have pointed out that we are free and welcome to discuss whatever we like on 3rd party forums. To that end, Dark Shikari was good enough to create this textboard. Feel free to drop in and have a chat there. I hope you dont really care what the mods think when you discuss things on 3rd party forums.
Xachariah Minmatar Starship Fellows	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:12:00 - [14] Originally by: Popsikle Um, they told us what happened, they told us which alliances was affected, they told us why K was banned, and they told us about thier Internal Affairs department... What more do you want? There are lots of unanswered question. The ammount of threads that still get posted shows this. It is completly ok, if you are satisfied with these answers, but please understand that others are not. Because this is a Forum, people usually like to post their own opinions, and that's why saying "I am perfectly fine with everything" is usually not very effective ;)
Guth Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:12:00 - [15] Originally by: Patch86 Incidentally, the Mods have pointed out that we are free and welcome to discuss whatever we like on 3rd party forums. To that end, Dark Shikari was good enough to create this textboard. Feel free to drop in and have a chat there. Been there. Interesting stuff. Between that site and the Kugutsamen site I became aware of how hard it was to get the same info from CCP! Factoid: Something fictitious that is presented as fact, devised especially to gain publicity and accepted because of constant repetition
Popsikle Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:12:00 - [16] Originally by: FuQue Originally by: Popsikle Um, they told us what happened, they told us which alliances was affected, they told us why K was banned, and they told us about thier Internal Affairs department... What more do you want? We want some better answers other than "we're looking into it". We want more assurances that this won't happen again, and step CCP will take to assure that it won't. We want all items BOB has acquired to be investigated to see if there are more BPO's that came into their hands through devs (seriously doubt those are the only ones). The game is ruined because BOB rules eve. We want retribution. This is my point exactly, you fail to see it any other way then BoB killed eve. BoB didnt control t20, t20 did. What about all the other 0.0 alliances cheating thier way to the top, free motherships, bugged complexes, and monopolizing hulk bpo's? Not to mention client side hacks and other things... If people cant be arsed to see the bigger picture, why bother allowing discussion on it... __________________________________________ -= We Fly for our people =- -= I fly for Blood =-
gfldex	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:15:00 - [17] Plain and simple legal issues. If CCP would ban me and make the reason accessable for the public I could sue them. The CEO wouldnt go to jail right away but if it happens a few times that would change. They are not allowed to by law. -- Number of pilots that logged while I scrambled, bubbles or shooten them: 9.
feiht'd'ero	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:16:00 - [18] Originally by: Guth I just wanna know? It seems to me (from reading some of the *facts* on the other sites that dont delete them.. looks at CCP) Did you parents not teach you NOT to beleive everything you read?
Dred'Pirate Jesus Amarr Imperial Warehousing Industries	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:16:00 - [19] Whats really funny is that all that "discussion" on third party boards is just a time sink as noone of any media or legal connections ever goes to those places to quote things for the real life discussion of the events.. but hey if it makes you feel better to rant in total anonymity then more power to you..
Popsikle Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:17:00 - [20] Originally by: Evil Vixen Originally by: Popsikle Um, they told us what happened, they told us which alliances was affected, they told us why K was banned, and they told us about thier Internal Affairs department... What more do you want? Their "facts" dont coincide with the information presented other places? FACTS: CCP found out a Dev was cheating, They disciplined the dev 8 months ago. CCP created the tools to monitor thier staff and hired someone to do that 40 hours a week. They are paying someone to just watch over the devs to try and prevent this in the future... The Community found out about this months later and wanted to know what happened, and if there was anything CCP missed. CCP communicated with the community as best they could, and better then any other MMO company ever would have saying they would investigate and find any more details they could. CCP found that the dev had given illegal items to someone in game, CCP removed illegal items. CCP allowed discussion on the events, in the open. CCP then answered all the questions they could about it without infringing on anyones privacy. CCP then decided to state there was no more need for discussion as they cant give any more details out. MY OPINION: Overall CCP was far more open in this then all the other MMO companies would have been, and there is a very vocal minority of the forums that are blowing this way out of size. Its that group of the forums that are getting our of hand and think that they are being silenced and muffled and they need to strike back by giving CCP bad press... CCP did the best they could, and did better then any MMO company has in the past, and probably will in the future when dealing with these sorts of issues, and its about time people start respecting that. On top of that, who is to say if the rest of the stuff K posted is true? After all he was doing it for isk in the first place, and greed is the biggest corrupter of everything. Im sure CCP read K's site, and looked into everything they could, but they CANT ban people for stuff said out of thier realm (forums/game), so if they cant find evidence to support K's claims, they cant do anything about it. __________________________________________ -= We Fly for our people =- -= I fly for Blood =-
XiticiX Gallente Kudzu Collective	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:17:00 - [21] Originally by: Popsikle Originally by: FuQue Originally by: Popsikle Um, they told us what happened, they told us which alliances was affected, they told us why K was banned, and they told us about thier Internal Affairs department... What more do you want? We want some better answers other than "we're looking into it". We want more assurances that this won't happen again, and step CCP will take to assure that it won't. We want all items BOB has acquired to be investigated to see if there are more BPO's that came into their hands through devs (seriously doubt those are the only ones). The game is ruined because BOB rules eve. We want retribution. This is my point exactly, you fail to see it any other way then BoB killed eve. BoB didnt control t20, t20 did. What about all the other 0.0 alliances cheating thier way to the top, free motherships, bugged complexes, and monopolizing hulk bpo's? Not to mention client side hacks and other things... If people cant be arsed to see the bigger picture, why bother allowing discussion on it... You don't have a clue, do you? We're not blaming BOB at all - we're blaming the fact that BPO'S came into possession of an alliance illegally, and we seriously doubt those were the only BPO'S. It just so happens BOB is the largest alliance in eve. That's secondary to the real issue we're discussing. If ANY alliance gained more control in EVE than they should have, we would be having the same discussion. ~~~ This is my sig. Do you like it? ~~~
Guth Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:19:00 - [22] Another interesting tidbit is the banning of Kugutsamen. I realize he did something illegal. But that has nothing to do with being banned as far as i know? He is talking about this on his site, but CCP hold to their "we cant tell" argument? Its clear that HE doesnt mind if they tell their side.. WE dont mind if they tell their side (frack, i WANT to hear their side, thats why I'm asking..), so why dont tell their side?? Like someone allready posted in this thread (and probably other threads before mine), many people are NOT satisfied with the generic answers we have gotten. Another thing regarding the t20 dev blog: What he has said in his blog does not coincide with what is shown on 3rd party sites. There are alot of posted quotes from this, from before the time he wrote the blog. How could they have "guessed" so accurately the bpos involved and the names involved? They couldnt? How then can the other info (also posted before the t20 blog..) be wrong? The info that directly contradicts what is written about "never giving them info" for instance. There are logs showing they knew about a story event in EVE before it took place. I know it could be propaganda by anti-CCP people.. but then they are amazing at getting half their facts completely correct from guesswork before the facts were published, then adding their own lies and completing the whole thing with faking the posting dates on everything.. Factoid: Something fictitious that is presented as fact, devised especially to gain publicity and accepted because of constant repetition
Taran Summers The Merovingians	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:20:00 - [23] Actually, the only thing in all his info that I give a crap about at this point is the cyno-net. Account sharing is illegal under the TOS and everyone involved with that thing need to get punished on it. And if any of the leadership at BOB condoned it, they need to be busted for it. All players need to be held to the same standards. But I don't need to be informed that it happened. I'm just going to have faith that CCP will do right by the community and take care of it.
Kylania Gallente Phoenix Industries	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:21:00 - [24] Originally by: FuQue We want ... We want... We want... We want ... Sing along with me... -- Lil Miner Newbie Skills Roadmap \| How to Build from a BPO
Xachariah Minmatar Starship Fellows	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:22:00 - [25] Originally by: Popsikle Originally by: Evil Vixen Originally by: Popsikle Um, they told us what happened, they told us which alliances was affected, they told us why K was banned, and they told us about thier Internal Affairs department... What more do you want? Their "facts" dont coincide with the information presented other places? FACTS: CCP found out a Dev was cheating, They disciplined the dev 8 months ago. CCP created the tools to monitor thier staff and hired someone to do that 40 hours a week. They are paying someone to just watch over the devs to try and prevent this in the future... The Community found out about this months later and wanted to know what happened, and if there was anything CCP missed. CCP communicated with the community as best they could, and better then any other MMO company ever would have saying they would investigate and find any more details they could. CCP found that the dev had given illegal items to someone in game, CCP removed illegal items. CCP allowed discussion on the events, in the open. CCP then answered all the questions they could about it without infringing on anyones privacy. CCP then decided to state there was no more need for discussion as they cant give any more details out. MY OPINION: Overall CCP was far more open in this then all the other MMO companies would have been, and there is a very vocal minority of the forums that are blowing this way out of size. Its that group of the forums that are getting our of hand and think that they are being silenced and muffled and they need to strike back by giving CCP bad press... CCP did the best they could, and did better then any MMO company has in the past, and probably will in the future when dealing with these sorts of issues, and its about time people start respecting that. On top of that, who is to say if the rest of the stuff K posted is true? After all he was doing it for isk in the first place, and greed is the biggest corrupter of everything. Im sure CCP read K's site, and looked into everything they could, but they CANT ban people for stuff said out of thier realm (forums/game), so if they cant find evidence to support K's claims, they cant do anything about it. I think you miss two main problems: 1) CCP obviously didnt remove the BPO directly after they were discovered, but 6 months later, after "the community" discovered them. 2) CCP actually muffles people. Its a fact that threads such as these get deleted. ( 3) They never allowed discussion in here, but only in the Information Portal. There have been stickies about way less important things in General Discussion, why not this one?) I agree to most of your points, however it's pretty understandable, that people stopped trusting CCP because of these two points above and want at least one deleted from that list (this means, they want to be allowed to talk about it).
Popsikle Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:23:00 - [26] Originally by: Taran Summers Actually, the only thing in all his info that I give a crap about at this point is the cyno-net. Account sharing is illegal under the TOS and everyone involved with that thing need to get punished on it. And if any of the leadership at BOB condoned it, they need to be busted for it. All players need to be held to the same standards. But I don't need to be informed that it happened. I'm just going to have faith that CCP will do right by the community and take care of it. IMO, they should fix cyno's versus banning all the alliances that use cyno nets. There would be no capital pilots left in 0.0, well very few. Cynonets are needed at this point, because moving capital ships without them sucks. __________________________________________ -= We Fly for our people =- -= I fly for Blood =-
Niccolado Starwalker Shadow Templars	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:25:00 - [27] Originally by: Guth I just wanna know? It seems to me (from reading some of the facts on the other sites that dont delete them.. looks at CCP) that the openness they usually have with their playerbase would be ESPECIALLY important in this case. Telling us about what happened would be alot better than this generic response from the CCP CEO and then total deletion of anything and anyone mentioning it. It seems to me there is more harm in CCP sticking their heads in the sand about this than actually facing the music. Have I done something wrong in asking now? For those who dont know how to use google.com, alot more info about can be found at eve-search.com and kugutsumen.com Devs/Moderators/Gms: If this thread gets deleted and locked down, can I get a reason? Oh and to the flamers: don't bother, I will ignore replies without substance :) Your post is without intelligene. If it had you would know that CCP have done what they could within their own rules for such behaviour. And there have allready been a 100+ page thread on the topic! No need to start another one. matter of fact, its not allowed starting another thread of the topic! So, please. Let this thread DIE! There is nothing more to say! Case closed! Finito. Its Game over! Originally by: Eldo Davip PORTRAITS OMFG WOOT. WE R GONIG FOR MROE BREEE!!!!11
Guth Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:25:00 - [28] Originally by: feiht'd'ero Originally by: Guth I just wanna know? It seems to me (from reading some of the *facts* on the other sites that dont delete them.. looks at CCP) Did you parents not teach you NOT to beleive everything you read? This is a phallacy. I should beleive everything CCP employees write but not anything other people write? I dont beleive everything i write, i weigh it against what i think is probable. I deduct and jugde out from the multiple sources and "facts" i find. As you can se from my last post, the timing and coinciding facts show that it is more likely that the whole information from the 3rd party logs posted are true than only the half that CCP has confirmed allready. But that is my opinion. We may deduce things in a different fashion. I for one as a system developer in a banking institution know very well the importance of strict rules. I also know how often they get bent without anyone on the outside knowing. Factoid: Something fictitious that is presented as fact, devised especially to gain publicity and accepted because of constant repetition
Ben Derindar KelBen Productions	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:27:00 - [29] Originally by: kieron We are looking towards the future, what we can do to improve EVE and repair the recent damage done to the EVE community. We ask the community to assist in this endeavour and not open any new threads on the topic. /Ben How to fix Eve
Xachariah Minmatar Starship Fellows	Posted - 2007.02.15 21:28:00 - [30] Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker Originally by: Guth I just wanna know? It seems to me (from reading some of the facts on the other sites that dont delete them.. looks at CCP) that the openness they usually have with their playerbase would be ESPECIALLY important in this case. Telling us about what happened would be alot better than this generic response from the CCP CEO and then total deletion of anything and anyone mentioning it. It seems to me there is more harm in CCP sticking their heads in the sand about this than actually facing the music. Have I done something wrong in asking now? For those who dont know how to use google.com, alot more info about can be found at eve-search.com and kugutsumen.com Devs/Moderators/Gms: If this thread gets deleted and locked down, can I get a reason? Oh and to the flamers: don't bother, I will ignore replies without substance :) Your post is without intelligene. If it had you would know that CCP have done what they could within their own rules for such behaviour. And there have allready been a 100+ page thread on the topic! No need to start another one. matter of fact, its not allowed starting another thread of the topic! So, please. Let this thread DIE! There is nothing more to say! Case closed! Finito. Its Game over! That is just your oppinion. I find it interesting that you post this over and over again in every single thread about this topic. You think this topic it closed, but you have to admit that many people dont think this way, otherwise there wouldnt be as many threads about this, right? What makes your oppinion worth more then others? If you think this topic is closed, why do you read them all the time and post that you dont care about it? (I hope you are the right person, if I actually mistake you for another one, then same on me) If these threads didnt get deleted or locked, then perhaps there wouldnt be hundreds of new threads all the time?

Pages: [1] 2 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.